Still feel like crap after PCT

**Kyle1337** · 06-13-2016, 02:18 PM

Followed first cycle guide by austinite to a T. Just finished PCT a few days ago... Feel like shit still. I literally have no energy to do anything. Gotta force myself to do everything. Usually involves 5 minutes of convincing myself I can do it!!

I'm falling asleep if I'm not being active, I'm so exhausted all damn day. Will I feel like this after ever cycle?? When will this go away? Ugh. I'm miserable. It's affecting my job and everything.

**< <Samson> >** · 06-14-2016, 07:17 AM

Yup, typical feeling

Give it a few weeks & get blood work

**AR's King Silabolin** · 06-14-2016, 07:43 AM

Did you use any 19nors?. Maybe your prolactin is elevated. Estrogen...test...i guess the only way to find the cause and healingpossibilities is bloodwork.
Heh..i know that is a real pain in the ass. Been there alot. When you feel tired and shit, the last thing you wanna do is get your ass up to the docs office and playing the target of the sentence "you had it coming son, we told ya)
But, if you get your bloodwork. We can help you a million times better than any doc around.

**Kyle1337** · 06-14-2016, 09:01 AM

Originally Posted by < <Samson> >

Yup, typical feeling

Give it a few weeks & get blood work

Fun fun! At least I know I'm not the only one. If I gotta feel like this every time I stop... Man, Idk if I can do it anymore lol. It's a trade off I guess.

Originally Posted by Silabolin

Did you use any 19nors?. Maybe your prolactin is elevated. Estrogen...test...i guess the only way to find the cause and healingpossibilities is bloodwork.
Heh..i know that is a real pain in the ass. Been there alot. When you feel tired and shit, the last thing you wanna do is get your ass up to the docs office and playing the target of the sentence "you had it coming son, we told ya)
But, if you get your bloodwork. We can help you a million times better than any doc around.

Halfway bloods indicated 28 e2, which is perfect. But, that was 8 weeks ago so it's probably irrelevant. I didn't use any 19 nors, only test. Blood work will be in 6 weeks. At least that's what austinite says to do it. Should it be sooner, say 3-4 weeks?

**Back In Black** · 06-14-2016, 11:35 AM

6-8 weeks post pct is fine. No need to do it sooner whilst your hormones are still in huge flux.

Yes, it's a trade off, some people have less symptoms and recover much easier than others.

Good luck.

**< <Samson> >** · 06-14-2016, 09:53 PM

Originally Posted by Kyle1337

Fun fun! At least I know I'm not the only one. If I gotta feel like this every time I stop... Man, Idk if I can do it anymore lol. It's a trade off I guess.

It is

No joke

Consider your options

I took the red pill, I'm not going back into the matrix. . . . .

**hammerheart** · 06-15-2016, 12:38 AM

SERMS can upregulate SHBG, that takes some time to normalize.

Having high SHBG means free test gets low, hence the symptoms, despite normal total levels.

**Cody95** · 06-15-2016, 01:33 AM

Originally Posted by Kyle1337

Followed first cycle guide by austinite to a T. Just finished PCT a few days ago... Feel like shit still. I literally have no energy to do anything. Gotta force myself to do everything. Usually involves 5 minutes of convincing myself I can do it!!

I'm falling asleep if I'm not being active, I'm so exhausted all damn day. Will I feel like this after ever cycle?? When will this go away? Ugh. I'm miserable. It's affecting my job and everything.

Give it time or you're fucked, ignore these guys saying get blood work it won't do shit for you. Do a longer pct.

**Back In Black** · 06-15-2016, 03:45 AM

Originally Posted by Cody95

Give it time or you're fucked, ignore these guys saying get blood work it won't do shit for you. Do a longer pct.

Your always the same bad advice.

What is he going to medicate? How does he know what is wrong? He finished PCT a few days ago why run another?

**InternalFire** · 06-15-2016, 04:17 AM

Originally Posted by Back In Black

Your always the same bad advice.

What is he going to medicate? How does he know what is wrong? He finished PCT a few days ago why run another?

Bam!

Is there any control over this board guarding uneducated members in a seek of help from such YOLO advices? Or "freedom of speech" exteds all over the place even here

Just curious

**< <Samson> >** · 06-15-2016, 07:16 AM

Originally Posted by Cody95

Give it time or you're fucked, ignore these guys saying get blood work it won't do shit for you. Do a longer pct.

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**Proximal** · 06-15-2016, 07:43 AM

Kyle, I recall your cycle log where you stated your T was under dosed, thanx to your supplier. Is there a chance that your PCT gear was bunk? If so veterans, what effect would that have on Kyle's situation?

**InternalFire** · 06-15-2016, 07:46 AM

Originally Posted by Proximal

Kyle, I recall your cycle log where you stated your T was under dosed, thanx to your supplier. Is there a chance that your PCT gear was bunk? If so veterans, what effect would that have on Kyle's situation?

I am no VET on this question, but bunk PCT may lead to results just as OP is experiencing, however, need detailed bloodwork to identify and even that its hard to argue vs. ones genetics, we cant know for certain how each of us will respond to either gear or PCT compounds, its trial and error based on certain expectations more less, thats my point of view

**Kyle1337** · 06-15-2016, 08:03 AM

Originally Posted by Proximal

Kyle, I recall your cycle log where you stated your T was under dosed, thanx to your supplier. Is there a chance that your PCT gear was bunk? If so veterans, what effect would that have on Kyle's situation?

Well the pct stuff was from Balkan pharmaceutical. It was from the same guy but a different brand. I'm not sure though. I did feel some nut pain when taking it, upon research that's normal from pct. I dunno tho.

Originally Posted by InsaneMuscle

I am no VET on this question, but bunk PCT may lead to results just as OP is experiencing, however, need detailed bloodwork to identify and even that its hard to argue vs. ones genetics, we cant know for certain how each of us will respond to either gear or PCT compounds, its trial and error based on certain expectations more less, thats my point of view

That's very true, and I'll certainly do bloods I'm not afraid to spend a couple for my health. Bloods are so important and the only way to know anything. Otherwise you're blind. Not sure what the guy earlier was talking about, but I won't take that advice lol.

**InternalFire** · 06-15-2016, 08:08 AM

Pct may be underdosed or mislabeled or fake too. Do you have packages or photos of these packages and names of your pct meds? Could help identify somewhat

By names I mean exact labelling and branding

**Mr.BB** · 06-15-2016, 08:56 AM

It is advised to use pharma PCT and AI. UGL can be anything, and who knows which dosage.

It is not that difficult to find pharma PCT and AI.

**Kyle1337** · 06-15-2016, 10:15 AM

I'd post photo of it, except I don't have any left. And the photos online link to "sources" don't wanna be flamed for posting a picture. Everyone knows who Balkan is... Google them clomid nolva, they look EXACTLY like that. I never saw him pull out of package, but yea...

**NACH3** · 06-15-2016, 10:24 AM

Originally Posted by InsaneMuscle

Bam!

Is there any control over this board guarding uneducated members in a seek of help from such YOLO advices? Or "freedom of speech" exteds all over the place even here

Just curious

Just call em out like we did... Never heard such retardedness(well here you might lol) - 'BW won't do sh!t' lmaoo

**InternalFire** · 06-15-2016, 10:48 AM

Originally Posted by NACH3

Just call em out like we did... Never heard such retardedness(well here you might lol) - 'BW won't do sh!t' lmaoo

I know bw dont do shit but it will at least indicate where one stands and if bloods taken earlier than the washout is done I feel it should show elevated fsh lh and maybe even test levels if pct meds work. Things may not necesarily be related to low test sometimes, it may be other things too.

**NACH3** · 06-15-2016, 11:07 AM

Originally Posted by InsaneMuscle

I know bw dont do shit but it will at least indicate where one stands and if bloods taken earlier than the washout is done I feel it should show elevated fsh lh and maybe even test levels if pct meds work. Things may not necesarily be related to low test sometimes, it may be other things too.

I agree I should especially after pct meds have been taken(hence elevated LH/FSH) ... BW Is far more valuable as we can't tell what's going on inside without it

**InternalFire** · 06-15-2016, 12:12 PM

Originally Posted by NACH3

I agree I should especially after pct meds have been taken(hence elevated LH/FSH) ... BW Is far more valuable as we can't tell what's going on inside without it

I must have misinterpreted you wrong at earlier message, I thought you were contradicting BW importance, now I see I had misread it wrong earlier

**Cody95** · 06-15-2016, 02:31 PM

Originally Posted by Back In Black

Your always the same bad advice.

What is he going to medicate? How does he know what is wrong? He finished PCT a few days ago why run another?

Dude I was drunk when I wrote that, don't even remember saying it. Give me a break, I hardly get on here.

**Cody95** · 06-15-2016, 02:31 PM

Originally Posted by Back In Black

Your always the same bad advice.

What is he going to medicate? How does he know what is wrong? He finished PCT a few days ago why run another?

Also I don't always give bad advice, dont be an asshole. I've been bodybuilding for 8 years, alot of the stuff I say is good.

**Cody95** · 06-15-2016, 02:36 PM

Originally Posted by InsaneMuscle

Bam!

Is there any control over this board guarding uneducated members in a seek of help from such YOLO advices? Or "freedom of speech" exteds all over the place even here

Just curious

Probably bigger then you bud. Keep talking.

**InternalFire** · 06-15-2016, 02:40 PM

Originally Posted by Cody95

Probably bigger then you bud. Keep talking.

I feel sorry for you, your attitude will get you nowhere, but good luck.
And of course youre bigger than me and smarter than most of us, after all youre bodybuilding for 8 years - you cant be wrong, youre so sincere. .. oh wait maybe you're intoxicated... I couldnt tell

**Proximal** · 06-15-2016, 02:42 PM

Guys, how about I bump this thing to distract from the negative & hopefully get the attention from a vet to solve Kyles problem, if his PCT gear was ineffective.

Sorry, have too much time on my hands today - off day, really need more hobbies, lol.

**InternalFire** · 06-15-2016, 02:47 PM

Originally Posted by Proximal

Guys, how about I bump this thing to distract from the negative & hopefully get the attention from a vet to solve Kyles problem, if his PCT gear was ineffective.

Sorry, have too much time on my hands today - off day, really need more hobbies, lol.

Great call Proxi,

I had free day today too, I found some answers I was looking for, finished reading some great articles.
After all, lets hope Kyle will get this sorted sooner than later.

**Back In Black** · 06-15-2016, 03:36 PM

Originally Posted by Cody95

Also I don't always give bad advice, dont be an asshole. I've been bodybuilding for 8 years, alot of the stuff I say is good.

it really isn't.

**Cody95** · 06-15-2016, 06:48 PM

Originally Posted by InsaneMuscle

I feel sorry for you, your attitude will get you nowhere, but good luck.
And of course youre bigger than me and smarter than most of us, after all youre bodybuilding for 8 years - you cant be wrong, youre so sincere. .. oh wait maybe you're intoxicated... I couldnt tell

Talk about having a attitude bud.

**InternalFire** · 06-15-2016, 07:14 PM

yea brother, lets vent

**< <Samson> >** · 06-15-2016, 09:54 PM

Whatever

Get BW & see where you stand and go from there

I felt like complete crap after all 3 of my PCT's - but, my natural levels were always crap.

Did, you get BW before cycle < most likely no. . . . .

**Kyle1337** · 06-17-2016, 08:28 AM

Yes, I did bw pre cycle. My test was already low "normal" all my other values were in range. Test was like 303 or something out of 273-1000. I have exact numbers in my thread I believe. But it's really close to that.

It's different every day, but usually about 10-11 am it hits me and I feel like fading off the planet I'm so tired.

**Proximal** · 06-17-2016, 12:38 PM

I know it's a personal & private question, BUT, any history of depression?

**Kyle1337** · 06-17-2016, 02:23 PM

Originally Posted by Proximal

I know it's a personal & private question, BUT, any history of depression?

Unfortunately yes, I was never diagnosed with it, but I also have anxiety (apparently they are directly related). But, it was a couple years ago. Actually, about 6 months ago I had an injury that took me out of work and the gym. I was never more depressed ever. I couldn't and didn't want to do anything. Injury is fixed, and I got back at it... I feel fine now I think lol!

**Mr.BB** · 06-17-2016, 02:30 PM

Get on 500mg Vit C and 5000ui Vit D3 in the morning. Before bed 30-40mg zinc and 100-200ng selenium. Feel good stack for me

**Proximal** · 06-17-2016, 02:35 PM

Just brainstorming, but isn't there connections between testosterone & serotonin? It would seem logical to me to have a drop in mood with plummeting testosterone levels perhaps more if there was some issue prior. Again, just speculating.

**Proximal** · 06-17-2016, 02:37 PM

Mr. BB, that new avatar alone just made me feel real good - no stack even needed.

**InternalFire** · 06-17-2016, 02:42 PM

I feel I can relate, I've been depressed for good few years on and off and never thought about checking my BW to see what my hormones were doing, and I just over a year ago started digging deep and found out I may have been lowT for a very long time and so the result of depression and so on. May be right may be wrong, but I feel it correlated in my situation alot.
Its weird but to my understanding its natural expression of the whole biological composition on how one can not get depressed naturally when his biological composition at the time dictates to him that he should be "more emotional and less of a man", lack of self esteem creeps in, mood swings, low motivation, low sex drive, loss of libido and in general feeling like "what's the point" because things gone south in ones body, so fixing hormonal pathways alone can help big time, just my point of view. self-bro-science kinda

**Proximal** · 06-17-2016, 02:58 PM

Don't think they can really check for serotonin in BW as it is a neurotransmitter. But you're right, fixing the hormonal effect of low testosterone is a nice mood elevator, however still just as artificial though as an anti-depressant med.

Depression is something never to taken lightly.

**InternalFire** · 06-17-2016, 03:05 PM

Originally Posted by Proximal

Don't think they can really check for serotonin in BW as it is a neurotransmitter. But you're right, fixing the hormonal effect of low testosterone is a nice mood elevator, however still just as artificial though as an anti-depressant med.

Depression is something never to taken lightly.

True, there are many more things to be checked and put in place to ensure more permanent fix, gut bacteria flora, autoimmune disease, dopamine and serotonin re-uptake pathways and more, its deep business when it comes to details, but for most part, exercise and nutrient and probiotic rich diet must be in place before anything to do with hormones takes place, you'd know that gut flora is responsible for the biggest part of serotonin production in the body, not the brain... ah well, I dont want to drift out of topic