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Thread: Dead Bodybuilders Speaking from the Heart

  1. #1
    kelkel's Avatar
    kelkel is offline HRT Specialist ~ AR-Platinum Elite-Hall of Famer ~ No Source Checks
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    Dead Bodybuilders Speaking from the Heart

    Interesting article. Use this link and enter "Dead Bodybuilders" into the search bar and download it.
    Or simply google Dead Bodybuilders Speaking from the Heart.
    Article examines the causes of death for 10 BB'ers.

    https://www.mdpi.com/2411-5142/7/4/105
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  2. #2
    Test Monsterone's Avatar
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    Thanks for the article.

    IMO some of the interesting takeaways:

    In another study, Smit et al. investigated the effects of AAS use on left ventricular hypertrophy and cardiac dysfunction prospectively in 31 men that had self-selected to start an AAS cycle [21]. Investigators reported that after a median AAS cycle of 16 weeks, 3D left ventricular ejection fraction declined, ratio of the early to late ventricular filling velocities decreased, 3D left atrial volume increased, and left ventricular mass increased [21]. While these values returned back to baseline after ~8 months of participants stopping their cycle, median dose was supraphysiological at ~904 mg per week during the 16-week cycle; this may be lower than that used by high level enhanced bodybuilders that potentially run longer cycles of 5–20+ consecutive years with few breaks, if any, in between cycles.

    .....

    Obesity is frequently associated as a contributing factor of heart disease; however, angiographic and post-mortem studies have demonstrated little or no correlation of total fat mass and coronary atherosclerosis except in those with abdominal obesity [32]. The bodybuilders in this investigation had a mean body mass index (BMI) of 31.6 Ī 2.3 kg/m2. While this BMI categorizes the bodybuilders as obese, these bodybuilders likely did not carry large quantities of fat mass or abdominal adiposity.

    .......

    I like that the values returned to normal after 8 months, but let's face it, most of us who have cycled probably took off a lot less than that. When I was still natty I had my heart checked and I had a left ventricle enlargement/thickening that was considered "borderline." I do have high blood pressure, and although it's controlled, I still don't think modern medicine completely neutralizes the negative effects. I'd be curious to see a comparison between natty and enhanced weight lifters.

  3. #3
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    Damn thats a long article gonna have to read that one at home.

  4. #4
    wango's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by kelkel View Post
    Interesting article. Use this link and enter "Dead Bodybuilders" into the search bar and download it.
    Or simply google Dead Bodybuilders Speaking from the Heart.
    Article examines the causes of death for 10 BB'ers.

    https://www.mdpi.com/2411-5142/7/4/105
    Great article, canít disagree with a single thing.

  5. #5
    wango's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Test Monsterone View Post
    Thanks for the article.

    IMO some of the interesting takeaways:

    In another study, Smit et al. investigated the effects of AAS use on left ventricular hypertrophy and cardiac dysfunction prospectively in 31 men that had self-selected to start an AAS cycle [21]. Investigators reported that after a median AAS cycle of 16 weeks, 3D left ventricular ejection fraction declined, ratio of the early to late ventricular filling velocities decreased, 3D left atrial volume increased, and left ventricular mass increased [21]. While these values returned back to baseline after ~8 months of participants stopping their cycle, median dose was supraphysiological at ~904 mg per week during the 16-week cycle; this may be lower than that used by high level enhanced bodybuilders that potentially run longer cycles of 5Ė20+ consecutive years with few breaks, if any, in between cycles.

    .....

    Obesity is frequently associated as a contributing factor of heart disease; however, angiographic and post-mortem studies have demonstrated little or no correlation of total fat mass and coronary atherosclerosis except in those with abdominal obesity [32]. The bodybuilders in this investigation had a mean body mass index (BMI) of 31.6 Ī 2.3 kg/m2. While this BMI categorizes the bodybuilders as obese, these bodybuilders likely did not carry large quantities of fat mass or abdominal adiposity.

    .......

    I like that the values returned to normal after 8 months, but let's face it, most of us who have cycled probably took off a lot less than that. When I was still natty I had my heart checked and I had a left ventricle enlargement/thickening that was considered "borderline." I do have high blood pressure, and although it's controlled, I still don't think modern medicine completely neutralizes the negative effects. I'd be curious to see a comparison between natty and enhanced weight lifters.
    Iím thinking natty has the following advantages:

    * Less blood pressure issues experienced during cycles. If you add up a lifetime of cycles, thatís a lot of unnecessary added stress on the left ventricle leading to its growth & inefficiency.

    * Potentially less body mass if natty, which is THE huge variable in this situation.

    * Potentially less HDL/LDL shenanigans due to a lifetime of cycles that once again adds up & can contribute to arterial plaque.

    * Changes in blood volume & hematocrit added up during a lifetime of cycles contributing to increase work & subsequent size/insufficiency of the left ventricle.

    Our hearts were not designed nor have evolved to handle extreme body weight, even if itís lean body mass. A candle that shines twice as bright, lasts 1/2 as long (or something like that).

    Thanks again Kel for an amazing article.
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  6. #6
    < <Samson> >'s Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by wango View Post
    I’m thinking natty has the following advantages:

    * Less blood pressure issues experienced during cycles. If you add up a lifetime of cycles, that’s a lot of unnecessary added stress on the left ventricle leading to its growth & inefficiency.

    * Potentially less body mass if natty, which is THE huge variable in this situation.

    * Potentially less HDL/LDL shenanigans due to a lifetime of cycles that once again adds up & can contribute to arterial plaque.

    * Changes in blood volume & hematocrit added up during a lifetime of cycles contributing to increase work & subsequent size/insufficiency of the left ventricle.

    Our hearts were not designed nor have evolved to handle extreme body weight, even if it’s lean body mass. A candle that shines twice as bright, lasts 1/2 as long (or something like that).

    Thanks again Kel for an amazing article.

    There is nothing healthy about getting roided(well, aside true trt to bring levels of someone with super low t levels to lets say 800_

    They destroy everything in our body - this is a very long & comprehensive study. But, "we" should all know this by now - organs are over worked, the heart enlarges(as mine has). Our bodies aren't meant to carry xx% more of LBM - let alone the other PED's we pump. From stimulants to diuretics

    Some folks body's just hold up better than others - yet, some do not
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  7. #7
    Euroholic is offline "ARs Pork Eating Crusader"
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    We all know our lifestyle is not ‘healthy’ but it just is what it is. Once we accept the fact that we COULD meet our maker anyday who cares what happens. Dying 10 or 15 years younger than the average age is a better alternative than being natural and not lifting weights our entire lives.

  8. #8
    Honkey_Kong's Avatar
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    We all know that PEDs in the long-term destroy organs and cause medical complications. The thing I am interested in is knowing by how much. Most of the studies we see are anecdotal and based on the autopsies of the bodybuilders and athletes after they expire. And most of these guys use rec drugs as well (and we all know that drinking, molly, coke, meth, etc. are also causes of death for many people before the age of 50).

    What I think we need is a more comprehensive study using a large sample size of bodybuilders/strength athletes/wrestlers/sports players both natural and unnatural and compare the hearts, arteries, livers, kidneys, and so on. It's also going to need a large sample size of men who don't train hard as a control.

    Of course it's going to require the samples to be honest about their drug use and give specific substances along with the dosages and duration of use.

    We know natural bodybuilders also have cardiovascular problems. They may have also suffered damage to their internal organs and that's part of the need to study them as well. We need to know how much of this is from sport/lifestyle and how much of it is from the drugs. It'd also help to know which drugs are better/worse.

    A problem even a study like this would have that is much like most of the rest is it's nearly impossible to eliminate other variables that may have an effect on the outcome (such as diet, family history, environmental causes, stress, etc.). But with more information can at the very least understand the risk better.
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  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by Euroholic View Post
    We all know our lifestyle is not ‘healthy’ but it just is what it is. Once we accept the fact that we COULD meet our maker anyday who cares what happens. Dying 10 or 15 years younger than the average age is a better alternative than being natural and not lifting weights our entire lives.
    Most of us are not signed to multi-million dollar endorsement deals. Most of us are not ever going to walk on stage at The Olympia. So is 20lbs of muscle worth 20 years of your life? And is it really 20 years we're risking? What are the actual probabilities? I'll tell you this much the 21 year old me probably would answer those questions a lot different than the 42 year-old me.

    When you're young, you think you're immortal and can't die. When you're older, you realize you're not immortal. Also when you're older, you often have things like families that depend on you. Besides, most people want to live long enough to see their children grow up and have children of their own. And that's stuff you don't think about when you're young.
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  10. #10
    < <Samson> >'s Avatar
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    We’re all so different, but the same - one person could b careless af, do dope daily & live to 73 - another, could catch a random cancer at half the age

    What I do kno is that if I wasn’t juiced for years my recovery post hemorrhage would look a lot different - all my surgeons agreed. Not many take one to the dome & walk into the hospital to walk out a week later. No way without roids & being juiced I would have had this recovery - unfortunately, it does come at a price

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