Cholesterol Advice

**Arcânn** · 09-13-2019, 12:44 PM

Hey guys, been a long time, nearly a year since I posted here I think.

I was going to do my first test cycle a while back but after two rounds of bloodwork, decided against it due to the cholesterol numbers, mainly low HDL. And it may be best that I didn't cycle because since then I've gained a decent-ish amount of muscle and not much BF. You guys' diet advice (even though my diet is far from perfect and always will be) has helped tremendously. So now I'm wanting to give this another shot.

Although it seems like cholesterol may actually not be THAT big of an issue, the media and society have done a good enough job of scaring me about it that I'd rather not take any stupid chances with it.

I read an old post by kelkel about NAC, Niacin, and Red Yeast Rice. Is that that still a good combo? Are there better options these days without going the drug route? I'd rather not use MORE drugs than I already plan on doing. I'll also be adding cardio since..well...I don't do cardio and I know that helps a bit.

I know Red Yeast Rice needs to come from somewhere other than here (USA) because apparently the stuff that actually works does have a statin in it that's banned in the US or something. I know I went wrong there, as well as using flush-free niacin. I'm currently using Nature's Bounty Time-Release Niacin. I haven't gotten bloodwork done since I started using that, but I'm hoping someone here knows whether or not that's a good option for Niacin. And can the NAC come from anywhere? I know that sounds like a silly question but since I got the other two supps wrong the first time, I figured I'd ask.

Thanks so much in advance for your input! I'd post this in the diet section, but since this is directly related to whether or not I cycle, I figured I'd put it here where hopefully it'll get more attention haha

**i_SLAM_cougars** · 09-13-2019, 12:50 PM

Since estrogen plays a big role in HDL production i’d start off with some more estrogenic compounds, and not use an AI. As long as you’re not very estrogen sensitive

**Arcânn** · 09-13-2019, 01:06 PM

Originally Posted by i_SLAM_cougars

Since estrogen plays a big role in HDL production i’d start off with some more estrogenic compounds, and not use an AI. As long as you’re not very estrogen sensitive

I'll need to refresh myself on exactly how I was going to run the cycle, but part of it was to run test at 400mg/wk and take Nolvadex 10mg/day instead of an AI, partly because I know lowering estrogen can have a negative impact on cholesterol. But I have aromasin on hand just in case I do end up needing it. I only plan using aromasin towards the end of m cycle or after my last pin in order to keep the estrogen lower than test while the test is clearing my system.

Are you suggesting adding something like dbol ? I'm just afraid of running into too many side effects on the first cycle, since an unadjusted body seems to get hit the hardest. That's actually why I was going for 400mg instead of the typical 500. I feel like I'm gonna get hit hard by the acne monster so I'm also doing everything I can to avoid that.

**i_SLAM_cougars** · 09-13-2019, 01:35 PM

Originally Posted by Arcânn

I'll need to refresh myself on exactly how I was going to run the cycle, but part of it was to run test at 400mg/wk and take Nolvadex 10mg/day instead of an AI, partly because I know lowering estrogen can have a negative impact on cholesterol. But I have aromasin on hand just in case I do end up needing it. I only plan using aromasin towards the end of m cycle or after my last pin in order to keep the estrogen lower than test while the test is clearing my system.

Are you suggesting adding something like dbol? I'm just afraid of running into too many side effects on the first cycle, since an unadjusted body seems to get hit the hardest. That's actually why I was going for 400mg instead of the typical 500. I feel like I'm gonna get hit hard by the acne monster so I'm also doing everything I can to avoid that.

500mg still isn’t very much, I doubt you’ll have any issues. Are you predisposed to acne? The only time I really seem to get it when hormones are in fluctuation. Once they settle out not so much. So just don’t freak out if you get some while your levels are rising at the beginning. A good body wash and face scrub will go along way too. Low dose Nolva through out your cycle is better than AI so you’re going in the right direction there. You want your estrogen levels to elevate during a cycle. It’s beneficial. You could add in 20-30mg of dbol a day to kickstart. You’ll be taking the Nolva anyway. If you’re worried about dbol being an estrogen bomb, and you don’t mind paying a little more 50mg of anavar a day would be perfect. Anavar is basically side effect free, and you could run it for 8 weeks or even the whole cycle if you wanted to. Just some ideas.

**Arcânn** · 09-13-2019, 01:44 PM

Originally Posted by i_SLAM_cougars

500mg still isn’t very much, I doubt you’ll have any issues. Are you predisposed to acne? The only time I really seem to get it when hormones are in fluctuation. Once they settle out not so much. So just don’t freak out if you get some while your levels are rising at the beginning. A good body wash and face scrub will go along way too. Low dose Nolva through out your cycle is better than AI so you’re going in the right direction there. You want your estrogen levels to elevate during a cycle. It’s beneficial. You could add in 20-30mg of dbol a day to kickstart. You’ll be taking the Nolva anyway. If you’re worried about dbol being an estrogen bomb, and you don’t mind paying a little more 50mg of anavar a day would be perfect. Anavar is basically side effect free, and you could run it for 8 weeks or even the whole cycle if you wanted to. Just some ideas.

I think I'm predisposed because anytime I have a fluctuation, like if I work out consistently then stop for 3-4 days....or if I haven't worked out in a while then get back to it consistently...or more recently where I just started doing things to try to increase my test naturally, I get tiny little bumps on my face or shoulders. Not like teenage acne, but tiny little beads that go away after 2-3 days. But I feel like that's a sign that when I get on a cycle, there will be some acne coming my way. Although interestingly enough, I didn't get all that much acne as a teen, compared to most of my peers. So it's hard to say one way or the other. I guess I'll never really know until I do it.

**GearHeaded** · 09-13-2019, 03:07 PM

I think your concern about running a test only cycle , and crushing your HDL cholesterol in the process, is un warranted. as long as E levels are not crushed and your not running an AI your HDL will likely be just fine and could actually improve

**Arcânn** · 09-13-2019, 03:11 PM

Originally Posted by GearHeaded

I think your concern about running a test only cycle , and crushing your HDL cholesterol in the process, is un warranted. as long as E levels are not crushed and your not running an AI your HDL will likely be just fine and could actually improve

Could LDL be an issue at all?

**almostgone** · 09-13-2019, 03:36 PM

Originally Posted by Arcânn

Could LDL be an issue at all?

Regular strength training will generally lower your LDL. The combo you mention works, but it is hard to source RYR that hasn't had the statin properties stripped out of it.

Yes on the NAC, TUDCA, and niacin...it works for me. Some people swear by policosinol, but the positive effects are negligible IMHO.

**almostgone** · 09-13-2019, 03:38 PM

Also, test can blunt your HDL to a degree. Several of the well known TRT Drs. give their patient on hormone therapy a 10 point bump on their values.

**Quester** · 09-13-2019, 04:14 PM

Originally Posted by Arcânn

Hey guys, been a long time, nearly a year since I posted here I think.

I was going to do my first test cycle a while back but after two rounds of bloodwork, decided against it due to the cholesterol numbers, mainly low HDL. And it may be best that I didn't cycle because since then I've gained a decent-ish amount of muscle and not much BF. You guys' diet advice (even though my diet is far from perfect and always will be) has helped tremendously. So now I'm wanting to give this another shot.

Although it seems like cholesterol may actually not be THAT big of an issue, the media and society have done a good enough job of scaring me about it that I'd rather not take any stupid chances with it.

I read an old post by kelkel about NAC, Niacin, and Red Yeast Rice. Is that that still a good combo? Are there better options these days without going the drug route? I'd rather not use MORE drugs than I already plan on doing. I'll also be adding cardio since..well...I don't do cardio and I know that helps a bit.

I know Red Yeast Rice needs to come from somewhere other than here (USA) because apparently the stuff that actually works does have a statin in it that's banned in the US or something. I know I went wrong there, as well as using flush-free niacin. I'm currently using Nature's Bounty Time-Release Niacin. I haven't gotten bloodwork done since I started using that, but I'm hoping someone here knows whether or not that's a good option for Niacin. And can the NAC come from anywhere? I know that sounds like a silly question but since I got the other two supps wrong the first time, I figured I'd ask.

Thanks so much in advance for your input! I'd post this in the diet section, but since this is directly related to whether or not I cycle, I figured I'd put it here where hopefully it'll get more attention haha

Cardio will improve HDL and weightlifting will improve your blood sugar. Blood sugar is key to cardiovascular health. Test will increase your bad cholesterol. Bad cholesterol isn't the bugaboo that it was touted to be but in the presence of misregulation of blood sugar, bad cholesterol is really bad. You may want to avoid anything that artificially affects your blood sugar. In addition to what you mentioned, fiber helps with blood sugar and cholesterol while 2 tbs of vinegar around meal times can help with blood sugar. You want to keep it in the healthy range, not to high (keep below 100 when fasting and below 140 two hours after eating) and not to low (above 70).

**Quester** · 09-13-2019, 04:34 PM

Also, Aromasin has been shown to lower total cholesterol while raising HDL.
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/16184460

**GearHeaded** · 09-14-2019, 10:15 AM

Originally Posted by Quester

Also, Aromasin has been shown to lower total cholesterol while raising HDL.
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/16184460

well the Study plainly states about 3 paragraphs in "" Exemestane [aromasin] did NOT demonstrate any other significant change in HDL level "" . so not sure why your saying that it raises HDL

also keep in mind this study was done on post menopause females . which is likely going to be quite a bit different then AAS using men

I think all the anecdotal evidence and 100 different blood work thats been posted by guys just on this forum alone showing HDL levels generally fall off when using AI's is fairly substantial to make the generally accepted idea that AI's generally have a negative effect on cholesterol profile, especially HDL.

then of course taking the basic biological tenet that Estrogen plays a role in hepatic output of HDL , its reasonable to conclude that any drug that can substantially lower Estrogen levels (like an AI) is going to thus then lower HDL (not raise it).

note - AI's are not going to substantially lower Estrogen levels in females near as much as it can for AAS using men on a percentage basis ..
a mans Estrogen levels can decline 95% from AI usage. that can have a big impact on HDL levels for him.. where as a post menopausal woman may not see near as significant drop in estrogen and thus not as much effect or any on HDL.
this of course has a lot to do also with the major differences between how men and women make estrogen (which is why a study on women and estrogen is not going to apply to men in general)