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It looks like the typical ratio of test:deca is anywhere from 2:1 to 5:3. Why do people do more test than deca when they usually do the opposite with tren and others? They let the tren do the heavy lifting and add enough test to counteract the shutdown.
I was planning on a cycle with 400 test and 300 deca, just based on common logs, but then I started wondering if I really need all that test. Why not 500 deca and 200 test for example?
Scrap the 2:1 rule, as long as you have a test base to keep things going, manage your prolactin/estrogen you will be fine.Quote:
Originally Posted by Cksnffr
Generally people use the 2:1 to avoid deca dick, but the test doesn’t matter (obviously you need a base) managing your hormonal imbalances will reduce the sides….
I’ve ran: Tes E 300mg per week combined with 400mg tren and 400mg deca.. No problems at all! Not telling you to do this, but because I know my body and understand when/how to implement protocols in order to keep the sides low I had no problems.
Agree with Eduke93. Doesn't matter. You need to manage E2 and Prolactin. You need an AI and DA. I use Arimidex (.25mg 3x/wk) and Caber (.25mg 2x/wk). That's with 800mg Test / 500mg Deca. It's all about what works for you. I get none of the negative Deca sides people speak of and libido is through the roof. What's Deca dick? lol
I also agree. I take 200 Test-e and 400 Deca per week.
Ditto Duke. I think we just had this discussion recently in another thread if you want to check it out. The test/deca ratio is broscience thats been rehashed over the internet for years.Quote:
Originally Posted by Eduke93
Its personal preference- which you will find out after you have run it a few different ways. Some like it better high test low deca, some the opposite. As long as you have a test base like Duke said, minimum maybe 200mg ballpark, you will be fine provided you control your estro and prolactin. I run my test higher only because ive tried ot a few different ways and thats how i like it. You may be the opposite.
I run 19nors higher and keep my Test at my TRT (150mg). I may of the minority's but I feel that it's easier to control prolactin over than estrogen and when Test is low you have less Estrogen to worry about / manage compared to high test + 19nor
I think you may actually be in the majority Windex, especially when it comes to tren. Most guys i know run test lower. Most of them are kinda estro sensitive too so it makes sense. Im not estro sensitive at all and barely have to run ai at 600 or 700mg so its not a prob for me to run my test higher. May be why i feel better on higher test, not sure. Just helps me bulk easier when i run it that wayQuote:
Originally Posted by Windex
Yep!!Quote:
Originally Posted by Dannyboy51577
Deca only i like to run test a touch higher just as preference/feel but tren ill keep my test as low as possible! With test low i feel like the tren gives you a much more "dense" look, and you can feel the drug and see the results... (at a lower level of BF)
Nowadays always run nandrolone with only nebido base, the only libido problem I have is that it is too much...
Good place to be!!Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr.BB
A TRT dose of test should be enough to prevent the low-test sides of nandrolone.
Makes sense duke. Ive always heard the idea is with tren is to have enough test in your system to function, then let the tren do its thing and do all the heavy lifting because of its potency. Seems to make sense, and i havent heard much of a discussion on positives of test higher than tren as of yet, so seems like best theory to run with currently.Quote:
Originally Posted by Eduke93
Putting crap internet dogma to rest with lightning speed. Great posts.
Nicely done!
Yeah, reading some of the stuff written on the internet about some of these things makes me nuts.Quote:
Originally Posted by kelkel
Plus trying to explain or debunk some of this broscience from some of these guys will make your head hurt.
Thanks Kel
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dannyboy51577
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4837307/
Thanks for pointing that out Kel, interesting read. Not much new science in there, but a nice summation of antidotal thoughts.Quote:
Originally Posted by kelkel
Nice intro.... "healthcare-provider attitudes towards anabolic androgenic steroids (AAS) and found that AAS users were viewed less favorably that cocaine abusers or healthy adults." so there's that...
I must admit, It drives me a little bonkers that someone submitted their thesis with this "evidence" but i understand it's publish or perish in academia...."Interestingly, Internet and discussion group anecdotal data suggests that nandrolone is effective in decreasing joint pain in bodybuilders. These athletes lift large amounts of weights putting extreme pressure on their joints while reporting improvement and lowered pain with the use of nandrolone. While limited data is available, and dosages are unknown...."
"Anecdotal evidence from patients, as well as those men who have previously used nandrolone from “alternative” sources suggests a relationship with the use of nandrolone (alone, not in combination with testosterone) and ED. "
But...
"As such, it can be theorized that nandrolone should be administered with testosterone to prevent ED with an eye towards regulation of a patients estradiol levels.".... Good reminder.
Kel always has the info in his back pocket. I need to start saving these articles and info somewhere. I read them, then forget where i saw the info when the subject comes up againQuote:
Originally Posted by kelkel
Open an account on Pubmed and just save to favourites.Quote:
Originally Posted by Dannyboy51577
Quote:
Originally Posted by hammerheart
Bingo.
Dito...ive used test. Tht for 3yrs doing a cycle every summer and never taking any kind of blockers. After being on this forum is made me crazy. Rethinking things.... That I never knew they'd be this much to it. Then everyone has got advice. Who's so you follow....Quote:
Originally Posted by Dannyboy51577
Sent from my SM-G892A using Tapatalk
Truth is man, theres alot of advice out there. But alot of it is just that, advice. Theres basis for some of it, some of it is purely opinion, and some is broscience garbage someone read somewhere or heard from someone. Alot is trial and error, finding out what works for you. Take some of the info and advice, bit dont expect it all to apply exactly to you. Everyone is very individual, which is why when i hear someone say that something needs be done exactly a certain way or its wrong, i tune them out pretty quick.