Blast and Cruise / TRT - HCG Protocol?

[SlammiN]

Hi

So I've read a lot of conflicting advice online when it comes to a HCG protocol when you are blasting and cruising / TRT protocol.

Some sources have stated to do say 250iu every other day and stay that way.

Other sources state that you should do HCG one week on 3 weeks off, and do 3x 500iu in that week on, stating that more than this will desensitise natural LH production and mess you up.

I would like to hear some opinions on this subject and the reasoning behind them.

Appreciate any advice on this, thanks.

[numbere]

Hey SlammiN.

I don't usually like just forwarding people to a link. I feel it kind of defeats the purpose of a form, but Dr Crisler explains his protocol much better than I can paraphrase.

An update to the Crisler HCG protocol

[DocToxin8]

I can also attest to that whether on TRT or cycle,
using HCG at 250u X 2 a week (even up to 500u X 2) isn't going to cause desensetivization at the testicles.

My endo can confirm this as well, so can pretty much all the Vets at this forum.

[DocToxin8]

But don't use hCG during pct, but that's because it's supressive and at that point you want your LH (and FSH) signaling coming from your brain (pituitary), which is easier accomplished by using SERMs.
HCG at that point would be counter productive.

[SlammiN]

Thanks Numbere, I appreciate the link you gave me, which is very informative.

Thank you also DocToxin8 for the input, that is good to know although it has made me concerned of what I have done when I have been off cycle.

From the article it would actually appear that the regimen I am currently employing, which is 2x 300iu 2x a week SubQ is in fact very similar to the supposed correct way of doing things. I use Organon Pregnyl.

The thing is I always have done in the past and always seem to suffer from massive testicular shrinkage. When I am well off the gear I would say I have large testicles, while they go to half of their size and they never seem to come back even when on a HCG protocol, which I do always follow.

I have in the last few months decided to blast and cruise but I would still like the look of full and healthy testicles, for my own piece of mind more than anything. I have had large IM shots of HCG when off cycle also, like 1500iu EOD, then E4D etc, I wonder if maybe I am suffering from desensitisation from doing that in the past and whether I need a few weeks break even though I will stay on the Test Cyp.

Would be interested to hear any opinions on this.

Thanks

[Vash the Stampede]

DocToxin8 ftw. Solid advise all the way.

[numbere]

Would be interested to hear any opinions on this.

To each his own.

I don't really see the point to having large testicles as long as they are doing their job at producing hormones.

The only thing that currently comes to mind would be experimenting with your hcg protocol.

e.g. You could try taking 100IU every day.

[SlammiN]

Thanks for advice!

So is there any chance that "HCG desensitization" may have occurred?

With all my off season heavy 1500iu jabs, then small dose when I am back on course, that's what I am now wondering

[SlammiN]

Guess what I'm saying is there any chance I could be desensitised to HCG even now as I have took so much when I was off cycle in the past?

Even though I'm staying on now could I somehow still be densitised, or does it not work like that?

Thanks

[numbere]

Thanks for advice!

So is there any chance that "HCG desensitization" may have occurred?

With all my off season heavy 1500iu jabs, then small dose when I am back on course, that's what I am now wondering

This would depend on your opinion on leydig cell desensitization.

Some people believe in desensitization while others believe in down regulation.

Imo desensitization only occurs at very high doses of hcg or prolonged periods of time in the absence of lh/hcg.
...

If you'd like to know more about your situation you can administer an hcg challenge test. An hCG challenge test consists of taking 1,000-2,500 IU of hcg every other day for 15 days. At the of the 15 day period one should have an lc/ms assay which includes total test. A failed test for sufficient leydig cell functionality is when serum test levels reside in the low 20% of the adult male reference range, which is about 400 ng/dl.

[SlammiN]

From the sounds of it then if I am staying on the test now it wouldn't really matter if I did too much HCG a few months back. The fact that I am staying on the test means I could desensitise the leydig cells by not doing HCG while constantly on. So following the protocol in the first post by yourself seems my best bet to try and keep it active is to keep using.

Also another question.

What difference in LH is there from HCG injections compared to HCGenerate, I have read a lot about that supplement stimulating the testicles and bringing them to size when on TRT. Is HCGenerate stimulating natural LH or is it still suppressing the natural in the same way?

Thanks

[The Deadlifting Dog]

HCGenerate is garbage

[numbere]

What difference in LH is there from HCG injections compared to HCGenerate, I have read a lot about that supplement stimulating the testicles and bringing them to size when on TRT. Is HCGenerate stimulating natural LH or is it still suppressing the natural in the same way?

Hcgenerare is literally snake oil.

[gymffiti]

Hey SlammiN.

I don't usually like just forwarding people to a link. I feel it kind of defeats the purpose of a form, but Dr Crisler explains his protocol much better than I can paraphrase.

An update to the Crisler HCG protocol

Great link

Although somewhat confusing. For me at least

my test cyp TRT patients now take their HCG at 250IU two days before, as well as the day immediately previous to, their IM shot. All administer their HCG subcutaneously, and dosage may be adjusted as necessary (I have yet to see more than 350IU per dose required).

Sooooo, if for example, someone injects their Test on a Wednesday ... They inject HCG Monday ('two days before') and Tuesday ('the day immediately previous') ?

It seems like such a weird way of stating it. I think I must be missing something here

[DocToxin8]

Remember that a very small amount of your testicles are actually producing testosterone . At least according to my endo, small nuts shouldn't affect T output when on hCG (that much), but spermatogenesis on the other hand is more directly related to testicle size.

[hammerheart]

Remember that a very small amount of your testicles are actually producing testosterone. At least according to my endo, small nuts shouldn't affect T output when on hCG (that much), but spermatogenesis on the other hand is more directly related to testicle size.

Agree, you can potentially get away with one working testicle.

[cyounger100]

Hi

So I've read a lot of conflicting advice online when it comes to a HCG protocol when you are blasting and cruising / TRT protocol.

Some sources have stated to do say 250iu every other day and stay that way.

Other sources state that you should do HCG one week on 3 weeks off, and do 3x 500iu in that week on, stating that more than this will desensitise natural LH production and mess you up.

I would like to hear some opinions on this subject and the reasoning behind them.

Appreciate any advice on this, thanks.

My doctor has me on 100 mg test cyp a week and 500 iu of hcg twice a week .

[kelkel]

Sooooo, if for example, someone injects their Test on a Wednesday ... They inject HCG Monday ('two days before') and Tuesday ('the day immediately previous') ?

It seems like such a weird way of stating it. I think I must be missing something here

That HCG injection protocol is based on a once per week Test injection. Injecting the HCG both 2 and 1 day prior to injection gives a bump to your test production which is rapidly declined at that point due to it's half life. It's why many test protocols are now every 5 days or splitting your T dose and injecting twice weekly.

[gymffiti]

That HCG injection protocol is based on a once per week Test injection. Injecting the HCG both 2 and 1 day prior to injection gives a bump to your test production which is rapidly declined at that point due to it's half life. It's why many test protocols are now every 5 days or splitting your T dose and injecting twice weekly.

Thanks for clearing that up

I guess the strange phrasing threw me off