pro's way of looking at bodybuilding!

ive recently read a comment from arnold and it said "if you want to look like a pro you have to train like one" i fully agree with this statement even with his routine working every bodypart 3times a week, approx. 5 exercises, of 5 sets, and reps ranging from 6-10 for each body part! now all of you guys on here say that this is way too much, and will cause a great deal of overtraining, then you think well obviously guys like arnold used alot of steriods to speed up recovery. i also read that back then when arnold was at his peak, the use of say 40mg of d-bol and 400mg of deca a week was thought to be a huge cycle and these doses were realistic to the former pros ! now how can you say that if you eat right, sleep at least 9 hours every night and consume a great deal of protein,carbs and calories, then why is this routine thought to be well over the limit if the former pros used half the amount of steriods guys use today ? also GH wasnt didnt come about till the 80's so thats not even a factor in this !

Dorian yates worked each body part less than once a week. Who is bigger? Arnold was a pioneer in BB and had awesome genetics but a lot has been learned in the past 3 decades. Since his time there have been countless individuals who surpassed him by 50+ lbs of muscle. Each body part trained intensely once a week is what I do. I used to do the 6 days a week each bodypart twice a week and was constantly overtrained.

Dont read the crap in Flex. Fancy workouts with lots of sets and reps sell better than a simple balls to the walls split.

not that you got your info from there, but I do know they push it alot and many people believe it. i assume you must have read arnolds book to come up with your conclusion on his training styles. i imagine wieder had some say in what went in there.

i understand where you guys are coming from but arnold got that big with taking low doses of AS ! and as for yates dont you think growth hormone plays a huge part in the reason y they are now 50 lbs heavier now ! the reason y i bring this up is because i have triied both routines and the arnold routine works really well for me for some reason but i dont stick to it every month i switch it ive tried it for the last month and im up 10lbs and trained with the same intensity as the twice a week routine and once a week routine ! has anyone tried this routine and experienced good gains from it ?

Dont assume his dosages were low. I know everybody heard something, but nobody really knows for certain except maybe his good friends or something, but I doubt they are posting here.

If it works, it works though. Do whats best for you.

o and ive also read that the pros now a days use the same type of double split routine (chest-morning , back- evening) training each muscle 3 times a week ! i just read coleman's routine and thats what it's like !

I also heard the OAK loved the sust

Arnold is a genetic superfreak. It is kind of like asking why God can lift more than you can. What is overtraining for some isn't enough for others.

You go ahead and try that routine and let me know how it goes for you.

I will not rule out your split ideas but it didn't work nearly as well as when I was doing each body part every 10 days while on sust. Every workout was 100% due to the muscles having time to recover.

Billyis right about Weider influence. Don't forget these guys get a lot of money from him. It's not really surprising they are touting the weider system. Coleman also claims to be drug free. If he's drug free then I'm the Queen of England.

yes but the reason why they all claim to be drug free is because they have endosements to sell supplements ! how would they sell that stuff if they all said they take retarded amounts of AS and growth hormone !

I personally don't trust anything the pros say. They are CONSTANTLY contradicting themselves on all topics. Training, Diet, AAS, etc. Now, we all understand why they can't admit to using AAS. But there seems to be just as much deceit behind their workout and diet claims. Here's some homework for you: Pick any pro out there and then go and research articles he has "written" over the years. You will find numerous inconsistencies in them. Sometimes they will say: " Well, when I'm bulking I eat whatever I want " Then in another articles: " Well, when I'm bulking I stick to eating clean, I just eat alot more" The same thing applies to their workout routines. Sometimes it's each bodypart once a week, sometimes it's twice. Who knows? You really have to be deep in that scene and know some pros to get the real scoop.

i would say that gh is not as big of a factor as insulin has been... i believe that is why pro's today are 30lbs or so heavier.

These guys don't write those articles. They show up for a photo shoot, get handed a check, and some 180lb geek types out whatever workout he saw at the gym that week.

so are you saying that insulin by itself plays a huge part in mass building ? ive always heard of insulin but never checked it out ! is this true ?

do a search... a whole TON of info about it

and dont make fun of 180lb geeks unless they are fat slob type geeks :)

i'm a computer geek partially and i'm 173 lean so :P

growth hormone was available during arnold's time and was used. look at mike katz and his head.

Mike Katz had a shitty physique not well porportioned

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Originally Posted by LightWeightBaby

Mike Katz had a shitty physique not well porportioned

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He was just too blocky looking.....but still a very large BB'er

I think over-training is over-rated. Only you know your body, some people have a high-tolerance for weight training, some others. I personally have a high-tolerance. It's something your body adapts too. I was always into weigh-training and football and rugby. My body got used to it. Only you know what works for your body.

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Originally Posted by crosby7117

so are you saying that insulin by itself plays a huge part in mass building ? ive always heard of insulin but never checked it out ! is this true ?

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I'd say the combination of insulin and GH plays a big part. But then you have to factor in the ammount of AAS these guys are taking. How much? Who knows? But I'd bet anything it's a NICE amount! Plus all of this allows them to consume far greater calories than bodybuilders of the past. And use these calories to build muscle and strength. From your post it sounds like you may be interested in trying slin. Unless you have big dreams in the sport, I'd advise against it bro. But that's just my opinion. I'm sure some will disagree. And I agree 100% with " The Bull " on the overtraining issue. I know that my body was meant to work. I could never grow well on a low volume system. (I've tried) I use what I call HIVT - High Intensity Volume Training. ;)

I was told Arnold did up to 300mg dbol ED. Seriusly thinking they only did 40mg is pretty naive. They juiced pretty hard back then too. Atleast that is what i belive.

i think they juiced REALLY hard back then considering that they did not know nearly as much about AAS as we do now so they always went for more like any uneducated person would do. they probably ate d-bol like candy... literally. you cant really say how much pro's took or are taking because they all lie (just like everyone else pointed out), but I personally think they juiced like there was no tomorrow because they didnt now any better.

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Originally Posted by palme

I was told Arnold did up to 300mg dbol ED. Seriusly thinking they only did 40mg is pretty naive. They juiced pretty hard back then too. Atleast that is what i belive.

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Yup, I read he ate them by the handfull.

Some thing I notice

The smaller guys <180lbs or so all follow the Flex/Arnold routines. Lots of sets and reps. 1-2hrs gym time

The huge guys >230-250 act more like powerlifters sticking to core movements only and keeping it very simple and short. 30-45min


That in florida and indiana. Anyone else notice that?

Not to sterotype people, but anytime I saw some one in there smaller I would watch and see how many flies and curls they did, while when I see the big guy I watch him squat or bench and then leave.

Bathgate, I totally agree with you. You will see that the larger bodybuilders, both past and present, all started as "weightlifters" and powerlifters and then switched over to bodybuilding. This i know is true with both Arnold and Ronnie. I have noticed that too in the gym. You will see a cut up kid weight at 170 doing sets of 20 on the preacher curl. Cut up, sure, great shape and symmetry, sure. But you look at the massive guys and shit, they chalk up, warm up, toss a shitload of wieght on and stick to the basic core movements.

As for as the AS, i agree that they prolly did way more than you could imagine. For the simple reasons that is what abundant, legal, and there was little to no evidence on its effects

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Originally Posted by Tank21

You will see a cut up kid weight at 170 doing sets of 20 on the preacher curl. Cut up, sure, great shape and symmetry, sure. But you look at the massive guys and shit, they chalk up, warm up, toss a shitload of wieght on and stick to the basic core movements.

As for as the AS, i agree that they prolly did way more than you could imagine. For the simple reasons that is what abundant, legal, and there was little to no evidence on its effects

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I totally agree!

Arnold's routine is for absolute genetic freaks only... unless you are one, don't do it.

Like everyone else has said... all the small guys you see at the gym do the routines they see in those nice, glossy muscle mags.

The big guys have found what's worked for them. For a very, very small percentage it may be 4 exercises 3 sets each, but for most of us it's much less... if you have the balls to bauk convention and try it you'll find that out for yourself.

most people diagree with me but do not believe in over trainning i believe in under-recovery, i stick to a dorian yates type workout (high intensity 2 set an exercise) but i work a lot and don't have the time to sit around and recover, but for anyone who doesn't really work (i wish) or doesn't do anyrthing really stressful working out a bodypart twice a week should be well within reason with proper nutrion, even without juice

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Originally Posted by Rsox1

most people diagree with me but do not believe in over trainning i believe in under-recovery, i stick to a dorian yates type workout (high intensity 2 set an exercise) but i work a lot and don't have the time to sit around and recover, but for anyone who doesn't really work (i wish) or doesn't do anyrthing really stressful working out a bodypart twice a week should be well within reason with proper nutrion, even without juice

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i do disagree with you. if you are natural and hit every body part twice a week and still grow i'd be extremely surprised. consider this, do back and bi's 2 times a week each, on seperate days. this would mean you hit your bi's 4 times this week, same with shoulders (due to chest, 4 shoulder workouts) and tri's (due to chest, 4 tri workouts). no way would this work. cortisol levels would sky rocket and you'd go catabolic.

We should remember that they are pros, and we are not (maybe someone is?). I have read some cycles here that pretty heavy and complicated and those guys are not competing in the olympia or its likes, so I am wondering if someone actually knows for sure what the big guys are taking? Or are they just more dedicated and motivated?

I tried some of Arnold's (supposedly his) programs and they are damn impossible to follow. Does not matter if I eat perfect and sleep 10+ hours I can't keep up. I should add that I was clean when trying this. Everybody is different so go with what ever fits you. Personally, right now, I do my whole body twice a week and I like it.

I too tried Arnold's program as outlined in " The New Encyclopedia Of Modern Bodybuilding " I simply found it to be too much work for me. And I actually have the ability to work often and I recovery very quickly. Though I hadn't yet tried AAS at the time. But I don't have the time nor desire to spend 2 - 2 1/2 hours in the gym. No thanks! Now, I have to disagree with everyone on the core lift issue. Most of the guys I see that look like crap spend all their time " benchin " It seems like everytime I see them they are pushin out the bench presses. Though I have to agree that bench is quite important. And the fact that they don't do core movements such as bent over rows and squats might have something to do with it all. ;) But I'll tell you what I did out of curiousity. I took all the guys I know in real life and found out all about their workouts, diets, etc. I did this with alot of the bros on the boards too. I found that all these guys have VERY similar routines. Generally one bodypart a day, maybe two. Anywhere from 9-20 sets per bodypart. And working each bodypart once a week directly. And they all work out 4-6 days per week. Take a look at the workouts that some of our " buffer " bros use here on A.R. - Pumpseeker, Dangit, Younggunz, BigKev, etc. Now, I'm not quite at their level yet. But my workouts are very similar to what I mentioned and I'm growing like crazy.

i dunno maybe i look at this topic alot different than some people but i still think if you wanna look like a pro (or be huge) you gotta train,eat and sleep like one maybe it's because i do not hit that overtraining point very easily and my body is able to deal with alot of physical stress but im using the "arnold routine" right now and im up 7 pounds in the last week and im clean right now so i do believe if you want great results then you have to go balls out no fuckin around and being with your workouts! and i dont spend 3 hours in the gym i take about 1.5 hours ! say if im working chest,back,bi's .... chest with 4exercises 4sets each will take me about 35 min, same with back, and bi's will take me about 25 mins ! i dont fuck around and take to people and lag around the gym i time my breaks and when its up im right back into my next set !

how much do you weigh though? no offense or anything, but people that are more just starting at or are smaller have a very good time putting on weight at first. then it gets tougher down the road.

i would love to see one pro that actually does the crap in flex. ive trained with two. 3 here and 2 in florida. They both made it to a national level. Neither of them spent more than 45min in the gym working out, cardio yes, but not training.

a,lot of the pro's ive talked to yes disagree with a muscle group 3 times a week but all train a muscle group 2 times a week ! im not saying any of you are wrong and i am taking in all of this info you guys are providing me with im just saying for some reason with this routine im growing i wont be using this routine for a long period of time at all, 2 weeks to a month at the most but i just came across this training routine on the net one day and thought why the hell not!