Lean bulk cycle. Can I add dbol?

[Smokey1987]

So I have anavar, test enanthate, aromasin and nolvadex on the way for my next cycle. I’m 6’ 215 lbs at around 10% bf. Here’s the cycle: 100mg var Ed, 200mg test enanthate per week split into two injections, 12.5 mg aromasin eod and 20mg nolva Ed. I’m going to run this for 26 weeks.

I’ve found you can put on decent mass with anavar and test so I use it to bulk as there is minimal water weight as I hate the bloated appearance of typical aromatizing steroids. However for the first 5 weeks I want to add 25mg of dbol Ed which I already have on hand. Is this a dumb idea? Will it cause water retention even with the aromasin and nolva use along with the water cutting effects of var? I wanted to see if the dbol would help gains that I wouldn’t normally get from the other compounds. Also I should add that the last 8 weeks of the cycle I plan on upping the var to 150 mg a day and cutting calories in order to lean out fully. But anyway what do you all think about the addition of the dbol for my lean bulk? I should also add that I’m well aware var isn’t a bulking steroid but I’m only looking to add 10lbs of muscle in 26 weeks which I know is possible on this cycle. I actually get quite big on high dose anavar. Thanks.

[Cuz]

I personally think its a horrible cycle but to answer your question in form of a question why would you run something like dbol if you are worried about excess water weight? At least for the majority of us that’s something you run in the offseason. So thats a no from me. Everything else about this “cycle” is wild to me Ill leave it at that

[Smokey1987]

I personally think its a horrible cycle but to answer your question in form of a question why would you run something like dbol if you are worried about excess water weight? At least for the majority of us that’s something you run in the offseason. So thats a no from me. Everything else about this “cycle” is wild to me Ill leave it at that

Well that’s why I came here to ask about the ai and serm plus anavar killing water retention from the dbol. Also why do you think it’s horrible?

[Cylon357]

So I have anavar, test enanthate, aromasin and nolvadex on the way for my next cycle. I’m 6’ 215 lbs at around 10% bf. Here’s the cycle: 100mg var Ed, 200mg test enanthate per week split into two injections, 12.5 mg aromasin eod and 20mg nolva Ed. I’m going to run this for 26 weeks.

I’ve found you can put on decent mass with anavar and test so I use it to bulk as there is minimal water weight as I hate the bloated appearance of typical aromatizing steroids. However for the first 5 weeks I want to add 25mg of dbol Ed which I already have on hand. Is this a dumb idea? Will it cause water retention even with the aromasin and nolva use along with the water cutting effects of var? I wanted to see if the dbol would help gains that I wouldn’t normally get from the other compounds. Also I should add that the last 8 weeks of the cycle I plan on upping the var to 150 mg a day and cutting calories in order to lean out fully. But anyway what do you all think about the addition of the dbol for my lean bulk? I should also add that I’m well aware var isn’t a bulking steroid but I’m only looking to add 10lbs of muscle in 26 weeks which I know is possible on this cycle. I actually get quite big on high dose anavar. Thanks.

There are a couple of issues with this cycle as designed.

Test too low, IMO. It should be closer to 350+.

That is WAY too much var for too long. Lipids and other bloodwork will go to poop. Remember: Risk = time x dose.

Too much nolva pre-emptively, assuming you are using it for gyno prevention. I don't have a problem with including it, but I would do so at a much lower dose, probably 5mg per day.

Don't start the aromasin (especially with the cycle you designed) unless you have obvious issues. Estrogen is good for us! With even 30mg var and 350mg test, you probably won't need an ai at all. But, you know you, so maybe there is some specific response you have.

Dbol will definitely bloat you up from the estrogen conversion. Plus, as designed, you are adding a wet compound, then drying it out with AI and var. That is counter productive. And then you are adding another oral, not an easy one either. I like dbol, I just don't think it has a place in this cycle.

30-50 mg var per day, either as a jump start or finisher, with 350-500 test will probably get it done for you, along with eating in a slight surplus.

Wait, I just noticed... you are planning this for 26 weeks? Are you on TRT? What is your cycle history?

[Cuz]

Well that’s why I came here to ask about the ai and serm plus anavar killing water retention from the dbol. Also why do you think it’s horrible?

Tamoxifen isnt going to cut water matter of fact it may cause you to hold more depending on individual. The only time you would need tamox on cycle is if you were experiencing gyno, thats literally the only reason and most of the time running something like masteron would be much more beneficial and its designed to do the same thing. Id recommend switching tamox to mast if you’re gyno prone. I really dont see why you need an AI plus a serm with a trt dose of test and something like var. with dbol then yes possibilities come into play.
With all due respect 26 weeks is not recommended to run any oral especially 100mg a day. I dont see why you think you need 150mg I wouldnt advise it but you do you. Id just get monthly checkups on Alt, ast and alp cholesterol and all lipids…supplement with tudca or glucothione and NAC.

[Smokey1987]

There are a couple of issues with this cycle as designed.

Test too low, IMO. It should be closer to 350+.

That is WAY too much var for too long. Lipids and other bloodwork will go to poop. Remember: Risk = time x dose.

Too much nolva pre-emptively, assuming you are using it for gyno prevention. I don't have a problem with including it, but I would do so at a much lower dose, probably 5mg per day.

Don't start the aromasin (especially with the cycle you designed) unless you have obvious issues. Estrogen is good for us! With even 30mg var and 350mg test, you probably won't need an ai at all. But, you know you, so maybe there is some specific response you have.

Dbol will definitely bloat you up from the estrogen conversion. Plus, as designed, you are adding a wet compound, then drying it out with AI and var. That is counter productive. And then you are adding another oral, not an easy one either. I like dbol, I just don't think it has a place in this cycle.

30-50 mg var per day, either as a jump start or finisher, with 350-500 test will probably get it done for you, along with eating in a slight surplus.

Wait, I just noticed... you are planning this for 26 weeks? Are you on TRT? What is your cycle history?

Yeah I’m on trt so I’m completely naturally shut down already. The 26 weeks of cycling won’t effect my hpta as it’s already f’ed. I take 100mg a week of test for my trt off cycle. As for the AI and nolva I am extremely sensitive to gyno but I’ll take your advice and hold off on the aromasin unless needed and keep the nolva at 5mg and hope I don’t flare up. Also with gyno the same goes with tren and deca but I think that’s a mix of prolactin and estrogen causing it as no amount of ai or serm will reduce it. I have to go off of them completely before the gyno fades to nothing.

So I’ll forget the dbol, up the test to 400, and cut the var until the final 10 weeks of the cycle at 50mg? Plus cut the aromasin unless needed and drop the nolva to 5 unless I flare up I’ll raise to 20 until it subsides. I have a feeling it will flare up at some point. My cycle history are cycles that have followed the intermediate cycles on steroid.com. Been on and off since 2018 with solid results and solid blood work. I’m 35 years old too just fyi.

[Smokey1987]

Tamoxifen isnt going to cut water matter of fact it may cause you to hold more depending on individual. The only time you would need tamox on cycle is if you were experiencing gyno, thats literally the only reason and most of the time running something like masteron would be much more beneficial and its designed to do the same thing. Id recommend switching tamox to mast if you’re gyno prone. I really dont see why you need an AI plus a serm with a trt dose of test and something like var. with dbol then yes possibilities come into play.
With all due respect 26 weeks is not recommended to run any oral especially 100mg a day. I dont see why you think you need 150mg I wouldnt advise it but you do you. Id just get monthly checkups on Alt, ast and alp cholesterol and all lipids…supplement with tudca or glucothione and NAC.

Ahh okay I wasn’t aware nolva could cause water retention thank you for that info. I’m def cutting the dbol now as well and will just add 50 mg anavar to the end with reduced calories. And I’ll keep the ai on standby for flare ups. As long as stay clean with my diet and low sodium I’m hoping the test won’t make me too watery when I’m in the first 16 weeks with no anavar but I understand it’s dangerous to stay on the oral for 26 weeks. Thank you for the info that’s why I’m here.

[Cylon357]

Yeah I’m on trt so I’m completely naturally shut down already. The 26 weeks of cycling won’t effect my hpta as it’s already f’ed. I take 100mg a week of test for my trt off cycle. As for the AI and nolva I am extremely sensitive to gyno but I’ll take your advice and hold off on the aromasin unless needed and keep the nolva at 5mg and hope I don’t flare up. Also with gyno the same goes with tren and deca but I think that’s a mix of prolactin and estrogen causing it as no amount of ai or serm will reduce it. I have to go off of them completely before the gyno fades to nothing.

So I’ll forget the dbol, up the test to 400, and cut the var until the final 10 weeks of the cycle at 50mg? Plus cut the aromasin unless needed and drop the nolva to 5 unless I flare up I’ll raise to 20 until it subsides. I have a feeling it will flare up at some point. My cycle history are cycles that have followed the intermediate cycles on steroid.com. Been on and off since 2018 with solid results and solid blood work. I’m 35 years old too just fyi.

Ok, so have you heard the term "blast and cruise"? A "blast" is what you are describing.

Still, 26 weeks is a bit long. I would run, say, 13 weeks, at the doses we talked about.

I personally don't like to use orals for longer than 6 weeks, at least not of any significant doses. The one exception is proviron, I use it almost year round at 25mg per day with my trt.

Absolutely agree with Cuz, especially the recommend for masteron. I really like that compound myself, and gyno prevention and reversal is kind of its thing. You could run it at 2 to 1 test to mast and probably not need either AI or nolva. If you run into gyno issues, up the mast.

[Smokey1987]

Ok, so have you heard the term "blast and cruise"? A "blast" is what you are describing.

Still, 26 weeks is a bit long. I would run, say, 13 weeks, at the doses we talked about.

I personally don't like to use orals for longer than 6 weeks, at least not of any significant doses. The one exception is proviron, I use it almost year round at 25mg per day with my trt.

Absolutely agree with Cuz, especially the recommend for masteron. I really like that compound myself, and gyno prevention and reversal is kind of its thing. You could run it at 2 to 1 test to mast and probably not need either AI or nolva. If you run into gyno issues, up the mast.

I’ll go ahead and order the masteron since you both recommend it. I wasn’t aware it was also good for gyno reversal. I hear it gives you a more defined look as well which is what I want. I personally don’t like the way nolva makes me feel and keeping aromasin out the picture will be nice keeping estrogen levels normal, helping with the bulk. Excited to try masteron now. I will cut the cycle to 13 weeks and add the var at week 7. I’ll just go off the blast for 13 weeks then come back with a cutting cycle in which I’ll verify with you all before running it. Probably something like like 8 weeks of var with low dose test for 12 weeks with a cutting diet. I wish I could do tren but even caber won’t kill the gyno lumps and it makes me crazy and paranoid.

[Crest]

I'm packing on a load of water even at just 15mg of dbol a day.... it's going to puff you up whatever way you look at it bro!

[Smokey1987]

I'm packing on a load of water even at just 15mg of dbol a day.... it's going to puff you up whatever way you look at it bro!

Thank you for that info. I'll def avoid the dbol then. Will 400mg of test not cause a similar bloat issue? Im going to be on 10mg nolva the entire cycle due to my gyno sensitivity but keeping the aromasin off to the side unless I flare up. Will the anavar minimize the bloat? It's been awhile since I've up my test levels so I can't remember how badly the bloat is from the estrogen.

[Octaneforce]

Thank you for that info. I'll def avoid the dbol then. Will 400mg of test not cause a similar bloat issue? Im going to be on 10mg nolva the entire cycle due to my gyno sensitivity but keeping the aromasin off to the side unless I flare up. Will the anavar minimize the bloat? It's been awhile since I've up my test levels so I can't remember how badly the bloat is from the estrogen.

400 test probably wont bloat you. But that is really diet dependent. Ive ran test at 1000/week during a calorie deficit and still stayed somewhat dry. Ive also noticed that running an ai (aromasin) helps keep me from getting bloated. But again diet is very important in that respect.

Anavar wont stop estrogen related bloat.

[JTP$]

I'm packing on a load of water even at just 15mg of dbol a day.... it's going to puff you up whatever way you look at it bro!

Thank you for that info. I'll def avoid the dbol then. Will 400mg of test not cause a similar bloat issue? Im going to be on 10mg nolva the entire cycle due to my gyno sensitivity but keeping the aromasin off to the side unless I flare up. Will the anavar minimize the bloat? It's been awhile since I've up my test levels so I can't remember how badly the bloat is from the estrogen.

keep in mind that one mans reaction to a particular drug may or may not be the same reaction you get from it. ive ran dbol at much higher doses with a mild calorie surplus and not noticed any bloating. thats not to say it didnt cause any water retention at all, but i couldnt notice it.

regarding your cycle, 100 mgs/day of anavar is very high. i would recommend increasing the test and decreasing the var dose. also, its typically not advised to take more than one oral compound at a time, nor is it a good idea to run oral compounds for 26 weeks straight.

[Honkey_Kong]

Yeah I’m on trt so I’m completely naturally shut down already. The 26 weeks of cycling won’t effect my hpta as it’s already f’ed. I take 100mg a week of test for my trt off cycle. As for the AI and nolva I am extremely sensitive to gyno but I’ll take your advice and hold off on the aromasin unless needed and keep the nolva at 5mg and hope I don’t flare up. Also with gyno the same goes with tren and deca but I think that’s a mix of prolactin and estrogen causing it as no amount of ai or serm will reduce it. I have to go off of them completely before the gyno fades to nothing.

So I’ll forget the dbol, up the test to 400, and cut the var until the final 10 weeks of the cycle at 50mg? Plus cut the aromasin unless needed and drop the nolva to 5 unless I flare up I’ll raise to 20 until it subsides. I have a feeling it will flare up at some point. My cycle history are cycles that have followed the intermediate cycles on steroid.com. Been on and off since 2018 with solid results and solid blood work. I’m 35 years old too just fyi.

The raised prolactin from 19nors is more of a myth than anything else. The #1 cause of an increase in prolactin is an increase in estrogens.

For a bulk, I liked running test e + deca + proviron. But you could also add some tren in there too (I liked using tren to both cut and bulk depending on the cycle I was running). How lean you can put on mass though is going to be nearly entirely diet related.

But back to your question about dbol. dbol bloat isn't permanent and goes away pretty quickly after you stop using it. And it certainly isn't going to make your gains less lean. That being said the effects of the dbol also go away pretty quickly after you stop using them. That's why I'd only ever use it at the beginning of a long-estered cycle where I'm waiting for the test and deca to "kick in." And as I got older, I found that my stomach couldn't handle dbol at all. I'd be giving up more potential gains by hugging the porcelain throne than I was getting off of it (and I tried different suppliers also).