Test E pct

[hendrira]

ive been told to use clomid along with nolva during pct,but the more i read here not alot of people use that. any input?

[Big]

I like a clomid/nolva pct

[hendrira]

Thanks Im prepared to do that pct, but all the reading about others kinda worried me

[Big]

There are many opinions on pct, and many pct regimens that work very well. The cycle itself will in some degree determine what pct is necessary, but a large part of it is finding what works well for you, everyone is different.

[hendrira]

How did your clomid/nolva pct look if you dont mind me asking

[the big lebowski]

bump

[Big]

How did your clomid/nolva pct look if you dont mind me asking

It depends on what type of cycle it's following, pct after a simple test cycle would look different than pct after a multi-compound cycle with 19nor compounds and test.

[N4cer]

They should basically be the same always. You don't ever want to see how little you can get by with on PCT. It's your nuts! Always go at PCT with 100% effort.

And I don't so much agree on mixing SERMs for PCT. The one that binds stronger at the hypothalamus will win anyway. So I prefer to hit clomiphene hard the first 3-5 days since it is better than tamoxifen for PCT and stop it before it raises SHBG too much extra, then switch off to toremifene or tamoxifen. This time will be toremifene.

[Kale]

Pheedno's PCT
My post cycle therapy consists of a three compound administration which is designed so that there is a primary and secondary LH stimulator which both are maximizing potential early in the duration; with the primary being phased out in extended protocol. With the addition of an Aromatase Inhibitor, which makes the above possible, the individual will also endure less of an increase in Sex Hormone Binding Globulin, which allows free testosterone levels to reach base line at a much quicker pace. The individual will also see less of a problem in most cases with sexual libido as the bounding SHBG is controlled(to an extent). Below you will find my suggested bare minimum, as well as a sample of an extended protocol. Extended PCT protcol is cycle length dependant so the below is not the standard for all cycles


PCT for cycles 8-16wks:
Day 1-30- .25mg L-dex + 100mg Clomid + 20mg Nolva

Extended protocol sample for a 12+ month cycle:
Day 1-15_ .25mg L-dex + 100mg Clomid + 20mg Nolva
Day 16-45_.25mg L-dex + 75mg Clomid + 20mg Nolva
Day 46-65_.25mg L-dex + 20mg Nolva
Day 66-80_.25mg L-dex

Now IMO, selective estrogen receptor modulators(SERMs) such as Clomiphine and Tamoxifen are selective to which tissues they bind too. Clomid being selective to the suprapituitary, while Tamox is selective to breast, bone, and liver ERs. I've come to this conclusion based on the comparison of studies on both SERMs. In every study showing benefit to HPTA from tamoxifin, the duration of the administration is 3-12months(This includes studies cited by William Llewellyn in his Nolva vs Clomid article). In studies showing levels of LH, FSH, and Testosterone checked after short durations of tamox, they were either insignificant, or their was an actual drop. I believe this is because tamox selectively works at the mammery(as well as bone and liver), thus taking longer for LH stimulation to occur.
With clomid, benefit to gonadotrophin concentrations, LH, FSH, and serum testosterone can be seen in short periods of 2-6wks. Because of the apparent selective nature of the two, and given our usual PCT duration, clomid is by far superior at LH stimulation than Nolva. Now both is the wise choice for a couple of reasons:

1. Nolva acts as the preventive measure to the estrogen flux
occured PC while clomid is the primary LH stimulator(Even more so in the case an AI is not used).
2. If your running a longer PCT, clomid needs to be discontinued after a while as it has been shown to desensitize GnRH, this due, IMO, to it's selective nature to the suprapituitary. In the longer forms of PCT, the clomid will be phased out, leaving Nolva and L-dex

Arimidex(or L-dex)
Estrogen is the main inhibitence of restoring HPTA, and AI administration has been shown to increase gonadotrophin concentrations and serum Testosterone by up to 50%. In addition, by adding L-dex, the inhibitence of excess estrogen allows Tamox to work greater at LH stimulation in the begining stages of PCT, since the need to prevent binding in the mammery is lessened by the reduction in estrogen biosynthesis