Not another thread on that post workout window

[stunner5000pt]

Ok i know this topic has been beaten to death over here and i have read those threads. Threads like this
http://forums.steroid.com/showthread.php?t=249518

In a recent argument i was having with some people on another forum someone pointed me to this article from pubmed.com

Dietary supplements affect the anabolic hormones after weight-training exercise.Chandler RM, Byrne HK, Patterson JG, Ivy JL.
Department of Kinesiology, University of Texas at Austin 78712.

To examine the effect of carbohydrate and/or protein supplements on the hormonal state of the body after weight-training exercise, nine experienced male weight lifters were given water (Control) or an isocaloric carbohydrate (CHO; 1.5 g/kg body wt), protein (PRO; 1.38 g/kg body wt), or carbohydrate-protein (CHO/PRO; 1.06 g carbohydrate/kg body wt and 0.41 g protein/kg) supplement immediately and 2 h after a standardized weight-training workout. Venous blood samples were drawn before and immediately after exercise and during 8 h of recovery. Exercise induced elevations in lactate, glucose, testosterone, and growth hormone. CHO and CHO/PRO stimulated higher insulin concentrations than PRO and Control. CHO/PRO led to an increase in growth hormone 6 h postexercise that was greater than PRO and Control. Supplements had no effect on insulin-like growth factor I but caused a significant decline in testosterone. The decline in testosterone, however, was not associated with a decline in luteinizing hormone, suggesting an increased clearance of testosterone after supplementation. The results suggest that nutritive supplements after weight-training exercise can produce a hormonal environment during recovery that may be favorable to muscle growth by stimulating insulin and growth hormone elevations.

PMID: 8175597 [PubMed - indexed for MEDLINE]

now im confused... contradicting information... im not really sure what to do or waht to believe anymore ...

[Alpha-Male]

i'm sorry, what r u confused about? what's contradicting???

[stunner5000pt]

actually i noticed a 'hole' in teh logic of those articles since they had their subjects consume at two times immedaitely and 2 hours later as they didnt directly contradict the research that says that consuming a protein shake immediately after exercise hinders growth.

the guy has yet to show me an article that says that post workout shake cosnumed immediately has greater benefits than waiting.

[stunner5000pt]

Here is an article he just showed me

except it applies to older people

Timing of postexercise protein intake is important for muscle hypertrophy with resistance training in elderly humans.Esmarck B, Andersen JL, Olsen S, Richter EA, Mizuno M, Kjaer M.
Sports Medicine Research Unit, Bispebjerg Hospital, Denmark. [email protected]

1. Age-associated loss of skeletal muscle mass and strength can partly be counteracted by resistance training, causing a net synthesis of muscular proteins. Protein synthesis is influenced synergistically by postexercise amino acid supplementation, but the importance of the timing of protein intake remains unresolved. 2. The study investigated the importance of immediate (P0) or delayed (P2) intake of an oral protein supplement upon muscle hypertrophy and strength over a period of resistance training in elderly males. 3. Thirteen men (age, 74 +/- 1 years; body mass index (BMI), 25 +/- 1 kg m(-2) (means +/- S.E.M.)) completed a 12 week resistance training programme (3 times per week) receiving oral protein in liquid form (10 g protein, 7 g carbohydrate, 3 g fat) immediately after (P0) or 2 h after (P2) each training session. Muscle hypertrophy was evaluated by magnetic resonance imaging (MRI) and from muscle biopsies and muscle strength was determined using dynamic and isokinetic strength measurements. Body composition was determined from dual-energy X-ray absorptiometry (DEXA) and food records were obtained over 4 days. The plasma insulin response to protein supplementation was also determined. 4. In response to training, the cross-sectional area of m. quadriceps femoris (54.6 +/- 0.5 to 58.3 +/- 0.5 cm(2)) and mean fibre area (4047 +/- 320 to 5019 +/- 615 microm(2)) increased in the P0 group, whereas no significant increase was observed in P2. For P0 both dynamic and isokinetic strength increased, by 46 and 15 %, respectively (P < 0.05), whereas P2 only improved in dynamic strength, by 36 % (P < 0.05). No differences in glucose or insulin response were observed between protein intake at 0 and 2 h postexercise. 5. We conclude that early intake of an oral protein supplement after resistance training is important for the development of hypertrophy in skeletal muscle of elderly men in response to resistance training.

PMID: 11507179 [PubMed - indexed for MEDLINE]

the bolded part is relevan to the discussion
would this have the same effect for younger individuals?

[Alpha-Male]

There's a book called Nutrient Timing that references many studies like these...search for studies published by John Ivy, he's one of the authors...google scholar them, or buy that book. I don't have as much time as i used to for cut and paste

alpha

[stunner5000pt]

There's a book called Nutrient Timing that references many studies like these...search for studies published by John Ivy, he's one of the authors...google scholar them, or buy that book. I don't have as much time as i used to for cut and paste

alpha

noo i dont wanna buy the book i don have money

but ill google em and see

is the guy well reputed??

[Alpha-Male]

dude, it's like a $10 book...anyhow, yeah, he and Portman authored the book, and Ivy is very well-reknowned for his research on the subject...Google scholar, or even go to pubmed...