Conflicting info on how to cycle, and dangers of cycling?

[TheGypsyKing]

Firstly, people are telling me the only thing necessary is Test, and if I feel symptoms coming on, add in an AI. That PCT is a play, HCG unnecessary.

This goes completely in the face of the guidelines posted here.

So what gives?

s well, what are the side effects I can reasonably expect to encounter if I take 400mg a week of Test E? Balding, more ody hair, sleep changes, acne? What else, what about organ issues like liver, heart issues? Psychological issues?

I have migraine issues and vasospasms that cause angina, due to a bad mediction reaction, so there's that. I'd like to be muscular for once in my life... not just ripped and hard, but have some julian edelman style arms, some size on my legs, etc.

As well, once I start doing gear, will I basically be reliant upon it for as many years as I want to be built, or does any of that muscle built in a cycle have a propensity to stay longterm if you work out hard? I'm not sure that cycling for 10 years sounds like a great idea to me.

[SampsonandDelilah]

Firstly, people are telling me the only thing necessary is Test, and if I feel symptoms coming on, add in an AI. That PCT is a play, HCG unnecessary.

This goes completely in the face of the guidelines posted here.

So what gives?

s well, what are the side effects I can reasonably expect to encounter if I take 400mg a week of Test E? Balding, more ody hair, sleep changes, acne? What else, what about organ issues like liver, heart issues? Psychological issues?

I have migraine issues and vasospasms that cause angina, due to a bad mediction reaction, so there's that. I'd like to be muscular for once in my life... not just ripped and hard, but have some julian edelman style arms, some size on my legs, etc.

As well, once I start doing gear, will I basically be reliant upon it for as many years as I want to be built, or does any of that muscle built in a cycle have a propensity to stay longterm if you work out hard? I'm not sure that cycling for 10 years sounds like a great idea to me.

Nearly impossible to paint it with such a broad brush. I’ve never needed an AI...ever. I used to PCT post cycle and at 40 decided to commit to TRT.

My sides have included increased body hair, some edema (transient) and oily skin from time to time. My first couple of cycles were test only and with surplus calories and regimented lifting, I continually put on mass. I’m convinced our genetics play such a vital role in how we react to compounds, side effects and growth. For some, more is required and for others, less is more.

In terms of AI’s...like all things it’s a dynamic process and we learn more as we progress. There for along time it was encouraged to run an AI during cycle, through trial and error and a better understanding of the role of estrogen, that theory has changed. Again, it’s case by case basis.

No one can ever tell you exactly how you’ll react, we can speak anecdotally and to what the literature suggests, but that doesn’t mean that’ll be your exact experiences...

With test I never really experienced any psychological issues like “roid rage”, I did experience an increased sense of well being (feeling like Superman) and my libido shot through the roof. I have experienced negative psychological effects on tren, but that’s a different animal (even then, not everyone experiences what i did).

With test, my my lab values have stayed in range ( not true with other aforementioned compounds).

Hope that helps...

[Cuz]

Samson give you an overall great answer some may experience more estrogenic sides than others. I used to use an AI, now i have quit and feel fine. My body is hairy as fuck but my dad was a fucking viking when it came to body hair so i think honestly the test just brings out your genetics even more. If you have a thick beard naturally as i do, it will make it even thicker...im naturally vascular as fuck bc naturally i am a toothpick my body is not designed to be where i am...im saying im “more vascular “ since i have used aas...it has really made my good qualities shine like delts and arms and brought up my lagging areas like chest...

As for keeping gains i did an experiment i quite the whole game for 6 years once no lifting not a fucking thing... I LOST ALL OF MY GAINS. So i can tell you if you stop training and eating and stop aas ur gains are more than likely gone.

If you put on 50lbs of muscle mass and decide maybe you dont want anymore muscle and just quit chances are you will lose 45lb of those gains

[balance]

OP

How old are you?
What’s your height, weight, consistent years lifting?

These are important questions that must be answered for people to give you truly helpful information. Are you open to learning or are you here to teach?

Seriously there are many extremely knowledgeable helpful people here but being open to truly learning is paramount.


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[TheGypsyKing]

Samson give you an overall great answer some may experience more estrogenic sides than others. I used to use an AI, now i have quit and feel fine. My body is hairy as fuck but my dad was a fucking viking when it came to body hair so i think honestly the test just brings out your genetics even more. If you have a thick beard naturally as i do, it will make it even thicker...im naturally vascular as fuck bc naturally i am a toothpick my body is not designed to be where i am...im saying im “more vascular “ since i have used aas...it has really made my good qualities shine like delts and arms and brought up my lagging areas like chest...

As for keeping gains i did an experiment i quite the whole game for 6 years once no lifting not a fucking thing... I LOST ALL OF MY GAINS. So i can tell you if you stop training and eating and stop aas ur gains are more than likely gone.

If you put on 50lbs of muscle mass and decide maybe you dont want anymore muscle and just quit chances are you will lose 45lb of those gains

You quit for 6 years as an experiment?

[< <Samson> >]

You quit for 6 years as an experiment?

I doubt it was just to experiment


lol



But yeah, ai - well, it's sorta necessary (no way I can run without an Ai when I push close to 3 grams a week)

Gains - they come & go like seasons


Safety - there is none, aside from your own commonsense & gathered knowledge






I been at this close to a decade straight, next week I'm off to get my bitch tits pulled out - and, I still ain't stopping

[Cuz]

You quit for 6 years as an experiment?

I say 6 it was more like 5 no lifting and no drugs looked like a prisoner of war...never again i hope and pray im able to train till im gone

[< <Samson> >]

I say 6 it was more like 5 no lifting and no drugs looked like a prisoner of war...never again i hope and pray im able to train till im gone

Sounds like me before the juice & massive eating


I weighed 145 all way up until 20 or so

[TheGypsyKing]

I doubt it was just to experiment


lol



But yeah, ai - well, it's sorta necessary (no way I can run without an Ai when I push close to 3 grams a week)

Gains - they come & go like seasons


Safety - there is none, aside from your own commonsense & gathered knowledge






I been at this close to a decade straight, next week I'm off to get my bitch tits pulled out - and, I still ain't stopping

So you're getting breast reduction surgery? This is likely from not using an AI or PCT? This sounds pretty dumb tbh

[TheGypsyKing]

Sounds like me before the juice & massive eating


I weighed 145 all way up until 20 or so

I was probably 155 at 20, at 5'11.5

I'm only 165 now. I just get strong and add no muscle. And all the big guys look at my plate and go "holy shit, you're gonna eat all that?" and I always do, and it just comes right off. I clearly just ain't the most masculine dude.

[< <Samson> >]

So you're getting breast reduction surgery? This is likely from not using an AI or PCT? This sounds pretty dumb tbh

Gets some facts bud

And try out some heavy cycling, then come back & let me know how things should be done

[GearHeaded]

I was probably 155 at 20, at 5'11.5

I'm only 165 now. I just get strong and add no muscle. And all the big guys look at my plate and go "holy shit, you're gonna eat all that?" and I always do, and it just comes right off. I clearly just ain't the most masculine dude.

lol. aren't you Vegan ? of course your plate looks big, it doesn't take much to fill up a plate with spinach.

[XnavyHMCS]

I doubt it was just to experiment


lol



But yeah, ai - well, it's sorta necessary (no way I can run without an Ai when I push close to 3 grams a week)

Gains - they come & go like seasons


Safety - there is none, aside from your own commonsense & gathered knowledge






I been at this close to a decade straight, next week I'm off to get my bitch tits pulled out - and, I still ain't stopping

Atta boy!!!
"Nobody likes a quitter"

[XnavyHMCS]

I was probably 155 at 20, at 5'11.5

I'm only 165 now. I just get strong and add no muscle. And all the big guys look at my plate and go "holy shit, you're gonna eat all that?" and I always do, and it just comes right off. I clearly just ain't the most masculine dude.

If you ain't "the most masculine dude..." then we gotta intruduce you to Obs.

He'll straighten you out...

By the time finishes with you, hell you'll eating nails, sitting razor blades and sweating Tren.

[GearHeaded]

So you're getting breast reduction surgery? This is likely from not using an AI or PCT? This sounds pretty dumb tbh

AI's don't prevent gyno . if your genetically prone to gyno its going to happen period. take all the AI in the world, which will make your dick stop working, and your still going to get bitch tits.
heck you can get gyno from Tren or Deca and they don't even convert to estrogen in the first place .

you need to do some research before you go referring to a long standing experienced member here in the context of the word "dumb"..

keep it up and everyone is going to think your just a troll and not help you out any at all (I'm sure most guys already think you are)

[Cuz]

AI's don't prevent gyno . if your genetically prone to gyno its going to happen period. take all the AI in the world, which will make your dick stop working, and your still going to get bitch tits.
heck you can get gyno from Tren or Deca and they don't even convert to estrogen in the first place .

you need to do some research before you go referring to a long standing experienced member here in the context of the word "dumb"..

keep it up and everyone is going to think your just a troll and not help you out any at all (I'm sure most guys already think you are)

DING DING!! Lol

[< <Samson> >]

Go figure, this surgery shit got me postin' - can't do much of anything else today anyway



I ran letro as an Ai when I was pushing insane doses. . . Was it the smartest thing to do? - well, not exactly. But, it worked - I grew like a weed & felt like I could lift a truck. My BW still checks out, last ultrasound showed nothing abnormal in the organs. I rather come down with gyno than organ damage as the first official sign of "you need to slow the fuck down"


My juicing habits have completely shifted. . . .I have been running 1/4 of what I ran in my first 3-4 years & it works just as well with diet adjustments. . . . . Shit, this is the longest I have been tren free in well over 5 years

[SampsonandDelilah]

AI's don't prevent gyno . if your genetically prone to gyno its going to happen period. take all the AI in the world, which will make your dick stop working, and your still going to get bitch tits.
heck you can get gyno from Tren or Deca and they don't even convert to estrogen in the first place .

you need to do some research before you go referring to a long standing experienced member here in the context of the word "dumb"..

keep it up and everyone is going to think your just a troll and not help you out any at all (I'm sure most guys already think you are)

165# vegan with more open threads than I can count. Essentially asking the same stupid iteration of then same question and the arguing over the answers.
Love the 5’11.5”...don’t forget that all important 1/2 inch. Getting strong and no muscle? Doesn’t happen unless you’re doing something wrong, which clearly you are. Comes down to running the correct gear and eating the correct foods. You’ve been spoon fed (pun intended) more info than one would ever need yet you continue to ask questions and then have the audacity to call dudes out. You’re a dime a dozen and sadly guys like you you will keep coming and going, I see it year after year. Good luck eating lentils and beans or whatever the fuck and I hope you get to where you’re striving to be...

I’m done

[< <Samson> >]

Usually I don't even read this stuff


But, rn - sure


On a semi serious note - Is there such thing as a swole vegan?



I'm out - I'm off to play son's switch

[ChainGang]

There's plenty of data on the web about the effects of cycling. As well as plenty of reviews and logs on the forums. You just have to ask yourself if the risk is worth accomplishing your goals.

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