Looking at DECA and Test

[MityMax96]

Hello All,
Would like to have input on this
I am looking to do DECA and Test Cypionate

About me:
Male
6'1"
175 lbs (currently)
43 years old, been lifting since I was 17.
Only PEDs I have done has been SARMS, and did that in 2018, 2019 and a little in 2020.

I am looking at DECA mostly, but I know there should be a test base paired with it.
But I want the DECA because at this point, my joints are killing me. Elbows, knees, hips, shoulders

I am not looking to become a mass monster, just enough to allow me to get in the gym, workout, grow a little and not be in pain. Just enjoy my workouts again.
So I am looking at something along the lines of DECA 150mg/week and Test 150mg/week

Is that smart, doable?
Anything else I should consider?
I would not like to do anything that would lead to shedding/balding, so any input in this area would be appreciated as well.

Thank you

[Wannabhuge14]

Hello All,
Would like to have input on this
I am looking to do DECA and Test Cypionate

About me:
Male
6'1"
175 lbs (currently)
43 years old, been lifting since I was 17.
Only PEDs I have done has been SARMS, and did that in 2018, 2019 and a little in 2020.

I am looking at DECA mostly, but I know there should be a test base paired with it.
But I want the DECA because at this point, my joints are killing me. Elbows, knees, hips, shoulders

I am not looking to become a mass monster, just enough to allow me to get in the gym, workout, grow a little and not be in pain. Just enjoy my workouts again.
So I am looking at something along the lines of DECA 150mg/week and Test 150mg/week

Is that smart, doable?
Anything else I should consider?
I would not like to do anything that would lead to shedding/balding, so any input in this area would be appreciated as well.

Thank you

Your doses of each look fine. My question is are you on trt currently? If not, deca is very suppressive and difficult to recover from. At your age you would likely benefit from trt and at the doses you have listed you could safely run those for the rest of your life.

[MityMax96]

I am not on TRT, I have been trying to hold off doing TRT for as long as possible.
Keeping my test up by doing Nolvadex every once in a while. For like 2 weeks at a time.

And yes, DECA is suppressive, so that is why I was gonna pair w/ Test Cyp

[Cuz]

I am not on TRT, I have been trying to hold off doing TRT for as long as possible.
Keeping my test up by doing Nolvadex every once in a while. For like 2 weeks at a time.

And yes, DECA is suppressive, so that is why I was gonna pair w/ Test Cyp

Why are you trying to hold off? You will feel a whole lot better.

Agree with above advice dose looks good but i would opt for trt bc after you come off things may not work right for you. Nandrolone can throw the old dick in the ground and it will be in your system awhile longer than test c

[MityMax96]

Why are you trying to hold off? You will feel a whole lot better.

Agree with above advice dose looks good but i would opt for trt bc after you come off things may not work right for you. Nandrolone can throw the old dick in the ground and it will be in your system awhile longer than test c

Biggest concern for me has been any possibility of losing hair.
My current test levels, while not great, have been within "range".
So I have always felt, that I can suck it up at this level because I would rather keep my hair.
The times I have done SARMS, I have noticed increased shedding, especially using RAD140
So I have limited my SARMS for that reason.

But now I am getting to the point where I am just frustrated with my workouts due to joint pain
I like and enjoy going heavy, but after a while (and at my age) it is just trashing my joints.
Like right now I am dealing w/ shoulder pain that has made me stop any type of pressing...I have tried doing other exercises to cause some pec/delt muscle stimulation, but even still I am seeing my chest get smaller.
I had the same issue last year w/ my shoulder, so I backed off things and when I could return to pressing I did so, but I went faster than I should have and wound up screwing things up again and now I am back to square one

So that is why I am considering a cycle of DECA and Test, I suppose going with TRT should be looked at also. But I really want something that will help with my joints and connective tissue.

So I have to watch for "DECA Dick"? Yeah I don't want to be losing the ability to get hard.
How much of that is a factor? Is it dosage related or just the compound itself will have the affect?

[fit_deskjocky]

Agree with the guys above. Deca is great at therapeutic levels. It increases collagen and helps lubricate the joints so it should help you with movements in the gym. I think at 43 you'd be a good candidate for TRT. Getting bloodwork done would be the first step in that direction, then your doc and you can make some decisions.

[MityMax96]

Agree with the guys above. Deca is great at therapeutic levels. It increases collagen and helps lubricate the joints so it should help you with movements in the gym. I think at 43 you'd be a good candidate for TRT. Getting bloodwork done would be the first step in that direction, then your doc and you can make some decisions.

I have been doing blood work over the past couple years, tracking my test
My doc (since numbers have been in range, although I think on the low side) has said no to TRT.

Perhaps I should just go to a Men's Wellness Clinic and work with them.
If doing just TRT, would that help w/ the joint issues?

[fit_deskjocky]

So I have to watch for "DECA Dick"? Yeah I don't want to be losing the ability to get hard.
How much of that is a factor? Is it dosage related or just the compound itself will have the affect?

Nandralone is pretty much immediately suppressive to your natural test levels. Your dick won't quit working on therapeutic levels, there are plenty that function well when adding Deca to their TRT and that's as low as 50mg/ week. As long as Test is being used in combination with Deca at therapeutic amounts you shouldn't encounter sexual sides. As far as MPB, how's your hairline now. What's the hair situation with the men in your family on you father's and mother's side. If you are predisposed to losing your hair already then taking gear could speed up the process. For the most part Test and Deca are fairly hairline friendly. Tren and Mast tend to effect the hairline the most.

[fit_deskjocky]

If doing just TRT, would that help w/ the joint issues?

Some docs avoid prescribing TRT if numbers are in the low range. It really comes down to are you healthily functional at that low range. Is your sex drive decent, ED issues, any fatigue, depression etc. Those are all common with low T. If any of these are occurring it would be good to tell your doc as it shows at the low range you aren't functioning healthily. Test alone won't help with the joint pain. It could make you stronger and able to support the weight better if there are weaknesses. The Deca will, but it will also mask a joint injury. Then you come off your blast with Deca and it starts hurting again and you'll know there is a deeper underlying injury.

[MityMax96]

Nandralone is pretty much immediately suppressive to your natural test levels. Your dick won't quit working on therapeutic levels, there are plenty that function well when adding Deca to their TRT and that's as low as 50mg/ week. As long as Test is being used in combination with Deca at therapeutic amounts you shouldn't encounter sexual sides. As far as MPB, how's your hairline now. What's the hair situation with the men in your family on you father's and mother's side. If you are predisposed to losing your hair already then taking gear could speed up the process. For the most part Test and Deca are fairly hairline friendly. Tren and Mast tend to effect the hairline the most.

Ok, that is good to know.
Is DECA at 150 considered to be therapeutic?
Or would DECA at 50 mg still yield the joint benefits I seek?

As far as hair. Both parents have hair, but I would say they are thin. Never met my mom's father, but my dad's father he had MPB
I am far more active and "healthy" than my parents, so I would say that has played in my favor regarding hair
I currently have a full head of hair, and my hairstylist says what she sees and at my age, I have a good head of hair.
So I am not sure if I am not predisposed to it, or just lucky.

[Cuz]

Biggest concern for me has been any possibility of losing hair.
My current test levels, while not great, have been within "range".
So I have always felt, that I can suck it up at this level because I would rather keep my hair.
The times I have done SARMS, I have noticed increased shedding, especially using RAD140
So I have limited my SARMS for that reason.

But now I am getting to the point where I am just frustrated with my workouts due to joint pain
I like and enjoy going heavy, but after a while (and at my age) it is just trashing my joints.
Like right now I am dealing w/ shoulder pain that has made me stop any type of pressing...I have tried doing other exercises to cause some pec/delt muscle stimulation, but even still I am seeing my chest get smaller.
I had the same issue last year w/ my shoulder, so I backed off things and when I could return to pressing I did so, but I went faster than I should have and wound up screwing things up again and now I am back to square one

So that is why I am considering a cycle of DECA and Test, I suppose going with TRT should be looked at also. But I really want something that will help with my joints and connective tissue.

So I have to watch for "DECA Dick"? Yeah I don't want to be losing the ability to get hard.
How much of that is a factor? Is it dosage related or just the compound itself will have the affect?

You will probably be ok on a therapeutic dose, as long as you run your test a little longer. Id run it 4 weeks longer just to be sure but then your practically running test 16 weeks

[MityMax96]

Some docs avoid prescribing TRT if numbers are in the low range. It really comes down to are you healthily functional at that low range. Is your sex drive decent, ED issues, any fatigue, depression etc. Those are all common with low T. If any of these are occurring it would be good to tell your doc as it shows at the low range you aren't functioning healthily. Test alone won't help with the joint pain. It could make you stronger and able to support the weight better if there are weaknesses. The Deca will, but it will also mask a joint injury. Then you come off your blast with Deca and it starts hurting again and you'll know there is a deeper underlying injury.

The biggest thing I notice for me is just lethargy....and also feeling like I am hitting a brick wall with my lifts
Don't feel depressed and sex drive is good. My mood is pretty stable for the most part....

Ah, so DECA doesn't actually do anything to promote healing in joints? I was mistaken then. I thought it did.

[MityMax96]

You will probably be ok on a therapeutic dose, as long as you run your test a little longer. Id run it 4 weeks longer just to be sure but then your practically running test 16 weeks

Roger that.

[fit_deskjocky]

Uncles are a good example of what you can expect of your hair. Most who use Deca as a blast to gain mass are with in the 350 to 500 range or more. Deca at 50 to 150 could be considered at the therapeutic levels but you don't want to use any more than you have to. If 50 to 150mg/ week does the trick, no reason to use more unless you want to use it for other means, ie bulking, strength etc. It'll have to be something you experiment with. I do feel if your doc is hesitant to put you on TRT he probably won't put you on Deca, even should he finally give in and put you on it. That might be an experiment you have to do on your own.

[MityMax96]

Uncles are a good example of what you can expect of your hair. Most who use Deca as a blast to gain mass are with in the 350 to 500 range or more. Deca at 50 to 150 could be considered at the therapeutic levels but you don't want to use any more than you have to. If 50,g/ week does the trick, no reason to use more unless you want to use it for other means, ie bulking, strength etc.

Both parents only had sisters. LOL

Ok, good to know.
I am not looking to jump from 175lbs to 200lbs, so I would be fine at the smallest amount that helped my joints.
Is DECA something you would not run long term? Like with TRT, you get on that, you are on it for good.

[fit_deskjocky]

Ah, so DECA doesn't actually do anything to promote healing in joints? I was mistaken then. I thought it did.

It does, lubrication in the joint is helpful. But it's not going to heal anything if there is a deeper issue

[MityMax96]

It does, lubrication in the joint is helpful. But it's not going to heal anything if there is a deeper issue

Ok, got it.

[Test Monsterone]

OP, I'm running 150 test/150 deca/150 primo right now. I love the deca/test combination, at least how it makes me feel. It takes a while to see results, though, as these are long estered steroids. At about 8 weeks and probably feeling the effects the most now. Veins are bulging, arms/chest/back feel pumped. Haven't put on any weight though, I just feel much stronger and look better. I'm already at my max, though, and I would need to up my doses by a lot to put on any more size.

For hair - you have minoxidil, finasteride, microneedling, and biotin supplements. They work, I use them.

[MityMax96]

OP, I'm running 150 test/150 deca/150 primo right now. I love the deca/test combination, at least how it makes me feel. It takes a while to see results, though, as these are long estered steroids. At about 8 weeks and probably feeling the effects the most now. Veins are bulging, arms/chest/back feel pumped. Haven't put on any weight though, I just feel much stronger and look better. I'm already at my max, though, and I would need to up my doses by a lot to put on any more size.

For hair - you have minoxidil, finasteride, microneedling, and biotin supplements. They work, I use them.

Thank you for your input.

For Hair
Do you use all those products at once, or just one of them?

[Test Monsterone]

Thank you for your input.

For Hair
Do you use all those products at once, or just one of them?

I use finasteride 1mg every other day (was doing it everyday, but found it was almost as effective at EOD doses with less sexual side effects), minoxidil 2x per day (if I don't forget or am lazy), biotin every day, and micro needling 1x per week (I was consistent for a while but stopped, but I feel it was working).

[Wannabhuge14]

Both parents only had sisters. LOL

Ok, good to know.
I am not looking to jump from 175lbs to 200lbs, so I would be fine at the smallest amount that helped my joints.
Is DECA something you would not run long term? Like with TRT, you get on that, you are on it for good.

Lots of doctors will prescribe a therapeutic dose of deca along with trt. You can use it at low doses as long as you want. Lots of guys here run in the 100mg range year round.

[fit_deskjocky]

Here's an article that may be helpful to show your doc if he seems to be reluctant putting you on therapeutic doses of Nandrolone. Your doc seems extremely hesitant. It may be a step by step process, getting him to put you on TRT first to conquer the fatigue first and then approaching the Deca at a later date once your levels are dialed in.

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4837307/

[musclemanchoice]

As for me would be better to do Week 1-5:

30mg dbol (ed)
500mg test-p by https://mr-pharmaceutical.com/profil...-propionate(ew split in 2)
2 tabs liv52 (ed)
15mg Aromasin (eod)
Week 6-10:

500mg test-p (ew split in 2)
15mg aromasin (eod)
Week 12-13:

Nolvadex (20mg ed)
Week 14-15:

Nolvadex (10mg ed)

[MityMax96]

Lots of doctors will prescribe a therapeutic dose of deca along with trt. You can use it at low doses as long as you want. Lots of guys here run in the 100mg range year round.

Ok, good.
Thank you.

[MityMax96]

Here's an article that may be helpful to show your doc if he seems to be reluctant putting you on therapeutic doses of Nandrolone. Your doc seems extremely hesitant. It may be a step by step process, getting him to put you on TRT first to conquer the fatigue first and then approaching the Deca at a later date once your levels are dialed in.

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4837307/

Cool thank you
He is just a PCP, so probably doesn't fully understand things.
And then looks at me, and thinks "Why go on TRT, you don't need it"
I don't look my age and I am a very healthy person...plus don't drink or smoke....but somehow I personally feel things to be a tad off.

[MityMax96]

As for me would be better to do Week 1-5:

30mg dbol (ed)
500mg test-p (ew split in 2)
2 tabs liv52 (ed)
15mg Aromasin (eod)
Week 6-10:

500mg test-p (ew split in 2)
15mg aromasin (eod)
Week 12-13:

Nolvadex (20mg ed)
Week 14-15:

Nolvadex (10mg ed)

Thank you for the outline.
Why the high Test dose?
Again, I am not looking to shoot from 175lbs -> 200+lbs
I would be fine being in the higher end of the "normal" test range if I felt good and my workouts were feeling better

[MityMax96]

I use finasteride 1mg every other day (was doing it everyday, but found it was almost as effective at EOD doses with less sexual side effects), minoxidil 2x per day (if I don't forget or am lazy), biotin every day, and micro needling 1x per week (I was consistent for a while but stopped, but I feel it was working).

Roger that
Thank you.

[MityMax96]

Would HGH be a good alternative to DECA?
How would that interact w/ test? I assume no affect on natural test levels.

[fit_deskjocky]

As for me would be better to do Week 1-5:

30mg dbol (ed)
500mg test-p (ew split in 2)
2 tabs liv52 (ed)
15mg Aromasin (eod)
Week 6-10:

500mg test-p (ew split in 2)
15mg aromasin (eod)
Week 12-13:

Nolvadex (20mg ed)
Week 14-15:

Nolvadex (10mg ed)

I don't understand what this post is asking. If you're wondering about your cycle you hijacked a post that discusses Test with Deca and don't have Deca anywhere in your cycle. You'll get more help if you posed this in your own thread

[fit_deskjocky]

Cool thank you
He is just a PCP, so probably doesn't fully understand things.
And then looks at me, and thinks "Why go on TRT, you don't need it"
I don't look my age and I am a very healthy person...plus don't drink or smoke....but somehow I personally feel things to be a tad off.

And it's kind of unfortunate you will have PCPs prescribe you a habit forming and in highly addictive antidepressant for your mood or fatigue or pain meds for your joint pain rather than TRT. Some will avoid it at all costs. The trend for men is getting better though

[MityMax96]

And it's kind of unfortunate you will have PCPs prescribe you a habit forming and in highly addictive antidepressant for your mood or fatigue or pain meds for your joint pain rather than TRT. Some will avoid it at all costs. The trend for men is getting better though

Agreed

I have my yearly physical coming up on 3/1, and will do my blood work on 2/22
So I am thinking about booking an appointment with a TRT Clinic on 3/1, once I have my most recent bloods in hand...and talk with them and get their thoughts
I am not a big fan of doing drugs (prescribed or otherwise), but at this point something has to give. I want to be able to work out, as pain free as possible.

[fit_deskjocky]

I'm am definitely anti-medication as well. For me the side effects of living with Low T, low sex drive, depression, fatigue, decreased bone density, increase fat deposition, decreased immune system etc outweigh the risks of being on TRT

[MityMax96]

I'm am definitely anti-medication as well. For me the side effects of living with Low T, low sex drive, depression, fatigue, decreased bone density, increase fat deposition, decreased immune system etc outweigh the risks of being on TRT

Very valid point.

[Test Monsterone]

Trt clinics, for the most part, are scams. A bottle of test will cost you $40 and last you many months. A trt clinic will charge you upwards of $2,000 a year for a couple of basic blood panels and testosterone. If you are diligent, intelligent, and responsible, you can handle things on your own much better than a clinic. If you want supervision, go with a real doctor that’s not in the game purely for profit and to try to sell you overpriced TRT regimens.

[MityMax96]

Trt clinics, for the most part, are scams. A bottle of test will cost you $40 and last you many months. A trt clinic will charge you upwards of $2,000 a year for a couple of basic blood panels and testosterone. If you are diligent, intelligent, and responsible, you can handle things on your own much better than a clinic. If you want supervision, go with a real doctor that’s not in the game purely for profit and to try to sell you overpriced TRT regimens.

Fair point.
The only thing I am concerned w/ is making sure I am getting actual product. And not something random.

[tootallshorty]

Mity, just from my personal experience I have had two bad bouts of tendentious in two separate places in my left elbow and both times an Ostarine cycle helped the injury completely heal. The injuries were pretty bad too. Its really good for joints, tendons and bones. MK 677 is supposed to also help but I cannot vouch for it.

[MityMax96]

Mity, just from my personal experience I have had two bad bouts of tendentious in two separate places in my left elbow and both times an Ostarine cycle helped the injury completely heal. The injuries were pretty bad too. Its really good for joints, tendons and bones. MK 677 is supposed to also help but I cannot vouch for it.

I have done ostarine as well....maybe I will try it again. I just notice shedding when using that, even more when using RAD140
I just hate the fact it crashes the crap out of my test. I can always tell a mood swing waiting for my test levels to pick back up and that is on Nolvadex

I have not used MK 677 in a while, and not sure I want to jump on that, as spring/summer is coming...that stuff will have you eating everything in the house.

[tootallshorty]

Yes very true about MK 677. I just started a few weeks ago and find myself very hungry these days.

I didnt experience any shedding on Ostarine but I am also taking 1mg of finasteride every day. I started losing my hair at a very young age. I've now had two hair transplant surgeries and take the pill and minoxidil daily. Its worked wonders for me.

As the other guys were saying, if you get on a TRT regimen for low T you wont have to worry about your test crashing anymore as you will always have it as a base. I didnt experience any crashing when using Ostarine anyway but everyone is different. Now I am using LGD 4033 and recently got put on 100mg/wk test for low T so no worries on crashing after the cycle.

As a final note, getting on a TRT regimen has really bettered my mood, energy level and libido. I only wish I had done it earlier. I am a TRT'er for life for sure!

[MityMax96]

Yes very true about MK 677. I just started a few weeks ago and find myself very hungry these days.

I didnt experience any shedding on Ostarine but I am also taking 1mg of finasteride every day. I started losing my hair at a very young age. I've now had two hair transplant surgeries and take the pill and minoxidil daily. Its worked wonders for me.

As the other guys were saying, if you get on a TRT regimen for low T you wont have to worry about your test crashing anymore as you will always have it as a base. I didnt experience any crashing when using Ostarine anyway but everyone is different. Now I am using LGD 4033 and recently got put on 100mg/wk test for low T so no worries on crashing after the cycle.

As a final note, getting on a TRT regimen has really bettered my mood, energy level and libido. I only wish I had done it earlier. I am a TRT'er for life for sure!

I am seriously considering TRT
How old are you?

[kelkel]

On your last blood work, what was your Total T and Free T. Include ranges.
If your total T is barely in range your Free T could be quite low. FT is what works for us, total doesn't really matter.

On your next blood work make sure you get all the normal crap plus, LH, FSH, thyroid panel to include TSH, FT3, FT4 and RT3 plus antibodies if the doc will allow it. SHBG would be great as well as Vit D.