Never Ending Sides... w/ Spreadsheet

[burritosnstuff]

I have read every forum and tried everything and am really running out of ideas so I'm hoping somebody here can help out.

I made a spreadsheet with my whole last cycle, I came to no conclusions about what my issue is, only that I might have messed up my estrogen, lets see if you guys can figure it out.

I'm 28YO 6'1" 205lbs 17%BF, been on and off juice for 5 years.

I have recently had issues with lethargy during cycles, it would hit like a brick for a few days then I'd feel great for a few days, on and off all cycle long, and every cycle my results have been minimal, and I have tried 6 or 7 different brands pharma to UGL.

In previous cycles I would run E2 tests but never sensitive because I didn't know about it till recently, and it was usually pretty high, so i'd pump adex and feel worse.

I always thought my issue was my inability to control estrogen but this last cycle I got smart and created a spreadsheet. Unfortunately, I could still not figure it out, and now I have been off juice for months. And this lethargy, one point mid cycle, came and never left.

The weirdest part is when the lethargy kicks in ALL ANABOLIC SIDES DISAPPEAR and I'm left with lethargy, spacey as shit, muscle pain and way over sleeping.

For example, I will feel the tren sides (pump, aggression, sweat, reddness, nightmares, insomnia) clear as day one day then the next day, after a meal or a workout, lethargy hits like a brick, all other sides disappear right away! The longer I have lethargy, the more weight and strength I loose. Went from 225lbs to 205lbs during the first 2 months of this cycle, stuck at 205 ATM and still managing to workout 4 days a week with no results and seemigly less and less strength each day.

Towards the end of this cycle I stopped the tren and took dbol for a while just to see if my body would react at all, and NOTHING. No pump, no bloat, just same lethargy.

Few things to note in this, when I say "kings brand test", that brand seems under-dosed (I show my lab results) so when im taking such a small dose of test AND its under dosed I probably don't need the Adex, which leads me to believe its crashed E2, even though when levels come back, sides stayed....

My biggest regret is not running an E2 test before I switched everything, and like an idiot, every time i got a chance I would switch compounds hoping it'd make me feel better, but when you feel this shitty, it's hard not to keep switching shit up

Anyway enough of me rambling, if you guys got some time, let's see what you think.

[cousinmuscles]

Your cycle is literally all over the place. To claim one can know what is causing what sides is a lie. Your cycle plan is pretty much incomprehensible.

I'd suggest you start over from scratch, and learn how to use compounds. Use one compound at a time.

For starters, come off and do a PCT. 6-8 weeks after the PCT has ended, get blood work - lipids, blood count, hormone (sensitive e2, thyroids, test, free test et.c.), liver, kidney et.c. Don't jump on a cycle right after, let your body come back to homeostasis. Time on + PCT = Time off.

When you decide to go back on a cycle, start with one compound, a basic one like test only. Do not inject whenever you feel like it. Do not take different brands of test on the same cycle. Stick to the exact same dosage of test and an AI, very consistently. E.g. arimidex 0.25mg every other day, 250mg test twice a week spread evenly apart. Get mid cycle bloods with a sensitive e2 test and see if you need to adjust your AI dose. See if you also happen to get too high hematocrit so you know if you have to donate mid cycle to keep things stable.

When you have done the above you will have a reference point for how to control estrogen at a particular dose of test. For your next cycle add one compound and see how you fare. For each compound there is a learning curve for all related intricacies, some raise other hormones that cause issues.

Check the diet section too, and perfect your diet before your next cycle. Your training could be lacking too.

Good luck and give us an update...

[Mr.BB]

^^^ This. Could not have said better.

[RoxRunner]

^^^ What cousin said.. + I'd include testing progesterone to see if you're taking enough caber. And for god sake, lay off the coke and alcohol when on cycle....

[cousinmuscles]

^^^ What cousin said.. + I'd include testing progesterone to see if you're taking enough caber. And for god sake, lay off the coke and alcohol when on cycle....

I must have missed this didn't see coke/alcohol. If you can't keep yourself from doing coke and going out partying drinking alcohol during a cycle, you shouldn't do AAS.

Escort=coke?

[RoxRunner]

I must have missed this didn't see coke/alcohol. If you can't keep yourself from doing coke and going out partying drinking alcohol during a cycle, you shouldn't do AAS.

Escort=coke?

Week 11 Thursday - Sunday of Week 12

[AlphaMindz]

I agree, your cycle is all over the place man. What really throws me off is every week looks totally different! You should schedule your injection days so they're the same each week to allow your body to establish a balance.. Injecting diff doses on diff days throughout the week is not going to be conducive to your body finding a balance with these exogenous hormones. I also would steer clear of using more than one brand of test in the same cycle.

Having said that, I'm still inclined to believe that this extreme lethargy is being caused by something else. Fluctuating hormones can cause various sides but to my knowledge, lethargy isn't one of them. It sounds like you're deficient in something. Most likely vitamin b-12.

So I would do what cousin suggested and you'll also want to do a b-12 injection to stimulate energy production. I'm not sure what your diet looks like but you may be missing key nutrients like b-12.

And the hard drugs certainly aren't helping matters. Clean up your life brother. Stick to one brand, scheduled injection days, same dosage in each injection, make sure your diet includes all the nutrients your body needs, and def get a b-12 shot and I suspect you'll feel much better. Good luck.

[Wyatt 88]

I glanced at that spreadsheet earlier and couldn't believe what I was reading. At first thought it was a joke or maybe some sort of test. But then I thought to myself who would take that amount of time.

I'm actually very impressed by the level of professionalism in the replies

[Chrisp83TRT]

Honestly , there was so much chaos on that spread sheet , I couldn’t even take the time to see.

You have a billion things all over the place. Why not keep it simple?
More isn’t always more, even with AAS. Just leads to more sides

[burritosnstuff]

OK. lemme explain why the cycle was such a horrific mess because at this point I see how I look insane.

I had an exact cycle down that I was going to stick with for 12 weeks, as soon as the lethargy hit I started tweeking things here and there, test dose, Adex dose, drop EQ... Still feel like shit.. test a bit of caber out... seemed to help, do it again when I feel shitty, nothin... Change esters then brands.. nothin... Then the thought was It HAS to be the tren ( I had similar issue on test deca cycle, stayed with it for 3 months and had minimal results. ) So at this point I was thinking my body doesnt like 19-nors, so now the thought was, im gonna try to do a couple weeks of Dbol before my vacation (why I was bulking in the first place) and see if my body works with it... Nope. Same shit, wtf. tampered with T3 (dumb idea, I know), HCG, bunch of bloodwork, and now my only thought is, it has to be having my E2 too low for too long that caused my crashed E2 symptoms to stay well after my E2 went back up...

So now I have been on a TRT dose of test for months with the same lethargy and just introduced HGH in the hopes that I can turn my Aroma receptors on or shake up what ever the hell is causing this lethargy.

I would blast PCT and try and come off everything but I feel so shitty now I can't imagine feeling worse with no test.

I know the correct approach woulda been to start a pct after I start feeling like shit and start over but I was determined to figure out wtf was causing all this.

I know I fucked up big time, just hoping I can get some pointers as to how to undo this mess and what can be causing these sides. I start university in a month and I have no shot of getting through it with these sides.

Thanks guys

[cousinmuscles]

OK. lemme explain why the cycle was such a horrific mess because at this point I see how I look insane.

I had an exact cycle down that I was going to stick with for 12 weeks, as soon as the lethargy hit I started tweeking things here and there, test dose, Adex dose, drop EQ... Still feel like shit.. test a bit of caber out... seemed to help, do it again when I feel shitty, nothin... Change esters then brands.. nothin... Then the thought was It HAS to be the tren ( I had similar issue on test deca cycle, stayed with it for 3 months and had minimal results. ) So at this point I was thinking my body doesnt like 19-nors, so now the thought was, im gonna try to do a couple weeks of Dbol before my vacation (why I was bulking in the first place) and see if my body works with it... Nope. Same shit, wtf. tampered with T3 (dumb idea, I know), HCG, bunch of bloodwork, and now my only thought is, it has to be having my E2 too low for too long that caused my crashed E2 symptoms to stay well after my E2 went back up...

So now I have been on a TRT dose of test for months with the same lethargy and just introduced HGH in the hopes that I can turn my Aroma receptors on or shake up what ever the hell is causing this lethargy.

I would blast PCT and try and come off everything but I feel so shitty now I can't imagine feeling worse with no test.

I know the correct approach woulda been to start a pct after I start feeling like shit and start over but I was determined to figure out wtf was causing all this.

I know I fucked up big time, just hoping I can get some pointers as to how to undo this mess and what can be causing these sides. I start university in a month and I have no shot of getting through it with these sides.

Thanks guys

If you are going to be on TRT, then get yourself checked by a doctor first who will prescribe you TRT (if you really need it). Your way of guessing what is going on is reckless, and trying to live your life relying on UGL gear to keep test levels up is also reckless. Just do a PCT and let your body go back to normal. Trust me with this one, you aren't that good at guessing what's going on, and you keep digging yourself deeper into shit with your decisions on taking this or that drug.