PCT, got my hands on more stuff!

[shabby]

6 1/2 weeks out in my test-E 500mg cycle it seems I'm now able to get what i need of HCG, clomid, aromasin and arimidex, in addition to my nolvadex. And so i got a couple questions.

HCG is a bit late, since i shouldve used it through the whole cycle, but wasn't available. Should I still do 500 iu's 2 times a week for the last 4 weeks of my cycle? (Week 11 and 12, and then 13 and 14 while waiting for PCT)

What do you think would be the best PCT? Most places I read I find that nolva+clomid is a waste, that nolva is enough. Maybe something like this(?):

HCG week 11,12,14,15
Week 16-17: 20mg nolva + 50 mg aromasin
Week 18-19: 20mg nova + 30 mg aromasin

If this looks OK, should I start aromasin in week 11 with my HCG? I havent used any AI during the cycle, so my estrogenlevels should be pretty high by then.

Thx.

[WARMachine]

6 1/2 weeks out in my test-E 500mg cycle it seems I'm now able to get what i need of HCG, clomid, aromasin and arimidex, in addition to my nolvadex. And so i got a couple questions.

HCG is a bit late, since i shouldve used it through the whole cycle, but wasn't available. Should I still do 500 iu's 2 times a week for the last 4 weeks of my cycle? (Week 11 and 12, and then 13 and 14 while waiting for PCT)

What do you think would be the best PCT? Most places I read I find that nolva+clomid is a waste, that nolva is enough. Maybe something like this(?):
HCG week 11,12,14,15
Week 16-17: 20mg nolva + 50 mg aromasin
Week 18-19: 20mg nova + 30 mg aromasin

If this looks OK, should I start aromasin in week 11 with my HCG? I havent used any AI during the cycle, so my estrogenlevels should be pretty high by then.

Thx.

I dont know what other places people are seeing this, but its not true.


Clomid does things Nolvadex cannot! Both SERMS should be included in any PCT.

And yes, in your particular case, an AI would be a welcome addition.

However, for people who run an AI on cycle, there isnt a need for one while on PCT.

[shabby]

Hmm, I see. Last place I read was the sticky on PCT "PCT by Steroid.com " by Pinnacle. Quote:

Although both Nolvadex and Clomid are both SERMs, they are actually quite different. As you already know, Nolvadex is highly anti-estrogenic at the hypothalamus and pituitary, while Clomid exhibits weak estrogenic activity at the pituitary (7), which as you can guess, is less than ideal. It should be avoided for the PCT I’m suggesting…and in fact, avoided in general…it’s simply not as good as Nolvadex.
Need I even add that the 150mgs of Clomid you need to get the hormonal increase experienced with 20mgs of Nolvadex is much more expensive? So lets dump the Clomid…and no, using it along with Nolvadex will provide no “synergy” that I’ve ever seen in any relevant study.

This is like the one subject that most of you disagree. Besides, I also thought about liver toxicity, with using both nolva and clomid. Thanks for help.

[Swifto]

6 1/2 weeks out in my test-E 500mg cycle it seems I'm now able to get what i need of HCG, clomid, aromasin and arimidex, in addition to my nolvadex. And so i got a couple questions.

HCG is a bit late, since i shouldve used it through the whole cycle, but wasn't available. Should I still do 500 iu's 2 times a week for the last 4 weeks of my cycle? (Week 11 and 12, and then 13 and 14 while waiting for PCT)

What do you think would be the best PCT? Most places I read I find that nolva+clomid is a waste, that nolva is enough. Maybe something like this(?):

HCG week 11,12,14,15
Week 16-17: 20mg nolva + 50 mg aromasin
Week 18-19: 20mg nova + 30 mg aromasin

If this looks OK, should I start aromasin in week 11 with my HCG? I havent used any AI during the cycle, so my estrogenlevels should be pretty high by then.

Thx.

500ius/ED 10-15 days out from PCT with an AI (Arimidex 0.5mg/ED or Aromaisn 10mg/EOD).

PCT with Clomid, Tamox, Tore. Choose any 2.

[WARMachine]

Hmm, I see. Last place I read was the sticky on PCT "PCT by Steroid.com " by Pinnacle. Quote:

Although both Nolvadex and Clomid are both SERMs, they are actually quite different. As you already know, Nolvadex is highly anti-estrogenic at the hypothalamus and pituitary, while Clomid exhibits weak estrogenic activity at the pituitary (7), which as you can guess, is less than ideal. It should be avoided for the PCT I’m suggesting…and in fact, avoided in general…it’s simply not as good as Nolvadex.
Need I even add that the 150mgs of Clomid you need to get the hormonal increase experienced with 20mgs of Nolvadex is much more expensive? So lets dump the Clomid…and no, using it along with Nolvadex will provide no “synergy” that I’ve ever seen in any relevant study.

This is like the one subject that most of you disagree. Besides, I also thought about liver toxicity, with using both nolva and clomid. Thanks for help.

Addvocating not using Clomid at all is just plain wrong IMO. can do things that Nolvadex cannot.

Case in point is the following. Taken from Pheeno's PCT Sticky.


Quote:
[i]"Now IMO, selective estrogen receptor modulators(SERMs) such as Clomiphine and Tamoxifen are selective to which tissues they bind too. Clomid being selective to the suprapituitary, while Tamox is selective to breast, bone, and liver ERs. I've come to this conclusion based on the comparison of studies on both SERMs. In every study showing benefit to HPTA from tamoxifin, the duration of the administration is 3-12months(This includes studies cited by William Llewellyn in his Nolva vs Clomid article). In studies showing levels of LH, FSH, and Testosterone checked after short durations of tamox, they were either insignificant, or their was an actual drop. I believe this is because tamox selectively works at the mammery(as well as bone and liver), thus taking longer for LH stimulation to occur. With clomid, benefit to gonadotrophin concentrations, LH, FSH, and serum testosterone can be seen in short periods of 2-6wks. Because of the apparent selective nature of the two, and given our usual PCT duration, clomid is by far superior at LH stimulation than Nolva. Now both is the wise choice for a couple of reasons:

1. Nolva acts as the preventive measure to the estrogen flux occured PC while clomid is the primary LH stimulator(Even more so in the case an AI is not used).
2. If your running a longer PCT, clomid needs to be discontinued after a while as it has been shown to desensitize GnRH, this due, IMO, to it's selective nature to the suprapituitary...


Follow thus far?

Here is yet another case and point.

In just 7 days of Clomid use at 100mgs ED is enough to raise LH and FSH by as much as 50%. You will need nolva also, as the point of these serms is to block estrogen receptors in the HPTA to fool it, and to tell the pituitary to start producing it's own LH and FSH. (Will find the supporting study asap.)



I agree with Swifto.

Pick two SERMS.

Nolva
Clomid
Tam


http://forums.steroid.com/showthread.php?t=379916

Read post 1 and 4

[shabby]

Alright, man. Thanks

I'll go with clomid 50/50/50/50 and nolva 20/20/20/20. 100mg and 40mg first day. Going to start using HCG as soon as i get my hands on it, too.

[WARMachine]

There you go buddy