first cycle

**baseballlife** · 10-28-2003, 05:48 PM

ive done a lot of research latley and im trying to come to a final decision on what to take. ive heard good and bad things for most of my choices and i wanted some final input to make my decision. i would like to put on 10-15 lbs but stay at around 6% bf. its between test prop, sust, dibol, oxandrolone, winstrol and parabolan . im leaning to parabolan but also would like to know the doses to take for a 5 week cycle. thanks again guys.

**TheMudMan** · 10-28-2003, 05:54 PM

Need some stats, Age, weight, height, training experiance, cycle experiance

**baseballlife** · 10-28-2003, 05:55 PM

6'1" 193lbs and been lifting for D1 baseball for my fourth year and three more before that 21 years old and no cycle experience.

**TheMudMan** · 10-28-2003, 06:01 PM

For a first cycle I would run either Test Cypionate or Enanthate . This way you will only need to inject 2 times a weeks compared to ED or EOD injections. Over 10 weeks that can become trying for some. You putting on 10 to 15 pounds and staying at 6% BF will be dependent on your diet.

I would run it like this:
1 - 10 Test 400mg
1 - PCT Nolvadex 10mg ED

PCT use Clomid and Nolva
Day 1 300mg Clomid / 20mg Nolvadex
Day 2 - 11 100mg Clomid / 20mg Nolvadex
Day 12 - 21 50mg Clomid / 20mg Nolvadex

**baseballlife** · 10-28-2003, 06:03 PM

any idea how to get the gear.

**TheMudMan** · 10-28-2003, 06:04 PM

No bro............... You can not ask that.

**FrkyBgStok** · 10-28-2003, 06:05 PM

no asking for a source, and if anyone PMs you, i would be very hesitant to go with them as they are probably scammers.

**baseballlife** · 10-28-2003, 06:12 PM

sorry thanks
will accept anyone elses input one my first cycle

**DocHoliday** · 10-28-2003, 09:11 PM

Originally Posted by baseballlife

ive done a lot of research latley and im trying to come to a final decision on what to take. ive heard good and bad things for most of my choices and i wanted some final input to make my decision. i would like to put on 10-15 lbs but stay at around 6% bf. its between test prop, sust, dibol, oxandrolone, winstrol and parabolan. im leaning to parabolan but also would like to know the doses to take for a 5 week cycle. thanks again guys.

1) You won't find Parabolan . If you do, it's probably not legit.
2) How are you at 6% body fat?
3) Oxandrolone is expensive, but probably a good sup to use for baseball to boost strength with a little less mass.

Personally from what you hear a lot on this board, Sus is not a good first time cycle steroid . It's not wise because it's a multi-esterified compound.

TheMudMan already said it. Go with Test Enanthate or Cypionate . Those are single esterified compounds. Combine that with Oxandrolone if you want it, and you got a good stack.

Read up on PCT, but TheMudMan told you how to run it. Read and understand WHY you need it.

Good luck.

Doc

**baseballlife** · 10-30-2003, 11:40 AM

thanks for the info and i think test is going to be the answer. and i have 6% body fat because i have sick genetics and we bust our ass everyday for baseball all natural so far.

**mass junkie** · 10-30-2003, 11:45 AM

Originally Posted by TheMudMan

For a first cycle I would run either Test Cypionate or Enanthate . This way you will only need to inject 2 times a weeks compared to ED or EOD injections. Over 10 weeks that can become trying for some. You putting on 10 to 15 pounds and staying at 6% BF will be dependent on your diet.

I would run it like this:
1 - 10 Test 400mg
1 - PCT Nolvadex 10mg ED

PCT use Clomid and Nolva
Day 1 300mg Clomid / 20mg Nolvadex
Day 2 - 11 100mg Clomid / 20mg Nolvadex
Day 12 - 21 50mg Clomid / 20mg Nolvadex

Just wondering why your only recomending 400mg and not 500mg?

**TheMudMan** · 10-30-2003, 11:53 AM

For a first cycle 400mg is more than enough to run........ It's what I ran for my first and I didn't see many sides from it just a little acne here and there. But 500mg is fine also.

**animal-inside** · 10-30-2003, 11:53 AM

I have to disagree on soem of what Doc has said..
Parabolan yes is extinct, but tren and fina are nto and are primarily the same compound.. I beelvie baseball was refering to tren/fina.. And sust is a fine 1st cycle drug. MANY 1st timers use 250-500 mgs a week and had awsome results (like me)... some will disagree because the prop in it would seem usless at such lower infrequent uses.. but again I know many who used and gained lots of lbs and shed some fat..

for a first cycle and what u want from it i would go
either
sust 500mgs a week

or
ethanate/cyp weeks 1-8
dbol weeks 1-4

altough tren woudl be one of the best drugs for you because it will add lean body mass and many find it cuts bf, but it is a hard drug that most people will not recomend for a first timer.. althoguh i have used and can not see why not.. It is the only juice i have used that can affect my temper that is border line hard to control.. I have read soem people saying this is the reason rookies shouldn't use it..

**BDTR** · 10-30-2003, 11:54 AM

test-e or cyp should be run atleast 10 weeks IMO.

**TheMudMan** · 10-30-2003, 11:54 AM

One more thing more gear or higher doses doesn't mean bigger gains it could just add more to the sides you will see.

**TheMudMan** · 10-30-2003, 11:56 AM

Originally Posted by bdtr

test-e or cyp should be run atleast 10 weeks IMO.

I agree

**BDTR** · 10-30-2003, 11:58 AM

More gear = bigger gains, im sorry i have to disagree with you there. In a perfect scientific enviorment if you put two subjects of equal genetics, perfect diet and perfect training intensity on 1 gram of test for subject A and 500mg for subject B, subject A will in all likelyhood gain more. HOWEVER, the more you run the previous time, the more you'll need to run the next time and so on. Not to mention the huge increase in side effects. I wouldn't go above 500 for a first cycle.

**TheMudMan** · 10-30-2003, 12:04 PM

Originally Posted by bdtr

More gear = bigger gains, im sorry i have to disagree with you there. In a perfect scientific enviorment if you put two subjects of equal genetics, perfect diet and perfect training intensity on 1 gram of test for subject A and 500mg for subject B, subject A will in all likelyhood gain more. HOWEVER, the more you run the previous time, the more you'll need to run the next time and so on. Not to mention the huge increase in side effects. I wouldn't go above 500 for a first cycle.

I don't know if I agree............... I know your a big advocte of running lots of AS and high dosages........ I've had seen plenty of guys running stacks of gear and not gain too much more than I did off of my first low dose cycle. I guess genetics plays a part but IMO I don't think that more gear will always equal bigger gains. But I do agree that with cycle history there may be a need to run more AS to grow.

**animal-inside** · 10-30-2003, 12:11 PM

I think....
lets say A uses 500mgs a week.....
B uses 1000 mgs a week

genetically the saem.. same diet.same work outs....etc...

A gains 20 lbs...
B gains 25...
I think B will deffinitly get bigger gains, but the gains won't go up at regualr intervals... twice as much test dosne't mean tqwice as much gains..

and peopel like bdtr need to use more anyways because of previous cycles..

When I first started I was told keep the doses low then steadily increase to avoid burning ur body out.. I wanted to do a medium cycle first time.. I was todl no because then you'll have to do a heavier cycle the next time to get results.. so why ruin it? You get huge gains of ur first 2 cycles no matter whether u do a light or medium cycle..

**mass junkie** · 10-30-2003, 12:13 PM

Originally Posted by TheMudMan

I don't know if I agree............... I know your a big advocte of running lots of AS and high dosages........ I've had seen plenty of guys running stacks of gear and not gain too much more than I did off of my first low dose cycle. I guess genetics plays a part but IMO I don't think that more gear will always equal bigger gains. But I do agree that with cycle history there may be a need to run more AS to grow.

ok so say if one does decide to go with 400mg their 1st cycle what would be the recommended next dosage on a second cycle and still expect to see gains

**animal-inside** · 10-30-2003, 12:13 PM

this thread was severly high jacked.......

**BDTR** · 10-30-2003, 12:16 PM

I dont advocate high doses, i only run high doses because low doses absolutely dont work for me anymore. If i ran test 500mg and eq 400mg for 12 weeks i'd gain about 6 lbs. For a first cycle 500mg is more than enough test to grow like a weed. But i do still believe that gains WOULD increase if the AAS were in larger amounts, but like you said, not to an extreme degree.

Originally Posted by TheMudMan

I don't know if I agree............... I know your a big advocte of running lots of AS and high dosages........ I've had seen plenty of guys running stacks of gear and not gain too much more than I did off of my first low dose cycle. I guess genetics plays a part but IMO I don't think that more gear will always equal bigger gains. But I do agree that with cycle history there may be a need to run more AS to grow.

**TheMudMan** · 10-30-2003, 12:18 PM

Originally Posted by mass junkie

ok so say if one does decide to go with 400mg their 1st cycle what would be the recommended next dosage on a second cycle and still expect to see gains

animal bro it sure did get hi-jacked.....

mass............. If you ran 400mg you first and made gains for the second you could still run 400mg a still make gains.................... There are other factors that you need to look at when creating a cycle and how much to run with what.

**BDTR** · 10-30-2003, 12:22 PM

I also believe that the slower your gains get has less to do with you becoming immune to lower doses of AAS and more to do with the fact that as you become larger, the slower the gains come and the closer you come to your genetic potential. A person can only grow SO much in his life time, therefore the closer you become to reaching that limit the harder it gets and the more gear you need.

**TheMudMan** · 10-30-2003, 12:25 PM

Originally Posted by bdtr

I also believe that the slower your gains get has less to do with you becoming immune to lower doses of AAS and more to do with the fact that as you become larger, the slower the gains come and the closer you come to your genetic potential. A person can only grow SO much in his life time, therefore the closer you become to reaching that limit the harder it gets and the more gear you need.

I agree .............. genetics and genetic potential are what hold us back..... AS/food/training/rest will help us get so far but in the end it's all up to genetics.

**baseballlife** · 10-30-2003, 05:12 PM

good info even though it went a little past what i needed to hear. the only prob. is that i only have a 5 week window of time to cycle due to drug test so would i still use the same mg per week for test and nolva, and use the same pct mg as said above for only using it for 5 weeks plus however long it takes to run the pct.

**baseballlife** · 10-30-2003, 05:18 PM

this is the ten week cycle is there any way as said in the last post to make this into a 5 week cycle to see results, 10-15 lbs.

I would run it like this:
1 - 10 Test 400mg
1 - PCT Nolvadex 10mg ED

PCT use Clomid and Nolva
Day 1 300mg Clomid / 20mg Nolvadex
Day 2 - 11 100mg Clomid / 20mg Nolvadex
Day 12 - 21 50mg Clomid / 20mg Nolvadex

**Consistency** · 10-31-2003, 10:26 AM

no... you cannot run test for only 5 weeks and see results of 15 pounds. Test E doesnt kick in until around week 4 usually. and it will stay in your system longer then the 5 weeks you take it.