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Thread: First Timer's First Cycle

  1. #1
    Butcher78 is offline New Member
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    First Timer's First Cycle

    I want to do this right so I'm looking for guidance from your experience. I'm looking tighten up what I have and put on a few lbs of lean. Honestly I will be happy with 5-10lbs but I'm not that concerned about the scale. Please, if you see any issues with my plan lay it out for me. Thanks in advance

    My Specs
    Height: 6'
    Weight: 202lbs
    16% Body Fat
    Diet: 3,000 40%/40%/20% (Protein,Carbs,Fat)
    Lifting: 5 days per week
    Cardio: 3 days per week 30min


    Questions:
    Should I include an oral like Dbol for my first cycle based on my goals? Test E alone cycle enough?
    One SERM or both for PCT as I have listed below?
    Is HCG necessary for a cycle this short?
    Best way to prevent acne?
    Needle size?
    Will injecting into my trouble areas result in better gains for that muscle?
    Any issues with the lab brands I have listed?
    Issues with Basicstereo and pharacomstore?
    I'm going on a 5 day vacation in 6 weeks and will be drinking. Should I wait to start after the trip?

    Scheduled pre-cycle blood work and plan to test at week 7 and 18

    Cycle
    Weeks 1-12 Test E (500mg week) - Balken
    Weeks 1-5 Dbol (20mg daily) - Balken
    Weeks 1-14 Aromasin (25mg daily) - Balken
    Weeks 1-12 HCG (500ui week) - SP Labs

    PCT
    Week 15 Clomid (75mg daily)- Balken
    Week 15 Nolvadex (40mg daily) - SIS
    Weeks 16-18 Clomid (50mg daily) -Balken
    Weeks 16-18 Nolvadex (20mg daily) - SIS

  2. #2
    fiddlesticks's Avatar
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    smaller the needle the better man. personal favorite is 30G. Dont even need to backload with a bigger syringe, I just use a peptide dropper to backload the 30g syringe ( my test is kept in a vial w a pop off lid)


    if youre doing 2.5cc of test e a week I would suggest.. 1cc in each delt and maybe .25cc subq in each thigh. general rule small amounts in various spots imo. delts tend to be easiest IM thigh or ass easiest subQ - subQ shots at .25 are mainly meant to see how your body reacts to them, some people react absolutely awful to them but present an interesting and way less painful way to get injections in especially if you're running low doses. The main downside of subQ is that if you react poorly to it it can be completely utterly debilitating. Since the lump will be protruding from the skin and be more exposed than an IM shot would be.. It's awful. As in god help you walking for a week debilitating.

    also doesn't apply to most but if you ever intend on competing you don't want to have fucked up muscle insertions from too much IM slamming - prevention is the best way to avoid that, some people can use it to their advantage but overtime(flex wheeler) it just starts looking terrible

    dbol is not really needed though it wont do anything at 3k cals anyhow.

    Biggest issue I see is 3k cals is not nearly enough , i would wager 4k at least w those stats

    Every UGL is completely hit and miss unless you are the dude making the shit you got no idea what you're dealing with. If I was you I would tell myself the stuff is 100 percent legit and run with the wind, don't wanna think about it too much ..Unless its horribly wrong and gives you horrendous pip or makes you stay up for a week lol.
    Last edited by fiddlesticks; 03-24-2019 at 06:48 AM.

  3. #3
    Chrisp83TRT's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Butcher78 View Post
    I want to do this right so I'm looking for guidance from your experience. I'm looking tighten up what I have and put on a few lbs of lean. Honestly I will be happy with 5-10lbs but I'm not that concerned about the scale. Please, if you see any issues with my plan lay it out for me. Thanks in advance

    My Specs
    Height: 6'
    Weight: 202lbs
    16% Body Fat
    Diet: 3,000 40%/40%/20% (Protein,Carbs,Fat)
    Lifting: 5 days per week
    Cardio: 3 days per week 30min


    Questions:
    Should I include an oral like Dbol for my first cycle based on my goals? Test E alone cycle enough?
    One SERM or both for PCT as I have listed below?
    Is HCG necessary for a cycle this short?
    Best way to prevent acne?
    Needle size?
    Will injecting into my trouble areas result in better gains for that muscle?
    Any issues with the lab brands I have listed?
    Issues with Basicstereo and pharacomstore?
    I'm going on a 5 day vacation in 6 weeks and will be drinking. Should I wait to start after the trip?

    Scheduled pre-cycle blood work and plan to test at week 7 and 18

    Cycle
    Weeks 1-12 Test E (500mg week) - Balken
    Weeks 1-5 Dbol (20mg daily) - Balken
    Weeks 1-14 Aromasin (25mg daily) - Balken
    Weeks 1-12 HCG (500ui week) - SP Labs

    PCT
    Week 15 Clomid (75mg daily)- Balken
    Week 15 Nolvadex (40mg daily) - SIS
    Weeks 16-18 Clomid (50mg daily) -Balken
    Weeks 16-18 Nolvadex (20mg daily) - SIS
    How old are you ?

    The thing about doing a cycle is a funny thing man.

    Yes you will some nice gains on it but when on pct and there after, your gains will go.

    If you are looking for solid steady gains , jumping on trt is your best bet.

    I don't recommend this if you are young hence why I'm asking how old you are

    Sent from my JSN-AL00 using Tapatalk

  4. #4
    Chrisp83TRT's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by fiddlesticks View Post
    smaller the needle the better man. personal favorite is 30G. Dont even need to backload with a bigger syringe, I just use a peptide dropper to backload the 30g syringe ( my test is kept in a vial w a pop off lid)


    if youre doing 2.5cc of test e a week I would suggest.. 1cc in each delt and maybe .25cc subq in each thigh. general rule small amounts in various spots imo. delts tend to be easiest IM thigh or ass easiest subQ - subQ shots at .25 are mainly meant to see how your body reacts to them, some people react absolutely awful to them but present an interesting and way less painful way to get injections in especially if you're running low doses. The main downside of subQ is that if you react poorly to it it can be completely utterly debilitating. Since the lump will be protruding from the skin and be more exposed than an IM shot would be.. It's awful. As in god help you walking for a week debilitating.

    also doesn't apply to most but if you ever intend on competing you don't want to have fucked up muscle insertions from too much IM slamming - prevention is the best way to avoid that, some people can use it to their advantage but overtime(flex wheeler) it just starts looking terrible

    dbol is not really needed though it wont do anything at 3k cals anyhow.

    Biggest issue I see is 3k cals is not nearly enough , i would wager 4k at least w those stats

    Every UGL is completely hit and miss unless you are the dude making the shit you got no idea what you're dealing with. If I was you I would tell myself the stuff is 100 percent legit and run with the wind, don't wanna think about it too much ..Unless its horribly wrong and gives you horrendous pip or makes you stay up for a week lol.
    He's doing 500mg a week why would he be using 2.5 cc ?
    2cc is what he needs a week . No need to overdue it especially for his first cycle.

    Sent from my JSN-AL00 using Tapatalk
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  5. #5
    fiddlesticks's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Chrisp83TRT View Post
    He's doing 500mg a week why would he be using 2.5 cc ?
    2cc is what he needs a week . No need to overdue it especially for his first cycle.

    Sent from my JSN-AL00 using Tapatalk
    usually test e is 200mg ml

  6. #6
    Butcher78 is offline New Member
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    I just turned 40. All the gains post cycle are lost? That kind of sucks. What does life on TRT look like? Does it involve AI's or PCT?

  7. #7
    Windex's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Butcher78 View Post
    I just turned 40. All the gains post cycle are lost? That kind of sucks. What does life on TRT look like? Does it involve AI's or PCT?
    If people were able to keep all the gains then people wouldn't need to cycle for years. TRT is not something you just jump into and there are many sticky / educational threads that explain TRT from A-Z

    There is no point to cycle if you are going on vacation halfway through and are drinking.

    At your age the very first step is bloodwork. While that's going on you will have the opportunity to read the educational threads and build a plan. After bloodwork comes in, that will determine your next step.

    BW may dictate low T and rather than rolling the dice it would be proactive to be on TRt. If that ends up being the case, then you would not be buying a PCT and would have to buy less testosterone .

    The rest of your questions are answered in Austinintes first cycle sticky.
    I no longer check my inbox. If you PM me I will not reply.

  8. #8
    DeeCee112's Avatar
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    Not sure how this got so sidelined for this guy.. You'll lose your gains go on trt? 2.5cc, 2 injections and a subq?

    You should be able to make some gains and retain them if your have a good diet, strong workout routine and stick to both. Keep both focused through pct and for a few months after before dieting down to cut. Do not cut immediately after which is what a lot of people make the mistake of doing. Need to eat for the weight you want to be, not what you are and keep that way u til the gains solidify, if you will. I am on my first run now but I, like you had most of the same questions and here are the answers I found:

    Bloodwork plan is solid that is good you have planned that ahead of time. The sooner you have baseline results the better advice you can get. Windex is right here and it's the first step to make sure you don't have any deficiencies out the gate

    HCG is very helpful to run from the start. I didn't but should have. 250iu twice a week with your test. It will keep your balls going and make keeping those gains after easier. Use insulin syringes subq.

    Wait until after your vacation. It makes things less complicated. Dial in your training and nutrition get all your ducks in a row and questions answered leading up to it, go away, dial back in for 2 weeks after then start is what I would suggest.

    Assuming you are going for test enanthate at 250mg per 1ml you'll be injection 1ml twice a week. I use 25g 1" for glutes and quads, 25g 5/8" for delts but might go back to 1" either works. Some guys use 23g. You'll want 18g pins for drawing out of the vial. As Windex said most this info can be found in stickies if your unfamiliar with the process. Ensure sanitary measures are spot on.

    Don't bother with the dbol , try the test see how it works for you. There is alot to learn about your body and Exogenous compounds trust me. If you like your results you can tack it on if you choose to do another cycle.

    Injecting in trouble areas does not work. It's like doing crunches to lose belly fat, doesn't work that way.

    No idea about your labs sorry, I don't have experience with other manufacturers.

    Best way to prevent acne is showering often, get a salicylic acid acne wash for face neck and shoulders and chest. If you are acne prone it may get bad, if not you should be fine. I can't comment too much on other measures as this isn't a problem for me. I get some acne big deal, I'm getting big it's the price!

    Your aromasin dose may be high I don't have experience with that compound. You also may benefit from not running an AI and seeing how your body reacts. Estrogen is beneficial to muscle building. Some guys are good with it some aren't, I suggest doing your research and finding what works best for yourself and your goals. Either way look more into that dose I believe 12.5 is closer to the maintenance dose, I forget.

    Goodluck!
    Last edited by DeeCee112; 03-24-2019 at 11:37 AM.

  9. #9
    Family_guy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Butcher78 View Post
    I want to do this right so I'm looking for guidance from your experience. I'm looking tighten up what I have and put on a few lbs of lean. Honestly I will be happy with 5-10lbs but I'm not that concerned about the scale. Please, if you see any issues with my plan lay it out for me. Thanks in advance

    My Specs
    Height: 6'
    Weight: 202lbs
    16% Body Fat
    Diet: 3,000 40%/40%/20% (Protein,Carbs,Fat)
    Lifting: 5 days per week
    Cardio: 3 days per week 30min


    Questions:
    Should I include an oral like Dbol for my first cycle based on my goals? Test E alone cycle enough?
    One SERM or both for PCT as I have listed below?
    Is HCG necessary for a cycle this short?
    Best way to prevent acne?
    Needle size?
    Will injecting into my trouble areas result in better gains for that muscle?
    Any issues with the lab brands I have listed?
    Issues with Basicstereo and pharacomstore?
    I'm going on a 5 day vacation in 6 weeks and will be drinking. Should I wait to start after the trip?

    Scheduled pre-cycle blood work and plan to test at week 7 and 18

    Cycle
    Weeks 1-12 Test E (500mg week) - Balken
    Weeks 1-5 Dbol (20mg daily) - Balken
    Weeks 1-14 Aromasin (25mg daily) - Balken
    Weeks 1-12 HCG (500ui week) - SP Labs

    PCT
    Week 15 Clomid (75mg daily)- Balken
    Week 15 Nolvadex (40mg daily) - SIS
    Weeks 16-18 Clomid (50mg daily) -Balken
    Weeks 16-18 Nolvadex (20mg daily) - SIS
    I’m a few weeks into my first cycle. I don’t think 500mgs/ week is necessary even though that’s the “forum bro science standard” I’m not doing 400 and gaining quickly.

    I wouldn’t add the dbol either. I would front load your cycle though so your not waiting so long to “feel it” I doubled my dose to 800mgs Test e the first week and gained 10lbs within 10 days.

    I went with 3 ml 1” 25 gauge syringes. I found out that I really don’t need that big of a needle. I changed from 2x week injections to everyday injections using a 31 gauge .5ml 1/2” needle I’m doing .25ml every day. It has reduced my sides in terms of oily skin and acne.

    Don’t go with the ai. Have it on hand but it’s really not necessary even though we’ve been brainwashed to believe it is. It will actually hinder you gains. Gear headed has a great post on it called “estrogen the other anabolic hormone”. I don’t even have an ai on hand. I don’t think I will need it so I see no reason to have it on hand yet.

    Anyways that’s my 2cents. Good luck bro

  10. #10
    fiddlesticks's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by DeeCee112 View Post
    Not sure how this got so sidelined for this guy.. You'll lose your gains go on trt? 2.5cc, 2 injections and a subq?

    You should be able to make some gains and retain them if your have a good diet, strong workout routine and stick to both. Keep both focused through pct and for a few months after before dieting down to cut. Do not cut immediately after which is what a lot of people make the mistake of doing. Need to eat for the weight you want to be, not what you are and keep that way u til the gains solidify, if you will. I am on my first run now but I, like you had most of the same questions and here are the answers I found:

    Bloodwork plan is solid that is good you have planned that ahead of time. The sooner you have baseline results the better advice you can get. Windex is right here and it's the first step to make sure you don't have any deficiencies out the gate

    HCG is very helpful to run from the start. I didn't but should have. 250iu twice a week with your test. It will keep your balls going and make keeping those gains after easier. Use insulin syringes subq.

    Wait until after your vacation. It makes things less complicated. Dial in your training and nutrition get all your ducks in a row and questions answered leading up to it, go away, dial back in for 2 weeks after then start is what I would suggest.

    Assuming you are going for test enanthate at 250mg per 1ml you'll be injection 1ml twice a week. I use 25g 1" for glutes and quads, 25g 5/8" for delts but might go back to 1" either works. Some guys use 23g. You'll want 18g pins for drawing out of the vial. As Windex said most this info can be found in stickies if your unfamiliar with the process. Ensure sanitary measures are spot on.

    Don't bother with the dbol , try the test see how it works for you. There is alot to learn about your body and Exogenous compounds trust me. If you like your results you can tack it on if you choose to do another cycle.

    Injecting in trouble areas does not work. It's like doing crunches to lose belly fat, doesn't work that way.

    No idea about your labs sorry, I don't have experience with other manufacturers.

    Best way to prevent acne is showering often, get a salicylic acid acne wash for face neck and shoulders and chest. If you are acne prone it may get bad, if not you should be fine. I can't comment too much on other measures as this isn't a problem for me. I get some acne big deal, I'm getting big it's the price!

    Your aromasin dose may be high I don't have experience with that compound. You also may benefit from not running an AI and seeing how your body reacts. Estrogen is beneficial to muscle building. Some guys are good with it some aren't, I suggest doing your research and finding what works best for yourself and your goals. Either way look more into that dose I believe 12.5 is closer to the maintenance dose, I forget.

    Goodluck!
    At the minimum it should be 2 1.25cc IMs per week.

    I'm biased because recently I got some god forsaken pip lol.
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  11. #11
    Couchlockd's Avatar
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    Grabbing test that needs to be 100% sterile for injection out of a flip top vial with a medicine dropper is a guarantee way to introduce bacteria and dirt into your injection.


    I'm beginning to have some serious questions about you fiddle.

    For one, I HAVE NEVER seen Testosterone Enanthate dosed at 200mg per ml.

  12. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by Couchlockd View Post
    Grabbing test that needs to be 100% sterile for injection out of a flip top vial with a medicine dropper is a guarantee way to introduce bacteria and dirt into your injection.


    I'm beginning to have some serious questions about you fiddle.

    For one, I HAVE NEVER seen Testosterone Enanthate dosed at 200mg per ml.
    You've never seen test enth 200 per ml. Very interesting considering thats literally the default pharmaceutical concentration... I don't believe this

    Also interesting that my method is a "guarantee way" to get an infection as I've accumulated somewhere between 0 and 0 infections through the thousands of shots but even more interesting I've gotten horrible PIP every time I've done 250mg or more per ML. Everything is sealed extremely securely in vacuum sealed things. The much more realistic problem to happen is the god forsaken pip from too high concentration which is definitely why default concentration is 200


    I enjoy playing devil's advocate with this topic which is why my posts can appear "off" sometimes. Everyone doing the same thing is boring.
    Last edited by fiddlesticks; 03-25-2019 at 04:48 AM.

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    ShootingAcez is offline Junior Member
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    Quote Originally Posted by fiddlesticks View Post
    You've never seen test enth 200 per ml. Very interesting considering thats literally the default pharmaceutical concentration... I don't believe this

    Also interesting that my method is a "guarantee way" to get an infection as I've accumulated somewhere between 0 and 0 infections through the thousands of shots but even more interesting I've gotten horrible PIP every time I've done 250mg or more per ML. Everything is sealed extremely securely in vacuum sealed things. The much more realistic problem to happen is the god forsaken pip from too high concentration which is definitely why default concentration is 200


    I enjoy playing devil's advocate with this topic which is why my posts can appear "off" sometimes. Everyone doing the same thing is boring.
    I have no idea where you get your Test E from, but every lab I have access to, is dosed at 250mg/ml.
    If everyone is doing the same thing, it's generally because it works. There's no sense recreating the wheel here, especially for a basic first cycle. 2 injections/week, 3.5 days apart, 1ml each day. That's straight forward and simple for a 12 week enanthate cycle.

  14. #14
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    I've seen pharma grade test at 200mg/ml. I've seen UGL test as low as 200mg/ml and as high as 500mg/ml. Seems anything over 250mg/ml is test E. Why are we debating concentration?

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    Quote Originally Posted by HDThunder View Post
    I've seen pharma grade test at 200mg/ml. I've seen UGL test E as low as 200mg/ml and as high as 500mg/ml. Why are we debating concentration?
    Bottom line is no one gets debilitating crystallization PIP from 200 or less, its an unneeded risk imo.

    The degree of pain that can possibly cause warrants avoiding using high concentrations at all cost.

    Id go as far as to tell OP to dilute the oil 20%.

  16. #16
    ShootingAcez is offline Junior Member
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    My PIP was only ever bad when using Prop esters. Enanthates are a walk in the park for me

  17. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by ShootingAcez View Post
    I have no idea where you get your Test E from, but every lab I have access to, is dosed at 250mg/ml.
    If everyone is doing the same thing, it's generally because it works. There's no sense recreating the wheel here, especially for a basic first cycle. 2 injections/week, 3.5 days apart, 1ml each day. That's straight forward and simple for a 12 week enanthate cycle.
    Strange. few years ago when I looked at UGL most was 200 although 250 and 300 were there they seldom appeared. Never have I been able to use test E over 250 without horrible pip

    "Everyone doing the same thing" is a very naive approach. No offense but most people here and in this industry in general spend quite a long time spinning their wheels. Outdated beliefs contribute to that.
    Last edited by fiddlesticks; 03-25-2019 at 08:26 AM.

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    ShootingAcez is offline Junior Member
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    Quote Originally Posted by fiddlesticks View Post
    Strange. few years ago when I looked at UGL most was 200. Never have I been able to use test E over 250 without horrible pip

    "Everyone doing the same thing" is a very naive approach. No offense but most people here and in this industry in general spend quite a long time spinning their wheels.

    There are other enanthates that are dosed at 200mg/ml, just not Testosterone from my sources. I can get Masteron Enanthate , which is dosed at 200mg/ml though.

    I meant with regards to a first cycle. Keeping it basic is the idea. Once more experience and knowledge is gained, trying out new things is the name of the game, so yes, I agree in that aspect.

  19. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by ShootingAcez View Post
    There are other enanthates that are dosed at 200mg/ml, just not Testosterone from my sources. I can get Masteron Enanthate , which is dosed at 200mg/ml though.

    I meant with regards to a first cycle. Keeping it basic is the idea. Once more experience and knowledge is gained, trying out new things is the name of the game, so yes, I agree in that aspect.
    apparently im an outlier in regards to the severity of the crystallization pip I experience which is why I'm so against the 250. I have memories of basically being stuck in bed for a week unable to move my leg. The prop pip I had was a different feeling, crystallization pip is unbelievably horrible

  20. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by Family_guy View Post
    I’m a few weeks into my first cycle. I don’t think 500mgs/ week is necessary even though that’s the “forum bro science standard” I’m not doing 400 and gaining quickly.

    I wouldn’t add the dbol either. I would front load your cycle though so your not waiting so long to “feel it” I doubled my dose to 800mgs Test e the first week and gained 10lbs within 10 days.

    I went with 3 ml 1” 25 gauge syringes. I found out that I really don’t need that big of a needle. I changed from 2x week injections to everyday injections using a 31 gauge .5ml 1/2” needle I’m doing .25ml every day. It has reduced my sides in terms of oily skin and acne.

    Don’t go with the ai. Have it on hand but it’s really not necessary even though we’ve been brainwashed to believe it is. It will actually hinder you gains. Gear headed has a great post on it called “estrogen the other anabolic hormone”. I don’t even have an ai on hand. I don’t think I will need it so I see no reason to have it on hand yet.

    Anyways that’s my 2cents. Good luck bro
    Hey just wanted a touch on some of this.

    I'm not sure front loading works like that, the ester takes as long as it takes to reach stable blood levels which is why some guys front load with prop or Dbol or other compounds with short half lives. Could be wrong here though. I got close to the same result with the jump in weight, it's almost surely 90 percent increased water retention.

    Also advising against an ai at least in hand ready I don't think is great either. You may not be sensitive to estrogen and gear headed is a smart dude but there is still a reason people have advised to use it for years. Like I said best advice I would say is see how you feel without it and find out for yourself but forgoing having it in hand completely I think would be irresponsible for a first cycle.

    Injecting test enanthate daily I've never heard of, not that it doesn't mean it doesn't work I suppose although in that case why not just get test prop so that blood levels do elevate sooner and when ready for pct dissipate sooner? People usually only get enanthate to reduce the amount of injections. The 1/2" length sounds pretty short I'm not sure I'd advise that either for glutes or larger areas. If you are very learn and because of your smaller volumes it may work but if you don't make it to the muscle and inject into the subq layer it will hurt like a bitch and I believe could leak elsewhere in the body, sit and swell or worse. Not a great move for a first timer.

    Morale of the story is I think he should stick to the basics and then if you want to figure out your own ways you can after.
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  21. #21
    redz's Avatar
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    There’s some confusing things being said to this guy. Keep it simple for him, The main issue I see is too much aromasin and not enough calories.
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  22. #22
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    IMO too many people saying different things instead of going back to basics. Here is what you need to read. https://forums.steroid.com/anabolic-...rst-cycle.html

    Wait until you can commit do a full cycle if you are going on a trip. HCG is a must! TRT sucks ass in the long term, short term it is amazing but after 10 plus years it becomes a chore.

    Brother, Get your bloodwork done now! Train and diet hard before your trip and then have a blast. Keep reading on this site and ask questions then come back after your trip and really think if you want to train and do a cycle and commit for the summer.

    If you do go on cycle, wait on the AI until you have a few weeks of test in your and see how what your needs are. Get bloods done during cycle to really know what AI you need.
    Last edited by David LoPan; 03-25-2019 at 04:33 PM. Reason: AI
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  23. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by DeeCee112 View Post
    Hey just wanted a touch on some of this.

    I'm not sure front loading works like that, the ester takes as long as it takes to reach stable blood levels which is why some guys front load with prop or Dbol or other compounds with short half lives. Could be wrong here though. I got close to the same result with the jump in weight, it's almost surely 90 percent increased water retention.

    Also advising against an ai at least in hand ready I don't think is great either. You may not be sensitive to estrogen and gear headed is a smart dude but there is still a reason people have advised to use it for years. Like I said best advice I would say is see how you feel without it and find out for yourself but forgoing having it in hand completely I think would be irresponsible for a first cycle.

    Injecting test enanthate daily I've never heard of, not that it doesn't mean it doesn't work I suppose although in that case why not just get test prop so that blood levels do elevate sooner and when ready for pct dissipate sooner? People usually only get enanthate to reduce the amount of injections. The 1/2" length sounds pretty short I'm not sure I'd advise that either for glutes or larger areas. If you are very learn and because of your smaller volumes it may work but if you don't make it to the muscle and inject into the subq layer it will hurt like a bitch and I believe could leak elsewhere in the body, sit and swell or worse. Not a great move for a first timer.

    Morale of the story is I think he should stick to the basics and then if you want to figure out your own ways you can after.
    I may not have spoken correctly. What I meant wasn’t to not have an ai on hand for op. I just haven’t had one cuz I know I could get one in 2 days if I really needed it.

    If you look at the release of even a longer eater like enanthate you will see huge peaks and valleys if only injecting 2xweek. By front loading you get stable levels within a week rather than slowly climbing levels.

    I agree with you for him to keep it simple. I was just commenting on my experience so far and what has worked for me. Also just some food for thought. I did what made sense to me. It’s up to everyone to do the same

  24. #24
    Butcher78 is offline New Member
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    Thanks for all the input. Lots us info in different directions, but that just gives me more to research. I've decided to wait till after my vacation to start anything. My diet and been on point for 6 months so I'll be in great shape when I start. I got ahold of a local lab for my bloodwork. What panels do I need? I plan on sharing the results on here and don't want to miss anything.
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  25. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by Butcher78 View Post
    Thanks for all the input. Lots us info in different directions, but that just gives me more to research. I've decided to wait till after my vacation to start anything. My diet and been on point for 6 months so I'll be in great shape when I start. I got ahold of a local lab for my bloodwork. What panels do I need? I plan on sharing the results on here and don't want to miss anything.
    The TRT sticky from Youthful55guy has the lab work tests you want being 40 years old. Reading that will also give some perspective as to whether TRT is a consideration for the near future.

    Lots of background noise and anecdote posted here ; don't get confused by it. Bloodwork, TRT sticky, Austinite first cycle sticky, and your off to the races.
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  26. #26
    Littlearnie is offline Associate Member
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    Quote Originally Posted by Chrisp83TRT View Post
    How old are you ?

    The thing about doing a cycle is a funny thing man.

    Yes you will some nice gains on it but when on pct and there after, your gains will go.

    If you are looking for solid steady gains , jumping on trt is your best bet.

    I don't recommend this if you are young hence why I'm asking how old you are

    Sent from my JSN-AL00 using Tapatalk
    If that was true why would anyone cycle!!
    I’m pretty sure volunterally going on trt is the single most retarded decision a person could make...

    Edit: ignore me I’m dumb lol
    Last edited by Littlearnie; 05-23-2019 at 09:05 AM.

  27. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by Littlearnie View Post
    If that was true why would anyone cycle!!
    I’m pretty sure volunterally going on trt is the single most retarded decision a person could make...
    You have some misconceptions or are ill-informed about TRT if you think voluntarily going on it is a "retarded decision". At least half (if not more) of the members on the forum are voluntarily on HRT.
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  28. #28
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    As promised, the numbers from my first cycle...

    Baseline 227lbs @ 19%bf
    Results 222lbs @ 12%bf

    Not bad if you ask me. Id consider that a decent recomp
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails First Timer's First Cycle-20190329_134944.jpg  

  29. #29
    Littlearnie is offline Associate Member
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    Quote Originally Posted by JohnnyV85 View Post
    As promised, the numbers from my first cycle...

    Baseline 227lbs @ 19%bf
    Results 222lbs @ 12%bf

    Not bad if you ask me. Id consider that a decent recomp
    Got before / after pics?

  30. #30
    Littlearnie is offline Associate Member
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    Quote Originally Posted by Windex View Post
    You have some misconceptions or are ill-informed about TRT if you think voluntarily going on it is a "retarded decision". At least half (if not more) of the members on the forum are voluntarily on HRT.
    Voluntarily going on trt. I take it to mean that a man that is capable of producing a sufficient amount his own testosterone has decided that he doesn’t want to any more because he can Buy fake testosterone and inject it into him self for the rest of his life! all for cosmetic reasons..? So he doesn’t really have to come off cycle?

  31. #31
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    Quote Originally Posted by Littlearnie View Post
    Got before / after pics?
    I've taken some before/progress pics and stuff but then I delete them because I dont think they look as good. Anyone else have that issue? When I look in the mirror I see the progress and I'm pretty pleased but then I take a progress pic and I'm like fack I still look like shit lol...

  32. #32
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    Quote Originally Posted by Littlearnie View Post
    Got before / after pics?
    I do have some 3d scans that I get at my dexa scan place actually... I'll upload them later

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    Quote Originally Posted by JohnnyV85 View Post
    I've taken some before/progress pics and stuff but then I delete them because I dont think they look as good. Anyone else have that issue? When I look in the mirror I see the progress and I'm pretty pleased but then I take a progress pic and I'm like fack I still look like shit lol...
    I know exactly what you mean lol.
    I’ve been taking week by week. Yet when I put my first and most recent pics together I think “meh” lol.
    But my cloths are all tight, friend and family comment on how I look. Even people I see in The gym everyday tell me how good I’m looking and ask me what I’m taking lol.

    Also being 227 at start of your first cycle is amazing! Bet your gonna get humongous! Well done!

  34. #34
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    Yeah I guess on paper 6'3 222lbs @ 12% bf is not bad but i dont think I'm that big. Same thing as you, coworkers and fam is like bro you're looking fucken big but I'm like ����*♂️

    I still feel far from my goal. All we can do is keep going
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  35. #35
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    Looks like most of them are sideways and I dont know how to fix that sorry...
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails First Timer's First Cycle-20190329_201144.jpg   First Timer's First Cycle-20190329_201114.jpg   First Timer's First Cycle-20190329_200929.jpg   First Timer's First Cycle-20190329_200814.jpg   First Timer's First Cycle-20190329_200949.jpg  

    First Timer's First Cycle-20190329_200837.jpg  

  36. #36
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    Quote Originally Posted by JohnnyV85 View Post
    Yeah I guess on paper 6'3 222lbs @ 12% bf is not bad but i dont think I'm that big. Same thing as you, coworkers and fam is like bro you're looking fucken big but I'm like ����*♂️

    I still feel far from my goal. All we can do is keep going
    Ya man keep up the good work! That’s an amazing transformation! Great job brother
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  37. #37
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    This is the type of results I'm looking for. I don't give a damn about moving the scale. 5-10bs of fat traded out for lean would be just fine for me. Awesome job and thanks for sharing. What did you take on this cycle?

  38. #38
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    Quote Originally Posted by Butcher78 View Post
    This is the type of results I'm looking for. I don't give a damn about moving the scale. 5-10bs of fat traded out for lean would be just fine for me. Awesome job and thanks for sharing. What did you take on this cycle?
    I did 500mg/wk of test e only. You have to dial in your macros though, big time...eat at a strict 500cal deficit and train hard as hell. Its not just the drugs alone that give you the results

  39. #39
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    Post up a current pic be proud of your progress. My context with working out is simply best me ever and strangely it turned hardcore when I stopped comparing myself to others.
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  40. #40
    Butcher78 is offline New Member
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    I will get some current pics to upload.

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