Decanoate esters- how do they work?

**Obs** · 11-24-2017, 05:05 PM

Originally Posted by workingout123

Umm we already established the industry lie is to say all other forms of creatine are not as good as mono. The lie extends all the way to the literature. However the lie is not in the patents. In there they say the reality of mono that it all converts to creatinine in the stomach, causes stomach cramps, liver, and kidney problems etc.

Says a guy who probably thinks he is better than everyone else because of his big muscles he got not mainly due to working but simply just injecting steroids a few times a week. Right....

Well tokkyo nutrition must be the real genius or the chemist who first made creatine decanoate ester. Not that it would be hard. Maybe simpletones like you think it is though.

I don't have big muscles. You have totally shit on some guys with enormous muscles though.

**hammerheart** · 11-24-2017, 05:05 PM

Hey, it's me or someone here defo sounds like a rep for this creatine deca ?

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**workingout123** · 11-24-2017, 05:08 PM

I originally came here thinking because body builders inject steroid ester decanoates they would give some good information on ester decanoates, and also creatine decanoate. I learned quickly no one (except the person who said they took it, and it was good thanks) really wants to help but just sell creatine monohydrate which is the same BS on all the other forums. Now I am forced to refute lie after lie about creatine.

**workingout123** · 11-24-2017, 05:09 PM

I don't have big muscles. You have totally shit on some guys with enormous muscles though.

You, and 99% of other steroid takers probably suffer from small man syndrome too.

**Obs** · 11-24-2017, 05:13 PM

Originally Posted by workingout123

You, and 99% of other steroid takers probably suffer from small man syndrome too.

Yes I do suffer from a little man syndrome but I have reported him and am waiting for him to be banned.

**almostgone** · 11-24-2017, 05:14 PM

Originally Posted by workingout123

Umm we already established the industry lie is to say all other forms of creatine are not as good as mono. The lie extends all the way to the literature. However the lie is not in the patents. In there they say the reality of mono that it all converts to creatinine in the stomach, causes stomach cramps, liver, and kidney problems etc.

Says a guy who probably thinks he is better than everyone else because of his big muscles he got not mainly due to working but simply just injecting steroids a few times a week. Right....

Well tokkyo nutrition must be the real genius or the chemist who first made creatine decanoate ester. Not that it would be hard. Maybe simpletones like you think it is though.

I posted a scholarly reference based on a real study and you come back with that. Woooow, I was wrong, you need waaaaay more help than someone trying to help you/ keep you from wasting your $$. But anyway, have a great experience with your creatine.

**almostgone** · 11-24-2017, 05:22 PM

Originally Posted by ghettoboyd

I cant even believe the patience of you guys trying to talk sense into this guy...why are you all wasting your time?... he is obviously smarter than all of us and is onto some groundbreaking game changing revolutionary shit here we all should listen close and learn...I for one and throwing all my gear away and jumping on the real deca=creatine deconate...thank you op for overthinking this and re-inventing the wheel for us all...

I know, Ghetto. I've been in a decent mood despite working like a madman the past week or two have been working on finding my "Zen". Should've gone in a more productive direction , I believe.

**workingout123** · 11-24-2017, 05:24 PM

Originally Posted by almostgone

I posted a scholarly reference based on a real study and you come back with that. Woooow, I was wrong, you need waaaaay more help than someone trying to help you/ keep you from wasting your $$. But anyway, have a great experience with your creatine.

Don't play dumb. You are an industry insider. You could tell me how it really works not the other way around. It is very easy- the studies on mono are fraudulent either just to sell it or because all the business owners are misanthropes, and enjoy selling ineffective, dangerous supplements such as creatine monohydrate. And soooo many body builders waste so much of their money on monohydrate, BCAAs, whey protein etc. Why don't you help them not waste money?

**almostgone** · 11-24-2017, 05:33 PM

Originally Posted by workingout123

Don't play dumb. You are an industry insider. You could tell me how it really works not the other way around. It is very easy- the studies on mono are fraudulent either just to sell it or because all the business owners are misanthropes, and enjoy selling ineffective, dangerous supplements such as creatine monohydrate. And soooo many body builders waste so much of their money on monohydrate, BCAAs, whey protein etc. Why don't you help them not waste money?

Ok, I'll give this one more try. Read slowly and try not to move your lips when you read.

This was a study done at Department of Health, Human Performance and Recreation, Baylor University. The study was posted in the Journal of the International Society of Sports Nutrition. This is posted on a government website.
You keep clamoring about industry hype, yet you espouse Tokkyo Nutrition and your greatest reference is Tokkyo Nutrition. Your posts are the epitome of industry hype.

**almostgone** · 11-24-2017, 05:42 PM

Also, workingout123, I believe you referred to a member as a simpleton earlier. It would be best to drop that kind of behaviour.

**kronik420** · 11-25-2017, 05:12 AM

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all that creatine

**almostgone** · 11-25-2017, 05:44 AM

Originally Posted by kronik420

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all that creatine

Nice!!!

**GearHeaded** · 11-25-2017, 01:40 PM

Originally Posted by workingout123

Don't play dumb. You are an industry insider. You could tell me how it really works not the other way around. It is very easy- the studies on mono are fraudulent either just to sell it or because all the business owners are misanthropes, and enjoy selling ineffective, dangerous supplements such as creatine monohydrate. And soooo many body builders waste so much of their money on monohydrate, BCAAs, whey protein etc. Why don't you help them not waste money?

I'd venture to say its probably not real bodybuilders that waste their money on this stuff , its kids like you.
The reason you are 150 pounds and the average guy on this forum reps out more then twice your body weight on bench press is because we spend our $ on FOOD and STEROIDS and train consistently , thats what works

I just dropped over $600 this morning on a couple bottles of stuff, and no it wasn't creatine . and I'll probably drop another $300 at the grocery store this evening.
I don't believe it to be a waste of $ on fake supplements

**David LoPan** · 11-25-2017, 02:20 PM

Originally Posted by workingout123

I originally came here thinking because body builders inject steroid ester decanoates they would give some good information on ester decanoates, and also creatine decanoate. I learned quickly no one (except the person who said they took it, and it was good thanks) really wants to help but just sell creatine monohydrate which is the same BS on all the other forums. Now I am forced to refute lie after lie about creatine.

Decanoate can be called a lot of different names like decylic acid, decanoic acid, capric acid, nonanecarboxylic acid, etc. This ester is used a lot with a hormone called nandrolone , aka Deca -Durabolin . I am 99% sure it is used in Sustanon as well. It is just an ester used to keep blood levels uniformed over a long peroid of time. All esters are all amost the same thing but they vary on the way they reduce AAS water solubiloity.

Creatinine (creatine anhydride) is a breakdown product of creatine phosphate in muscle. The loss of water molecule from creatine results in the formation of creatinine. So to answer you question about "Deca Creatine", it is just a marketing tactic like a number of people have already told you. If you had been reading what other have been saying about creatine you would see that you have been caught in a marking ploy and you are thinking that yout right and you are looking for justifications for buying creatine with the word deca in it.

If your kidney function is normal and you have a healthy diet then you have no need for a long releasing creatine.

**kelkel** · 11-25-2017, 06:56 PM

Originally Posted by GearHeaded

I'd venture to say its probably not real bodybuilders that waste their money on this stuff , its kids like you.

Bingo.

**hollowedzeus** · 11-27-2017, 03:58 AM

Trust me

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**cousinmuscles** · 11-27-2017, 04:28 AM

Originally Posted by hollowedzeus

Trust me

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Oh that's you? Cool.

**workingout123** · 11-30-2017, 07:21 PM

The thing that is better than creatine decanoate is home made liposomal magnesium creatine chelate using a blender, and ultrasonic jewellery cleaner. It's solubility is low though only 3g/100ml. I will be experimenting with adding ethanol or DMSO to improve its solublity.

**David LoPan** · 11-30-2017, 07:35 PM

Originally Posted by workingout123

The thing that is better than creatine decanoate is home made liposomal magnesium creatine chelate using a blender, and ultrasonic jewellery cleaner. It's solubility is low though only 3g/100ml. I will be experimenting with adding ethanol or DMSO to improve its solublity.

Why? What is the point?

**workingout123** · 11-30-2017, 07:47 PM

To deliver creatine direclty into cells bypassing the digestion, first pass metabolism in the liver, and creatine transporters on cell membranes. It is commonly done with vit c, glutathione, and curcumin but is difficult with creatine because the most common form monohydrate quickly converts to creatinine in water where as mag cre chelate does not. I guess it could be done with steroid hormones also... WOW that would be strong... turn someone into the hulk. I can give details how to make liposomal nutrients if interested.

**GearHeaded** · 11-30-2017, 08:35 PM

Originally Posted by workingout123

improve its solublity.
I guess it could be done with steroid hormones also... WOW that would be strong... turn someone into the hulk.

making a steroid hormone more water soluble would not make it strong , it would make it weak . it wouldn't survive the first pass of the liver and would be destroyed . Thats why they are 17-alpha-alkylated

**Obs** · 11-30-2017, 08:44 PM

Originally Posted by GearHeaded

making a steroid hormone more water soluble would not make it strong , it would make it weak . it wouldn't survive the first pass of the liver and would be destroyed . Thats why they are 17-alpha-alkylated

Don't piss on his dreams. Creatine is a miracle above all steroids and he is gonna make some real shit in his blender off a reddit article. Someday we will be big like him. We don't know a damn thing. I mean really... Look at us... We are pathetic juicemonkeys with littleman syndrome.

Off to do chest and back. I think there was a couple grams of creatine in my arginine i just took. I credit any and all gains to that powdery creatine God tonight. That pocket of tren in my ass is meaningless.

**workingout123** · 11-30-2017, 08:56 PM

Originally Posted by GearHeaded

making a steroid hormone more water soluble would not make it strong , it would make it weak . it wouldn't survive the first pass of the liver and would be destroyed . Thats why they are 17-alpha-alkylated

I was referring to mag cre chelate which is more lipid soluble than water soluble. I had only been using glycerol which is a water not lipid soluble solvent for the liposomal mix but I will add a little DMSO or ethanol as a lipid soluble solvent, and try get the mix to 10g/100ml mag cre chelate.

Originally Posted by Obspowerstroke

Don't piss on his dreams. Creatine is a miracle above all steroids and he is gonna make some real shit in his blender off a reddit article. Someday we will be big like him. We don't know a damn thing. I mean really... Look at us... We are pathetic juicemonkeys with littleman syndrome.

Off to do chest and back. I think there was a couple grams of creatine in my arginine i just took. I credit any and all gains to that powdery creatine God tonight. That pocket of tren in my ass is meaningless.

I don't take steroids or even work out I am making liposomal creatine to try to find a cure for a severe genetic disease- creatine transporter deficiency. If you are trying to say creatine powders mixed in water are a scam yes I agree.

**Obs** · 11-30-2017, 09:56 PM

Originally Posted by workingout123

I was referring to mag cre chelate which is more lipid soluble than water soluble. I had only been using glycerol which is a water not lipid soluble solvent for the liposomal mix but I will add a little DMSO or ethanol as a lipid soluble solvent, and try get the mix to 10g/100ml mag cre chelate.

I don't take steroids or even work out I am making liposomal creatine to try to find a cure for a severe genetic disease- creatine transporter deficiency. If you are trying to say creatine powders mixed in water are a scam yes I agree.

I think creatine as a supplement is basically useless. Food is best. Other than that maybe you will develop something more effective. Its generally people who were scoffed at that do make the ground breaking discoveries that make life better.

I am no scientist I am a meathead first and foremost. My nerdiness goes bye bye at a certain point. Don't stop. Keep researching and I actually do hope you develop something absolutely life changing.

Please make me something that works better than tren .
Even if you don't do something life saving you will learn a lot. Good luck

**workingout123** · 11-30-2017, 10:01 PM

Thank you

I plan to let body builders know if I do develop a good home made liposomal form so that they can make it also. Sorry won't be doing research on steroid hormones - to harmful to the body. Only interested in safe substances.

**GearHeaded** · 11-30-2017, 10:35 PM

Originally Posted by workingout123

Sorry won't be doing research on steroid hormones - to harmful to the body. Only interested in safe substances.

without steroid hormones the world would be a much more painful, diseased, and sick place . Steroids save millions of lives and treat a host of diseases and ailments. From an allergic reaction , to bone and muscle wasting disease , to burn victims in the ER. Steroids help save lives and treat and prevent diseases .

if you have something better and more powerful in mind , more power to you then, but Steroids are going to be hard to beat

**hammerheart** · 11-30-2017, 11:02 PM

Originally Posted by GearHeaded

without steroid hormones the world would be a much more painful, diseased, and sick place . Steroids save millions of lives and treat a host of diseases and ailments. From an allergic reaction , to bone and muscle wasting disease , to burn victims in the ER. Steroids help save lives and treat and prevent diseases .

if you have something better and more powerful in mind , more power to you then, but Steroids are going to be hard to beat

I like your thinking.

**workingout123** · 12-01-2017, 01:09 AM

Originally Posted by GearHeaded

without steroid hormones the world would be a much more painful, diseased, and sick place . Steroids save millions of lives and treat a host of diseases and ailments. From an allergic reaction , to bone and muscle wasting disease , to burn victims in the ER. Steroids help save lives and treat and prevent diseases .

if you have something better and more powerful in mind , more power to you then, but Steroids are going to be hard to beat

Yep agree. I mean body builders regularly injecting the anabolic steroids which shorten life span, and cause all the other health problems.

**Obs** · 12-01-2017, 01:45 AM

Originally Posted by workingout123

Yep agree. I mean body builders regularly injecting the anabolic steroids which shorten life span, and cause all the other health problems.

Not all of us are interested in living a risk free, safe life.

For some it is better to live a day as a lion than live a thousand years a pussy.
https://youtu.be/bUytYjoRFlI
Watch Seth from 5:30-7:30