Weight class athlete cycle

[pimpdawgin]

I am not a bodybuilder, and I am probably not the only one on this forum that isn't. So, keeping in mind that I am not looking to become a lot bigger, but looking for some reasonable but not drastic, strength, power, and %bf improvements, I ask the followng.
What is a good cycle and PCT that:
1) is Gyno-proof. (Non-aromatizable, minimal progesterone complications, etc)
2) adds lean mass and strength, aids fat loss, without much net weight gain
and water retention/bloat.
3) will recover the HPTA and nat test production quickly and effectively.

I have made a thread on an anavar-only cycle, which many people have opposed, for various reasons (see here:
http://forums.steroid.com/showthread...=1#post3561375 and here http://forums.steroid.com/showthread...1#post3561349).

I am thinking of Anavar mainly, and possibly Primobolan. I know that both have similar effects and are non-aromatizing.
As for PCT, I am looking at Nolva or Clomid (which is probably a debate on its own), Cabergoline and Proviron.
Can anyone shed any further light onto good cycles and PCT for something along these lines?
Thanks.

[unclemoney]

I'm thinking Test prop and EQ.

And for no estrogen related sides run nolva at 20mg/ed throughout or letro at .25mg/ed

[powerliftmike]

keep test prop dose low-moderate and either stack in eq, primo, or prolly best halo. masteron tends to add weight, but other DHT-derivatives like winny would work.

[SilverToungedDevil]

go with a low dose of test prop, eq, and anavar or primo. keep letro on hand for gyno purposes. run anthony roberts pct afterwards or do a full pct of clomid, and nolvadex. you could possibly throw in some clen/t3 during the pct to add more fat loss and muscle hardness.

[buckeyefootball4]

what would be a low dose of test - 200-300mg?

[pimpdawgin]

thanks for the responses, but why is everyone saying test prop and equipoise? I was looking for non-aromatizing compounds, which they both aren't, and test prop will add more weight than I want.
Am I out of line here? I am gyno-prone, and am adamant on non-aromatizing and no water retention/bloating.
Anavar so far, according to my research, appears to be the perfect candidate.

[cmillett]

anavar really hurt my joints man !!! my knees the most. @ only 50mg ED for 8 wks,and also suffered from decreased libido =(
But that is only my personell experiance.I'm a PLer and try too hold a weight class.
PS ,go check out my thread on OT @ 40-60mg ED,and watch for the posts.

[buckeyefootball4]

thanks for the responses, but why is everyone saying test prop and equipoise? I was looking for non-aromatizing compounds, which they both aren't, and test prop will add more weight than I want.
Am I out of line here? I am gyno-prone, and am adamant on non-aromatizing and no water retention/bloating.
Anavar so far, according to my research, appears to be the perfect candidate.

dude if u use test prop at 200mg per week you wont add weight. go with test prop, masteron, and halo. i play pro football at the skill so i know all about increasing strength and power without adding much mass.

[pimpdawgin]

dude if u use test prop at 200mg per week you wont add weight.

What about the aromatization? Sure, I am probably being a bitch here, but I am gyno-prone, I do know that, and don't want to take any chances.

[ecto9]

If I'm not mistaken i think the idea of using prop is less sides ie: gyno. Is that right guys?

[buckeyefootball4]

What about the aromatization? Sure, I am probably being a bitch here, but I am gyno-prone, I do know that, and don't want to take any chances.

take some a-dex while on ur cycle.

[pimpdawgin]

anavar really hurt my joints man !!! my knees the most. @ only 50mg ED for 8 wks,and also suffered from decreased libido =(
But that is only my personell experiance.I'm a PLer and try too hold a weight class.
PS ,go check out my thread on OT @ 40-60mg ED,and watch for the posts.

OT I assume is Oral Turinabol, correct? I am not familiar with this. Is it aromatizing. Why will it not affect joints, unlike var? Why does var decrease libido, but turinabol doesn't?

[pimpdawgin]

I saw your thread, cmillet. You are running quite a few compounds I see. That isn't what I'm going for, but would it be a good idea for me to do a Anavar and Oral Turinabol stack, assuming the OT is non-aromatizing and can cancel out Var's libido-decreasing and joint-hurting effects?

[cmillett]

Var is a DHT dericed compound which in some cases DHT will lower estrogen in turn your natural test will lower too compensate .

Yes OT is oral turinabol.
OT is a testosterone derived compound which will probably decrease your natural test but at the same time maitain libido while ON.
From what i've read and what I've been told OT does not aromatize in most cases.

[buckeyefootball4]

I saw your thread, cmillet. You are running quite a few compounds I see. That isn't what I'm going for, but would it be a good idea for me to do a Anavar and Oral Turinabol stack, assuming the OT is non-aromatizing and can cancel out Var's libido-decreasing and joint-hurting effects?

i hate var you have to take higher amounts to get the job done and with me being a athlete i can only take 20-30mg max bc anything more gives me bad pumps in the lower back and calves.

[cmillett]

I saw your thread, cmillet. You are running quite a few compounds I see. That isn't what I'm going for, but would it be a good idea for me to do a Anavar and Oral Turinabol stack, assuming the OT is non-aromatizing and can cancel out Var's libido-decreasing and joint-hurting effects?

I would not run Var with OT,
Heres some options,
cycle 1=HALO @ 20-40mgs ED no more than 4-6 wks at a time.
cycle 2=Anavar @ 50mg ED for 8-10wks, Halo @ 20mgs on heavy days, Glucosmine supps @ 2000mg ED
cycle 3=EQ @ 200-400mg E wk,test prop @ 50mg EOD,Proviron @ 50mg ED,Halo @ 20mgs On heavy days

here's a list of a few compounds that will keep your weight down while increasing strength,
Tren-A
EQ
test prop
test susp
OT
Halo
Var

You will have too way out the bad with the good,There are plenty of goods that will combat most if not all of the sides you will encounter with any of those compounds I mentioned.
My suggestion ,use a process of elimination too find what you need too take compared too your goals.I would not worry about the gyno sides de too the fact that there are plenty of good Research chemicals too combat those nasty sides.

[buckeyefootball4]

I would not run Var with OT,
Heres some options,
cycle 1=HALO @ 20-40mgs ED no more than 4-6 wks at a time.
cycle 2=Anavar @ 50mg ED for 8-10wks, Halo @ 20mgs on heavy days, Glucosmine supps @ 2000mg ED
cycle 3=EQ @ 200-400mg E wk,test prop @ 50mg EOD,Proviron @ 50mg ED,Halo @ 20mgs On heavy days

here's a list of a few compounds that will keep your weight down while increasing strength,
Tren-A
EQ
test prop
test susp
OT
Halo
Var

You will have too way out the bad with the good,There are plenty of goods that will combat most if not all of the sides you will encounter with any of those compounds I mentioned.
My suggestion ,use a process of elimination too find what you need too take compared too your goals.I would not worry about the gyno sides de too the fact that there are plenty of good Research chemicals too combat those nasty sides.

i took halo and it didnt do shit maybe i needed to take more i only took 20mg. cant wait to try test prop tren a masteron with some t3 an clen.

[Doc.Sust]

prop,eq and halo. that is the ticket

[sarcomere]

Would a NPP and test prop stack work? Or is nandrolone more for size?

[tadpoleboyy]

im low dosing test cyp at 250 and im getting water retention and weight gain, i dont suggest test at all unless you have some AI. you should look into eq, winny, maybe primo. If you dont want to gain that much, maybe you should try something thats is not an AAS. I dont know your history, but creatine will boost strength noticeably. Also, you say you are gyno prone, and want to cut up but not add a lot of weight. Why dont you just run an AI and/or a SERM for a few weeks? It will def. not cause any gyno and may help get rid of fat and water weight, and will boost you test levels enough to make some gains

[buckeyefootball4]

im low dosing test cyp at 250 and im getting water retention and weight gain, i dont suggest test at all unless you have some AI. you should look into eq, winny, maybe primo. If you dont want to gain that much, maybe you should try something thats is not an AAS. I dont know your history, but creatine will boost strength noticeably. Also, you say you are gyno prone, and want to cut up but not add a lot of weight. Why dont you just run an AI and/or a SERM for a few weeks? It will def. not cause any gyno and may help get rid of fat and water weight, and will boost you test levels enough to make some gains

longer esters tend to make you hold more water, my friend is taking 200mg of test prop and tren a no water.

[tadpoleboyy]

why would long make you hold more than short? Is there any solid evidence on this?

[pimpdawgin]

im low dosing test cyp at 250 and im getting water retention and weight gain, i dont suggest test at all unless you have some AI. you should look into eq, winny, maybe primo. If you dont want to gain that much, maybe you should try something thats is not an AAS. I dont know your history, but creatine will boost strength noticeably. Also, you say you are gyno prone, and want to cut up but not add a lot of weight. Why dont you just run an AI and/or a SERM for a few weeks? It will def. not cause any gyno and may help get rid of fat and water weight, and will boost you test levels enough to make some gains

It might help make some very minor gains, but it seems like an expensive way to go about getting minor gains.
I think an anabolic is a must. My quest now, is to find one that doesn't aromatize, give gyno, destroy joints and do any permanent damage to HPTA and libido.

[buckeyefootball4]

It might help make some very minor gains, but it seems like an expensive way to go about getting minor gains.
I think an anabolic is a must. My quest now, is to find one that doesn't aromatize, give gyno, destroy joints and do any permanent damage to HPTA and libido.

goodluck, let us know what u pick bc it seem like you dont need our help.

[tadpoleboyy]

AAS is an expensive way to go, buyin a bit of nolva and a AI aint nothin compared to a full blown cycle. Hell i might even try that myself this school year since i wont have enough $ to do a real cycle till next summer. Get some novla, some dermacrine, creatine, and maybe an AI, and some good supps i would bet that i could put on some decent lbs.

[pimpdawgin]

goodluck, let us know what u pick bc it seem like you dont need our help.

Of course I need help. I am asking for a non-aromatizable, joint-friendly, non-HPTA-destroying drug. Is there a chart similar to this (http://www.steroid.com/effect.php), but for joint effects?

[buckeyefootball4]

Of course I need help. I am asking for a non-aromatizable, joint-friendly, non-HPTA-destroying drug. Is there a chart similar to this (http://www.steroid.com/effect.php), but for joint effects?

cant tell, everyone here has given you some great tips but you seem to have your mind made up.

[Alfamale]

It is just easiers for us heavy weighters... Im on Test E, Eq and Mast p at pretty high doses. Im gainin plenty, more than i wanted and my stamina suck right now. Well i havent got match before feb so i will survive. I would go for Test P, anavar, halo, mast p or Eq all at low doses. What do you compete in? And how much body fat do you have? How much weight do you have to loose before comp?

[buckeyefootball4]

It is just easiers for us heavy weighters... Im on Test E, Eq and Mast p at pretty high doses. Im gainin plenty, more than i wanted and my stamina suck right now. Well i havent got match before feb so i will survive. I would go for Test P, anavar, halo, mast p or Eq all at low doses. What do you compete in? And how much body fat do you have? How much weight do you have to loose before comp?

when u say low doses what are we talking about?

[pimpdawgin]

It is just easiers for us heavy weighters... Im on Test E, Eq and Mast p at pretty high doses. Im gainin plenty, more than i wanted and my stamina suck right now. Well i havent got match before feb so i will survive. I would go for Test P, anavar, halo, mast p or Eq all at low doses. What do you compete in? And how much body fat do you have? How much weight do you have to loose before comp?

I compete recreationally in submission wrestling at 170. Right now I am 183. I am a bit on the chunky side (in my view, anyway). I am not in a mad rush to cut weight for any particular competition, but rather looking for a long-term and relatively healthy approach. That is why I am preferring nothing heavy on the side effects, and I am not willing to risk gynecomastia. Whis is why I am leaning towards Anavar and Primo. I am not a BB'er, and don't want to bulk up, I just want less fat, a bit more strength and some definition.
Hope that makes sense.