Second Cycle: Deca 300 Test 300

whats up everyone.

finished up my first cycle and got unbelievable gains from 500mg of test e per week with NO SIDES! Great experience but I would like to introduce myself to a different compound that is mild but mainly used for bulking. I was thinking Dbol but I do not want the water retention, high estro conversion, etc. I was thinking of running deca alongside test.

here is what I have drawn up for my next cycle:

w 1-12 test 300 (250-350 range)
w 1-12 deca 300 (250-350 range)
w 1-14 caber (.25 or .5) e3d
w 1-14 aromasin 12.5mg eod (or ed if needed)
w 10-14 hcg 500-1000iu last 4 weeks leading up to pct (last 2 weeks of cycle and 2 weeks of letting esters clear)

PCT:
nolvadex 40/40/20/20
clomid 50/50/25/25 (or 75/75/50/50?)

QUESTIONS:

1. If I run deca, how often do YOU recommend I pin? I have heard I can get away with 1 time a week due to the long ester of deca however, will doing this reap any negatives or what should I do instead?

2. Would or should I pin the deca at the same time as the test?

3. What test should I run with deca to pin the least amount of times? (I am okay with test enanthate which would be 2 times a week) Basically I would like to take both compounds in one shot rather than having to do them separately if possible.

Thanks!

BTW Stats:

6'2", 205lbs, ~10%bf, 24 years old, second cycle (first being test e 500), good with dieting to accomplish goals (high self-discipline), good with cardio, weights everyday for 1.5-2 hours

If you have any questions please do not hesitate to ask below! Thanks for reading and please give me honest answers that have my best health interest in mind!

Deca is hardly mild. One shot will shut you down.

Unbelievable gains from tests only? Repeat the cycle. Maybe up to 600mg per week but you really don't need to add add add at this stage.

You have looooooooong workouts, up to 2 hours? Everyday?

I agree with BiB. Do another test only. You will have great results again. A few comments.... When you get to adding multiple compounds, put them all together in the same syringe.
I try to keep the frequency short between pinning just to try and keep the levels consistent. The longer between pins, the bigger the peaks and valleys. This also transmits into more sides. I noticed a big difference with tren.
No AI? HCG is to be taken from the beginning of the cycle 250 iu 2X week. I also include this with the oils in the syringe. Some people do not like to mix water base with oil, but I have not had any bad experiences.
If your workouts are 2 hours, you should increase the intensity and lower the rest period. Think in and out. You do not grow in the gym. You grow outside.


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1. One time per week with deca is fine.
2. Of course
3. Cyp or enth.

That said, BB is on point. There's no reason yet to add in a second compound. And run HCG from week one, not week 10. Makes no sense to shut your boys down.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Back In Black

Deca is hardly mild. One shot will shut you down.

Unbelievable gains from tests only? Repeat the cycle. Maybe up to 600mg per week but you really don't need to add add add at this stage.

You have looooooooong workouts, up to 2 hours? Everyday?

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Okay thank you for the advice. Yes 1.5-2 hour workouts every day and fasted morning cardio every other day when I am trying to lean out. Towards the end of my cycle of test e I gained basically no size for the last 2-3 weeks just recomped while my diet was still on point along with my training. I did gain quite a lot from the beginning of the cycle (first 4-6 weeks) which was strange because my diet and training was the same from before the cycle but the test e hadn't even kicked in at that point (i think). Anyways, I would like to get up to the 230-240 range and I understand this is not a sprint but a marathon however I would like to obviously get bigger than I am now. Would you 100% not recommend deca for a second cycle? Thanks

Quote:

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Originally Posted by charger69

I agree with BiB. Do another test only. You will have great results again. A few comments.... When you get to adding multiple compounds, put them all together in the same syringe.
I try to keep the frequency short between pinning just to try and keep the levels consistent. The longer between pins, the bigger the peaks and valleys. This also transmits into more sides. I noticed a big difference with tren.
No AI? HCG is to be taken from the beginning of the cycle 250 iu 2X week. I also include this with the oils in the syringe. Some people do not like to mix water base with oil, but I have not had any bad experiences.
If your workouts are 2 hours, you should increase the intensity and lower the rest period. Think in and out. You do not grow in the gym. You grow outside.


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AI = aromasin

I have been told staying on HCG for over 8 weeks can burnout the LH and FSH receptors by the body building a tolerance to the hcg. My first cycle I ran 500 iu a week of hcg from week 1-12 and still saw testicular atrophy. I did mix both the hcg and test in the same barrel.

I like my long workouts due to the fun I have in the gym and I like to leave the gym knowing I went hard as possible. I do have moderately high intensity when training on certain days all depends how I am feeling and how the workout is going. I think the longer but average intensity (average for a regular gym go-er) works best with my body.

When do you think is a good time to introduce myself to deca? 3rd or 4th cycle? Thanks!

Quote:

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Originally Posted by kelkel

1. One time per week with deca is fine.
2. Of course
3. Cyp or enth.

That said, BB is on point. There's no reason yet to add in a second compound. And run HCG from week one, not week 10. Makes no sense to shut your boys down.

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If I were to run deca with test e would it be ok to put half of the weeks dose in each shot (150 test e, 150 deca) to make a full 300mg of both per week or would that be bad to do with deca? Would it be better to run 150 test e, 0 deca and then the next pin run 150 test e, 300 deca? Thanks and sorry if that is confusing.

I think I will run the exact same cycle as I did before because I did get such great results. Thanks for the advice guys

You can pin multiple compounds with the same syringe, but prefer not to go over 2.5 ml per shot. I have done 3 ml at once, but prefer not too. I would definitely run test only, you should get great results again.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by bigfish1993

Okay thank you for the advice. Yes 1.5-2 hour workouts every day and fasted morning cardio every other day when I am trying to lean out. Towards the end of my cycle of test e I gained basically no size for the last 2-3 weeks just recomped while my diet was still on point along with my training. I did gain quite a lot from the beginning of the cycle (first 4-6 weeks) which was strange because my diet and training was the same from before the cycle but the test e hadn't even kicked in at that point (i think). Anyways, I would like to get up to the 230-240 range and I understand this is not a sprint but a marathon however I would like to obviously get bigger than I am now. Would you 100% not recommend deca for a second cycle? Thanks

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I don't think you need it. Why would you take the potential long term risks of a deca cycle at 24? What do you add next cycle? And the cycle after? How much are you taking after 5 cycles?

Quote:

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Originally Posted by bigfish1993

AI = aromasin

Aromasin should be dosed daily and will likely need to be higher with a higher test dose.

I have been told staying on HCG for over 8 weeks can burnout the LH and FSH receptors by the body building a tolerance to the hcg. My first cycle I ran 500 iu a week of hcg from week 1-12 and still saw testicular atrophy. I did mix both the hcg and test in the same barrel.

People on TRT generally take 250ius twice per week, 52 weeks of the year. There is no sense to people's logic about only being able to run HCG for short durations. I bet most people suffer some atrophy on cycle but regain full size after.

I like my long workouts due to the fun I have in the gym and I like to leave the gym knowing I went hard as possible. I do have moderately high intensity when training on certain days all depends how I am feeling and how the workout is going. I think the longer but average intensity (average for a regular gym go-er) works best with my body.

No offence, but if you went as hard as possible you'd not be training more than an hour. Can you detail a leg and a chest workout?

When do you think is a good time to introduce myself to deca? 3rd or 4th cycle? Thanks!

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When the test only stops providing results. Test is king in my book and I'd rather run that at higher doses and my second compound lower. Doesn't mean it's right but you don't know what works for you best yet. Run test again, up to 600mg and see how you go. That's a 20% increase.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by bigfish1993

If I were to run deca with test e would it be ok to put half of the weeks dose in each shot (150 test e, 150 deca) to make a full 300mg of both per week or would that be bad to do with deca? Would it be better to run 150 test e, 0 deca and then the next pin run 150 test e, 300 deca? Thanks and sorry if that is confusing.

Either way is fine

I think I will run the exact same cycle as I did before because I did get such great results. Thanks for the advice guys

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Good choice imho, if you want to gain you have to eat more. If you rely on aas to give you gains what happens when you come off? Eat more on cycle to take advantage of the aas and more during and after PCT to try and retain the gains.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Back In Black

I don't think you need it. Why would you take the potential long term risks of a deca cycle at 24? What do you add next cycle? And the cycle after? How much are you taking after 5 cycles?



When the test only stops providing results. Test is king in my book and I'd rather run that at higher doses and my second compound lower. Doesn't mean it's right but you don't know what works for you best yet. Run test again, up to 600mg and see how you go. That's a 20% increase.



Good choice imho, if you want to gain you have to eat more. If you rely on aas to give you gains what happens when you come off? Eat more on cycle to take advantage of the aas and more during and after PCT to try and retain the gains.

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I will take your advice! thanks for taking the time to reply and looking out for my best interest!

Quote:

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Originally Posted by guitarzan

You can pin multiple compounds with the same syringe, but prefer not to go over 2.5 ml per shot. I have done 3 ml at once, but prefer not too. I would definitely run test only, you should get great results again.

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thanks man! I will run test only again and see where it takes me.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Back In Black

Deca is hardly mild. One shot will shut you down.

Unbelievable gains from tests only? Repeat the cycle. Maybe up to 600mg per week but you really don't need to add add add at this stage.

You have looooooooong workouts, up to 2 hours? Everyday?

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way too much training... 3-4 days a week max for bulking IMO and not past 1-1.5hrs IMO. I go 3x a week and do well.

OP as for cycle everything looks good except i would run the test (teste or cyp is fine) for 2 weeks LONGER so deca 12 and test 14wks. i would maybe also just have the caber on hand. ( i have never really needed it but have prami on hand) keeping estrogen in check seems to keep any issue away for me.

I will be runing a similar cycle soon. 300mg deca ew and 400-600mg test ew.

you could go with teste and deca and do in same shot either 1x or 2x a week. some get very worked up with 2 or 3 times a week with teste but iv done it all ways and prefer one shot a week, if i have more volume than I can pin in one shot then ill split it into 2 shots about 3 days apart. FOR ME 1x a week is fine.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by charger69

I agree with BiB. Do another test only. You will have great results again. A few comments.... When you get to adding multiple compounds, put them all together in the same syringe.
I try to keep the frequency short between pinning just to try and keep the levels consistent. The longer between pins, the bigger the peaks and valleys. This also transmits into more sides. I noticed a big difference with tren.
No AI? HCG is to be taken from the beginning of the cycle 250 iu 2X week. I also include this with the oils in the syringe. Some people do not like to mix water base with oil, but I have not had any bad experiences.
If your workouts are 2 hours, you should increase the intensity and lower the rest period. Think in and out. You do not grow in the gym. You grow outside.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

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hcg can be takn at end of cycle before pct or during. both are good ways, specially if you dont care about shrinkage and more so about recovery then at end of cycle is fine .

i agree though go heavy and cut the time in gym, you grow out of the gym, not in it.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Back In Black

I don't think you need it. Why would you take the potential long term risks of a deca cycle at 24? What do you add next cycle? And the cycle after? How much are you taking after 5 cycles?

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A VERY good point, many go off the deep end after the first cycle and are a bit reckless IMO. shit I been using gear for like 10yrs (hrt also) and I am still pretty much gonna do the cycle he just posted haha, no need to go crazy. I mean I have dabbled in differing cycles and amounts and yet find good ol test or test and deca at about this dose to be just as good (and cheaper) than alot of these crazy cycles i see posted ( or have tried myself) i wont lie i like test closer to 750mg ew, but 500 is good also.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Juced_porkchop

hcg can be takn at end of cycle before pct or during. both are good ways, specially if you dont care about shrinkage and more so about recovery then at end of cycle is fine .

i agree though go heavy and cut the time in gym, you grow out of the gym, not in it.

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The reason that you take it throughout the cycle is to keep the boys working. If you do not, You run the risk of not starting up again or even becoming sterile. If you take it at the end of the cycle you are probably talking about taking much larger amounts which can desensitize them.
It's all a game of risk. I like to keep my risk as low as possible.


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Definitely not during PCT. during PCT you are trying to get natural and things started again. HCG stops the natural start up.
It is really contradictory to say that you are using HCG during PCT.


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