casein instead of whey

[wolfstriked]

I read many reports about how whey is no good and cause its too quickly absorbed your body will just convert to fat.Now I buy protein that has both whey and casien or sometimes milk or egg protein to last longer in digestive system.

Now I wonder why we cant just use whey for PWO and casein for rest of shakes thruout day?I have read that casein is better tasting than whey powder also.

[novastepp]

you can. so what's the problem?

[wolfstriked]

Ive read that it takes 8 hrs to release into your blood stream.If you eat every 3 hrs its gonna clog you up.After reading below ill stick to protein blends instead of just whey or casein.

http://www.alive.com/3086a6a2.php?su...read_cramb=455

Scroll down to bottom.Has interesting differences between mothers milk and cows milk.I didnt know that mothers milk has essential fatty acids and also good bacteria like acidolphilus.Hmm so a protein blend shake with some EFA's and some probiotics mimics mothers milk.Now if Only my girlfriend would allow me to drink my protein shakes off her breast id be in heaven

[novastepp]

my bad, i thought u meant like a whey/egg/casein protein combination. i see what u meant now. i would just go with a combo for before bed. and i don't use liquid form of protein throughout my day.

[Superballer]

I've heard GREAT things about Nitrean protein mix.

It is whey/egg/casein and tastes good. Not extremely pricey either.

Look into it.

I myself prefer to eat ALL solid meals except for PWO. I'll eat a chicken breast as fast as you can drink a shake. lol.

[novastepp]

I've heard GREAT things about Nitrean protein mix.

It is whey/egg/casein and tastes good. Not extremely pricey either.

Look into it.

I myself prefer to eat ALL solid meals except for PWO. I'll eat a chicken breast as fast as you can drink a shake. lol.

ditto on the whole foods. love to eat and be full, sadly that doesn't happen much on this here cutter however, i am going to use a whey/egg/casein protein shake before bed or in periods where eating may not be possible, which will be rare, but i haven't used them before but was talking with a few guys who said they were great pre-bed and felt they had great results with them. alread that the mixture lasts a whole lot longer when incorporated with a fat meal. so natty PB added to the mix sounds like heaven to me

[Kärnfysikern]

I read many reports about how whey is no good and cause its too quickly absorbed your body will just convert to fat.Now I buy protein that has both whey and casien or sometimes milk or egg protein to last longer in digestive system.

Now I wonder why we cant just use whey for PWO and casein for rest of shakes thruout day?I have read that casein is better tasting than whey powder also.

Whey is not converted into fat...

Casein is good protein but personaly I would just eat some cottage chese, drink some milk or eat a few whole eggs if I want a slower digesting protein. Atleast here in sweden casein protein powders are disgustingly expensive

[Kärnfysikern]

its just as good as whey pwo aswell. So if you can find it cheap go ahead and use it.

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/q...=pubmed_docsum

Ingestion of casein and whey proteins result in muscle anabolism after resistance exercise.

Tipton KD, Elliott TA, Cree MG, Wolf SE, Sanford AP, Wolfe RR.

Metabolism Unit, Shriners Hospitals for Children and Department of Surgery, The University of Texas Medical Branch, Galveston, TX 77550, USA. [email protected]

PURPOSE: Determination of the anabolic response to exercise and nutrition is important for individuals who may benefit from increased muscle mass. Intake of free amino acids after resistance exercise stimulates net muscle protein synthesis. The response of muscle protein balance to intact protein ingestion after exercise has not been studied. This study was designed to examine the acute response of muscle protein balance to ingestion of two different intact proteins after resistance exercise. METHODS: Healthy volunteers were randomly assigned to one of three groups. Each group consumed one of three drinks: placebo (PL; N = 7), 20 g of casein (CS; N = 7), or whey proteins (WH; N = 9). Volunteers consumed the drink 1 h after the conclusion of a leg extension exercise bout. Leucine and phenylalanine concentrations were measured in femoral arteriovenous samples to determine balance across the leg. RESULTS: Arterial amino acid concentrations were elevated by protein ingestion, but the pattern of appearance was different for CS and WH. Net amino acid balance switched from negative to positive after ingestion of both proteins. Peak leucine net balance over time was greater for WH (347 +/- 50 nmol.min(-1).100 mL(-1) leg) than CS (133 +/- 45 nmol.min(-1).100 mL(-1) leg), but peak phenylalanine balance was similar for CS and WH. Ingestion of both CS and WH stimulated a significantly larger net phenylalanine uptake after resistance exercise, compared with the PL (PL -5 +/- 15 mg, CS 84 +/- 10 mg, WH 62 +/- 18 mg). Amino acid uptake relative to amount ingested was similar for both CS and WH (approximately 10-15%). CONCLUSIONS: Acute ingestion of both WH and CS after exercise resulted in similar increases in muscle protein net balance, resulting in net muscle protein synthesis despite different patterns of blood amino acid responses.

[wolfstriked]

Interesting articles you post Johan and while Ill admit I am skeptic,I can keep an open mind that it could be true.I do like to follow the mothers milk formula though so a protein blend seems best IMO.

[Kärnfysikern]

Interesting articles you post Johan and while Ill admit I am skeptic,I can keep an open mind that it could be true.I do like to follow the mothers milk formula though so a protein blend seems best IMO.

From the limited reading I have done one of the most important ingredients in mothers milk is lauric acid(a saturated fat). You can find it in coconut oil. So if you want to make the mothers milk blend perfect be sure to add some virgine coconut oil aswell

Blending protein sources is always good I agree with that. But casein, whey and egg protein are all complete proteins. They contain all the amino acids needed just in different proportions. So its hard to enhance the effect of one of them.

It defenetly wont hurt though so aslong as it doesnt hurt your wallet to much keep on doing it

[wolfstriked]

Ewww,coconut oil got old on me too fast.After one day I would gag at just the smell as I opened the jar.I do believe that coconut oil has many health benefits but just cant tolerate it.

[Kärnfysikern]

Ewww,coconut oil got old on me too fast.After one day I would gag at just the smell as I opened the jar.I do believe that coconut oil has many health benefits but just cant tolerate it.

to bad I cant even get ahold of it here in sweden

[ascendant]

I read many reports about how whey is no good and cause its too quickly absorbed your body will just convert to fat.Now I buy protein that has both whey and casien or sometimes milk or egg protein to last longer in digestive system.

Now I wonder why we cant just use whey for PWO and casein for rest of shakes thruout day?I have read that casein is better tasting than whey powder also.

the entire whey protein being digested too quickly thing seems very controversial and primarily financially motivated. 95% of the people suggesting whey is bad because it's absorbed too quickly are telling you that and then trying to sell you something else and always for far more than what whey costs.

maybe if you chugged down a whey protein shake in like 5 minutes, yes, then i could see that MAYBE it would get digested too quicky and some might be stored as fat. however, if you have a whey protein shake and take it down gradually, like over the course of 15-30mins, that should be plenty adequate enough to spread out the absorption.

additionally, many of the studies i've seen where they show whey being digested too quickly is with people taking in only whey protein at the time. of course we don't do that as we always add fats or carbs to it as well. the other parts of our meal that goes along with the whey would slow down it's digestion.

as far as taking in a lot of casein, as someone else had already mentioned, it digests TOO slow for that to be a good idea. you'll be feeling bloated and full all day. maybe adding some casein would be good for someone looking to cut, but certainly not for those looking to bulk. however, i've also read studies that indicate that although we want carbs that are slow digesting for a continuous supply of blood sugars, with protein our body utilizes it in rushes. so if you had protein that was continuously digesting all day long and no gaps at all in between, it would seem that would not be the optimal state we'd want our bodies to be in. there were some studies done on that somewhere around on bodybuilding.com, but i don't know the article off the top of my head.

also, combining different proteins will simply slow down the faster digesting ones. if you take in whey and casein, the whey will be digested almost just as slowly as the casein. it can't just pass through the casein. so, unlike many would think, you won't get some whey for now and casein for later. it will all be absorbed at the same rate, the casein obviously being the dominant one in the slowing down of the digestion rate which as previously stated, is not necessarily a good idea.

the only time i'd personally suggest taking in casein is for right before bed. other than that, i just feel it digests too slow and keeps our bodies from being in an optimal anabolic environment.

whey protein should be fine and i wouldn't worry about the hype going around personally. i know many people who have gone both with and without whey protein in their diets and have not noticed any difference at all. if you really want to know for sure, try doing the same for yourself and compare your results.

[wolfstriked]

also, combining different proteins will simply slow down the faster digesting ones. if you take in whey and casein, the whey will be digested almost just as slowly as the casein. it can't just pass through the casein. so, unlike many would think, you won't get some whey for now and casein for later. it will all be absorbed at the same rate, the casein obviously being the dominant one in the slowing down of the digestion rate which as previously stated, is not necessarily a good idea.

the only time i'd personally suggest taking in casein is for right before bed. other than that, i just feel it digests too slow and keeps our bodies from being in an optimal anabolic environment.

whey protein should be fine and i wouldn't worry about the hype going around personally. i know many people who have gone both with and without whey protein in their diets and have not noticed any difference at all. if you really want to know for sure, try doing the same for yourself and compare your results.

First off this is being looked into in this topic

http://forums.anabolicreview.com/sho...php?t=249516is

I agree with alot you posted but the whey being slowed by casein to the point of being just as slow digesting as the casein.

Now heres why I disagree with the above.IMO,milk from any animal is geared to the correct ratio of slow to fast digesting proteins for that species.From elk to tigers to cows and humans the ratio of casein to whey changes.There must be a reason for the ratios in the same way that there must be a reason to have the same amino acids in different forms of digestion speed.Thats why I doubt mixing casein with whey will turn the whey into casein.The liquid part of milk will flow right thru stomach spiking AA and the curds part will gel up for sustained release.Mother natures intelligent design at work.

If you look at mothers milk as an example then you realize that we have adapted to a ratio of 40:60 casein to whey.Now cows milk has a ratio of 80:20 casein to whey.So if you follow mother nature than the optimal ratio we humans would thrive on is a 40:60 slow to fast protein or a simple 1/1.]

So you say "but animals like say a tiger will turn and eat only meat for remainder of its life....so wheres "this" ratio now smartass"

Well milk is geared for rapid growth of babies and an animal once fully grown doesnt need this perfect ratio.But a person trying to gain muscle is still growing.

I think im gonna start eating half my per meal protein as whey and the other half casein or a meat source.