Sensible, knowledgable perspective req'd.

[TLrugby]

After much research on product, discussion and prices, I have come up with the following cycle and would appreciate some feedback:

Goals: gain 10lbs lean mass with strength. Workouts focus on sport-specific lifting and conditioning. A lot of olympic lifts.

Stats:
36 male
5'9"
185 lbs
12% bf (thigh, chest, love-handle, tri-cep caliper test)
15yrs competitive sport and lifting

Concerns: too much mass for size (increase in potential injury) appropriate pct, hair loss (job needs hair although apparently proper pct would apparently minimize concerns)

Cycle: test p/primo with clomid pct

weeks 1-10 50mg test prop, eod
weeks 1-8 primo, every five days (expensive)

weeks 13-17 clomid 75/50/50/25

Comments? Thank you in advance.
TR

[BennyLom]

A few comments:

1.) You would want to run Test @ 8 weeks OR increase the dose from week 8-10.

2.) Why Test P and not Test E (seems the better choice as far as injections goes)

3.) Why Primobolan? You mention it you think it's expensive but are you even sure you are even getting real product? According to "Anabolics 2009" (even 2006 edition), Primobolan is only made by Schering and withdrawn from most(all?) markets. I would assume any vial you buy to be fake or UGL. And you should not pay much for UGL so your comment about price is confusing... You would probably achieve goal without Primobolan anyways.

4.) Clomid for PCT is not enough if you want to do this proper. I will be using both Clomid, Nolvadex,(Proviron) and hCG. Read more and get the right gear man --dont risk your future healh!

[TLrugby]

A few comments:

Thanks Benny, please see comments below..TR

1.) You would want to run Test @ 8 weeks OR increase the dose from week 8-10. Understandable... I thought that with only 50mg per shot, 10 weeks would be a good go. But as long as "8 is enough", I'd rather go 50mg eod for only eight weeks!

2.) Why Test P and not Test E (seems the better choice as far as injections goes) Test P acts faster and leaves system faster... also less water retention. I suppose this is more of a cutting cycle.

3.) Why Primobolan? You mention it you think it's expensive but are you even sure you are even getting real product? According to "Anabolics 2009" (even 2006 edition), Primobolan is only made by Schering and withdrawn from most(all?) markets. I would assume any vial you buy to be fake or UGL. And you should not pay much for UGL so your comment about price is confusing... You would probably achieve goal without Primobolan anyways.

I like what I've read about primo. I could get pharma grade but way too expensive so have opted for underground. I also read a post on another site about a test p/primo/var cycle that seemed to be well set up. My only difference is that the amounts are much less (and no var)

4.) Clomid for PCT is not enough if you want to do this proper. I will be using both Clomid, Nolvadex,(Proviron) and hCG. Read more and get the right gear man --dont risk your future healh!

Would clomid 4 weeks @ 50mg/ed be better than the pyramid? Looking at the amounts that I have set up to cycle, I wouldn't think that all three are necessary. I appreciate your concerns and look fwd to your reply.

[rcmf5525]

Check out this thread on PCTs... I found it very informative and well cited...

http://forums.steroid.com/showthread.php?t=209758

I think Prop sounds like the best of the three Test variants, if you can handle injections every day. Oil based is not so bad, but if you ever use water based winstrol, you will hate life... But the prop is oil based, so it wont hurt that bad...

[TLrugby]

Great discussion on PCT and a lot to put to thought. This is a work in progress... some refining is needed.
Any other comments on the cycle and dosage from anyone?

TR

[TLrugby]

With the numerous opinions concerning primo, how could I match up the following with var?

test p 50mg eod for eight weeks...

I was all set to get the primo but am considering otherwise (despite quality assurances from UGL...long-time supplier)

Please advise

[TLrugby]

Any other opinions?

[peachfuzz]

With the numerous opinions concerning primo, how could I match up the following with var?

test p 50mg eod for eight weeks...

I was all set to get the primo but am considering otherwise (despite quality assurances from UGL...long-time supplier)

Please advise

This was going to be my input.

you could do 8 weeks of test p at 50mg ED with 40-70mg of Var for 8 weeks as well. for your goals and concerns i think this would be your best bet. post cycle starts 3 days after last injection and 50mg of clomid with 20mg of nolvadex would do you well.

now a couple questions/comments

is this your first cycle?

are you prone to MPB? are you losing hair already?

water retention can easily be negated no matter which ester you choose to run. dont let it be your deciding factor in using prop as opposed to a longer ester.

[michael tyson]

your work needs hair? im interested to know what your occupation is. hair club?

[Swifto]

I'd go with Test Prop and Winstrol for 8 weeks. Test Prop 100mg/EOD with Winstrol 50mg/EOD or ED. Whatever you can afford.

Primo needs to be run for atleast 10 weeks due to its ester. That would be to get optimal results. And if you spend the money on Primo, you'll want the best results.

wk 1-8 Test Prop 100mg/EOD
wk 1-8 Winstrol Inject 50mg/EOD
*HCG 250ius 2x week
* Arimidex 0.5mg/EOD OR Aromasin 10mg/EOD

PCT

wk 1-2 Clomid 50mg/ED
wk 2-5 Clomid 25mg/ED
wk 1-5 Tamox 20mg/ED

[stpete]

^^^^^ Solid cycle and pct.

[peachfuzz]

I'd go with Test Prop and Winstrol for 8 weeks. Test Prop 100mg/EOD with Winstrol 50mg/EOD or ED. Whatever you can afford.

Primo needs to be run for atleast 10 weeks due to its ester. That would be to get optimal results. And if you spend the money on Primo, you'll want the best results.

wk 1-8 Test Prop 100mg/EOD
wk 1-8 Winstrol Inject 50mg/EOD
*HCG 250ius 2x week
* Arimidex 0.5mg/EOD OR Aromasin 10mg/EOD

PCT

wk 1-2 Clomid 50mg/ED
wk 2-5 Clomid 25mg/ED
wk 1-5 Tamox 20mg/ED

This is a good cycle as well but with hairloss being a concern i still say opt for the var.