Israel Jerusalem Policy Condemned....

[RamyGras]

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/middle_east/6658799.stm


Israel Jerusalem policy condemned

Israel has built an outer ring of settlements around East Jerusalem
The international Red Cross has privately accused Israel of reshaping Jerusalem to further its own interests, in violation of international law.
A leaked ICRC report says Israeli policy has far-reaching humanitarian consequences for Palestinians living under occupation in East Jerusalem.

Israel captured East Jerusalem in 1967, and the territory is regarded as occupied land under international law.

But Israel rejects this, and says the report's premise is, therefore, wrong.

The report says Israel shows "general disregard" for its obligations under international humanitarian law and the law of military occupation in particular.

Violations that change the status of East Jerusalem include the West Bank barrier, an outer ring of Jewish settlements around the city and roads to connect Israeli districts and settlements, the report says.

An ICRC spokesman confirmed that leaked quotations in a US newspaper were from a confidential report transmitted in February 2007 to Israel and some other governments.

Boycott

The leak comes a day before Israel marks 40 years, according to the Jewish calendar, since its capture of East Jerusalem from Jordanian control, in the 1967 war.

"We reject the premise of the report," said Israeli foreign ministry spokesman Mark Regev.

"East Jerusalem is not occupied land, it is part of Israel. All people there were offered full Israeli citizenship."

Israel's unilateral moves in Jerusalem have been condemned by several UN Security Council Resolutions.

US and EU ambassadors have boycotted ceremonies in the run-up to Israel's Jerusalem Day on Wednesday, arguing that the status of the city should be determined by negotiations with the Palestinians.

[mcpeepants]

one state is the only way

[Logan13]

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/middle_east/6658799.stm


Israel Jerusalem policy condemned

Israel has built an outer ring of settlements around East Jerusalem
The international Red Cross has privately accused Israel of reshaping Jerusalem to further its own interests, in violation of international law.
A leaked ICRC report says Israeli policy has far-reaching humanitarian consequences for Palestinians living under occupation in East Jerusalem.

Israel captured East Jerusalem in 1967, and the territory is regarded as occupied land under international law.

But Israel rejects this, and says the report's premise is, therefore, wrong.

The report says Israel shows "general disregard" for its obligations under international humanitarian law and the law of military occupation in particular.

Violations that change the status of East Jerusalem include the West Bank barrier, an outer ring of Jewish settlements around the city and roads to connect Israeli districts and settlements, the report says.

An ICRC spokesman confirmed that leaked quotations in a US newspaper were from a confidential report transmitted in February 2007 to Israel and some other governments.

Boycott

The leak comes a day before Israel marks 40 years, according to the Jewish calendar, since its capture of East Jerusalem from Jordanian control, in the 1967 war.

"We reject the premise of the report," said Israeli foreign ministry spokesman Mark Regev.

"East Jerusalem is not occupied land, it is part of Israel. All people there were offered full Israeli citizenship."

Israel's unilateral moves in Jerusalem have been condemned by several UN Security Council Resolutions.

US and EU ambassadors have boycotted ceremonies in the run-up to Israel's Jerusalem Day on Wednesday, arguing that the status of the city should be determined by negotiations with the Palestinians.

Rocket attacks against your civilians would make you act as well. Care to rationalize the Pals actions in Lebanon while your at it??

[singern]

Jerusalem: Hebrew for "The city of peace".

All people regardless of Ethnic, race, or religion are welcome to live, pray, work, and visit in the capitol of Israel. No amount of suicide bombing, or religious extremism will change this simple fact.

[BgMc31]

Israel is not without blame in this. To say that Israel is simply the victim responding to crisis is bullshit. Everyone has their own agenda. Both Israel and the Palistenians share equal responsibility in this crap. I really grow tired of people trying to put the blame solely on one side or the other when both are guilty of atrocities worthy of the Spanish Inquisition.

[RA]

Israel is not without blame in this. To say that Israel is simply the victim responding to crisis is bullshit. Everyone has their own agenda. Both Israel and the Palistenians share equal responsibility in this crap. I really grow tired of people trying to put the blame solely on one side or the other when both are guilty of atrocities worthy of the Spanish Inquisition.

But you have to look at the deliberate targeting of civilians vs some civilians getting hurt by accident while your going after the enemy. Maybe I look at it that way because I dont hate jews enough.

[Logan13]

Maybe I look at it that way because I dont hate jews enough.

LOL!!!! Isn't that the truth.

[singern]

Israel is not without blame in this. To say that Israel is simply the victim responding to crisis is bullshit. .

Every civilised nation on the planet has felt the bloody hand of Islamic extremism and terror, and every nation condems it as a horrific act, unless Israel/Jews are the target . Why is that? Why are Israeli civilians blown to bits not victims? Why as you say is that bullshit?

[BgMc31]

Look I'm not siding with terrorists, nor do I hate Jews and yes I have Jewish friends, LOL!!! All I'm saying is all we hear is how Israel is always the victim. But more Palistenian civilians are killed everytime Israel retaliates. Israel is not without its faults and many Jews that I've spoken with agree with it. I admire Israel for using as much force as possible to deter agression against them, but they and their supporters need to stop the bullshit argument that these civilians are simply casualties of war.

[RamyGras]

Rocket attacks against your civilians would make you act as well. Care to rationalize the Pals actions in Lebanon while your at it??

Nope. Nothing to rationalize here. Idiots that need to find a frickin' job.

[RamyGras]

Jerusalem: Hebrew for "The city of peace".

All people regardless of Ethnic, race, or religion are welcome to live, pray, work, and visit in the capitol of Israel. No amount of suicide bombing, or religious extremism will change this simple fact.

Except Palestinians.

[RamyGras]

But you have to look at the deliberate targeting of civilians vs some civilians getting hurt by accident while your going after the enemy. Maybe I look at it that way because I dont hate jews enough.

Look at the difference in Israeli civilians killed this year vs. Palestinians civilians killed this year. All of those killed were by accident? I think it's more of a disregard of human life.

To quote Benjamin Netenyahu:

"Israel should have exploited the repression of the demonstrations in China, when world attention focused on that country, to carry out mass expulsions among the Arabs of the territories."
-- Benyamin Netanyahu, then Israeli ***uty Foreign Minister, former Prime Minister of Israel, speaking to students at Bar Ilan University, from the Israeli journal Hotam, November 24, 1989.

That mindset has never, and will never change.

[RamyGras]

Every civilised nation on the planet has felt the bloody hand of Islamic extremism and terror, and every nation condems it as a horrific act, unless Israel/Jews are the target . Why is that? Why are Israeli civilians blown to bits not victims? Why as you say is that bullshit?

I do find that to be crap. I always felt as though our country were kind of hypocrites when it came to that. Israel has been battling fundamentalists for many years prior to 2001, and Reagan, Bush, and Clinton urged them to find peace and to not retaliate. Then, when we get a taste of what Israel goes through, we begin an endless war to end it.

The way I believe some perceive it is that the land was unfairly taken from the Palestinians in 1948. And, that the Israelis knew what they were getting themselves into.


"We must expel Arabs and take their places."
-- David Ben Gurion, 1937, Ben Gurion and the Palestine Arabs, Oxford University Press, 1985.

"Let us not ignore the truth among ourselves ... politically we are the aggressors and they defend themselves... The country is theirs, because they inhabit it, whereas we want to come here and settle down, and in their view we want to take away from them their country."
-- David Ben Gurion, quoted on pp 91-2 of Chomsky's Fateful Triangle, which appears in Simha Flapan's "Zionism and the Palestinians pp 141-2 citing a 1938 speech.


"Jewish villages were built in the place of Arab villages. You do not even know the names of these Arab villages, and I do not blame you because geography books no longer exist. Not only do the books not exist, the Arab villages are not there either. Nahlal arose in the place of Mahlul; Kibbutz Gvat in the place of Jibta; Kibbutz Sarid in the place of Huneifis; and Kefar Yehushua in the place of Tal al-Shuman. There is not a single place built in this country that did not have a former Arab population."

-- David Ben Gurion, quoted in The Jewish Paradox, by Nahum Goldmann, Weidenfeld and Nicolson, 1978, p. 99.


Didn't Israel name their airport after him?

[mcpeepants]

I do find that to be crap. I always felt as though our country were kind of hypocrites when it came to that. Israel has been battling fundamentalists for many years prior to 2001, and Reagan, Bush, and Clinton urged them to find peace and to not retaliate. Then, when we get a taste of what Israel goes through, we begin an endless war to end it.

The way I believe some perceive it is that the land was unfairly taken from the Palestinians in 1948. And, that the Israelis knew what they were getting themselves into.


"We must expel Arabs and take their places."
-- David Ben Gurion, 1937, Ben Gurion and the Palestine Arabs, Oxford University Press, 1985.

"Let us not ignore the truth among ourselves ... politically we are the aggressors and they defend themselves... The country is theirs, because they inhabit it, whereas we want to come here and settle down, and in their view we want to take away from them their country."
-- David Ben Gurion, quoted on pp 91-2 of Chomsky's Fateful Triangle, which appears in Simha Flapan's "Zionism and the Palestinians pp 141-2 citing a 1938 speech.


"Jewish villages were built in the place of Arab villages. You do not even know the names of these Arab villages, and I do not blame you because geography books no longer exist. Not only do the books not exist, the Arab villages are not there either. Nahlal arose in the place of Mahlul; Kibbutz Gvat in the place of Jibta; Kibbutz Sarid in the place of Huneifis; and Kefar Yehushua in the place of Tal al-Shuman. There is not a single place built in this country that did not have a former Arab population."

-- David Ben Gurion, quoted in The Jewish Paradox, by Nahum Goldmann, Weidenfeld and Nicolson, 1978, p. 99.


Didn't Israel name their airport after him?

where did you find those quotes?

[RamyGras]

I found them online, however every single quote is provided with the book it was taken from and its publisher.

[RA]

Hes probably right. Look if the U.S. kicked mexicos ass in a war but mexico continued to send in suicide bombers, fire rockets into our country, etc...
What do you think we would do?? Go down and kill all the mfkrs we could. Simple logic.

Look at the difference in Israeli civilians killed this year vs. Palestinians civilians killed this year. All of those killed were by accident? I think it's more of a disregard of human life.

To quote Benjamin Netenyahu:

"Israel should have exploited the repression of the demonstrations in China, when world attention focused on that country, to carry out mass expulsions among the Arabs of the territories."
-- Benyamin Netanyahu, then Israeli ***uty Foreign Minister, former Prime Minister of Israel, speaking to students at Bar Ilan University, from the Israeli journal Hotam, November 24, 1989.

That mindset has never, and will never change.

[***xxx***]

Hes probably right. Look if the U.S. kicked mexicos ass in a war but mexico continued to send in suicide bombers, fire rockets into our country, etc...
What do you think we would do?? Go down and kill all the mfkrs we could. Simple logic.

we ll wut would u do if mexicans came, ocupy 3/4 of the states (and leave u ohio) and then tell everybody it was gods will cause they r the chosen ones and they have been living on those lands for thousands of years before you? and you have nobody that listens to you, no political movement that helps u, no money, no future - nothing.

and now tell me u wouldn t be pissed off and wouldn t try to get the land back!

[RA]

I would organize and go to war but I certainly would never send men, women, and children strapped with bombs over. btw, you know how much money arafathead had? Millions.....You want to talk about having no money but its just another case of the guy at the top screwing the rest out of money.

we ll wut would u do if mexicans came, ocupy 3/4 of the states (and leave u ohio) and then tell everybody it was gods will cause they r the chosen ones and they have been living on those lands for thousands of years before you? and you have nobody that listens to you, no political movement that helps u, no money, no future - nothing.

and now tell me u wouldn t be pissed off and wouldn t try to get the land back!

[***xxx***]

I would organize and go to war but I certainly would never send men, women, and children strapped with bombs over. btw, you know how much money arafathead had? Millions.....You want to talk about having no money but its just another case of the guy at the top screwing the rest out of money.

organize and go to war - how? without a possibility to train an army? thats bs sorry, if they would have had aa chance to fight I m very certain they would have done it.

I do not want to sympathize with terrorists, I just can understand the ill logic behind the hatred between israelis and palaestinians...it s a vicious circle and way too easy to blame one side. both sides are guilty in a lot of ways.

[RA]

Sounds wishy washy

IMO, you get your ass kicked in a war, you give up or get your ass kicked again.

organize and go to war - how? without a possibility to train an army? thats bs sorry, if they would have had aa chance to fight I m very certain they would have done it.

I do not want to sympathize with terrorists, I just can understand the ill logic behind the hatred between israelis and palaestinians...it s a vicious circle and way too easy to blame one side. both sides are guilty in a lot of ways.

[RamyGras]

I would organize and go to war but I certainly would never send men, women, and children strapped with bombs over. btw, you know how much money arafathead had? Millions.....You want to talk about having no money but its just another case of the guy at the top screwing the rest out of money.

So true. However, this was the main reason that the Palestinians voted Fatah out of office. They are frickin' thieves. Unfortunately, they voted in a group that, at one time, prided themselves on being suicide bombers. At this point, if Hamas (the new government of Palestine) were to start assembling an army, do you think they would be allowed to? The world would see this as terrorist training. The U.S. and Israel would not allow it. Let's not forget, that when Palestine was offered a state, there were two MAIN conditions. Recognize Israel, which Israel won't agree to do with the Palestinians, and have a state sans military.

[RA]

So true. However, this was the main reason that the Palestinians voted Fatah out of office. They are frickin' thieves. Unfortunately, they voted in a group that, at one time, prided themselves on being suicide bombers. At this point, if Hamas (the new government of Palestine) were to start assembling an army, do you think they would be allowed to? The world would see this as terrorist training. The U.S. and Israel would not allow it. Let's not forget, that when Palestine was offered a state, there were two MAIN conditions. Recognize Israel, which Israel won't agree to do with the Palestinians, and have a state sans military.

Yes, it could be seen as terrorist training. Possibly they should stop all terrorist activities Then, eventually, it might be seen as raising a defense force.

[***xxx***]

Yes, it could be seen as terrorist training. Possibly they should stop all terrorist activities Then, eventually, it might be seen as raising a defense force.

big difference: israel bombing ur ass because ur terrorist or because u try to build an army

[RamyGras]

Yes, it could be seen as terrorist training. Possibly they should stop all terrorist activities Then, eventually, it might be seen as raising a defense force.

"Everybody has to move, run and grab as many (Palestinian) hilltops as they can to enlarge the (Jewish) settlements because everything we take now will stay ours...Everything we don't grab will go to them."
-- Ariel Sharon, Israeli Foreign Minister, addressing a meeting of the Tsomet Party, Agence France Presse, Nov. 15, 1998.

Is it really terrorism when the Israeli Foreign Minister and future Prime Minister is making comments like this?

[RamyGras]

David Ben Gurion (the first Israeli Prime Minister): "If I were an Arab leader, I would never sign an agreement with Israel. It is normal; we have taken their country. It is true God promised it to us, but how could that interest them? Our God is not theirs. There has been Anti - Semitism, the Nazis, Hitler, Auschwitz, but was that their fault ? They see but one thing: we have come and we have stolen their country. Why would they accept that?"
-Quoted by Nahum Goldmann in Le Paraddoxe Juif (The Jewish Paradox), pp121.


Ben Gurion also warned in 1948 : "We must do everything to insure they ( the Palestinians) never do return." Assuring his fellow Zionists that Palestinians will never come back to their homes. "The old will die and the young will forget."

What Israel has found out is that they young certainly did not forget. And, I'm not sure they will.

[RA]

So what? This isnt offical Israel policy. Thats not what they are doing. As a matter of fact, during Clintons presidency, Israel was ready to give up a ton for peace.

"Everybody has to move, run and grab as many (Palestinian) hilltops as they can to enlarge the (Jewish) settlements because everything we take now will stay ours...Everything we don't grab will go to them."
-- Ariel Sharon, Israeli Foreign Minister, addressing a meeting of the Tsomet Party, Agence France Presse, Nov. 15, 1998.

Is it really terrorism when the Israeli Foreign Minister and future Prime Minister is making comments like this?

[***xxx***]

So what? This isnt offical Israel policy. Thats not what they are doing. As a matter of fact, during Clintons presidency, Israel was ready to give up a ton for peace.

also because of one man - it was not israels official policy neither. he got killed by another israeli and we know wut happend afterwards...

[eliteforce]

This is a myth, they never offered withdrawel of the Wbank, they offered a cut-up patchwork called a "state" not included was-*soverignty over any part of Jerusalem..soverignty over the wbanks water resources.. sovereignty of the border..sovereignty of central hebron(those crazies in the middle of the city were to stay there with their own road leading back to Israel, which would be under Israeli military control..and 'settlement blocks' would continue to keep most of the settler population in the wbank. and this was what..8 years ago? what do they offer a 'fair' settlement every 10 years with a take it or leave it option. and if you don't take it you get another 10 years of terror/occupation/aphartied?

>As a matter of fact, during Clintons presidency, Israel was ready to give up >a ton for peace.

[RamyGras]

So what? This isnt offical Israel policy. Thats not what they are doing. As a matter of fact, during Clintons presidency, Israel was ready to give up a ton for peace.

We (Americans) wouldn't vote for a presidential candidate if they made this kind of comment.