Clenbuterol VS ECA Stack: Health Concerns

[geobatman]

Hey,

Regardless of the effectiveness of either, I wanted to get a full range of opinions on something.

In your opinion, which is more dangerous to the human body OVERALL?

Assumptions:
1. ECA STACK (consists of 24ephedrine/200caffiene/81asprin X 3 times a day)
2. Clenbuterol (consists of cycle from the Clenbuterol handbook)
3. Cycle time is the same
4. Water consumption is at 2gallon
5. DIET/CARDIO/WEIGHT - All in check
6. Taurine is taken

Before answer, realize there are alot of studies blown out of proportion on both thermogenics; the studies usually involve a MUCH higher dosage than humans use.

Please include a brief description of why either is more dangerous to the human body.

Thanks alot guys.

[1buffsob]

That's a tough one bro. Too many variables in my opinion. Some people experience little to no sides on one, and have terrible sides on the other. Maybe someone with a little more knowledge on both will chime in.

1buffsob

[badboy247]

clen is a broncodilator and studies are not blown out of proportion i dont think,,, clen puts an enormous stress on your heart and makes it beat alot faster,, there is no warning signs or set point with clen where your body tells u its had enough... my heart beat when on clen has been 85beats/min at rest. which means if i walk up some stairs say,,, my heart beat reaches around 105 which is equivalent of non user sprinting say 50 metres. believe this,, clen dangers are underrated big time. clen is def more dangerous than eca. but works alot better, especially if stacked with t3. then your talking thermogenics on a larger scale. the other problem with clen is the reaction subsides after 3 weeks,,, that is why some stupid people take ridiculously high doses to sustain results but it just doesnt work. clen and t3 are cheap and very effective together but the warnings are not to be overlooked my friend.

[geobatman]

thanks for the responses thus far.

Please don't forget that a daily dose(1 dose x 3 times a day) of homemade ECA stack consists of:
600mg of caffiene
75mg of ephedrine

So while ECA may not place as much stress on your heart, it could be impacting other areas of the body which normally have difficulty with processing caffiene and ephedrine.

I always tend to go on the side of safety. I have been to the doctor on a full dosage of clen and another time on a full dosage of ECA.

My blood pressure was higher while on ECA. Heart rate higher on Clen. (diet/cardio/weights all in check)

keep discussing...opinions?

[ascendant]

as for which one is more dangerous is highly questionable. i truly think it's dependent on the person. though clen does take a toll on the heart, as long as you're not pushing your heart to it's limits and monitoring your hr during cardio to keep it at reasonable levels, you should be fine. back in 2000, tons of athletes had this prescribed to them, and look at how many of them ended up dead cause of it? i don't know any.

ephedrine puts a big toll on your cns too. for some reason, clen is much better for me personally. i take too much ephedrine and i get chest pains like like you wouldn't believe. with the clen, my bp never went up, my hr only went up a very small amount, and i got much better results as far as decreasing bf% and it even helped me increase lean muscle mass while i was on a calorie-restriced diet. my only issue i had on clen was it gave me a lot of anxiety and once when i was doing cardio at too high of a hr (160bpm), i started having funny feelings in my chest which lasted for about 10mins. after cooling down. then again, i know now i shouldn't have been doing my cardio above 140bpm while on the clen, so that was my mistake. oh, and this stuff did wonders for my asthma while i was on it too.

there is some research that will say clen is worse and others saying the opposite. it's highly controversial and really does seem to be dependent on the personalized experience while on it. however, as long as you monitor your rhr, bp, cardio hr, and body temp while on clen, you should be fine. if you combine clen and t3, that will be far more effective than eca, but again you're increasing your risk for side-effects, though not necessarily heart issues since t3 doesn't seem to affect the heart.

[geobatman]

as for which one is more dangerous is highly questionable. i truly think it's dependent on the person. though clen does take a toll on the heart, as long as you're not pushing your heart to it's limits and monitoring your hr during cardio to keep it at reasonable levels, you should be fine. back in 2000, tons of athletes had this prescribed to them, and look at how many of them ended up dead cause of it? i don't know any.

ephedrine puts a big toll on your cns too. for some reason, clen is much better for me personally. i take too much ephedrine and i get chest pains like like you wouldn't believe. with the clen, my bp never went up, my hr only went up a very small amount, and i got much better results as far as decreasing bf% and it even helped me increase lean muscle mass while i was on a calorie-restriced diet. my only issue i had on clen was it gave me a lot of anxiety and once when i was doing cardio at too high of a hr (160bpm), i started having funny feelings in my chest which lasted for about 10mins. after cooling down. then again, i know now i shouldn't have been doing my cardio above 140bpm while on the clen, so that was my mistake. oh, and this stuff did wonders for my asthma while i was on it too.

there is some research that will say clen is worse and others saying the opposite. it's highly controversial and really does seem to be dependent on the personalized experience while on it. however, as long as you monitor your rhr, bp, cardio hr, and body temp while on clen, you should be fine. if you combine clen and t3, that will be far more effective than eca, but again you're increasing your risk for side-effects, though not necessarily heart issues since t3 doesn't seem to affect the heart.

Awesome. Thanks for looking at the WHOLE picture.

While the general consenus is that t3 coupled with clenbuterol is far superior to ECA, I still wouldn't take t3 soley based on its purpose. It directly affects thyroid, i don't want to go down that road.

Any more opinions?

[ascendant]

Awesome. Thanks for looking at the WHOLE picture.

While the general consenus is that t3 coupled with clenbuterol is far superior to ECA, I still wouldn't take t3 soley based on its purpose. It directly affects thyroid, i don't want to go down that road.

Any more opinions?

i know many people have concerns about t3 because of their concerns for it shutting down your thyroid and being stuck on permanent therapy for life because of it. however, looking in the steroid profiles section of this board, you can see that those concerns are unfounded and that t3 may very well be the safer compound of the two (compared to clen). clen is the only one of the two to put strain on the heart. again though, under controlled moderate doses (like the ones mentioned in the profiles section) the side-effects should not be serious.

[Random]

ascendant i agree with you that t3 is safer than clen, i still have yet to find enough evidence that t3 will shut your thyroid down for good, especially if you take a low maintenance dose....as for me, i get no heart rate increase with clen or ephedra. i personally consider ephedra far more effective since it increases my endurance, strength, water output, and energy. clen did nothing for me even at 160mcg per day...no increase in BP, heart rate, or fat loss...i got in the best shape of my life in a natural show using ephedra compared to another show where i used clen and t3...

[geobatman]

ascendant i agree with you that t3 is safer than clen, i still have yet to find enough evidence that t3 will shut your thyroid down for good, especially if you take a low maintenance dose....as for me, i get no heart rate increase with clen or ephedra. i personally consider ephedra far more effective since it increases my endurance, strength, water output, and energy. clen did nothing for me even at 160mcg per day...no increase in BP, heart rate, or fat loss...i got in the best shape of my life in a natural show using ephedra compared to another show where i used clen and t3...

although i welcome the response, you've dodged the question.

That is remarkable that your heart rate did not increase at 160mcg of clenbuterol. Was it legit?

I agree that ECA is an awesome thermogenic.

[ascendant]

ascendant i agree with you that t3 is safer than clen, i still have yet to find enough evidence that t3 will shut your thyroid down for good, especially if you take a low maintenance dose....as for me, i get no heart rate increase with clen or ephedra. i personally consider ephedra far more effective since it increases my endurance, strength, water output, and energy. clen did nothing for me even at 160mcg per day...no increase in BP, heart rate, or fat loss...i got in the best shape of my life in a natural show using ephedra compared to another show where i used clen and t3...

good info. that right there shows you how different people respond to this stuff and that you need to experiment with what works for you.

on a personal note, i went up to, it was either 120 or 140 mcgs myself on clen, and i had no increase in bp, rhr, or temp either, but it did give me much better results than eca ever had. i know some people say to just go higher till your temp goes up, but i think some people just don't respond that way. as it was, that dose had me more anxious than any all-nighters with caffiene ever came close to. only issue though is since i don't have those things to go by, i don't know personally how high to up my dose, but maybe i'll save that for another thread...

[geobatman]

one of my main beefs with clenbuterol is finding your tolerance.

at 140mcg i was literally laughing at the side effects. I felt i could handle ALOT more. But there is a fine line when reaching tolerance and oversaturating your receptors.

I feel you have alot more control with a homemade ECA stack. I also can't wait to try clenbuterol with ketotifen.

[Random]

oh sorry, well IMO on paper id say clen is more dangerous than ephedra....and yes it was legit with original package and label......when i took clen i used it with ketotifen every day at 1-2mg...i wonder does anyone use keto when using ephedra? would it create the same effect on cleaning your receptors and make ephedra more effective?

[geobatman]

oh sorry, well IMO on paper id say clen is more dangerous than ephedra....and yes it was legit with original package and label......when i took clen i used it with ketotifen every day at 1-2mg...i wonder does anyone use keto when using ephedra? would i create the same effect on cleaning your receptors and make ephedra more effective?

thanks.

On paper ketotifen works with ephedrine......yet its rarely used. You might be on to something captain!!

[Random]

hmm im preparing for a contest in july, and i have some keto lying around, i think im gonna use it with ephedra and ill post my thoughts...

[ascendant]

oh sorry, well IMO on paper id say clen is more dangerous than ephedra....and yes it was legit with original package and label......when i took clen i used it with ketotifen every day at 1-2mg...i wonder does anyone use keto when using ephedra? would it create the same effect on cleaning your receptors and make ephedra more effective?

though i can't say for sure, keto certainly should do the same for ephedra considering the fact that ephedra hits those same receptors that clen does.

however, don't misinterpret that keto will make them more effective. what it does is allow you to take it for longer periods without receptor downgrade. on clen, you don't need to even think about starting keto until about 2 weeks into it.

[Testostack]

thanks for the responses thus far.

Please don't forget that a daily dose(1 dose x 3 times a day) of homemade ECA stack consists of:
600mg of caffiene
75mg of ephedrine

So while ECA may not place as much stress on your heart, it could be impacting other areas of the body which normally have difficulty with processing caffiene and ephedrine.

I always tend to go on the side of safety. I have been to the doctor on a full dosage of clen and another time on a full dosage of ECA.

My blood pressure was higher while on ECA. Heart rate higher on Clen. (diet/cardio/weights all in check)

keep discussing...opinions?

That's quite reasonable you, i'm kinda sensitive to heart stimulants such as caffein, of course ephedrine - or i thought so - and finally i'm regulary taking ripped fuel on my cardio day, that is to say 75mg ephedrine, and not a single sign that my heart speeds up!
Clen is another strory though, i'd never give it a try, even for free, trust me on that one!

[trulbfan3]

run both together or cycle them. personally i prefer clen and ever more i prefer clen and eca together. worked real good for me. then i did a bulker, ate everything in sight and once again im carrying around a gut. i really shouldnt have tried to empty that damn ice cream machine everyday at lunch lol

[ascendant]

run both together or cycle them. personally i prefer clen and ever more i prefer clen and eca together. worked real good for me. then i did a bulker, ate everything in sight and once again im carrying around a gut. i really shouldnt have tried to empty that damn ice cream machine everyday at lunch lol

i wouldn't suggest clen and eca together. not a good idea to put that much of a strain on your cns. if you're on clen, that should be the only cns that you should be on. you're asking for heart problems with that combo. if you can take it and have no problems, fine, but that's not something i'd recommend suggesting for people on this board. you could send one of this forums newbs to a hospital with that advice. clen and t3 are much much safer than your combo.

[Testostack]

BS.........don't throw some Clen in your ECA stack already! it's damn effective if your diet is good and your cardio as well......Clen IS good, but w/ ephedrine, ain't nuttin but a bad idea....or save some to buy a new heart!

[stupidhippo]

its not very effective either.... Im lacking any valid evidence to either direction to decide which is worse to the heart. U have to keep in mind that B2 agonists have been and are used to treat asthma all the time and very commonly.. U cannot make simple conclusions on how they effect ur HR and BP... AAS affect my HR much more than clen. My biggest concern on clen is the effect it might have on myocardial apoptosis / necrosis... Ive seen some studies but they arent enough to convince me yet.. The thing is that Im concerned most on irreversible changes which can become serious cumulatively.

[badboy247]

eca versus clen alone is a debatable issue and will raise differing opinions depending on the individuals.. clen and cyto combined versus eca is a different kettle of fish.. completely.. without a shadow of a doubt CONSIDERABLY more effective at reducing body fat than any eca stack, and i challenge anyone to disagree with this statement. but ultimate fat burner DNP + IGF-1 and before the influx of warnings about DNP yes it is dangerous... a bit like clen and cyto being a small knife DNP would be a chainsaw. FU****G lethal but similarly truely astounding results. (( for my money go with slow increases up to a max of 100mg cyto a day for 6 weeks taper off slowly spread it over the day,, no more than 200mg clen a day light cardio 20mins a day will be fine ...trust me you'll burn triple the calories. keep an eye on hb bp etc...my last clen cyto stack i didnt do any cardio and just ate clean and still got from 23%bf down to 14%. remember one main warning with cyto -liothyronine is thyroid hormone and its worth going to doc and getting thryroid function tested b4 embarking on any dose. clen and cyto are safe together provided you treat them with respect and adhere to the guidelines. start off with a small dose 25mg day and see how u get on. the only horror stories with these chemicals are ALWAYS dose related or sudden not taking from a high dose. u must taper off slowly and with cyto your thyroid function will return to normal pretty quickly.

[geobatman]

Thanks for the responses so far guys.

On another notes, I'm effectively feeling the clenbuterol crash as i didn't taper off properly. I'm having minor chest pressure and i feel fluish, fatigued, malaise.

Conversly, when i come off ECA i also crash but its more of a common cold feeling. E.g. Headache, sneezing (my nasal system is ****ed after ECA). I think caffiene influences a big part of the withdrawl from ECA.

I'm spent a good month researching clenbuterol and now its time to research cytomel.

[PurplePatriot]

Which stack would be more ideal for an athelete who does a good amount of cardio and wants to keep strength gains up? Clen + t3 or ephedra/caffine/asprin??

[swole25]

clen worked just as good as ECA for me, but with clen it's neccessary to refresh your receptors or it loses it's effect usually after 3 weeks or so, so most people cycle it every 3 weeks or take benadryl the 3rd week to refresh the receptor sites. with ECA there is no need for this. plus clen made me sweat like a MF at night!

[ascendant]

Thanks for the responses so far guys.

On another notes, I'm effectively feeling the clenbuterol crash as i didn't taper off properly. I'm having minor chest pressure and i feel fluish, fatigued, malaise.

Conversly, when i come off ECA i also crash but its more of a common cold feeling. E.g. Headache, sneezing (my nasal system is ****ed after ECA). I think caffiene influences a big part of the withdrawl from ECA.

I'm spent a good month researching clenbuterol and now its time to research cytomel.

funny you mentioned that "minor chest pressure" feeling from crashing off clen. i actually had that feeling almost the entire time i was on it. i just got used to it, though i never did find out exactly what it was from. if anyone has any ideas, i'm open to them?

anyway, the most important thing to remember here is everyone is different and everyone will react differently to different chems. i personally tolerate clen much better than eca. eca gives me unbelievable chest pains if i take too much, even if i very gradually increase my dose. clen never gave me more than chest pressure, and it was so slight it was completely tolerable. it all depends on your reaction to the chem.

[Random]

ascendant...hey man, for my contest prep im gonna use ephedra, in your opinion do you think i should use it for like 3 wks then the 3rd week add the keto for the whole wk then continue the ephedra or would u use keto at a light does ED with the ephedra?