Advice for first test prop cycle

[Mr.Waffles]

I am 31 years
I have been training for approx 3 years . I am planning my first cycle and want to do it the right way! I plan on running test prop at 200 a week to

[Mr.Waffles]

I am 31 y

[Couchlockd]

1st- your 5'6" and 210. either your jacked and a beast, or very high body fat.

I'm not going to parrot "you can't cycle with that high body fat" as I think its bullshit. but that height and weight if not a jacked beast says diet and training aren't optimized yet. steroids won't fill in those blanks.

2- 200 mg a week is not worth a cycle, go 400-500 weekly out the gate and keep it that dose.

run prop every other day at 100 mg. go 8-10 weeks.

hello

[Dannyboy51577]

Im with hornbuckle on this one- i understand the idea of bf playing a role -but started my first cycle in a very long time about 5 wks ago. Bf in the mid 20's. Prop at 150mg eod, incr to 100mg ed. Im already slimmer, down bf%, feeling great, and adding muscle right in front of my eyes. And although i understand the viewpoint of alot of vets and experienced guys-i just disagree that steroids cant fill that blank. I dont have the training experience or dieting expertise any of you guys have, but i made alot of changes very recently in diet and training and am making progress each week. Alot of the advice and mindset here and and all over the internet is bodybuilding based. But what gets overlooked constantly is tge overwhelming majority of aas users in this day and age are not bodybuilders, and not looking to be bodybuilders. They are 30 something and 40 something year old guys, casual aas users, looking for a little better build, a little better physique, a little better than they are now. And so far im an experiment of my own that goes against alot of what is said to be the guidelines for aas use, and it working out fantastic for me. Yes i am only 1 person, but i fit the exact mold of the overwhelming majority of new age aas users.

I also agree, the 200-300mg/wk is kinda a waste. Its not that far above trt dose. If you are looking to just increase your test to feel better then by all means have at it. If you are looking to do it for muscle building or performance reasons, then you will want to be at 500 or better per wk

[Austinc54]

I have never done test prop, but I do know about it, it is Great for cutting compared to test enanthate or test cynpiote. Which one you take depends on what you want to do I’m assuming you want to cut since you’re weighing in heavy on your side and I don’t know your body fat. Aromasin is AI pct for a test cycle alone and then for a post cycle therapy (pct) I suggest nolvadex . I personally prefer test e or test c since you don’t have to stick as much. A liver support such as milk thistle 1300mg once a day would help even though you’re not taking any orals. And if you want less side affects just stick with 200 prop even though 300 is still pretty low I personally have taken 325mg/1ml a week by only injecting .5cc two a week for less side affects but cardio still kills my calves but I don’t have any other negative affects. On cycle you don’t need to diet to notice gains but I don’t suggest it. I hope my rambling helped a little good luck

[Austinc54]

Im with hornbuckle on this one- i understand the idea of bf playing a role -but started my first cycle in a very long time about 5 wks ago. Bf in the mid 20's. Prop at 150mg eod, incr to 100mg ed. Im already slimmer, down bf%, feeling great, and adding muscle right in front of my eyes. And although i understand the viewpoint of alot of vets and experienced guys-i just disagree that steroids cant fill that blank. I dont have the training experience or dieting expertise any of you guys have, but i made alot of changes very recently in diet and training and am making progress each week. Alot of the advice and mindset here and and all over the internet is bodybuilding based. But what gets overlooked constantly is tge overwhelming majority of aas users in this day and age are not bodybuilders, and not looking to be bodybuilders. They are 30 something and 40 something year old guys, casual aas users, looking for a little better build, a little better physique, a little better than they are now. And so far im an experiment of my own that goes against alot of what is said to be the guidelines for aas use, and it working out fantastic for me. Yes i am only 1 person, but i fit the exact mold of the overwhelming majority of new age aas users.

I also agree, the 200-300mg/wk is kinda a waste. Its not that far above trt dose. If you are looking to just increase your test to feel better then by all means have at it. If you are looking to do it for muscle building or performance reasons, then you will want to be at 500 or better per wk

If you could find your natural test levels that would help you find out how much test you personally need everyone is different I believe the normal range is 350-850 or so and depending on what you do you don’t need to do much test especially if you are stacking anything, but I do agree with him on it’s not worth just doing test if your body fat is really high unless you run win or anavar

[redz]

The blind leading the blind. There is nothing useful here and no one should be cycling at mid 20’s bf% come on..... I don’t even know what else to say there’s so much bs in this thread.

[Mr.Waffles]

Thank you guys for your input . I'm not jacked but, you can definitely tell I lift. I have been plateaud for a while on mian lifts . I'm not a fat ass . I am short and barrel chested . There is so much contradictory information about what dose to start at . I planned on starting at 200 a week every 3 days . Then if all is well upping it to end. I am curious about my body fat %.

[Couchlockd]

The blind leading the blind. There is nothing useful here and no one should be cycling at mid 20’s bf% come on..... I don’t even know what else to say there’s so much bs in this thread.

what about every single powerlifyers walking the face of the earth, reds?

I didn't realize it said "only use at 15% body fat or less," can you help me find that, as I don't know were they printed it on the Watson box or the accompanying papers

[Couchlockd]

I'm, ust curious, as I see majority of "vets" threads and lots of them start at 20% or better.

just go look in the January competition thread. almost every single guy was 20 or more.

[Mr.Waffles]

I am patient guys . I will check body fat % and post blood test results when I go.

I want to do this the right way . I don't want my family and friends to even know, is the reason why I want to do a mild 1st cycle . I know there are better compounds where I don't have to pin as much but, test prop is what I have .

[Dannyboy51577]

Redz- no disrespect at all, i know you are very knowledgeable on alot of different topics-i read alot of your posts and learn from them.

But why not? Im 40 yo, i was never into bodybuilding and i never will be. Im not looking to get ripped and shredded to the point of competition, not what im doing it for. I have low t, and was going round in circles with doctors for quite some time, trying to get the proper help. Not there yet.

I have experience with aas, albeit quite some time ago. Like i said, there is a overwhelmingly large number of people who are now considered social steroid users, and that number is growing. Its wall street guys, or union guys, or the guy that cleans up your local gym-that have entered the world of aas, like it or not. Not bodybuilders- people deciding to go this route for different reasons. And the people im talking about arent pro trained, dont have the experience, or diet, or training, and get the results they are looking for.

Just because it may not be the best way, doesnt mean theres only one way. I understand theres a certain way to go about being a bodybuilder, a pro, a top notch fitness guru. But that doesnt mean the same path needs to be followed by everyone. Cmon. How can you say its bs? I decided to go my own route until i get things square with trt, and since, ive dropped bf, gained some muscle, and getting in better physical shape. Is this bad, of course not. And just because it isnt being done the way that some people prefer, or think is the best way in their experienced opinion.

Im not some 19yo kid that doesnt understand aas, blood levels, pulling bw, ai's, protocol, etc etc. So why is this such bs to alot of you guys. And what i would like to accomplish is nowhere near what most of you guys are working on, but if i am getting to where i want to be, whats the prob?

[MACKATTACK]

Prop and virgin muscle for a first cycle, lmao........have fun with that

[Dannyboy51577]

Yeah im with ya horn- maybe i have a slanted view- but a guy that gets injured or gets away from working out for various reasons get supported when he gets back in after a year or 5 years- an average joe gets criticized. Its not like im shooting from the hip or doing this on the fly, but still get treated like it. They can say what they want- i have a plan, knowledge, info, and crazy motivation. Isnt gonna stop me from the path im on, the results i want to get, or how i go about it. Ill keep to myself, do my thing, and leave the forum talk and advice giving to the pro's here and mind my own business and stay out of it, because apparently the way im doing it is bullshit.

[Couchlockd]

Yeah im with ya horn- maybe i have a slanted view- but a guy that gets injured or gets away from working out for various reasons get supported when he gets back in after a year or 5 years- an average joe gets criticized. Its not like im shooting from the hip or doing this on the fly, but still get treated like it. They can say what they want- i have a plan, knowledge, info, and crazy motivation. Isnt gonna stop me from the path im on, the results i want to get, or how i go about it. Ill keep to myself, do my thing, and leave the forum talk and advice giving to the pro's here and mind my own business and stay out of it, because apparently the way im doing it is bullshit.

one thing,

SHOW ME ONE PRO IN HERE........*crickets*

these guys aren't pros, the few that were here are ran off because they talk about cycles that don't follow someone else's protocol.

[Octaneforce]

Jeez this thread went off the rails lol.
OP, read this sticky

https://forums.steroid.com/anabolic-...rst-cycle.html

Follow that protocol and you should do just fine. If you want to use test prop just be aware that you might get some major PIP (post injection pain). Cyp and E are much smoother and require less frequent injections, which is why its reccomended for new guys.

Get everything in order. Test, hcg , ai, pct, needles, prep pads, everything. Even go food shopping! Lol. Food is your best friend. Eat lots of clean meats, eggs, olive oil, oatmeal, etc. sure not all of us are trying to be pros but getting on the sauce greatly improves the quality of life when done propery. Nothing wrong with adding some kick to your recreational bodybuilding.

[redz]

There’s a right way and a wrong way. Your choice but you further risk health complications instead of learning how to do things properly. If you can’t get into reasonable shape naturally then it’s just not worth the risk. Blood, sweat and tears you know hard work and sacrifice that is the path to greatness. Using steroids and ending up in worse shape than natural lifters makes no sense to me but hey it’s your life.

[Mr.Waffles]

Jeez this thread went off the rails lol.
OP, read this sticky

https://forums.steroid.com/anabolic-...rst-cycle.html

Follow that protocol and you should do just fine. If you want to use test prop just be aware that you might get some major PIP (post injection pain). Cyp and E are much smoother and require less frequent injections, which is why its reccomended for new guys.

Get everything in order. Test, hcg, ai, pct, needles, prep pads, everything. Even go food shopping! Lol. Food is your best friend. Eat lots of clean meats, eggs, olive oil, oatmeal, etc. sure not all of us are trying to be pros but getting on the sauce greatly improves the quality of life when done propery. Nothing wrong with adding some kick to your recreational bodybuilding.

Thank you for the information. I know all to well fitness success is about diet . Eating quality over quantity. Once again all I have access to is prop. . I'm not scared of pain . I am choosing to lower my body fat drop around 15 lbs then start . I'm not trying to be a pro I just want to look good and get some strength gains.

I'm by no means a rookie in the gym . 6-7 years ago I was 300+lbs. Around 260 last year . I chose now to eat lean meats and quality carbs and fats. I understand that this isn't going to magically change everything.

My gym partner has a few cycles under his belt and has been mentoring me and training together for well over a year . He told me that I will absolutely blow up because of the way we train ( drop sets , time under tension , intensity) I all ready can bench press close to 3 plates , deadlift high 4s and squat 405 for acouple good reps.

I am not going to start until I have EVERYTHING , all I need now is hcg AE and pct but not sure where to aquire.. thank you all for your quick responses.

[Mr.Waffles]

Nevermind , but how do I delete posts?

[almostgone]

You would have less E2 conversion @ a lower bodyfat %. With that being said, I have know many people that ran prop for their first cycle.

[Mr.Waffles]

Should I shoot for under 20%?

[almostgone]

Should I shoot for under 20%?

That would.be a good goal.

[Dannyboy51577]

Octane and almost are most definitely right on with their advice. And the sticky has correct and valuable info for guys starting out or limited experience or knowledge of steroids .

But everyone doesnt have to fit in this little box.

Right way and wrong way? Risking health complications? We are injecting steroids into pir body- not sure what level of risk you are co.fortable with, but thats high enough risk on its own.

Not worth the risk? To who?

Path to greatness? Cmon already. This isnt a robbins seminar

Use steroids and end up in worse shape than natural lifters? Not unless im using and sittin on the couch eatin cheetos all day

Im not a lifter, im not a pro, im not a bodybuilder, im not a competitor. Im a 40yo, father of 2, with low t, a more than full time job, who has experience in previous years with certain steroids. Which is what i stick to. Im sorry i dont fit into the box that some would like everyone to fit in before shootin steroids in their ass. I stay in my lane, keep my levels in check, pull bloodwork more than is necessary, get my time in at the gym, eat as well as i can.

Its great for young guys just getting into it, who are looking to get to a high level, to get the advice and knowledge of alot of the guys here, much of it is invaluable. But to try to stuff everyone is in the same box, name call and talk down to people who dont choose to follow the path that you deem the right path, criticize what they choose to do or not do, is what makes alot of inexperienced people avoid posting, avoid asking, avoid being involved, and walk away from this forum and the actual valid and valuable knowledge. Because they dont want to be the object of the down talk and bullshit.

I could give two shits if i fit the mold of what some people think i should- i feel better than i have in 10 years, refocused on being in shape, already seeing decreased bf and drastic results compared to previous. And im dedicated and motivated to hit the point that i want to hit, not what someone else thinks i should hit. So you keep doing what makes you feel good about yourself, and ill keep doing my thing. And no doubt when i get there, ill be the first to show why its adviseable but not an end all be all, to fit a certain mold or play within the lines that soneone else draws for you

[almostgone]

Octane and almost are most definitely right on with their advice. And the sticky has correct and valuable info for guys starting out or limited experience or knowledge of steroids .

But everyone doesnt have to fit in this little box.

Right way and wrong way? Risking health complications? We are injecting steroids into pir body- not sure what level of risk you are co.fortable with, but thats high enough risk on its own.

Not worth the risk? To who?

Path to greatness? Cmon already. This isnt a robbins seminar

Use steroids and end up in worse shape than natural lifters? Not unless im using and sittin on the couch eatin cheetos all day

Im not a lifter, im not a pro, im not a bodybuilder, im not a competitor. Im a 40yo, father of 2, with low t, a more than full time job, who has experience in previous years with certain steroids. Which is what i stick to. Im sorry i dont fit into the box that some would like everyone to fit in before shootin steroids in their ass. I stay in my lane, keep my levels in check, pull bloodwork more than is necessary, get my time in at the gym, eat as well as i can.

Its great for young guys just getting into it, who are looking to get to a high level, to get the advice and knowledge of alot of the guys here, much of it is invaluable. But to try to stuff everyone is in the same box, name call and talk down to people who dont choose to follow the path that you deem the right path, criticize what they choose to do or not do, is what makes alot of inexperienced people avoid posting, avoid asking, avoid being involved, and walk away from this forum and the actual valid and valuable knowledge. Because they dont want to be the object of the down talk and bullshit.

I could give two shits if i fit the mold of what some people think i should- i feel better than i have in 10 years, refocused on being in shape, already seeing decreased bf and drastic results compared to previous. And im dedicated and motivated to hit the point that i want to hit, not what someone else thinks i should hit. So you keep doing what makes you feel good about yourself, and ill keep doing my thing. And no doubt when i get there, ill be the first to show why its adviseable but not an end all be all, to fit a certain mold or play within the lines that soneone else draws for you

We do try to keep the downtalk and bullshit to a minimum here because it is soooo counterproductive. You're right, we all aren't cookie cutter entities that fit into one perfect mold.
However, we do try to help people mitigate the risks as much as possible.
You have an advantage being on TRT that many of the younger guys don't have. I am on TRT as well, and I assume you are like me; you know your labwork frontwards and backwards, know when to adjust your dosage and when to bump it down, and when it is time to donate blood, etc.
Stick around and help us provide some proactive feedback to these younger guys, so they get some support instead of getting snippy replies, etc.

[Mr.Waffles]

Thank you guys . I feel I have more to learn before I start. I ignore the snippy replies .

Do you regret running cycles when you were younger and what age did you start? .

I personally want to run a cycle once or twice a year .
I know very little about blood work .

[Couchlockd]

Prop and virgin muscle for a first cycle, lmao........have fun with that

says the guy cutting test c 250 with grape seed oil.

[Couchlockd]

Mr. Waffles your picture you showed me says your body fats absolutely fine to start a cycle

[almostgone]

Thank you guys . I feel I have more to learn before I start. I ignore the snippy replies .

Do you regret running cycles when you were younger and what age did you start? .

I personally want to run a cycle once or twice a year .
I know very little about blood work .

Re: the blood work, read the sticky that was mentioned earlier, it will help some:
https://forums.steroid.com/anabolic-...rst-cycle.html

If you really want to get deeper into the subject, visit the TRT forum and do some reading. Not everything will apply to a cycle, but it is still good info and will help you get a better understanding, IMHO. Just keep in mind that it is geared more towards us old farts on TRT.

[GearHeaded]

My gym partner has a few cycles under his belt and has been mentoring me

someone with a 'few' cycles under his belt is your mentor !??

Thats like my 16 year old getting driving lessons from her friend cause her friend has been driving for 3 months.

Personally I'd look to someone with a good 30+ cycles under his belt and a decade or two studying AAS as a mentor ,, keep your buddies or gym partners as buddies and kick ideas off them and shoot the shit with them. but don't be mentored by someone that needs mentored himself .

[Dannyboy51577]

Sorry guys, i did not mean to go off on a tangent, my apologies.

Waffles, i did my first cycle at 22. Dont regret it one bit. Unfortunately we didnt have alot of the info or pct available then like you guys do now. And you really need to take advantage of that info and these guys that can answer alot of the questions for ya.

You are gonna learn alot of stuff first hand- how ur first pin did or didnt hurt, ehat pip is, why your body likes this dose and not that dose, etc etc. But If there is one suggestion i would make - it wouldnt be what compound to run or what needle size to use- it would be learn how to get your bloodworl done, what it means, how to adjust for differemces in levels, etc. It is probably the most invaluable tool you will have at your disposal. I run bloods much more than is necessary, i generally spend more on my bloodwork than on my gear per cycle. But im anal about it. I dont mind experimenting with dosages, combos, etc, but i will pull bloods after each and every change i make. Im only 5 wks into my current run test/deca and ive had bloods pulled 3 times. Im adding winny at a later date and will pull bloods 2 more times at least before im done. I dont mind spending that money one bit. Once you learn where your levels should be and what to look for, its just a matter of fine tuning your own body to get at whatever level you want to be.

[Mr.Waffles]

someone with a 'few' cycles under his belt is your mentor !??

Thats like my 16 year old getting driving lessons from her friend cause her friend has been driving for 3 months.

Personally I'd look to someone with a good 30+ cycles under his belt and a decade or two studying AAS as a mentor ,, keep your buddies or gym partners as buddies and kick ideas off them and shoot the shit with them. but don't be mentored by someone that needs mentored himself .

. He isn't planning my cycle or anything like that he gave me basic info on blood work , pct and anti e . So talking to someone who has more experience then me is silly ? Please tell me how I can walk up to someone and ask them about gear period? 30+ cycles ? .

He is mainly a good reliable gym partner brother . I came here to further my education. . I will listen to any information anyone gives me . Then use my own judgement .

You have no clue he needs mentored . Making that assumption is silly.

[GearHeaded]

ok maybe "mentoring" or "mentor" is not the right terminology. I've paid $ to top pro level coaches to learn from them and teach me over the past decade. thats what I consider mentoring.
talking to a gym buddy is something entirely different I'm sure he is a good dude and knows some stuff about training , but 3 cycles under his belt , come on he can't be considered an AAS mentor .

[Mr.Waffles]

I never said be was a aas mentor.
I haven't asked him how many cycles he has done ! I chose the wrong words for that "few" . I'm not looking to turn pro or anything like that.

[Mr.Waffles]

How should I go about getting a blood test ? Should I go through my doctor or find a different route. I am paying out of pocket?

[Dannyboy51577]

You can use privatemdlabs.com. not too pricey. Theres different options based on what you need, but basic is Hormone panel with F&T testosterone lc/ms-ms.

Normal panels will give u total test level up to 1500. Lc/ms will give u actual test numbers. You can add other individual tests as well if you need -ex. Prolactin and they will do all at once.

Theres a coupon code, MAR2018. I think its 15% off, maybe 10%

[Mr.Waffles]

You can use privatemdlabs.com. not too pricey. Theres different options based on what you need, but basic is Hormone panel with F&T testosterone lc/ms-ms.

Normal panels will give u total test level up to 1500. Lc/ms will give u actual test numbers. You can add other individual tests as well if you need -ex. Prolactin and they will do all at once.

Theres a coupon code, MAR2018. I think its 15% off, maybe 10%

I read some where if I get a female panel it will give me e2 and it's actually cheaper ?

[almostgone]

I read some where if I get a female panel it will give me e2 and it's actually cheaper ?

I may be mistaken, but most female panels would.give you the estrone value (E1) which isn't of much use to males. Make sure the panel you select contains E2, sensitive estradiol.

Edit:. Dannyb is dead on about looking for/using a discount code. They will definitely save you money. If the code he provided has expired by the time you do labs, peep around online, there is generally a code that is current.

[Dannyboy51577]

I think that code is the current o e, at least as of a week or so ago, if not let me know and ill fi d the newest one- they float around online and a friend of mine gets an email once a month with the new code.

Waffles, if you look through the info on the tests, there are a few different ones that will give you info you need, so e are different prices. If i remember correct i think one of the female panels will do, and i think the unisex panel also. I think those 2 and the one i mentioned above are pretty close in price. I think the hormone panel i mentioned above was in the $105-110 range. So you can end up payibg maybe 90 bucks with coupon.
But look through them and check them out. Woth that test i think you should get estradiol, free and total test, the CBC, FSH, LH, metabolic panel. Then you can add tests in if you ever want to.

[Mr.Waffles]

I think that code is the current o e, at least as of a week or so ago, if not let me know and ill fi d the newest one- they float around online and a friend of mine gets an email once a month with the new code.

Waffles, if you look through the info on the tests, there are a few different ones that will give you info you need, so e are different prices. If i remember correct i think one of the female panels will do, and i think the unisex panel also. I think those 2 and the one i mentioned above are pretty close in price. I think the hormone panel i mentioned above was in the $105-110 range. So you can end up payibg maybe 90 bucks with coupon.
But look through them and check them out. Woth that test i think you should get estradiol, free and total test, the CBC, FSH, LH, metabolic panel. Then you can add tests in if you ever want to.

I was looking at the wrong one then . The one I was looking at was around 300$ ,

I'm going to wait until I get the rest of what I need . Because I'm not sure how long it will take to get .
You guys have been a big help .

[Mr.Waffles]

Hormone Panel with F&T Testosterone LC/MS-MS ?