Terrible college dieting-CRITIQUE

[flyguy7]

Alright, I've been trying to cut down now for about 7-8 weeks, with a diet that I pretty much threw together given what I have here at school, and with classes and such. It's not very good, but it was giving me good results for a while (I know, prolly a lot of water) but now I've seriously leveled off and am just not dropping anymore. 5'9, 220 about. here we go, complete with excuses:

8am-cardio, about 45 minutes 4 days a week (i'd do more if i could)

9am-4eggs, two slices of dry whole wheat bread. I don't have any egg whites, and I figured that some fat this early after running wasn't a big deal, but if you guys think it would be smarter to just take a shake here let me know.

12pm-half chicken breast, or sometimes hamburger when it's the only thing I can get.

3pm- lift baby

5pm-two scoops whey, half a cup of corn flakes

6:30pm- half chicken breast.

10pm-2 scoops whey

1am- half chicken breast or hamburger when it's the only thing I can get.

I recently took someone's advice and programmed my daily food intake into fitday.com, and it told me I was eating around 1600 calories a day, which is a helluva deficit. Am i wrong in thinking that's too little food, I'm sure I'm doing tons wrong, help a brother out!

[Myka]

Have a look at the stickies...what are you doing going to bed at 1am?...thats something I would do

[xtinaunasty]

24labor posted an awesome thread on foods for students...do a search. good luck!

[Haro3]

man im incollege and i can eat significantly better than that..i would suggest some mass gainers because u are in a serious calorie deficit..

[Myka]

Its not so much that your in a calorie deficit...its the food your eating...bad quality...

And the times are bad too...I would pass out if I had to work out after not eating for 3 hrs...but sense your used to it your probably just catabolic

[flyguy7]

haro it's a cutting diet- bulking is no problem at college. newkid what sort of things are better than chicken breast and whole wheat bread, obviously hamburger isn't exactly the best thing in the world? I'm very limited in what I can get ahold of, but if you think the stuff I'm eating is real bad I could start buying some of my own food. ouch$$$$$$$

[flyguy7]

Its not so much that your in a calorie deficit

and does this mean that you don't think 1600 calories a day is too little? Cuz that was one of my main confusions.

[xtinaunasty]

of course 1600 cals isnt enough!!! look...i even found the thread for you...im so sweet

college tips:
http://forums.steroid.com/showthread.php?t=200303

cutting sticky:
http://forums.steroid.com/showthread.php?t=75729

[Myka]

The best thing you could do is read and understand this...

http://67.18.108.244/showthread.php?t=75729

And yes your gonna have to really take a hit in the wallet if you want to diet properly...I recently had a problem with this but I got a tax return so Im okay for a while...



*oooops Im too slow

[chest6]

Im in college and put down 6k cals. I dont see what is so hard about being in college? Its not as bad as having a job??

[hawktribal]

Im in college and put down 6k cals. I dont see what is so hard about being in college? Its not as bad as having a job??

WORD

[flyguy7]

6000 calories a day while cutting down? Would that really work for me? that wouldn't be changing much at all from my regular bulking diet, except now I'm doing a more cardio. thanks for the links xtina and newkid.

[Myka]

6000 calories a day while cutting down? Would that really work for me? that wouldn't be changing much at all from my regular bulking diet, except now I'm doing a more cardio. thanks for the links xtina and newkid.

no he was giving an example of how much is possible while going to college...

[Haro3]

flyguy im eating 3500 cals eating 2 mass gainers aday eating almost 400 carbs 300 protein AND im leaning down....it has alot to do with how clean u eat how you monitor insulin spikes etc....1600 cals is to low if you ask me your 220...im 205 at 18% soo im not exactly lean to begin with but i can already tell a big difference jmo

[flyguy7]

no he was giving an example of how much is possible while going to college...

ok, well no I'm not eating 1600 calories because I simply can't get more food than that in at college Chest, i got up to 255 on school food. The point is I ignorantly thought that I had to cut down on how much I was taking in WAY more than I actually do- because when i checked my daily caloric intake it was only around 1600.
So haro you recommend a 3,000+ calorie diet for a 220 pounder? I'll shoot for that, but I don't understand the mass gainer thing, don't those have a lot of fats in them (don't know, never used them before)? Would you guys recommend I increase my carb intake at all, or keep it strictly high protein low fat foods?

[flyguy7]

flyguy im eating 3500 cals eating 2 mass gainers aday eating almost 400 carbs 300 protein AND im leaning down....it has alot to do with how clean u eat how you monitor insulin spikes etc....1600 cals is to low if you ask me your 220...im 205 at 18% soo im not exactly lean to begin with but i can already tell a big difference jmo

also, what kind of weight loss have you gotten from this diet, over how much time?

[LAGMuXle]

Flyguy,

This is what I would suggest, prioritized:

1. Read the cutting and the bulking stickies, and any other links or searches that xtina or newkid reccomended. Study them well.

2. Make a complete list of the types of foods you have most readily available to you throughout the day and/or week. Once this list is developed, visit FitDay again and see what properties the foods have. Study them well. Become familiar with your important foods.

3. Based on your research with the cutting sticky and bulking sticky, apply the types of foods from your list and compose a diet that best suits your needs. When you create a post, include your current stats clearly layed out, along with your new meals clearly layed out and your realistic goals layed out as well.

4. We will review your diet, and give you some of the best criticism you could ever find on the net.

Any questions along the way we will be happy to help, but double check yourself by doing searches and reading. You are on the right track starting with your diet.

Best of luck,

LAG

[flyguy7]

I respect what you say lag, and for what it's worth, I have researched a great deal of cutting threads, obviously including the stickies and what xtina and newkid posted. For instance from the cutting sticky, the general structure of my food is based right around the general formula outlined there:

Meal 1:
Lean Protein, 1/2 cup oatmeal

Meal 2:
Protein shake/Lean Protein (2 tbsp flax


Meal 3:
Veggies, Lean Protein

Workout

Meal 4:
PWO Nutrition

Meal 5:
Veggies, Lean Protein, 1/2 cup rice or oatmeal.

Meal 6:
Shake with Flax

in that plan there's one more meal before the workout, and in mine there's one more after the workout. Otherwise it's generally the same, minus some things i don't have access to (like flax), and I have always found those stickies helpful.
I don't think a complete list of everything I have access to is necessary, but let's just say I can get pretty much everything, as long as you guys motivate me to work or spend that much more for it.
I'm not sure what stats you need outside of my weight. I'm not taking any supplements for this cut, all natural. I started 7 weeks ago at 255, and have lost 35 pounds so far. Don't know what else you need, bicep measurements? I have no idea of current bf, let me know if I'm missing anything.
This diet has trimmed a lot of fat, but the last couple weeks it's stalled, so i figured that even though my metabolism may just be slowing down, i should bring my diet here, because I knew it probably sucked, and see what y'all had to say. I'm already trying to get more calories in, clean stuff of course, and thanks again for any further advice.

[xtinaunasty]

if you cant motivate yourself then you will never reach your goals. no one here is going to do the work for you.

[24labor]

24labor posted an awesome thread on foods for students...do a search. good luck!

thanks for the boost of confidence

[flyguy7]

if you cant motivate yourself then you will never reach your goals. no one here is going to do the work for you.

Geez that's helpful Alright xtina let me rephrase: This diet I've been on has given me good results, and is fairly easy to operate under even with classes and limited dining hours and such. But if you guys give me good reason to think that much of it drastically needs to be changed, I'm definitely willing to put in the extra effort/money for the last few weeks of the diet.

[hawktribal]

if you're going to commit to this diet you're going to have to do more shopping. just eating during dining hours (in a dorm i'm guessing) does not have to limit your ability to maintain an adequate amount of calories.

yes you are in college, that should give you more time than the average person on here. think about it, we go to school for what like 3-4 hours a day tops, possible job, and we're done. doesn't get much better this bro, you have time to make your diet successful you just have to put the effort in to doing it.

you said you modeled your diet after the sticky, and that's what you should do, but be specific. say what you're eating instead of "lean protein" etc. and you are going to get better help. best of luck.

[Myka]

I hope you dont think you can get lean protein from the dining hall...grade D...with PLENTY of fat...they are all the same...

As I said before you will have to give a good amount of cash if you want to have a successful cutter...This means going to walmart or aldys or whatever...

[flyguy7]

Hawk, the lean protein and general stuff was just taken from the sticky. My specific diet is at the top of the page. And don't worry, the majority of my eating is when the dining hall isn't open.

I hope you dont think you can get lean protein from the dining hall...grade D...with PLENTY of fat...they are all the same...

As a matter of fact I did NOT know this, I always just thought chicken breast was chicken breast. Thanks for this.

[hawktribal]

actually, i lived in a dorm last year and ate at a dining hall. the chicken breasts were actually quality.. all grilled, but i made sure of both before i ate it. i don't think that it isthe same everywhere.

[flyguy7]

actually, i lived in a dorm last year and ate at a dining hall. the chicken breasts were actually quality.. all grilled, but i made sure of both before i ate it. i don't think that it isthe same everywhere.

yeah, i tend to think the quality is really pretty good at school. It's grilled right in front of you- I've been to some other colleges and would definitely say my situation is about as good as I could ask as far as quality of food.

[xtinaunasty]

okay...in summary:

1. you've seen good results with this current diet. why change anything?

2. we've all said 1600 cals isnt enough and haro recommended 3000+, but refer to #1.

3. you dont need to spend an outragous amount of money on protein suppliments (you only really need 1-2 scoops PWO)...tuna, eggs, cottage cheese, oatmeal, brown rice, chicken breast, flaxseed and olive oil, peanut butter, even whole wheat bread if you are absolutely deperate.

4. i dont care what excuses you have, you can eat or down a shake in class or on a break. you can sneak a forman grill, microwave, and rice cooker into your dorm room (i dont advocate this of course ) all of those are fairly inexpensive.

5. we are all here to help you but if you refuse to take our advice we are wasting our time.

6. form a diet and post it...not that hard.

[24labor]

okay...in summary:



4. i dont care what excuses you have, you can eat or down a shake in class or on a break. you can sneak a forman grill, microwave, and rice cooker into your dorm room (i dont advocate this of course ) all of those are fairly inexpensive.
.

Hell eat in class I do if anybody gives you crap like a professor tell him to kiss your ass your paying his salary.

[flyguy7]

Again eating more food isn't a problem at all, I have plenty enough time in between classes (and yeah, sometimes during for the longer ones) to eat food. My problem was that I did not even calculate my total intake until a few weeks on the diet, and realized I was eating much less than I thought. Xtina, you say eating whole wheat bread only if I must. Granted, I do eat mostly oatmeal, but I don't understand why whole wheat bread was a poor decision as a source of carbs, though I've heard this before. Can anyone help me understand this?

[flyguy7]

5. we are all here to help you but if you refuse to take our advice we are wasting our time.

I don't get why you say this, I've already changed my diet a great deal based on the things I've read in this thread, as I mentioned in a previous post. I've loved all the advice, and can only hope for more. I already feel like I'm back on track with my weight, believe it or not, I think the sudden increase in food might have boosted my metabolism--somehow tonight I was down a couple pounds from a few days ago, and I haven't dropped anymore pounds for a couple weeks.
I thought your comment that I won't develop if I'm not motivated before was ridiculous and unnecessary, but I didn't mean to hurt anyone's feelings-sorry if I did. peace and love.

[LAGMuXle]

I respect what you say lag, and for what it's worth, I have researched a great deal of cutting threads, obviously including the stickies and what xtina and newkid posted. For instance from the cutting sticky, the general structure of my food is based right around the general formula outlined there:

Meal 1:
Lean Protein, 1/2 cup oatmeal

What type of Lean Protein? How Much? Why 1/2 Cup Oats? What is the total breakdown of this meal?

Meal 2:
Protein shake/Lean Protein (2 tbsp flax)

What kind of protein shake? Why are you combining a "Protein Shake" and Flax AND Lean protein? What kind of Lean Protein, How much?

Meal 3:
Veggies, Lean Protein

How much veggies, what kind? How much Lean Protein? What kind?

Workout

Is this workout weight training? What type of workout? For How Long? Why don't you have a Pro/Carb meal for your pre-workout?

Meal 4:
PWO Nutrition

What the HELL does this mean? A candy bar here for a insulin spike? Be more specific. "PWO Nutirtion" means nothing to us without some details.

Meal 5:
Veggies, Lean Protein, 1/2 cup rice or oatmeal.

Again, Lean Protein?

Meal 6:
Shake with Flax

When is this meal eaten? Right before bed? Right after "Meal 5"? What is a "Shake" ? Is it whey? Is it a meal replacement?

What are you taking in totally here? Can we have a Macro break down? How about your requirements? Did you check your BMR? How about a harris-benedict? Anything? How active are you? Are you doing cardio too? When are you doing it? What type of cardio? How intense? (heart rate %)? Are you taking any supplements? Any fat burners? Any metabolism increasers? Anything? Vitamins? How about Water? Do you drink water?

...
I don't think a complete list of everything I have access to is necessary, but let's just say I can get pretty much everything, as long as you guys motivate me to work or spend that much more for it.

I think the motivation will need to come from yourself. We are here to help, not motivate.

I'm not sure what stats you need outside of my weight. I'm not taking any supplements for this cut, all natural. I started 7 weeks ago at 255, and have lost 35 pounds so far. Don't know what else you need, bicep measurements? I have no idea of current bf, let me know if I'm missing anything.

Yes you are missing some things here; one thing is BF, which isn't THAT important unless you want to loose some (which is why you are cutting I would hope?). You are also missing your GOALS. How do you expect to make it anywhere without knowing where you are going?

This diet has trimmed a lot of fat, but the last couple weeks it's stalled, so i figured that even though my metabolism may just be slowing down, i should bring my diet here, because I knew it probably sucked, and see what y'all had to say. I'm already trying to get more calories in, clean stuff of course, and thanks again for any further advice.

Your diet doesn't "suck." But yes, it could use a lot of improvements. You need to give us a full evaluation of where you stand and where you want to be. You are being WAY to general with your foods.

There are a couple questions. We will start here.

LAG

[flyguy7]

Lag:
My specific diet, complete with times as requested, is at the top of the page, and yes it has the times I eat included with it. I answered this before when hawktribal asked for more specifics, and obviously I should never have done it b/c I just confused everyone, in a later post I copied that general diet from the cutting sticky to show everyone that I had done more than a little research, and my diet looked virtually identical to that one- for instance you ask me why I'm not eating a pro carb meal before lifting? because the sticky doesn't say to eat any carbs before lifting. Obviously I respect everyone's opinion on this forum a great deal, and if you guys say to eat carbs before I workout I will without question, just be aware the sticky doesn't reflect this, so it's confusing.
hopefully by looking at the thread starting post that will answer a few of your questions, such as when and how much cardio I'm doing. I have no idea what a harris-benedict is. I said in the first post i'm not taking any supplements (except multi,vitC and protein)-honestly I don't know how much else I need to respond to, alot of it's in that first post.
My goals are a bit confused at this point, sorry for not giving any definites here. I won't be able to do this diet for more than 4 or 5 weeks, as I start track very soon, and don't think I should be in much caloric deficit going into meets. I'm around 220 now, if I could lose 5-10 more pounds I'd be happy. Alot of posting this thread was to further my knowledge of cutting for future reference, and you all have been greatly helpful. Thanks.

[LAGMuXle]

Alright, I've been trying to cut down now for about 7-8 weeks, with a diet that I pretty much threw together given what I have here at school, and with classes and such. It's not very good, but it was giving me good results for a while (I know, prolly a lot of water) but now I've seriously leveled off and am just not dropping anymore. 5'9, 220 about. here we go, complete with excuses:

8am-cardio, about 45 minutes 4 days a week (i'd do more if i could)

9am-4eggs, two slices of dry whole wheat bread. I don't have any egg whites, and I figured that some fat this early after running wasn't a big deal, but if you guys think it would be smarter to just take a shake here let me know.

My first meal of my day is 8-10 egg whites and 1 Cup of Oats. Not that you should do the same, but give it some thought. Maybe make it 8 Egg Whites and 1/2 Cup Oats since you are cutting.

12pm-half chicken breast, or sometimes hamburger when it's the only thing I can get.

Avoid the "hamburger" unless it's 97% lean ground beef and NOTHING else. And you might want to make this a Pro/Carb meal. If I eat a Pro/Fat meal before I lift, I simply waste my time in the gym with no energy.

3pm- lift baby

5pm-two scoops whey, half a cup of corn flakes

Move this meal to right after you lift, and make it 4 scoops whey and a good source of carbs such as 1 Cup Oats. A lot of people like to use Dextrose, but I personally don't.

6:30pm- half chicken breast.

You need to have either a Fat or Carb added here. Since this is your PPWO I would reccomend Carbs - either white rice, brown rice, or oats again. Don't forget Veggies here as well.

10pm-2 scoops whey

2 Scoops? What type of whey are you using? I said 4 above but you could be using a larger scoop than me. Make it around 40 grams of protein and you are good.

1am- half chicken breast or hamburger when it's the only thing I can get.

I would just make this either 1 Cup cottage cheese, or another whey shake with some flax. Stay away from eating greesy foods with bad fats or bad carbs before bed.

I recently took someone's advice and programmed my daily food intake into fitday.com, and it told me I was eating around 1600 calories a day, which is a helluva deficit.


Your maintance level should be approximately 3,363.65 calories if you are moderately active (before you start track). Once you start track this will jump to apprxomiately 3,743.42. At these levels you shouldn't gain or lose weight. You will know better, it is your body. These numbers are just guidelines.

Check out http://www.bmi-calculator.net and see what you think. I took the time to plug in your numbers and play with them a bit.

Am i wrong in thinking that's too little food, I'm sure I'm doing tons wrong, help a brother out!

I would suggest having carbs in your first meal, the meal right before you lift, and the two meals after you lift.

Try this for a week, see you how you feel.

I think this should answer some of your main questions. The only thing I want to emphasize is that I would get rid of that last meal in your diet ... the 1:00AM meal, just doesn't seem to fit. If anything eat 1/2 cup fat free cottage cheese or a few scoops of whey, nothing else. You are cutting remember, that hamburger in the middle of the night isn't going to help.

Just a few pointers:

1. Keep reading. Don't stop researching EVER. You will never fully understand everything involved with training, you can only keep improving.

2. Carbs are meant to be placed where you need them throughout the day. This is my opinion on where they should be only because it works best for me. You may need to play around a little bit with your meal placement until you are satisfied. Carbs in the A/M (first meal) make sense, carbs before you lift make sense, and carbs after you lift make sense (for two meals).

3. I would suggest keeping your sugars low, since you are only eating like this for 4-5 weeks I wouldn't reccomend a cheat meal until after then to maximze your potential.

4. As far as fruits are concerned, I will answer this before you ask; everyone will have a different opinion, the best guys on here will say it both ways. I would suggest trying fruits later on in the day (right after you lift) and not before bed. This will prevent any unwanted insulin spikes. I personally am avoiding all sugars, all milk products, and all fruits right now as I am cutting. I am having great results while avoiding them. So this is just a personal choice.

5. No-one here will be able to tell you WHAT to do. You seem to have a fairly high IQ so I can't imagine that this will be hard to understand. Think of it this way; the more hard work you put in, the more good results you will see. Every day counts.


6. One last thing - when you begin track all you will really do is increase your activity level on your BMR, this will help you maintain weight during track. The main thing you will change in your diet is your carb intake to compensate. IMO.

K, that's all for now, I need to go eat.

Good Luck,

LAG

[flyguy7]

Lag, amazing post bro.

I use myopro whey, each scoop is 22g. I agree with you on the fruits, though I do normally have a banana right after lifting, just forgot to put that in when I was typing out my diet. Obviously I'm not getting enough carbs in at all, so I'll fix that right away. As for the burger I'd sometimes eat at night, I was thinking that getting some protein and fats in before going to sleep would help with catabolism through the night, but this definitely needs to be dropped as well.

Thanks for taking the time to type that all out man, seriously helping me out here. Hopefully with this I'll be back on track again.

[LAGMuXle]

Lag, amazing post bro.

I use myopro whey, each scoop is 22g. I agree with you on the fruits, though I do normally have a banana right after lifting, just forgot to put that in when I was typing out my diet. Obviously I'm not getting enough carbs in at all, so I'll fix that right away. As for the burger I'd sometimes eat at night, I was thinking that getting some protein and fats in before going to sleep would help with catabolism through the night, but this definitely needs to be dropped as well.

Thanks for taking the time to type that all out man, seriously helping me out here. Hopefully with this I'll be back on track again.

Anytime.

Keep us posted.

LAG