Water retention on AI's while on cycle

[Spumps]

Hey guys. Just started my first cycle after getting on TRT earlier this year. I'm struggling with figuring out how to track my weight gain on cycle?

What I'm taking:

1-12 weeks: Test E 500mg/week (pinned twice)
1-14 weeks: Letrozole 1mg e3.5d. I'll assess and adjust doses later as needed.
14-18 weeks: PCT

My stats: 26yo,5'9,77kg, 13%bf.

I cannot source Aromasin or Arimidex where I live hence the use of letro.

Let's say this dose keeps my estradiol levels in the normal range. Do I still have to worry about water gain? I don't mind water gain but it makes it impossible to assess how much i'm actually putting on. Monitoring changes in the mirror is something I've always sucked at tbh so that's not an option.

How do you guys track your weight in any meaningful way while on compounds that aromatize?

Thank you

[SampsonandDelilah]

If the test is prescribed, getting access to an AI should be easy.

If it’s self administered TRT, then dealing with some water weight is just part of the game. No different than acne, hair loss, emotional fluctuations, etc…

Instead of a scale or a mirror, you can use a tape measure to monitor progress. Even with an AI on board, you don’t want to crush E2 and some up and down weight swings are going to occur

[Spumps]

If the test is prescribed, getting access to an AI should be easy.

If it’s self administered TRT, then dealing with some water weight is just part of the game. No different than acne, hair loss, emotional fluctuations, etc…

Instead of a scale or a mirror, you can use a tape measure to monitor progress. Even with an AI on board, you don’t want to crush E2 and some up and down weight swings are going to occur

I meant that I cannot find them for a reasonable price. A months supply of Arimidex or Aromasin is about $150. Can't really afford it cuz I'm still a student.

Thanks for the tape suggestion. I did get all my measurements done yesterday. I'll keep tracking them.

What are the effects on gains if you have your e2 crushed during the cycle? I'm aware of all the other effects of crushed E2 but how bad is it in terms of making gains?

[SampsonandDelilah]

Any history of gyno as a kid?

Have you held a lot of water while on TRT?

I’m a believer of only using an AI if needed, I’ve never used one on cycle, just haven’t needed it. Ya, I’ve had some bloat and edema but not enough to necessitate using an AI. I’m not saying they’re a horrible idea as we all react so differently.

E2 is needed for growth and is an extremely important hormone for growing and sexual homeostasis. Using too much of anti estrogen medications can lower E2 so much that it brings on more problems than if you had it too high. That’s why blood work is so important. I’m one that WAY rather have it too high than too low.

Another avenue would be adding on Masteron as it’s a DHT derivative.

In fact, DHT has been shown to prevent the estrogen-dependent augmentation of the progesterone receptor in human breast cancer cells.

It’s not cheap either but I use that alongside proviron in every cycle that I run now and have never had issues with gyno or too much water retention since.

If you have to use letro while on, I would go slow and low or have it in your back pocket to incorporate if you become symptomatic


(And yes, the take measure will be your friend)

Good luck

[Chicagotarsier]

If the test is prescribed, getting access to an AI should be easy.

If it’s self administered TRT, then dealing with some water weight is just part of the game. No different than acne, hair loss, emotional fluctuations, etc…

Instead of a scale or a mirror, you can use a tape measure to monitor progress. Even with an AI on board, you don’t want to crush E2 and some up and down weight swings are going to occur

Well stated. You also have to define whatyou mean by water gain. If you mean bloat due to fat cells there is no substitute for an AI and no ..... Letro will not do the same as Adex no matter the dose of Letro you use (double negative but you get what I mean).

I can tell you how bad bloat can get. Using Asin vs Adex. I was at max daily dose of Pharma Asin and swapped to Adex and lost 20 lbs of water in 7 days. Having your AI correct means a lot. Still you got to do what you got to do.

[Spumps]

Well stated. You also have to define whatyou mean by water gain. If you mean bloat due to fat cells there is no substitute for an AI and no ..... Letro will not do the same as Adex no matter the dose of Letro you use (double negative but you get what I mean).

I can tell you how bad bloat can get. Using Asin vs Adex. I was at max daily dose of Pharma Asin and swapped to Adex and lost 20 lbs of water in 7 days. Having your AI correct means a lot. Still you got to do what you got to do.

Is there a reason why letro isn't as good as Adex for combatting water gain?

[Chicagotarsier]

Adex is an aromatase blocker. You can adjust doseage and how much it blocks.

Letro is same as Adex but many times more powerful. It's purpose is to make estrogen production 0 at minimum dose. Hence Adex >>> Letro for controling how much is blocked.

Letro is a better tool against gyno.

Asin actually cancels out and lowers estrogen directly.

Estrogen halflife is 7 days. So it takes 21 days with 0 estrogen production to get you back to a normal estrogen level without Asin for gyno treatment. You can do that in 4 days with Letro and Asin.

Everyone is different with water retention. Estrogen and you determine what is best for you.

[Spumps]

Thanks guys! Very helpful.

[Honkey_Kong]

I meant that I cannot find them for a reasonable price. A months supply of Arimidex or Aromasin is about $150. Can't really afford it cuz I'm still a student.

Thanks for the tape suggestion. I did get all my measurements done yesterday. I'll keep tracking them.

What are the effects on gains if you have your e2 crushed during the cycle? I'm aware of all the other effects of crushed E2 but how bad is it in terms of making gains?

If you're 26, why are you on TRT? What symptoms are you having that you need this? Have you had bloodwork and an examination? A 26-year-old shouldn't have low test. If you have it, your doctor should be looking for the cause of this first rather than just treat the symptom with test. It can be something like a prolactinoma that is causing this. TRT should be a last resort for you.

As far as prices go, I don't know what the prices for things are where you are, but if you can't afford the right materials to be doing your cycle, then you shouldn't be doing one. Besides, the gear is the cheap part. Your food bill is where the money really goes. I know that's probably not what you want to hear. Maybe snag a part time job and put this on hold until you can afford it?

[Spumps]

If you're 26, why are you on TRT? What symptoms are you having that you need this? Have you had bloodwork and an examination? A 26-year-old shouldn't have low test. If you have it, your doctor should be looking for the cause of this first rather than just treat the symptom with test. It can be something like a prolactinoma that is causing this. TRT should be a last resort for you.

As far as prices go, I don't know what the prices for things are where you are, but if you can't afford the right materials to be doing your cycle, then you shouldn't be doing one. Besides, the gear is the cheap part. Your food bill is where the money really goes. I know that's probably not what you want to hear. Maybe snag a part-time job and put this on hold until you can afford it?

I've been on TRT since I was 25. Been on antidepressants my whole life so that may be the cause. I know plenty of people my age and below on TRT. Sometimes there really isn't an explanation for low T.

Where I come from food is dirt cheap. Besides, my diet is very simple and cheap. Just a lot of rice, chicken, veggies and some fruit. The food bill for the whole cycle would be like 1/5th of the money I've spent on this cycle so far.

How it works in my country is that they only import a few drugs of a particular class. For eg, letrozole is relatively cheap while Aromasin and Arimidex are ridiculously expensive because the government only import a few thousand units of those. Similarly, they don't import testosterone cypionate or decanoate - just enanthate .

I know it sounds like I have an excuse for everything but this is just reality, I guess. There are other places on earth aside from the US and Europe and most of us will never be able to afford the ideal cycle.

[balance]

If pins are cheap where you are I would switch to pinning daily vs twice a week. Just changing the frequency of your given dose can make an impact. Simply put it gives your body a better opportunity to deal with the gear in a a proper way (ultimately meaning less conversion to E2).

A lot of people (likely majority) will tell you well it’s Enanthate and the half life ... but keep in mind EVERYONE react differently and this change in administration schedule could make a difference for some.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Spumps]

If pins are cheap where you are I would switch to pinning daily vs twice a week. Just changing the frequency of your given dose can make an impact. Simply put it gives your body a better opportunity to deal with the gear in a a proper way (ultimately meaning less conversion to E2).

A lot of people (likely majority) will tell you well it’s Enanthate and the half life ... but keep in mind EVERYONE react differently and this change in administration schedule could make a difference for some.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Thanks for the suggestion!

Not really sure how I could break the dose into 7. Pins are cheap but I'll have to find myself some insulin syringes.

[Honkey_Kong]

Can you order gear online from another country and have it shipped?