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Thread: Xanax, Diazepam and zopiclone for sleep on a low dose TRT boldernone cycle.

  1. #1
    twalker1992 is offline New Member
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    Xanax, Diazepam and zopiclone for sleep on a low dose TRT boldernone cycle.

    Hi all,

    I'm not sure if I'm allowed to post this on here (I did look for a relevant thread). Anyway Just a quite brief of where I'm at... I'm an endurance athlete training for triathlons and ofc the legendary Ironman. I've always been relatively fit and I did used to body build years ago and use heavy cycles.

    I'm currently running 150mg Test Hep, 200mg Boldernone and 500mg HcG per week. I was using 0.25 Arimidex EOD but I've noticed low E2 issues so I'm going to see how E3Ds goes and I'll be getting bloods done so see where I'm at. Oh I've also added 50mg of proviron as it has many benefits whilst on cycles (I'm on week 11 out of 20) and feeling great cardio wise - Get lots of strava KOMs and PBs and feeling unstoppable some rides.

    Now my main question if there sometimes I'm sleeping so poorly (possibly due to the intensive training) and it's fucking my training up and work is tough if I dont sleep well. I have zopiclone, xanax and diazepam on side - I'm not willing to abuse these much but just on a bad night I'm curious as to whether what dose I should take to sleep well and wake up feeling ready for the day. it's either 4/5am for a running morning or up to 6am if I'm not running.

    Note: I have DNP on hand and T5 eca & ephedrine to aid with breathing as I have exercise induced asthma and I'm trying to make race weight (I'm 82kg slowing coming down to 75ish)

    and I'm also vegan to help reduce stress load on the heart.

    Sorry it's a lot to read but any advice would be appreciated.

    Thank you.

  2. #2
    SampsonandDelilah's Avatar
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    Eszopiclone will be your best bet for longer sleep and less potential for rebound insomnia (I sold Ambien and Ambien CR for 8 years and am also an insane insomniac. I know my shit). Lunesta (branded) was designed as a chronic medication.

    Valium and Xanax are benzodiazepines and although bring on sleep, they have really short half lives and have a tendency for tolerance resulting in insomnia and poor sleep upon discontinuation.

    They work great for initiating sleep though and can be a great short term solution, but be prepared for middle of the night awakenings and potentially grogginess. I like around 1 mg of Xanax for sleep. Diazepam (Valium) is like eating a tic tac for me, so I don’t bother.

    They also street value though and have a higher potential for abuse than say lunesta or Ambien.
    If you like the benzodiazepines, I’d look into Atavan, longer half life and better sleep studies.

    2 or 3 mgs of eszopliclone is where I’d start.

    The 3 mgs is notorious for leaving a metallic taste in your mouth the next morning so don’t be alarmed if it happens.

    If that fails, eat a 42 ounce porterhouse,
    …puts me to sleep every time

    Guys will recommend OTC’s and melatonin, for me I’m better off eating a sour patch kid.
    They don’t work a bit…

    Trazadone is my drug of choice for sleep
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  3. #3
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    When it comes to sleep, and also other semi-related stuff like depression and anxiety, I only use a medication when it becomes tortuous. And if it does become tortuous, then I'll tone down the semi-deliberate causes of it (e.g. taking stimulants such as caffeine, playing video games until midnight) before I use another medication to put me right. That cycle of compensation can go on for weeks and months and years, and can escalate. I'm not saying it ends in catastrophe every time, but sometimes it does.

    If you take alcohol, or smoke cigarettes, or drink more than 3 cups of coffee a day, and are having sleep trouble, I'd try cutting one or two of those things out.

    A lot of the time, I don't know an exact percentage, but trouble getting to sleep and staying asleep is purely an emotional/psychological issue. Dealing with an emotional/psychological issue with an medication is only something I consider when it's extreme -- I mean if I got a call at 2pm on Wednesday to say my wife and kids just died in a house fire at home then I'd take sleeping tablets for a while. But if I'm losing sleep because of the drugs I'm taking for athletic performance/aesthetic then I'd just reduce my dose.
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  4. #4
    twalker1992 is offline New Member
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    Quote Originally Posted by SampsonandDelilah View Post
    Eszopiclone will be your best bet for longer sleep and less potential for rebound insomnia (I sold Ambien and Ambien CR for 8 years and am also an insane insomniac. I know my shit). Lunesta (branded) was designed as a chronic medication.

    Valium and Xanax are benzodiazepines and although bring on sleep, they have really short half lives and have a tendency for tolerance resulting in insomnia and poor sleep upon discontinuation.

    They work great for initiating sleep though and can be a great short term solution, but be prepared for middle of the night awakenings and potentially grogginess. I like around 1 mg of Xanax for sleep. Diazepam (Valium) is like eating a tic tac for me, so I don’t bother.

    They also street value though and have a higher potential for abuse than say lunesta or Ambien.
    If you like the benzodiazepines, I’d look into Atavan, longer half life and better sleep studies.

    2 or 3 mgs of eszopliclone is where I’d start.

    The 3 mgs is notorious for leaving a metallic taste in your mouth the next morning so don’t be alarmed if it happens.

    If that fails, eat a 42 ounce porterhouse,
    …puts me to sleep every time

    Guys will recommend OTC’s and melatonin, for me I’m better off eating a sour patch kid.
    They don’t work a bit…

    Trazadone is my drug of choice for sleep
    Is Eszopiclone as I have that on hand, I may try Trazadone like you mentioned
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  5. #5
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    Benzos work great for one or two times every now and then. Problem is you quickly start doing them every day and you build tolerance very quickly.

    And they're majorly addictive too.

    And if you do develop a dependency on them, although you probably won't, you can die from the withdrawals and you certainly will feel like you're dying from them. I'm talking seeing light that isn't there when your eyes are closed and the room is pitch black, smelling smells that don't exist, loss of muscle control, cramping of every muscle in your body, the inability to sleep for nearly a couple weeks (and the hallucinations that brings). Difficulty breathing and swallowing (due to lack of muscle control). The worst anxiety you'll ever experience and your insomnia comes back with a vengeance.

    Don't even bother with them. Use an Ambien or take some Benedryl.
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  6. #6
    doublewide is offline Associate Member
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    Ambien or Lunesta for sure. As mentioned above Xanax and Valium (and Klonopin for that matter) will put you to sleep rather quickly but I always wake up in the middle of the night and my sleep is just not that solid.

  7. #7
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    Since xanax is a quick acting drug I would recommend valium/diazepam because its half life is a lot longer than zannies. I dont know much about Zopiclone but im sure you know benzos can be addictive, usually make my sleep apnea worse but I do sleep very well on it. I have to say a big dose of melatonin 10-15mg knocks me out and I sleep great. Interesting side note, melatonin clears out stimulant receptors so it helps keep your tolerance a bit lower.
    Last edited by kloter1; 07-16-2021 at 09:03 AM.

  8. #8
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    Quote Originally Posted by SampsonandDelilah View Post
    Valium and Xanax are benzodiazepines and although bring on sleep, they have really short half lives and have a tendency for tolerance resulting in insomnia and poor sleep upon discontinuation.
    Trazadone is my drug of choice for sleep
    I agree with the view that having Xanax may lead to addiction resulting in further side effects. I am also in the favor of Trazadone in such cases. You can also order your medicines online from the Canada Drugs website. It is recommended to consult the doctor before taking any pills.
    Last edited by kusum; 08-05-2021 at 07:50 AM.

  9. #9
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    I'd stay away from benzodiazepines for merely sleeping aid. Although I never grew a tolerance for it (I've been on Xanax and Clonazepam) despite being on them for several months each, it is in fact difficult to quit. I had the prescription for depression-related anxiety but it did knock me out within 30 mins whenever I took it.
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  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by Honkey_Kong View Post
    Benzos work great for one or two times every now and then. Problem is you quickly start doing them every day and you build tolerance very quickly.

    And they're majorly addictive too.

    And if you do develop a dependency on them, although you probably won't, you can die from the withdrawals and you certainly will feel like you're dying from them. I'm talking seeing light that isn't there when your eyes are closed and the room is pitch black, smelling smells that don't exist, loss of muscle control, cramping of every muscle in your body, the inability to sleep for nearly a couple weeks (and the hallucinations that brings). Difficulty breathing and swallowing (due to lack of muscle control). The worst anxiety you'll ever experience and your insomnia comes back with a vengeance.

    Don't even bother with them. Use an Ambien or take some Benedryl.
    I've heard benzo withdrawals are worse (and more dangerous) than opiate withdrawals. I've had a few friends that have been on them for a couple of decades and don't seem to be stopping any time soon. Glad I never got hooked on that. A little bit of weed is all I need. And some steroids .

  11. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by Test Monsterone View Post
    I've heard benzo withdrawals are worse (and more dangerous) than opiate withdrawals. I've had a few friends that have been on them for a couple of decades and don't seem to be stopping any time soon. Glad I never got hooked on that. A little bit of weed is all I need. And some steroids.
    I was never addicted mentally but I got physically addicted to Xanax twice. Had two seizures. I’m ok if I take Xanax once or two days in a row, but if I take it long enough to have become physically dependent (4/5 days), and then stop cold Turkey… 3/4 days later I have a seizure. Once it happened while I was driving. Went over the median into oncoming traffic. Went into the woods hit a small tree. Seatbelt on. Broke my shoulder. I’ve got angels on my back. Yeah so I can’t fuck with Xanax. I know seizures from Xanax withdrawal isn’t uncommon. The scary part about it is that it happens to me 4 days later. I think I’m good. Comes out of nowhere.

    I suspect all benzo withdrawal could give me seizures although it hasn’t happened with Valium/klonopin. Longer half life benzos.

    Seizures are scary as fuck. They say it’s like an electrical storm in your brain. You can get brain damage. Turn into a vegetable.

    Yeah so I can fuck with Xanax/benzos like that. Xanax and opiates could kill me. My Achilles heal.

    Yeah I remember the withdrawals from Xanax. Very different than opiate withdrawals. Auditory hallucinations. Delirious. Night tremors. Bad shit.

    They do work good tho lol. I’m playing Russian roulette takin em tho.
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  12. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by Flacco View Post
    I was never addicted mentally but I got physically addicted to Xanax twice. Had two seizures. I’m ok if I take Xanax once or two days in a row, but if I take it long enough to have become physically dependent (4/5 days), and then stop cold Turkey… 3/4 days later I have a seizure. Once it happened while I was driving. Went over the median into oncoming traffic. Went into the woods hit a small tree. Seatbelt on. Broke my shoulder. I’ve got angels on my back. Yeah so I can’t fuck with Xanax. I know seizures from Xanax withdrawal isn’t uncommon. The scary part about it is that it happens to me 4 days later. I think I’m good. Comes out of nowhere.

    I suspect all benzo withdrawal could give me seizures although it hasn’t happened with Valium/klonopin. Longer half life benzos.

    Seizures are scary as fuck. They say it’s like an electrical storm in your brain. You can get brain damage. Turn into a vegetable.

    Yeah so I can fuck with Xanax/benzos like that. Xanax and opiates could kill me. My Achilles heal.

    Yeah I remember the withdrawals from Xanax. Very different than opiate withdrawals. Auditory hallucinations. Delirious. Night tremors. Bad shit.

    They do work good tho lol. I’m playing Russian roulette takin em tho.
    Wow. Seizures are no joke. It’s funny you say how quickly your body gets physically addicted. I’ve suspected this before. One summer, back around 2012, I was living in LA and my girlfriend from back home came to visit. She had a prescription for Xanax and had a bunch of them. I started taking them every day cause I found they mellowed me out when I got too high on that dispensary kush.

    I just have skipped doses but I got, what I later thought were very bad panic attacks. I was driving the canyon roads outside of Santa Monica and I had to pull over cause I started shaking and feeling like the world was closing in on me. For about 6 months I had this happen at least once a week, to varying degrees. I didn’t realize how it could have been from the Xanax.

  13. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by Test Monsterone View Post
    Wow. Seizures are no joke. It’s funny you say how quickly your body gets physically addicted. I’ve suspected this before. One summer, back around 2012, I was living in LA and my girlfriend from back home came to visit. She had a prescription for Xanax and had a bunch of them. I started taking them every day cause I found they mellowed me out when I got too high on that dispensary kush.

    I just have skipped doses but I got, what I later thought were very bad panic attacks. I was driving the canyon roads outside of Santa Monica and I had to pull over cause I started shaking and feeling like the world was closing in on me. For about 6 months I had this happen at least once a week, to varying degrees. I didn’t realize how it could have been from the Xanax.
    The rebound effect. You usually start taking benzos because of panic episodes, then when you stop taking them is when you have the worse panic attacks of your life. My panic attacks would resemble a heart attack.

    Did you have any sever muscle cramping too?
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  14. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by Honkey_Kong View Post
    The rebound effect. You usually start taking benzos because of panic episodes, then when you stop taking them is when you have the worse panic attacks of your life. My panic attacks would resemble a heart attack.

    Did you have any sever muscle cramping too?
    I didn’t have muscle cramping during those panic attacks, but I did feel my hands getting numb and getting the pins and needles feeling in my body. The reason I stopped working out for almost 2 years was because of those panic attacks. Anything that raised my heart rate made me get that aura and have palpitations or jolts of adrenaline. I’m sure the beta blockers I’m on now help with that.
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  15. #15
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    You all need to meditate

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    Quote Originally Posted by Fluidic Kimbo View Post
    You all need to meditate
    I hate this. I hate it when people mention meditation as a cure for literally anything. My dads a part-time meditation instructor and he hates it when people do that too.

    I'm clearly triggered cuz meditation has never solved anything for me. :/

  17. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by Spumps View Post
    I hate this. I hate it when people mention meditation as a cure for literally anything. My dads a part-time meditation instructor and he hates it when people do that too.

    I'm clearly triggered cuz meditation has never solved anything for me. :/
    You're right -- I just blurted out something that works for me without any consideration of what works for others. I know a lot of people here relieve themselves by reading the Bible. I knew a guy who kept crystals. Whatever works.

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