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Just came off my first cycle, was prepared for everything except DHT. Now it’s thru the roof and causing me to break out uncontrollably. Came across someone on YouTube that mentioned Test free cycles and having minimal side effects after dropping test from his cycle and still making good gains. I asked him where can I learn more about it n he directed me to this site. If anyone could point me in the right direction so I look more up on it would be greatly appreciated thank you
High test causes me to break out with cystic acne so I feel your pain on the one. How much were you running?Quote:
Originally Posted by NewAceYity
YES , despite bro myths bullshit, you can run no test cycles. but what you need to do is use drugs properly stacked that cover all your basis that test itself would cover to some degree.
so what does test do for us. well mainly it converts to estrogen and DHT. two important hormones we need to function. estrogen controls the male libido and a ton of other health promoting functions. DHT is a 'masculizing' androgen (its what gave you a dick and balls in the first place).
if you take steroids, without test, your natty test production is going to shut down and thus so will your estrogen and DHT. but instead of taking Test, we can take other drugs and control the level of estrogen and DHT we are getting.. when you go injecting 500mg of test you have no control over how much estrogen and dht thats going to convert to. and you may likely spill over and get the bad acne like you have.
so we need to select drugs that cover the anabolic basis, the androgen basis (dht being one), and the estrogen basis.
so something like
25mg Winstrol per day (anabolic basis is covered and SHBG will lower and free up more DHT which is in limited supply because of no test)
20mg Tren per day (this is your heavy androgen .. it will also sensitize you to estrogen)
20mg Dbol per day (this provides you some amount of estrogen, which you need, and also will bind to androgen receptors 'like test')
^thats a very light cycle. yet it covers your basis and you will likely grow way more off of that then you would grow off of a test only cycle.
you'll also not likely get the high DHT based side effects like out of control acne because your limiting the amount of DHT
lots of other combos can be done with no test cycles. the above is just one example
Hmmm.
I can only pass on what one person much more experienced and knowledgeable than myself passed on... He said the only cycle he'd ever do or recommend without any test was Primo solo. He'd do like a gram a week for 16 weeks or something like that. Yet I've been told by others that even this should have 100mg/wk test or so thrown in.
You can always just run a lower TRT dose of test and stack on top of that.
So odd how we can all react so differently. I thrive on DHT.
In the meantime use Dawn dishsoap when you bathe. Works great on acne.
I agree about primo.. the first no Test cycle I ever did years ago was Primo (from a pharmacy). I think I ran about 400mg a week is all. felt awesome the whole time. only did it a couple months.Quote:
Originally Posted by Ernst
I was coming off a heavy cycle of test, deca, and dbol where my BP got super high and I got that lethargic can't breath feeling. so maybe I just thought I felt great on Primo only cause it has quite the opposite effect of that and relieved all that 'bloat' side effects
the problem your going to run into though with long term Primo (no test) is your estrogen levels will plummet. not only does Primo not aromatize its actually anti estrogenic.
your nuts are shut down and you have no exogenous test coming in so eventually you have no estrogen.
simply adding 20mg per day of Dbol to your Primo no test cycle would drastically help out
Thank you man now I know what direction to go in more or less. The person I was getting “knowledge” from first told me I didn’t need to worry about sides so much because the stuff I was getting is legit. It quickly became apparent he didn’t know wth he was talking about. I have people telling me to run HGH wit very low test n I shouldn’t have problem with sides. This makes a lot more sense
I was running 750mg per week
Great info here for those of us that are acne prone!
You can use a therapeutic dose of Test as a base to the cycle (75-150mg).
My last cycle was only 90mg of Test but over a gram of total gear.
acne is generally caused by Test converting to DHT and DHT acting on sebaceous gland receptors, OR by compounds that lower SHBG and thus free up more DHT in the body.. but when taking these compounds without testosterone added in this is much less likely to happen (cause your only freeing up bound DHT and not adding more DHT in).
IF I'm running 500mg of test and I add in Primo, then I'm going to get acne. because the Test is converting to DHT, plus the primo is lowering SHBG and is thus freeing up more DHT in the blood stream from a bound state.
if I run primo without the test though, no acne.
also Nandrolones like Deca can cause acne for those that are genetically prone to and sensitive or progestin. Deca acne is NOT at all DHT based as it does not convert to DHT at all, actually quite the opposite it converts to DHN which will bind to DHT receptors yet not illicit any androgenic effects. its via progestin sensitivty that your skin becomes more "oily" when taking deca.
adding Masteron may help this. BUT you have to keep your test dosage low or completely out. because Mast will lower SHBG and free up more DHT, but thats fine as long as you don't have more DHT coming in from exogenous test.
NO , DHT blockers like finasteride will not help. the DHT receptors in the hair follicle is a totally different type of receptor then the one in your subacoeus glands that cause acne. DHT blockers will not work for acne
Quote:
Originally Posted by GearHeaded
The guy who told me I didn’t have to worry is completely bald. I’m guessing DHT didn’t cause him to break out but to lose hair. Im also acne prone so Im thinking ima keep Test very low 150mg max. I started on test only had little breakouts nothing crazy mostly on my back but only 2-3 at a time. Mid cycle threw in EQ n Mast, felt amazing, crazy pump and gains, no acne but noticed my skin got a bit rougher if that makes sense. As soon as I came off the EQ n Mast the breakouts started going crazy.
One of the guys I go the gym with decided he wanted to start using gear after I told him what I'm taking. He decided to start using 20mg dbol and 80mcg clenbuterol and wants to lose weight. He's 25 years old at about 200 lbs, 5'10''. He is to scared to inject anything. Any tips for improving his first cycle?
It's amazing what people who sell this stuff on the street tell their customers
if he optimizes his diet and cardio and training .. the 20mg of Dbol and Clen will likely get him resultsQuote:
Originally Posted by IronLiver
Whilst I agree that it’s cool that we can do the test free cycles... doesn’t anyone else fucking just love blasting test?
I mean I’m on this sweet little cruise with 250mg test, 125mg deca, 400mg primo, 25mg of winstrol @ night, and 25mg of Var in the morning, and I feel amazing... my blood pressure isn’t fucked up, my heart rate is normal, I don’t sweat when I move, I don’t have bacne, but dammit... it’s not the same lol.
lol . exactly why when I do promote Test I generally tell guys to blast 1000+ mg per weekQuote:
Originally Posted by i_SLAM_cougars