WTF going while in deficit on Tren!

[JuliusPleaser]

So i've posted a few times about me being in calorie deficit and debating to up my tren to 400... So on May 24th I did.

A week later I went from 206, now weighting at 210. I'm getting stronger and leaner...I should be losing a lb of fat per week, but why I'm getting bigger and leaner!? My cals have not changed; they are at 2500 (500 below maintenance). I did however reduce my carbs to 200 g a day, fats upped to 100 grams and protein 200 g, but that's it.

I am also doing NO cardio, but my gym time has increased simply because I feel like training harder and longer. I train for about 2 hrs. My training has only gotten better.

I'm on week 11 of my cycle:

200 cyp (TRT all year)
week 1-10 was 200 tren E
week 11 (now) to 16 will be tren E 400
var 40mg ED which I started on Apr 24 (about over a month ago)

It is possible that I am either growing while in deficit, or simply re-comping? This doesn't make sense.

Pictures below. Left was last week, right was today.

[JuliusPleaser]

Also, lately I've been feeling hungrier and it feels as if my body wants to return to maintenance cals (3000). I almost feel like listening to it, because it seems being in deficit isn't doing shit while on the 400mg tren and I might as well grow (recomp) at maintenance which would yield more muscle than what I could be gaining now...any thoughts?

Also, what BF% do you guys think I'm at. I'm thinking 12% as every other part of my body is virtually shredded, in regards to my legs, gluts, calves; I'm only holding some fat on the bottom of the abs and lower back sides...

[PT1982]

Are you certain the anavar is legit? I only ask because I've been fooled before. I usually always gain weight on cycle unless I use some thermogenics and/or a stim. You could very well be having a recomp. I believe that muscle memory is a real thing. Did you used to be larger? There are several variables here. If you want to know for certain and have time to get to the nitty gritty, I'm sure we'll find the culprit. For me to lose weight while using AAS, my caloric deficit should be substantial and I have to eat several meals through the day. 3 won't cut it for me. I need 5 or more actual meals and I don't use and protein powder at all. And I keep all of my doses much lower than one would typically recommend. When I want to cut, which is rarely, I'll actually lower my trt from 100mgs weekly to 100 and have went to 75mgs. It's still plenty to keep the normal functions in tact. It might not be the safest, but it shouldn't hurt either. Then I'll use a lower dose of tren or npp. 37.5mgs of tren daily or 50mgs of NPP daily or EOD even. I will use masteron at higher doses. I won't use masteron under 600mgs a week. I Jyst don't get a thing from it any lower. But I prefer it at 900-1000mgs a week. Keep in mind I'm only giving you am example of how I have to do this to actually lose weight while being on. I know everyone is different. And I do enjoy anavar at 100mgs daily, but I gain weight on anavar every single time I use it. So I usually won't add it in if I really want to cut weight. And I always use T3 for this. I find 100mcgs to be my sweet spot, but 50-75 might be fine for you. My workout routine is what really changes of everything I do. I don't do any cardio either, but I dio high enough reps that one could argue cardio is involved. I never do a HIT routine, which is hard for me to adjust to since I typically use heavy weights with high intensity and low reps. Heck, since I've went this far, I'll give you what works for me so you'll at least have a reference. I'm not asking you to use this by any means. But I know for a fact it always works for me.

Test E @ 100mgs weekly
Tren A @ 37.5 mgs daily OR
NPP @ 50-75mgs EOD
Mast P @150mgs ED
T3 @ 100mcgs daily
Maybe an ECA stack a couple of times a day to suppress appetite (I don't always use this every day. Sometimes I'll do it daily, some times EOD and sometimes a couple times a week)

I eat at least 5 full meals a day. If my TDEE is say 3200, I'll start at a 500 deficit. If I tolerate that well, and my blood sugar stays up (hence the multiple smaller meals), I'll immediately cut down to a 700-800 deficit and stay there until I need to readjust. As long as I'm getting in my meals, I usually don't have an issue with my sugar dropping. Its a good idea to have glucose tabs of you decide to go on a large deficit right away.

I think that a good time 3 of thumb is to not get too crazy with the AAS and keep the doses low. They are after all used to build muscle. I want to keep my doses low enough to preserve muscle, not build it.

My training goes from 3 sets of 4-6 reps to 4 sets of 8-10 or even 10-12. And I like a full minute in between sets. This is so hard for me to do! Lol.

To be quite honest, if your looking to cut weight (fat) and preserve muscle and still use T3, you would be fine with using your TRT and 100mgs of tren a week. You might add a little muscle, but you're more prone to protect the muscle at those doses while on a strict calorie deficit.

Sorry that was so long. I tried to help even though I gave an example of what works for me. And I think you're close on body fat. I would guess you're 12-15% based off the 2 pictures you posted. Anyways, I hope all of that gibberish helped! Good luck to you.

[MToption2]

I was in the exact same position as you not long ago. I'm also in a large caloric deficit. The weight will come off slowly. For me, cutting on Test is slower than when natural.

You are on 400mg Tren E on top of 200mg Test and 40mg Var!!! You can manage a larger deficit.

[Chicagotarsier]

As to Why...

Technically you are not in a calorie deficit. Tren mobilizes fat at such a rate that you are not going to see a loss until you up the deficit of calories. This is why so many call Tren the recomp drug. It is because they do not understand how powerful Tren is on fat. I find for me it results in 800 ish calories available a day so...for me my calorie deficit has to be over 800 to see any results in overall weightloss while on Tren.

As for you...you are lowering BF percentage but not as straight forward fat loss. Fat will come off slowly but overall weight loss needs a larger deficit.

[JuliusPleaser]

I was at 2200 cals a day, which would make it 800 deficit, with two high cal days of 2500... But then I was having these refeeds twice a week (binges really)... I figured just be straight away and do 500 cal to lose a lb of fat a week...But its clear I am recomping so if I am recomping, then what's the point of shredding....I should shred once the recomp is done, am I right? I may even reach 10% just recomping

[JuliusPleaser]

Thanks. Yes the var is 100% legit lol...

These changes started happening when the tren was upped to 400mg. I'm also getting more sides that I wasn't before on 200mg; one being higher anxiety and sleeping is more difficult.. 200mg was perfect but I wanted to go to 400mg. I'll only be doing this for another 5 weeks then I'm gonna jump off tren switch to masteron

[MToption2]

Thanks. Yes the var is 100% legit lol...

These changes started happening when the tren was upped to 400mg. I'm also getting more sides that I wasn't before on 200mg; one being higher anxiety and sleeping is more difficult.. 200mg was perfect but I wanted to go to 400mg. I'll only be doing this for another 5 weeks then I'm gonna jump off tren switch to masteron

I've read from 4 different users each from a different forum say Mast used alongside Tren reduced most side effects. They claim a synergy exists. I can't explain it.

[NACH3]

I've read from 4 different users each from a different forum say Mast used alongside Tren reduced most side effects. They claim a synergy exists. I can't explain it.

Mast acts as an anti estrogen(not an AI) but enough to help with the aromatize enzyme not bind to the ER as much - and most people use it together hence why 'cut stack' is so popular - prop/ace/mast p but if rather have them each separate to control dosage better imho - hate mixes

[NACH3]

Thanks. Yes the var is 100% legit lol...

These changes started happening when the tren was upped to 400mg. I'm also getting more sides that I wasn't before on 200mg; one being higher anxiety and sleeping is more difficult.. 200mg was perfect but I wanted to go to 400mg. I'll only be doing this for another 5 weeks then I'm gonna jump off tren switch to masteron

I'd start your mast with it now...

[JuliusPleaser]

Whats a decent dose, not too high, not too low... I'm just doing minimal dosages and getting great affects on them

[JuliusPleaser]

Also, should I just go to maintenance, or stick at 2500... It seems to make no difference in performance and I seems that I'm leaning out, so Idk.

[MToption2]

Also, should I just go to maintenance, or stick at 2500... It seems to make no difference in performance and I seems that I'm leaning out, so Idk.

I'd stick at 2500. You won't lose any muscle if that's what you're worried about. My waist has noticeably shrunk since I decided to keep it low. It takes time!

Whats a decent dose, not too high, not too low... I'm just doing minimal dosages and getting great affects on them

Oh boy. Here comes PT1982 explaining how anything less than 700mg a week of Mast is not worth it LOL.

[JuliusPleaser]

lol...

I was thinking to do 600 min

[NACH3]

lol...

I was thinking to do 600 min

That's a nice dose have you ever run mast b4? Are you running prop or Ethanate? I'm guessing prop due to duration of compound

[JuliusPleaser]

I haven't gotten yet.

My guy has mast prop 100mg and mast enanthate 150..

I'll prob take the enanthate as I'm all about mon and thurs injections. I like long esters better.

[PT1982]

That's a nice dose have you ever run mast b4? Are you running prop or Ethanate? I'm guessing prop due to duration of compound

I'll concur. While many articles will say 400mgs weekly is sufficient, I'm left with the thought of "sufficient for what"? I know you're keeping compounds on the low side and getting good effects, so don't think 600mgs is high with masteron. It's actually a moderate dose with all things considered. As expensive as it is, I'd want you to get good effects from it, and 600mgs should do it. I never go under 600. I saw that member Scotchguard uses 200mgs with his trt and gets good results. That would be the only circumstance I could see to run it low because you'll be running it for longer durations. 600 is a great beginner dose, as well as a great advanced dose. I just seem to enjoy mine a bit higher

[JuliusPleaser]

All I can say, the tren at 400mg has been making huge differences... I am however, eating more, again last night, I went over my cals as my body just "felt" like it... These extra cals does have literally no effect on me the next day... I'll weight 213, but then I'll be back to 209.5... So i clearly added muscle from 206.

I'm still experimenting with carb cycling but I'm keeping the calories at 2500 a day, irrespective of the macros... It seems to make no difference in my performance; however, i have added a preworkout carb intake of 50 grams, helps with a pump, then 100 grabs PWO...which does seem to do something different. But utlimatley, if the goal is fat loss (which its supposed to be for me) none of this matters.

But what I have noticed, is these binge nights come every 3-4 days and at night, the tren wants MORE lol...So i give it more lol.

So I'll be doing 300 gram carbs 200 gram protein 56 grams of fat for 3 days on back, legs and arm days; the rest will be 200 c 200 p 100 f on chest, shoulder, and off days... And when days I want to eat higher fats, I'll just play with the macros, probably on off days. But It seems the tren doesn't care what I want to do...

I've been reading if carbs are even necessary as much as we think, and many say no we dont' need them (which is true for survival) but for optimal muscle growth and performance, yes...we do... Although my body works well on both low carb and high carb, I think it makes more logical sense to keep the muscle fuller with glycogen, and ultimately, I'm on the gear so I don't need to resort to natty techniques and methods.

The tren sides are now pretty much gone as my body has become accustomed to the 400mg.

The plan is, when my tren and var run out, I'll run cyp and masteron... I won' stack anything with because I want to see what Masteron does to my body alone at 600mg... I'll be taken masteron enanthate which my lab has at 150mg per cc, so 4 cc a week, splint into mon & thurs shots... if I do stack something, it would be winny, but i dont think its necessary; I want to do one drug at a time to see how my body responds.

Eventually I wanted to "deload" off everything for a few months and maybe just run Primo alone, any thoughts on that? Would give my receptors a break from TRT and all?

[PT1982]

^^^^^Are you asking about using primo in place of trt? And you don't really give receptors a break when on trt. You either need testosterone supplementation or you dont.