Results 1 to 18 of 18
Like Tree2Likes

Thread: liverenzymes 250 ;(

  1. #1
    Silabolin is offline Banned
    Join Date
    May 2015
    Location
    Norway
    Posts
    3,735
    So i did 20 mg dbol for two months with injectables.
    1200 mg NAC.

    Stil, 4 and a half week after one of my liverenzymes were 250. Others were normal. Do not recall which one. Doc just called me. Ordered UV.
    They are supposed to be 40-50.

    Is my value normal for my dose?

    I drank heavy 31 desember. Else just 2 beers each week during cycle.
    Precycle liver was ok.
    Last edited by Silabolin; 02-05-2017 at 11:10 AM.

  2. #2
    The Deadlifting Dog's Avatar
    The Deadlifting Dog is online now Knowledgeable Member
    Join Date
    Sep 2012
    Posts
    2,539
    Quote Originally Posted by Silabolin
    So i did 20 mg dbol for two months with injectables. 1200 mg NAC. Stil, 4 and a half week after one of my liverenzymes were 250. Others were normal. Do not recall which one. Doc just called me. Ordered UV. They are supposed to be 40-50. Is my value normal for my dose? I drank heavy 31 desember. Else just 2 beers each week during cycle. Precycle liver was ok.
    Please name ALL compounds that you were running when you got the bloodwork.
    All SARMS , SERMS, supplements, AAS, AIs, DAs, etc...

  3. #3
    Silabolin is offline Banned
    Join Date
    May 2015
    Location
    Norway
    Posts
    3,735
    Quote Originally Posted by The Deadlifting Dog View Post

    Please name ALL compounds that you were running when you got the bloodwork.
    All SARMS, SERMS, supplements, AAS, AIs, DAs, etc...
    8 weeks 20 mg dbol .
    8 weeks sus 250 mg
    5 weeks tren a 200 mg
    8 weeks mk677
    Cardarine 25 mg 3 times a week
    Very low arimedexdose
    Very low caberdose
    NAC 1200 mg
    Red Yeast Rice 1200 mg

    Normal diett ( not superhealthy)
    14 days with burning sensation lower rigth abdomen.
    Ill get all values from the bloodtest tomorrow. But doc said everything was ok. Hdl cholestrol also. Just the one liverenzym. Alat or asat. 250.

    Feeling ok and no problem with training.

  4. #4
    Mr.BB's Avatar
    Mr.BB is online now MONITOR
    Join Date
    Apr 2014
    Location
    HOME
    Posts
    6,746
    You need to post the timings when you took those dosages and when you started PCT. Or you didnt do PCT???

    Although NAC is a great supp, it doesnt specifically targets liver.

    From your description sounds like gallbladder problem, stones or sluggish bile. High fat meals will trigger this even further.

    Hepatitis is also something that should be checked, but the ultrasound will tell. BTW please do full abdomen ultrasound, prostate included. Kind of a waste if only liver is checked.

  5. #5
    Flynman is offline Associate Member
    Join Date
    Apr 2003
    Location
    South Carolina
    Posts
    358
    I have had it go that high after a long cycle and it returned to normal after a few weeks. Drink plenty of water. Milk thistle worked for me and NAC didn't. As long as it is just the one enzyme i would stay off any AAS for a few weeks nd get it re-tested.

  6. #6
    Silabolin is offline Banned
    Join Date
    May 2015
    Location
    Norway
    Posts
    3,735
    Quote Originally Posted by Mr.BB View Post
    You need to post the timings when you took those dosages and when you started PCT. Or you didnt do PCT???

    Although NAC is a great supp, it doesnt specifically targets liver.

    From your description sounds like gallbladder problem, stones or sluggish bile. High fat meals will trigger this even further.

    Hepatitis is also something that should be checked, but the ultrasound will tell. BTW please do full abdomen ultrasound, prostate included. Kind of a waste if only liver is checked.
    Started 1. desember and continued 8 weeks with test and dbol . Tren 200 in the middle there. 5 weeks. Stopped 31. desember. Just a clomid 50 pct from 10 januar until now. 10 days with nolva. Stil on mk677. HCG 500 every week on cycle.
    Also use 5 mg imovane each day but done it for 5 years and never saw bad livervalues from it.

    PSA was ok from the bloods. But i always piss 4 yimes a nigth. Done it for 3 years so he sent me to a urologist too.

  7. #7
    Obs's Avatar
    Obs
    Obs is online now "Convert Emotion to Willpower"
    Join Date
    Apr 2007
    Location
    Earth
    Posts
    9,501
    Quote Originally Posted by Silabolin View Post
    Started 1. desember and continued 8 weeks with test and dbol . Tren 200 in the middle there. 5 weeks. Stopped 31. desember. Just a clomid 50 pct from 10 januar until now. 10 days with nolva. Stil on mk677. HCG 500 every week on cycle.
    Also use 5 mg imovane each day but done it for 5 years and never saw bad livervalues from it.

    PSA was ok from the bloods. But i always piss 4 yimes a nigth. Done it for 3 years so he sent me to a urologist too.
    You used ephedrine for years sil. I have overdosed it a lot myself. That shit is real hard on your prostate. I would say that is prob the root of pissing four times a night. Most guys who use ephedrine regulary manifest prostate problems. I know a couple 40 something guys with ephedrine related prostate issues. I really like it myself.

  8. #8
    DocToxin8's Avatar
    DocToxin8 is offline Knowledgeable Member
    Join Date
    May 2015
    Location
    Land of the screwed
    Posts
    2,157
    ASAT can easily reach that value by some test and heavy training.
    But they've almost stopped using ASAT, so it's probably ALAT.
    That usually is normal for me, but I've had both ALAT and ASAT at around 230, and I was using an SSRI med at time, and my doctor simply said he though it was the SSRI (I wasn't open about the AAS, this is a long time ago), and that this light liver stress was nothing to worry about.

    But I've also had aches around were the liver would be, as you describe, when I had those values. I simply stayed on 250mg test e a week and it normalized.

    So my advice would be this;
    1) see a doctor (as you know and said in the hospital thread, this is not to replace the need to see a doctor, but share our experience so you might find some answers that can lead to questions to the doctor.

    2) from your description of symptoms I might have experienced the same,
    but the sensation I had wasn't that painful, it was more of an ache that I could forget when I moved around. And it didn't hurt to press on the liver.
    Both ALAT and ASAT was about as high as your. Ca 230
    It lasted for several months, as I didn't take it that seriously, I was young and reckless. But while using 250mg test e a week it went away.
    So, since i know you won't totally quit, since you got low natty T, I'd say stop all SARM and all ancillaries. If you really need to use, try a TRT dose of test or if you must cruise use 250mg test e a week max.
    Follow this up with blood tests often.

    If you've had unprotected sex with anyone new remember that while not that common in Norway, there are more than you think who's got hepatitis B which transmits through sexs. Hepatitis C is much more common, but it's very difficult to get hep c with sex, (they don't even recommend a condom if you're in a steady relationship) But it IS possible, if she had her period and you got very sore then..

    Point is you need to rule out diseases and shit as a cause, so do more blood tests.
    And don't use any SARMs , or anything else you have to put in your mouth, only T, and preferably just TRT.
    I'd even say don't use an AI, unless it's from a pharmacy,
    (And at TRT you might not need an AI, or it's no higher than what you can allow for a little time.)

    And don't worry too much, (but check this out!)
    these liver values can easily go higher without it being dangerous,
    but it indicates liver stress, and depending on what that stress is it may lead to nothing or ta lot of different shit.

  9. #9
    Silabolin is offline Banned
    Join Date
    May 2015
    Location
    Norway
    Posts
    3,735
    Quote Originally Posted by DocToxin8 View Post
    i can easily reach that value by some test and heavy training.
    But they've almost stopped using ASAT, so it's probably ALAT.
    That usually is normal for me, but I've had both ALAT and ASAT at around 230, and I was using an SSRI med at time, and my doctor simply said he though it was the SSRI (I wasn't open about the AAS, this is a long time ago), and that this light liver stress was nothing to worry about.

    But I've also had aches around were the liver would be, as you describe, when I had those values. I simply stayed on 250mg test e a week and it normalized.

    So my advice would be this;
    1) see a doctor (as you know and said in the hospital thread, this is not to replace the need to see a doctor, but share our experience so you might find some answers that can lead to questions to the doctor.

    2) from your description of symptoms I might have experienced the same,
    but the sensation I had wasn't that painful, it was more of an ache that I could forget when I moved around. And it didn't hurt to press on the liver.
    Both ALAT and ASAT was about as high as your. Ca 230
    It lasted for several months, as I didn't take it that seriously, I was young and reckless. But while using 250mg test e a week it went away.
    So, since i know you won't totally quit, since you got low natty T, I'd say stop all SARM and all ancillaries. If you really need to use, try a TRT dose of test or if you must cruise use 250mg test e a week max.
    Follow this up with blood tests often.

    If you've had unprotected sex with anyone new remember that while not that common in Norway, there are more than you think who's got hepatitis B which transmits through sexs. Hepatitis C is much more common, but it's very difficult to get hep c with sex, (they don't even recommend a condom if you're in a steady relationship) But it IS possible, if she had her period and you got very sore then..

    Point is you need to rule out diseases and shit as a cause, so do more blood tests.
    And don't use any SARMs , or anything else you have to put in your mouth, only T, and preferably just TRT.
    I'd even say don't use an AI, unless it's from a pharmacy,
    (And at TRT you might not need an AI, or it's no higher than what you can allow for a little time.)

    And don't worry too much, (but check this out!)
    these liver values can easily go higher without it being dangerous,
    but it indicates liver stress, and depending on what that stress is it may lead to nothing or ta lot of different shit.
    Yo obs. Didnt now about ephedrin and prostate. But my psa was fine.

    Ive been to the doc. Because of that burning sensation. He ordered most values and did pressure with his hands to rule out appendix etc
    He just called me sunday to inform about the elevated liverenzym. He also said it was nothing to worry about. But i have never seen this elevation before. When i used superdrol last summer it only jumped up to 100.

    Ive red one of those livervalues may elevate from an other disorder. Muscular issues from lower abdomen etc
    Ill get all my postcycle bloods up today later on.
    Now im feeling fine. When i woke up the pain was almost gone. But it guess it will return. But ive had similar lower rigth abdomen burning pain before. Then i thought i was from an ulcer comming from some strong meth i did before a party. But it healed.

    I didnt want noone to drop the doctore and relie on the "Hospital".
    But i think a forum called Hospital would fit this post better than aas q/a.
    I stil think that. These failures are so important for everyones studies because its often drugsrelated and many tries to hide that part when seeing mainstream help.

    And doctox, ssri can tax the liver significantly.
    Last edited by Silabolin; 02-06-2017 at 12:05 AM.

  10. #10
    DocToxin8's Avatar
    DocToxin8 is offline Knowledgeable Member
    Join Date
    May 2015
    Location
    Land of the screwed
    Posts
    2,157
    It most likely was the SSRI that made those values jump in me, as that was the only thing that had changed. But I stayed on the SSRI (used another type after a while), the time the values returned to normal.

    The ache thing you describe I've had many times in the past,
    but not for many years now.
    I think it's the liver that's telling you "I don't especially like this shit! Please clean up some!" At meats that's what I thought it meant when I had it, on and off over some years. I was so young and reckless then i didn't care much, bloodwork was ok enough and that was all that mattered.

    It seems to me you got the same thing;
    Your liver is telling you to chill out.
    I'd blame any and all oral PEDs you are using.
    And i know you like the SARMs .
    Yes, SARMs aren't supposed to be hepatoxic, but who knows when their used in BB dosages? And also, the SARMs on the market have impurities, some of which may be hepatoxic. (I would think they have very low hepatotoxicity, but when you feel like this, why not use just TRT for a while tombs safe?)

    In essence I would just try to be a bit kind with my life liver for a while if I was you. That's always a good idea regardless.

  11. #11
    Mr.BB's Avatar
    Mr.BB is online now MONITOR
    Join Date
    Apr 2014
    Location
    HOME
    Posts
    6,746
    Quote Originally Posted by Silabolin View Post
    Started 1. desember and continued 8 weeks with test and dbol . Tren 200 in the middle there. 5 weeks. Stopped 31. desember. Just a clomid 50 pct from 10 januar until now. 10 days with nolva. Stil on mk677. HCG 500 every week on cycle.
    Also use 5 mg imovane each day but done it for 5 years and never saw bad livervalues from it.

    PSA was ok from the bloods. But i always piss 4 yimes a nigth. Done it for 3 years so he sent me to a urologist too.
    Im not saying you have a prostate problem, all I said was if you going to do ultrasound just do the whole abdomen, and it can include prostate. Yes, they can analyse prostate through your tummy, they make you drink lots of water and hold your urine, half way through you go to bathroom and they analyse left over urine content in bladder and they can see the prostate size. It just something all men over 40 should do every 5 years... Probably should have explained it better before, ppl immediately think of "anal action" when we mention prostate lol.

    Again, you cannot feel any liver pain, what you feel is your gallbladder. If the duct gets partially obstructed and the bile flow compromised, liver dejects cant be ejected to intestine, making some liver damage elevating transaminases. Steroids will mess with bile flow promoting the formation of cholesterol stones. Ask your doctor for Ursofalk (UCDA, ursodeoxycholic acid) if he doesnt prescribe it.

    Dont think MK677 has anything to do with it, its just something that was accelerated by the cycle.

    Doctoxin, you really never had an abdomen ultrasound??


    EDIT: GGT and bilirubin values would help.

  12. #12
    Silabolin is offline Banned
    Join Date
    May 2015
    Location
    Norway
    Posts
    3,735
    Quote Originally Posted by Mr.BB View Post

    Im not saying you have a prostate problem, all I said was if you going to do ultrasound just do the whole abdomen, and it can include prostate. Yes, they can analyse prostate through your tummy, they make you drink lots of water and hold your urine, half way through you go to bathroom and they analyse left over urine content in bladder and they can see the prostate size. It just something all men over 40 should do every 5 years... Probably should have explained it better before, ppl immediately think of "anal action" when we mention prostate lol.

    Again, you cannot feel any liver pain, what you feel is your gallbladder. If the duct gets partially obstructed and the bile flow compromised, liver dejects cant be ejected to intestine, making some liver damage elevating transaminases. Steroids will mess with bile flow promoting the formation of cholesterol stones. Ask your doctor for Ursofalk (UCDA, ursodeoxycholic acid) if he doesnt prescribe it.

    Dont think MK677 has anything to do with it, its just something that was accelerated by the cycle.

    Doctoxin, you really never had an abdomen ultrasound??

    EDIT: GGT and bilirubin values would help.
    So. ALAT 254 (10-70)
    GT 33 (15-115)
    ASAT also ok
    But white blood cells borderline high.

    The gallbladder kan give ALAT 250?
    Even if the ultrasound show liverdamage i guess it cant tell why.

    I think i stop mk677 and cardarine today. U never know whats inside those bottles.
    And i had no elevation on HGH after 4 weeks with mk677 25 mg each day so..

    Everything else pretty much precycle level. E ven HDL-colestrol.
    BP and heart beat. Prolactin good. Kidneys never been better.

    Damned ALAT.

    Could one heavy drinking party at the end of a dbol run do the damage? I drank a bottle of vodka..at least.
    But 5 weeks.
    And i only did 20 mg each day. With 1200 mg NAC. Strange in my head. Something fishy here. And its not good.
    Last edited by Silabolin; 02-06-2017 at 06:26 AM.

  13. #13
    Mr.BB's Avatar
    Mr.BB is online now MONITOR
    Join Date
    Apr 2014
    Location
    HOME
    Posts
    6,746
    Forget what you did 5 weeks ago on a party, its not related, except if it was unprotected sex ehheheeh.

    The ultrasound doesnt show liver damage, even an MRI has trouble detecting that kind of detail. It will can show if its enlarged and detect nodules, there rest is a bit subjective and can depend on the experience of the doctor performing it.

    Yes gallbladder can give ALT of 250, and even higher if the ducts get completely obstructed. Bile ducts are the waste way of the liver "garbage"!

    Your right about the MK677, we never really know whats inside this vials.

    As said before, dont worry about it too much, when are you doing the ultrasound?

    Also I would stop NAC till you know what it is.

  14. #14
    Silabolin is offline Banned
    Join Date
    May 2015
    Location
    Norway
    Posts
    3,735
    Quote Originally Posted by Mr.BB View Post
    Forget what you did 5 weeks ago on a party, its not related, except if it was unprotected sex ehheheeh.

    The ultrasound doesnt show liver damage, even an MRI has trouble detecting that kind of detail. It will can show if its enlarged and detect nodules, there rest is a bit subjective and can depend on the experience of the doctor performing it.

    Yes gallbladder can give ALT of 250, and even higher if the ducts get completely obstructed. Bile ducts are the waste way of the liver "garbage"!

    Your right about the MK677, we never really know whats inside this vials.

    As said before, dont worry about it too much, when are you doing the ultrasound?

    Also I would stop NAC till you know what it is.
    Yes. Been on nac 600 after cycle but im upping to 1500 now with some milkthistle.

    Guess ill have to wait 1-3 weeks Public free norweigian healtcare isnt that good.

    But i def look into the gallbladderthing. Never crossed my mind. Or my docs. Thanks . You are knowledgeable.

  15. #15
    DocToxin8's Avatar
    DocToxin8 is offline Knowledgeable Member
    Join Date
    May 2015
    Location
    Land of the screwed
    Posts
    2,157
    Quote Originally Posted by Mr.BB View Post
    Im not saying you have a prostate problem, all I said was if you going to do ultrasound just do the whole abdomen, and it can include prostate. Yes, they can analyse prostate through your tummy, they make you drink lots of water and hold your urine, half way through you go to bathroom and they analyse left over urine content in bladder and they can see the prostate size. It just something all men over 40 should do every 5 years... Probably should have explained it better before, ppl immediately think of "anal action" when we mention prostate lol.

    Again, you cannot feel any liver pain, what you feel is your gallbladder. If the duct gets partially obstructed and the bile flow compromised, liver dejects cant be ejected to intestine, making some liver damage elevating transaminases. Steroids will mess with bile flow promoting the formation of cholesterol stones. Ask your doctor for Ursofalk (UCDA, ursodeoxycholic acid) if he doesnt prescribe it.

    Dont think MK677 has anything to do with it, its just something that was accelerated by the cycle.

    Doctoxin, you really never had an abdomen ultrasound??


    EDIT: GGT and bilirubin values would help.
    Never did get an ultrasound no. As I said, I was reckless those years.
    Did bloodwork and since GammaGT was ok no doctor asked anything about the bile flow. I don't think i had anything near cholestasis, just some stress and the body telling me to chill. It wasn't like PAIN, it was an ache.

    I simply thought I had a mild case of hepatitis (inflammation in the liver), and left it at that. In those days I didn't even think about the gallbladder and such.

    I've heard other describe the same symptoms before,
    and let it resolve itself. (After AAS use)
    Though I would ofcourse say to anyone to seek medical attention.
    I think the amount of ache is important here.
    If it goes from ache (really just a sensation) to pain I'd be really worried.

  16. #16
    Silabolin is offline Banned
    Join Date
    May 2015
    Location
    Norway
    Posts
    3,735
    Quote Originally Posted by DocToxin8 View Post
    Never did get an ultrasound no. As I said, I was reckless those years.
    Did bloodwork and since GammaGT was ok no doctor asked anything about the bile flow. I don't think i had anything near cholestasis, just some stress and the body telling me to chill. It wasn't like PAIN, it was an ache.

    I simply thought I had a mild case of hepatitis (inflammation in the liver), and left it at that. In those days I didn't even think about the gallbladder and such.

    I've heard other describe the same symptoms before,
    and let it resolve itself. (After AAS use)
    Though I would ofcourse say to anyone to seek medical attention.
    I think the amount of ache is important here.
    If it goes from ache (really just a sensation) to pain I'd be really worried.
    Mine is stil sensation. And never noticable when lying. And i noticed, when i stress and get upset at work f.i it often turns worse.
    So im more worried about the ALAT. Doc strongly suggested those two were not connected.

  17. #17
    Mr.BB's Avatar
    Mr.BB is online now MONITOR
    Join Date
    Apr 2014
    Location
    HOME
    Posts
    6,746
    Quote Originally Posted by DocToxin8 View Post
    Never did get an ultrasound no. As I said, I was reckless those years.
    Did bloodwork and since GammaGT was ok no doctor asked anything about the bile flow. I don't think i had anything near cholestasis, just some stress and the body telling me to chill. It wasn't like PAIN, it was an ache.

    I simply thought I had a mild case of hepatitis (inflammation in the liver), and left it at that. In those days I didn't even think about the gallbladder and such.

    I've heard other describe the same symptoms before,
    and let it resolve itself. (After AAS use)
    Though I would ofcourse say to anyone to seek medical attention.
    I think the amount of ache is important here.
    If it goes from ache (really just a sensation) to pain I'd be really worried.
    Quote Originally Posted by Silabolin View Post
    Mine is stil sensation. And never noticable when lying. And i noticed, when i stress and get upset at work f.i it often turns worse.
    So im more worried about the ALAT. Doc strongly suggested those two were not connected.
    Cholestasis only has real bad pain when it gets critical (full obstruction), usually presents itself as a burden, hardly noticeable, on the right side just below ribs. It can usually feel a bit stronger by lying on your right side, or by sitting in the car after a meal. As I said, bile is triggered by fatty meals so the feeling usually present it self stronger after heavy meals.

    If your stool is yellowish its pretty much it.

    Not much too worry about, except if it goes critical where you need surgery, thats something that you should be aware of. Dont for get to ask for ursofalk, it helps more than milk thistle, but some doctors are a bit skeptical because so many ppl has it.

  18. #18
    Silabolin is offline Banned
    Join Date
    May 2015
    Location
    Norway
    Posts
    3,735
    We ate a BIG BIG fat sunday bufet yesterday and i drove the car 30 min to come back home. No pain ..or worse than the sensation i usually have.

Thread Information

Users Browsing this Thread

There are currently 1 users browsing this thread. (0 members and 1 guests)

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •