Winny

[Ragu]

I just picked up 20 winny depots..whats your opinion on an only winny cycle and is there any pct needed?

[TheMudMan]

Winny only cycle are not worth the money, sore joints, little gains......... add test.

20 amps will not be enough.

[barbarian]

do not do winny without test bro, is it just me or has there been an insurgance of neewbs askin about cycles without test in them??

[razor67]

wouldnt run winny alone..
yes, pct would be needed..
whats your stats and cycle history

[Ragu]

ok so winny/test...thanks.. one more thing..what about a winny/deca stack?

[MBaraso]

ok so winny/test...thanks.. one more thing..what about a winny/deca stack?

Thats even a worse idea then winny alone.
Test is needed in all cycles.

[Ragu]

wow ok thanks...i guess i was very misinformed..if you dont mind can you explain why test is needed in every cycle? sorry im just not informed=)

[MBaraso]

because when you start taking steriods your natural test production is shut down, so you need to supliment it w/ synthetic test for a # of reasons I'm not going to get into.
Deca is probably the worst thing to take by itself. Why? Do a search on "Deca only" cycles and you'll find your answers. Also search "Deca Dick". Those threads should be enough to steer you away from cycles with out test...

[decadbal]

win, eq and deca....good cycle, u dont need to take test as much as is told here....there are alot of awesome test free cycles. test is good, not great.

[MBaraso]

win, eq and deca....good cycle, u dont need to take test as much as is told here....there are alot of awesome test free cycles. test is good, not great.

Bad advice.
You wanna go around feeling like s h i t for your whole cycle...along w/ not being able to use your dik that's your business.
Personally I enjoy getting laid...

[inheritmylife]

win, eq and deca....good cycle, u dont need to take test as much as is told here....there are alot of awesome test free cycles. test is good, not great.

This guy has probably never done a cycle before, judging by his question. Test used independently is always the most favorable first cycle.

I'm not convinced that test should be the dominant AAS in any cycle either, but it is a great place to start.

-------------------

Ragu, what is your cycle history?

[Ragu]

i thought a good PCT is what gets your testosterone back to a normal level even with no test in the cycle...so are you saying that if i did a cycle without test that (clomid for example) would not be sufficient enough to bring my normal hormone levels back?

[BUYLONGTERM]

Bad advice.
You wanna go around feeling like s h i t for your whole cycle...along w/ not being able to use your dik that's your business.
Personally I enjoy getting laid...

I agree!!! Man, I could not imagine not being able to get it up for several weeks. That gives me nightmares!!!!

[razor67]

This guy has probably never done a cycle before, judging by his question. Test used independently is always the most favorable first cycle.

I'm not convinced that test should be the dominant AAS in any cycle either, but it is a great place to start.

-------------------

Ragu, what is your cycle history?

according to his profile he has...but i dont agree with his advise..

Birthday:
September 20, 1979
Biography:
up and coming bodybuilder
Location:
hotlanta
Interests:
bodybuilding, nutrition, fitness
Occupation:
Grad School
Height:
5-9
Weight:
255
Body Fat %:
13% 7Point Caliper test
Training Experience:
8, 3 as a bodybuilder
Bodybuilding Knowledge:
i know quiet a bit, but am always open to learn...
Cycle Experience:
done just about everything under the sun... and will do the rest in time.
Bodybuilding Competitions:
2 this year, maybe 1, depends on how big i can get my legs

[BUYLONGTERM]

i thought a good PCT is what gets your testosterone back to a normal level even with no test in the cycle...so are you saying that if i did a cycle without test that (clomid for example) would not be sufficient enough to bring my normal hormone levels back?

think your missing the point. During your cycle, you want to be able to replace your natural Test so during your whole cycle, you aren't shut down! But now think about it. When you stop all together (meaning no natural test, no synthetic test), you need clomid to get your natural test levels back to normal

[MBaraso]

I agree!!! Man, I could not imagine not being able to get it up for several weeks. That gives me nightmares!!!!

Couple weeks? That's sometimes an understatement.
Picture this: Moving to a beach house w/ a bunch of your buddies for the summer, women everywhere...not being able to get laid for almost 2 months cuz of a deca only cycle. That happend to one of my roomates 2 yrs ago...

[inheritmylife]

i thought a good PCT is what gets your testosterone back to a normal level even with no test in the cycle...so are you saying that if i did a cycle without test that (clomid for example) would not be sufficient enough to bring my normal hormone levels back?

No, clomid would still work. Whether or not you run test, you still won't be producing any post cycle. Running test with tren or deca won't help with PCT either. Reguardless of whether or not test is run, PCT will take longer with a nandrolone derivative. I say again, test won't make a difference, you need to be prepared for a harder recovery when using nandrolone.

Test is run in cycles because it reduces to DHT, the primary male androgen. this keeps motivation levels high, libido up, etc.

Nandrolone and winny will not yield these benefits to the extent test will. Nothing will.

[decadbal]

actually ive done several cycles. and i know enough about test to know the longterm isnt worth the short term. youll learn this later, if its bad advice then dont listen, but dont put ppl down as well... as far as your cycle goes bro, dont believe everything the gurus here say, buy some books and research your own stuff, dont just go by what ppl you never will meet will say...

[Ragu]

thanks buylongterm, that really helped and made sense..one more thing though.. when your shut down, does that mean you cant get it up? im assuming it does, and is there anything else that it means?

[inheritmylife]

actually ive done several cycles. and i know enough about test to know the longterm isnt worth the short term. youll learn this later, if its bad advice then dont listen, but dont put ppl down as well... as far as your cycle goes bro, dont believe everything the gurus here say, buy some books and research your own stuff, dont just go by what ppl you never will meet will say...

I wasnt refering to you when I mentioned #of cycles. I suppose that is why I quoted Ragu.

[decadbal]

LOL then my bad bro..... little defensive latlty seems alot of ppl are badmouthing me....anyway sorry bro..

[inheritmylife]

thanks buylongterm, that really helped and made sense..one more thing though.. when your shut down, does that mean you cant get it up? im assuming it does, and is there anything else that it means?

It is a term describing all the bad things that come from low androgen levels: low libido, impotence, low motivation, depression, etc.

[inheritmylife]

LOL then my bad bro..... little defensive latlty seems alot of ppl are badmouthing me....anyway sorry bro..

Its alright bro, youre gonna catch a lot of flak around here when you question whether or not test should be run in a cycle. I think it should always be run, but not necessarily at higher doses than everything else. My main reason for including it is to keep androgen levels high. 250mg/wk will do that.

[Ragu]

well you guys guessed right about me, cause ive only done one cycle..and it was winny depot. Actually, believe it or not, i loved it. I didnt get shut down at all, and i didnt do any PCT. I gained 17 lbs of muscle that i have kept on for a year now. Now i know that may be ignorant, but was that cycle a mistake?

[inheritmylife]

well you guys guessed right about me, cause ive only done one cycle..and it was winny depot. Actually, believe it or not, i loved it. I didnt get shut down at all, and i didnt do any PCT. I gained 17 lbs of muscle that i have kept on for a year now. Now i know that may be ignorant, but was that cycle a mistake?

It was a learning expierience, take something from it and get better.

My first cycle was deca only, my dick didnt fall off, I didnt die. But was it a good idea? I would say hell no.

[Blown_SC]

It was a learning expierience, take something from it and get better.

My first cycle was deca only, my dick didnt fall off, I didnt die. But was it a good idea? I would say hell no.

I'm trying to persuade my roommate to not start a deca-only cycle tomorrow. It's kinda hard cuz 'his friends' say that it is the best thing ever. I myself considered a Winny-only cycle before I received some REAL advice from the good bro's on this site. I agree, according to nearly everyone on this board, test is a must. Good luck to everyone.

[jkoss]

well you guys guessed right about me, cause ive only done one cycle..and it was winny depot. Actually, believe it or not, i loved it. I didnt get shut down at all, and i didnt do any PCT. I gained 17 lbs of muscle that i have kept on for a year now. Now i know that may be ignorant, but was that cycle a mistake?

Ragu,

Please explain your winny cycle in detail, how long was it and how frequent were your injections...were you running 50 mg a day?