short low test cycle with no SERM?

**DustMan** · 07-08-2020, 02:56 PM

I've seen lots of guys talk about doing low test cycles, 150-250mg a week and get really good results with the aid of hard training and a good diet. I've got a couple hypothetical questions:

Does doing lower amounts of test mean that you suppress your HPTA less? Could you use this to recover faster / healthier from a cycle?

If you do a shorter 8 week cycle, does this enable your HPTA to recover faster and healthier?

Since Estrogen plays such an important role in health and muscle growth... if your bloods come back good and you aren't showing any gyno, can you run a low test cycle with no SERM for better health / more gains?

**Chark** · 07-08-2020, 03:39 PM

Any amount of exogenous test will shut you down. An extreme example, if you injected 25mg test a week you’d be worse off than completely natty.

The shorter the cycle the better chance for recovery. You’re always at risk of HPTA not returning to normal.

SERMs don’t affect the amount of estrogen in your body in any material way nor will it give you any notable gains.

**Capebuffalo** · 07-08-2020, 04:39 PM

Everyone’s recovery can be different. As said above even a small amount on a short cycle will shut you down. There’s always a risk with recovery.

**DustMan** · 07-08-2020, 04:46 PM

Right, so then it's really about the individual then, but lower dosages / shorter cycles probably lead to better recovery.

Sorry SERM was probably a mistake by me then, an AI would be what gets rid of your estrogen. I hear guys using too much AI and end up with so little estrogen that it hurts their gains, or makes them look flat, so I guess the question would be: If your bloods come back good on cycle, can you go without using an AI, and will that give you better gains?

**Chark** · 07-08-2020, 05:54 PM

Originally Posted by DustMan

Right, so then it's really about the individual then, but lower dosages / shorter cycles probably lead to better recovery.

Sorry SERM was probably a mistake by me then, an AI would be what gets rid of your estrogen. I hear guys using too much AI and end up with so little estrogen that it hurts their gains, or makes them look flat, so I guess the question would be: If your bloods come back good on cycle, can you go without using an AI, and will that give you better gains?

I’m not so sure lower dosages lead to better recovery. Even if they do it may not be significant enough to be worth doing it that way. Since you’re shut down no matter the dosage it may be worth it to just do your cycle at cycling dosages and get your gains vs. hoping a smaller amount leads to better recovery. It may be one of those things that if you’re going to do it, you should just do it all the way. Lower isn’t exactly MUCH safer or anything.

The answer to your second question is yes.

**Capebuffalo** · 07-08-2020, 06:07 PM

You are trying to justify it. Short answer is NO. Small amount doesn’t equal better recovery.

**DustMan** · 07-09-2020, 12:49 AM

Originally Posted by cylon357

Is this your first cycle?

I did a cycle 9 years ago, I was very stupid about it =P, haven't decided if I'm going to do another cycle or just stay natty yet. I'm just asking questions right now, I've pretty well memorized all the information in the steroid .com pages, but I get a fair amount of conflicting information from people on Youtube, I realize that two people can both be right with different opinions since people can respond so differently from each other, I'm just trying to get a better picture of how things work.

If I was going to do another cycle I'm planning on doing just test, and I am considering doing around 300mg a week to try and avoid potential side effects.

**Gallowmere** · 07-09-2020, 12:54 AM

Originally Posted by DustMan

I did a cycle 9 years ago, I was very stupid about it =P, haven't decided if I'm going to do another cycle or just stay natty yet. I'm just asking questions right now, I've pretty well memorized all the information in the steroid .com pages, but I get a fair amount of conflicting information from people on Youtube, I realize that two people can both be right with different opinions since people can respond so differently from each other, I'm just trying to get a better picture of how things work.

If I was going to do another cycle I'm planning on doing just test, and I am considering doing around 300mg a week to try and avoid potential side effects.

Everyone is different, and I don’t necessarily blame you for erring on the lower end. Just keep in mind that every time you play with the pin, your recovery is a dice roll. A small handful guys PCT just fine off of ridiculous dosages for extended periods, while many end up never fully recovering and having to go on TRT permanently, then there’s another small handful who end up hypo even from a short cycle of small doses.
As such, that is the most important thing to consider. All of the typical sides of a test cycle are temporary (even with guys running 2+g/week), but that shut down can be a permanent “side effect” that requires you to marry the needle forever. So roll that one around in your head for a bit, instead of worrying about a bit of water retention and acne.