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So I was on finasteride for a while, stopped taking it a few years ago now. My question is, if I didnt shed on any compound. tren, test, primo, dbol, anadrol.. I never lost any hair, I was on 1mg a day. So if I didn't shed on any drug does that mean I am not prone to mpb? Im asking this because I have heard that it only works for testosterone hair loss. Im am not sure if this is true. Does anyone have any information about this?
It isn't clear if you were on finasteride while taking peds or not.Quote:
Originally Posted by tbjake34
That said, all finasteride does is block 5alpha reductase to prevent testosterone and some similar compounds fron converting to DHT.
DHT is generally considered a contributing factor in hair loss. So, having less of it, if you can do so without sides, is generally considered hair friendly.
If you are prone to MPB, accept it.
So, if you were on finasteride during your PED use, then you can't say for sure if you are prone to being bald. If you weren't using finasteride during your ped use, you still can't say for sure. Could be just a matter of time, could be different compounds, etc.
I WILL say that if you are 35 to 40+, have a long history of AAS use, and have your hair, you are probably going to be ok. But I'm no doctor.
yeah sorry I was on 1mg fina and did not shed on any PED
Im considering trying oral minoxidil. Do you know anything about this? Reason im not taking fina anymore cuz I started getting really bad sides even on just 1mg a day so I had to stop it.Quote:
Originally Posted by Cylon357
But in theory finasteride wouldn't stop the hair loss caused by tren, primo, or anything besides test ?
Anything that doesn't 5alpha reductase to DHT will not be impacted by finasteride. Primobolan, masteron etc are already DHT like and won't be touched by finasteride.Quote:
Originally Posted by tbjake34
Note that microdosing finasteride can be safe and side effect free. Peep my latest bloodwork in the HRT section for my results.
No clue on oral minoxidil. I used topical with some success 30 years ago, but now just accept my baldness.
I have decent hair and im not married otherwise id say fuck it and if I go bald I wouldn't care. I still have to find a wife so I want to keep my hair until then.
where was your dht before the 50mcg fina? how do you dose that with the liquid or did you get raws and measure it out yourself? I was thinking about dosing it eod or e3d even. just maybe .5mg eod or e3d. Also I didn't lost hair on any dhts. But I don't want to fucking chance it haha shit
Finasteride inhibits 5a-reduction. In some cases, the use of it can make people who are prone to hair lose more hair. Like for instances in cases where the parent hormone is more androgenic than the 5a-redance metabolite. A good example of that is with nandrolone. its 5a metabolite is DHN which is less androgenic than the nandrolone (where as DHT is more androgenic than testosterone). Granted nandrolone is significantly less androgenic than test is.Quote:
Originally Posted by tbjake34
Trenbolone doesn't undergo 5a-reduction into more androgenic compounds. But Trenbolone is 5x more androgenic than testosterone.
I'll also say that how androgenic something is doesn't necessarily always perfectly correlate to how bad it is on the hairline. But if you faired well before and haven't experienced hair loss from gear, it would be reasonable to assume that you will continue to fair well. But that's not a guarantee either.
Chicks really don't care if you're bald. Unless of course you have a weird shaped head and then yeah they do.Quote:
Originally Posted by tbjake34
If you're fat, out of shape and bald then yeah finding a wife might be an issue. If you're in shape and muscular and bald, no problem.Quote:
Originally Posted by tbjake34
If you're rich, doesn't matter about hair or body! lol
I mixed my own by taking a prescribed 5mg tablet and putting it in 100ml of rum. 90 proof, I think. I have also made it with Wild Turkey 101 and Everclear, though I do NOT recommend that last one. At any rate, the 5mg to 100ml ratio gives me, you guessed it, 50mcg per ml.Quote:
Originally Posted by tbjake34
Based on previous blood work, available by searching the HRT sub if you want more info, without the finasteride in place, my DHT would be around 115, instead of the 47 it is now.
Note that my DHT has been as high as 210'ish, but that was on compounded test cream and some other things (IIRC), without the finasteride. I MAY consider going back to the cream as my TRT, at least for a short while, with the finasteride in play. If I do that, I will pull blood work after 3 months to see where I am and make a decision about cream vs needle for TRT. I won't abandon injectables entirely, they will still be part of regular blasts. But IDK where I will land on this.
very true. If you're rich you could be a fat fuck who can't even walk and still have a smoking hot wife. im however poor. So I need to be jacked AND have hair hahaQuote:
Originally Posted by teedoff
Yeah I checked out your blood work, that's how I knew your 50mcg dose. That's so low Its crazy it actually does anything. I wonder what dht would be on 1mg. im curious if hair loss only occurs with elevated dht levels? I see yours are in range and you aren't getting hairless on a trt dose?Quote:
Originally Posted by Cylon357
The hairloss ship sailed for me in my 20s so no, it doesn't necessarily have to do with DHT, though elevated DHT is certainly considered a driver for hair loss. One of those things to watch, but not PRECISELY enough on its own. I am one of the fortunate few that was given the MPB gene, so it was inevitable for me.Quote:
Originally Posted by tbjake34
My goal with finasteride is prostate related.
The linked study supports the attached chart regarding the finasteride dose response curve. Spoiler alert: a little goes a long way. The doses regularly prescribed are WAY overkill.
Study: https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/10495374/
Chart:
Attachment 182739
Ive always been under the impression that certain dht compounds, such as mast, free up unbound test which is what leads to hair loss. More free test means more can be converted into dht and the result is hair loss. Duta/fina stop that conversion.
As for mixing it with deca i have no idea. I never noticed more hair loss while mixing deca and duta.
you make a good point here does anyone know about this? Do dhts free up more test and that's what causes the hair loss?Quote:
Originally Posted by Octaneforce
Yes, DHTs typically bind to shbg and increase free test.Quote:
Originally Posted by tbjake34
No, high test doesn't directly contribute to hair loss.
Well, not directly, at least to the best of my knowledge. Testosterone is not implicated in hair loss, but more Testosterone does equal more conversion to dht.
I think most men lose some amount of hair as they age, but I would say if you haven't noticed any hair loss from all the cycles you've ran, then you're good. I thought I was one of those dudes that will always have a thick head of hair, even on gear, but I was wrong. Luckily I reversed some of the damage I did, but it's never gonna be as thick as before I ran gear.
At one point I crushed the pills and would mix in a little powder of the finasteride with the minoxidil foam in the plastic bottle cap from the minoxidil and let some hot water run under it in the sink. I'd wait until the foam and powder melted together, then I would apply it with a pipet. I was doing this to make the application of finasteride more local to the scalp as I didn't want to experience any side effects. I couldn't tell you if it worked, though, as that method was too much work and kinda faded away.
They say that he topical version of fina results in more localized effect but im not taking any chances fina is fucking shit man its not worth your sex life going to shit imo id rather lose my hair. But I will be starting the oral minoxidil soon here. There's a few studies on it and it seems to cause more hair regrowth than fina. But without any dht lowering so we will see. It can cause heart palpitations which scare the shit out of me to be honest so if I start to get that ill have to find another option. But I just dont feel good running a heavy cycle without something to at least maintain my hairline.Quote:
Originally Posted by Test Monsterone
Yeah, they used minoxidil as a blood pressure med originally and realized it caused hair to regrow. I’d think if you took the oral form it would cause hair growth not just on the head, though. Might wanna be careful if you take it and are already on bp meds or take cialis/viagra/etc. as it’s a vasodilator and so are those drugs.Quote:
Originally Posted by tbjake34
yeah that's what im worried about. im currently on a blood pressure med its like proponol or some shit. Ive been having a problem with my bp idk if its cuz I tried to front load eq but my bp Is thru the roof bro I saw the doctor just a couple days ago she's like "oh its anxiety" obviously I didn't tell her im on gear. but im trying to get on telemasartan .Quote:
Originally Posted by Test Monsterone
edit: I think front loading gear is fucking stupid and just makes the sides kick in worse and faster. I would not recommend it. this was my first try with front loading.
Quote:
Originally Posted by tbjake34
Yeah, but tbh EQ made my bp spike, too. It seems like it makes the blood thicker and faster than other compounds. I went to donate once and they turned me away cause my bp was like 177/90. I also got super lethargic on EQ. Once I ended the cycle and donated, I felt much better. I'd much rather do regular test than EQ or deca.
A beta blocker is good to take cause it slows the heart down, but an ARB like losartan/lisinopril/valsartan is going to make the blood vessels more elastic. I'm on 25 mg metropolol and 40 mg lisinopril right now. On gear I bump the lisinopril to 80 mg.
An even better product for vasodilation would be either losartan or telmisartan. Telmisartan has a much longer half-life and neither will induce coughing like lisinopril.Quote:
Originally Posted by Test Monsterone
Sorry TM, read over your mention of losartan. ����Quote:
Originally Posted by Test Monsterone
yeah im trying to get on telamisartan I just got a script for oral monxadil just. 2.5 mg. I really think the bp is from trying to front load eq and it spiked my bp.
Actually I misspoke, or mistyped, cause lisinopril is not an ARB, it's an ACE inhibitor. I wasn't aware of the side effects, so thanks for pointing that one out. I was on losartan and valsartan at one point, but for some reason was switched. When I was on valsartan I had to throw the pills out a few times cause I guess whoever tests them found impurities and potential to cause cancer. Maybe that's how I ended up on lisinopril. As far as efficacy, it seems like all ARBs and ACE inhibitors work equally well.Quote:
Originally Posted by OdinsOtherSon
I’ve taken metoprolol (beta blocker), lisinopril, losartan, and currently on telmisartan. Lisinopril gave me a terrible cough and also made me feel very similarly to the beta blocker, i.e., fatigued and lethargic which is typical of beta blockers. I took 50mg of losartan, twice daily and it just had too short of a half-life to adequately protect me. Telmesartan continues to exert protective effects 24 hours after administration.Quote:
Originally Posted by Test Monsterone
Nice - I'll check telmesartan out and see if I can get prescribed. I do hate the lethargy I feel an hour or so after taking my bp meds.Quote:
Originally Posted by OdinsOtherSon
I am just starting propranolol or some shit like that it's a beta blocker. I hope I dont get these sides.Quote:
Originally Posted by OdinsOtherSon
You likely will. That’s how beta blockers work. They down regulate the amount of work your heart can do by blocking the adrenaline receptors. They are a metabolic suppressor, no question. That’s another reason beta’s are used to treat heart arrhythmia, because they slow the heart and allow an opportunity to regain a normal rhythm. That was one of the reasons I was initially put on metoprolol. It is vitally important that if you are taking a beta blocker not to simply stop, the chances of a cardiac incident are greatly increased if you do that. You must work with your physician to slowly ween off the beta and replace with another drug. I personally recommend telmisartan. Telmisartan is an angiotensin II receptor blocker and basically works by allowing the blood vessels to relax (vasodilator). It also has a very long half life, unlike most other widely prescribed hypertension medications. Talk with your doctor about it, my 2¢.Quote:
Originally Posted by tbjake34
yeah man I just started it literally today I took a 10mg tab and it definitely mellowed me out. But I dont want it to block my adrenaline I like having that while I train. I mentioned telamisartan and she's like "oh well I usually give that to people after they try this first" which is fucking stupid and she stomped out of the room and have me this beta blocker bullshit.Quote:
Originally Posted by OdinsOtherSon
bro I have been coughing like a bitch all day you think its form that propolol shit? Bro after I took it I had almost like a euphoric feeling. I felt really content just laying there watching tv wtf is this shitQuote:
Originally Posted by OdinsOtherSon
Kinda doubt that is causing a cough. It’s a beta blocker. The ACE inhibitors are what are known to induce cough. The beta can make you feel dizzy and/or tired.Quote:
Originally Posted by tbjake34
I didn't take it today and no cough. Idk It made me feel tired so Im not taking that shit.Quote:
Originally Posted by OdinsOtherSon
Give it a chance. Most side effects normalize after a while. Don't be a dumbass like Bostin loyd and end up with kidney failure when you could have prevented it.Quote:
Originally Posted by tbjake34
I agree with TM. If the sides are bothering you, take it at bedtime. Might even help you sleep. With beta blockers, it takes time to build the drug in your system. When I took it for arrhythmia, I’d take it in the morning and by 2:00 PM, the palpitations would have returned. After 10 days/two weeks, they had fully subsided and did not return. I then began working with my PCP, trying various other types of anti hypertensives until we found one that worked best for me. I completely agree with TM. Don’t give up so quickly and risk some serious downstream disease processes.
Ive started oral manoxidil and that seems to lower my bp a bit so its not jacked up to 160/100 anymore its been hanging around 135/88. I guess oral rogan is FDA approved to treat high bp but the studies I read it didn't lower it very much. So my bp is a fucking problem now Im still trying to get on telmisartan
If you're having any shortness of breath with that cough, call your doctor immediately. It can be a bad reaction to it. And there are other options. As far as that "euphoric" feeling goes, I never experienced it, but I'm aware that some orchestra musicians use it to control anxiety while at performances and auditions.Quote:
Originally Posted by tbjake34
Some beta blockers can cause bronchial spasms in people who has asthma or worsen symptoms for people that have COPD. The ACE inhibitor cough is more like an itch in the throat that won't go away.Quote:
Originally Posted by OdinsOtherSon
Oral minoxidil sides also include headache, elevated heart rate, low blood pressure, and light headedness. There could be some contraindications existing with the combination of the two drugs; however, one would’ve thought the pharmacist would have caught that, if indeed there may be complications with the two.
Just in my personal experience with ACE inhibitors, the cough manifested more as a chest irritation rather than a tickle. But I have little doubt that it does indeed affect each individual differently.