First Cycle .PCT Question.

[Aiwa]

Hello ALL

I've been researching steroids for about 1 year, I've been trying to educate myself on the subject of AAS :diffrent websites,articles,book(Anabolics 2006) etc.. Why? I love bodybuilding and am ready to take it to the next step. I've been lifting since I was 16-years-old from school.

Currently i work out 4 days per week and my diet ( 7 meals per day-3 protein shakes ) is in check.I have been progressing steadily since i starting lifting, started out at 110 lbs, currently am 165 lbs and went as high as the 180s.

Here is my proposed first cycle.

Testosterone Enanthate - Weeks 1 - 10 (500 mg per week)
Nolvadex - Weeks 12-16 (40/20/20/20/20)

(All items are from a Pharmacy)


Test. ,hCG & Nolvadex can be bought without a pescription from a pharmacy in my country,for Clomid a pescription is needed.


QUESTION:

1.Will a Nolvadex PCT alone be adequate for PCT,have any of you personally tried this?

2.How about running hCG during the the cycle or including it in the PCT along wit the Nolvadex?

I plan on doing a cycle in March of next year, and when that time comes i will be doing blood tests before and after the cycle.The main reason for the above questions is cost, Clomid is very expensive almost 70% of the cost of the Test. .The Nolvadex and hCG are relatively cheap and other items like Arimidex,and other types of Test, are non existant.

If Clomid has to be included in the PCT it will be done,i am just wodering if i can get the same results from a Nolvadex PCT or Nolvadex/hCg.


Any input will be most welcomed.

[yungone501]

What are your stats bro?

[ottomaddox]

Age?
Height?
Weight?
yrs training?
etc?????

[Aiwa]

Age:22
Height:5ft
Weight:165
yrs training:7

what else do you need to know?

pics of me now

[BJJ]

Hello ALL

I've been researching steroids for about 1 year, I've been trying to educate myself on the subject of AAS :diffrent websites,articles,book(Anabolics 2006) etc.. Why? I love bodybuilding and am ready to take it to the next step. I've been lifting since I was 16-years-old from school.

Currently i work out 4 days per week and my diet ( 7 meals per day-3 protein shakes ) is in check.I have been progressing steadily since i starting lifting, started out at 110 lbs, currently am 165 lbs and went as high as the 180s.

Here is my proposed first cycle.

Testosterone Enanthate - Weeks 1 - 10 (500 mg per week)
Nolvadex - Weeks 12-16 (40/20/20/20/20)

(All items are from a Pharmacy)


Test. ,hCG & Nolvadex can be bought without a pescription from a pharmacy in my country,for Clomid a pescription is needed.


QUESTION:

1.Will a Nolvadex PCT alone be adequate for PCT,have any of you personally tried this?

2.How about running hCG during the the cycle or including it in the PCT along wit the Nolvadex?

I plan on doing a cycle in March of next year, and when that time comes i will be doing blood tests before and after the cycle.The main reason for the above questions is cost, Clomid is very expensive almost 70% of the cost of the Test. .The Nolvadex and hCG are relatively cheap and other items like Arimidex,and other types of Test, are non existant.

If Clomid has to be included in the PCT it will be done,i am just wodering if i can get the same results from a Nolvadex PCT or Nolvadex/hCg.


Any input will be most welcomed.

Nolvadex should be started at week 13 (40/40/20/20).
Nobody can tell you how your body will respond so clomid should be on hand because, probably, you are going to need it.
Good call for the blood work, you are the very first one I read who is including bw in his schedule.

In any case, since you are only 22, I advise you not to cycle at all yet.
First reach your own genetic limit, then in a few years from now, you may consider aas.

[ottomaddox]

Wait till at least untill 25 years old and the endocrine system has been fully matured before cycling. Forget about all the shakes and replace with real food.

[Aiwa]

Nolvadex should be started at week 13 (40/40/20/20).
Nobody can tell you how your body will respond so clomid should be on hand because, probably, you are going to need it.
Good call for the blood work, you are the very first one I read who is including bw in his schedule.

In any case, since you are only 22, I advise you not to cycle at all yet.
First reach your own genetic limit, then in a few years from now, you may consider aas.

Thank you for your quick response.

When you say clomid should be on hand,do you mean it must be included in PCT?like in a traditional Clomid/Nolva PCT e.g
Nolvadex - 40/20/20/20/20 (week 13-17)
Clomid - 100/100/50 (week 13-15)

For bloodwork I think we should all do it to insure our health,we put hours and hours of research into AAS to protect our health, to me it does not make sense not to get the bloodwork after investing all those hours.

Going on a cycle is not set in stone , i am still open to trying more diffrent approaches to training and diet to improve my body.

What age did you start?

[marcus300]

In humans your Endocrine system is not fully functional until an average age of 25yrs, although the main development is up to around 21yrs it still fluctuates a little bit up to its fully functional age. There is a risk of permanently damaging your HPTA if you take AAS to young and you could end up with symptoms of andropause and HRT for life. Symptoms could be Limp dick, low libido, depression, low energy, low endurance, erection problems and many more but.......are these the types of symptoms you want to have in your 20's?. Believe me its hard to cope with these in your 40's yet alone in your prime of your life.

Around this age your Testosterone levels are the highest they going to be in your life naturally, so use what you have and don't take the risk of damage, I am passionate about this because ive seen it many times with young kids wanting to looking like their heroes and they think the answer is in an injection/tablet.

Taking AAS to young can also cause problems with development, one other main problem is premature sealing of your epiphyeal bone and the consequences mean that you wont grow as big as your genetics could allow you to, there is a test which can be done to see if your growth plates have sealed yet but the average age is around 21yrs old.



TRAINING
You need a few years of hard training under your belt before even considering taking any kind of anabolic support, people who jump on a cycle to soon without having some quality years under their belt usually results in injuries, it takes time to develop your connective tissue, tendons and nervous system to heavy overload training. Slowly getting your own system use to these kinds of extreme's will only help in muscle growth later on when you do decide to start taking AAS.

Build a solid foundation for muscle tissue to grow and maintaining and development will be far greater than without it. Many younger guys will start cycling before they have reached their genetic potential which is crazy when a good solid diet and training program will be far beneficial and productive to muscle building.

Workouts should be mainly focused on basic movements with a priority of over loading the muscle each and ever time you train, increasing your strength and ability to lift in proper form will help with building the foundation for future development


DIET
A lot of younger bodybuilders don't know how to eat. Researching and understanding how your own body responds will help you get to your natural limit, the right food at the right time and a full understanding of proteins,carbs, and fats will only help you succeed in achieving your natural goals. Keeping a diet diary will also help you understand the importance of macro, nutrients, calories and should help you see in which areas you could be going wrong in adding lean muscle tissue.

No matter how much anabolic support you have it will be worthless without proper nutrition, food will help build and maintain your valued muscle weather its natural, cycling or in PCT. Adjusting your food intake and consuming muscle building foods coupled with a solid training program will help you achieve your natural limit and foundation before you start AAS use.

This area is a huge problem with the younger guys and I can't express enough how important diet/food is when first starting out, post and pre training nutrition are very important and understanding how to load and feed the body will help push growth and create a very natural anabolic environment

[ottomaddox]

Thank you, that's what I was trying to get at, but I like your description better.
Peace.

In humans your Endocrine system is not fully functional until an average age of 25yrs, although the main development is up to around 21yrs it still fluctuates a little bit up to its fully functional age. There is a risk of permanently damaging your HPTA if you take AAS to young and you could end up with symptoms of andropause and HRT for life. Symptoms could be Limp dick, low libido, depression, low energy, low endurance, erection problems and many more but.......are these the types of symptoms you want to have in your 20's?. Believe me its hard to cope with these in your 40's yet alone in your prime of your life.

Around this age your Testosterone levels are the highest they going to be in your life naturally, so use what you have and don't take the risk of damage, I am passionate about this because ive seen it many times with young kids wanting to looking like their heroes and they think the answer is in an injection/tablet.

Taking AAS to young can also cause problems with development, one other main problem is premature sealing of your epiphyeal bone and the consequences mean that you wont grow as big as your genetics could allow you to, there is a test which can be done to see if your growth plates have sealed yet but the average age is around 21yrs old.



TRAINING
You need a few years of hard training under your belt before even considering taking any kind of anabolic support, people who jump on a cycle to soon without having some quality years under their belt usually results in injuries, it takes time to develop your connective tissue, tendons and nervous system to heavy overload training. Slowly getting your own system use to these kinds of extreme's will only help in muscle growth later on when you do decide to start taking AAS.

Build a solid foundation for muscle tissue to grow and maintaining and development will be far greater than without it. Many younger guys will start cycling before they have reached their genetic potential which is crazy when a good solid diet and training program will be far beneficial and productive to muscle building.

Workouts should be mainly focused on basic movements with a priority of over loading the muscle each and ever time you train, increasing your strength and ability to lift in proper form will help with building the foundation for future development


DIET
A lot of younger bodybuilders don't know how to eat. Researching and understanding how your own body responds will help you get to your natural limit, the right food at the right time and a full understanding of proteins,carbs, and fats will only help you succeed in achieving your natural goals. Keeping a diet diary will also help you understand the importance of macro, nutrients, calories and should help you see in which areas you could be going wrong in adding lean muscle tissue.

No matter how much anabolic support you have it will be worthless without proper nutrition, food will help build and maintain your valued muscle weather its natural, cycling or in PCT. Adjusting your food intake and consuming muscle building foods coupled with a solid training program will help you achieve your natural limit and foundation before you start AAS use.

This area is a huge problem with the younger guys and I can't express enough how important diet/food is when first starting out, post and pre training nutrition are very important and understanding how to load and feed the body will help push growth and create a very natural anabolic environment

[yungone501]

I believe Marcus keeps this on a 'copy & paste' reserve.

[marcus300]

Same old questions deserve the same old reply, its there in the stickies but people dont read them, instead they look for what they want to hear!

[BJJ]

Same old questions deserve the same old reply, its there in the stickies but people dont read them, instead they look for what they want to hear!

Exactly.

[yungone501]

Marcus, it's nice to see someone fighting an endless battle with such deligence.

[BJJ]

Thank you for your quick response.

When you say clomid should be on hand,do you mean it must be included in PCT?like in a traditional Clomid/Nolva PCT e.g
Nolvadex - 40/20/20/20/20 (week 13-17)
Clomid - 100/100/50 (week 13-15)

For bloodwork I think we should all do it to insure our health,we put hours and hours of research into AAS to protect our health, to me it does not make sense not to get the bloodwork after investing all those hours.

Going on a cycle is not set in stone , i am still open to trying more diffrent approaches to training and diet to improve my body.

What age did you start?

I am not a fan of traditional pct in the way that a person must have his own blood work done before and at the end of the bulking cycle to observe his personal situation and act accordingly regarding the pct, IMO.
Said that, from what I have read and studied so far, a pct made by only nolva after a cycle of a long ester like test en, is a week pct. It could be enough but probably it will not.
After a 10/12 weeks cycle on test en, you may want a standard pct on schedule, like clomid 100/100/50/50 and nolva 40/40/20/20.
By comparing your blood works, you may change your lined pct at a later time. But it is a must to have both drugs, taking into account also toremifene.

I started at 36 but my idea was to start at 30. I awaited though, because I knew I did not yet reach my genetic limit naturally.

So, since you wrote your cycle is not set in stone, read what, not only myself, but also other members more experienced than me in this environment, have advised you... and do the right thing.

[Aiwa]

In humans your Endocrine system is not fully functional until an average age of 25yrs, although the main development is up to around 21yrs it still fluctuates a little bit up to its fully functional age. There is a risk of permanently damaging your HPTA if you take AAS to young and you could end up with symptoms of andropause and HRT for life. Symptoms could be Limp dick, low libido, depression, low energy, low endurance, erection problems and many more but.......are these the types of symptoms you want to have in your 20's?. Believe me its hard to cope with these in your 40's yet alone in your prime of your life.

Around this age your Testosterone levels are the highest they going to be in your life naturally, so use what you have and don't take the risk of damage, I am passionate about this because ive seen it many times with young kids wanting to looking like their heroes and they think the answer is in an injection/tablet.

Taking AAS to young can also cause problems with development, one other main problem is premature sealing of your epiphyeal bone and the consequences mean that you wont grow as big as your genetics could allow you to, there is a test which can be done to see if your growth plates have sealed yet but the average age is around 21yrs old.



TRAINING
You need a few years of hard training under your belt before even considering taking any kind of anabolic support, people who jump on a cycle to soon without having some quality years under their belt usually results in injuries, it takes time to develop your connective tissue, tendons and nervous system to heavy overload training. Slowly getting your own system use to these kinds of extreme's will only help in muscle growth later on when you do decide to start taking AAS.

Build a solid foundation for muscle tissue to grow and maintaining and development will be far greater than without it. Many younger guys will start cycling before they have reached their genetic potential which is crazy when a good solid diet and training program will be far beneficial and productive to muscle building.

Workouts should be mainly focused on basic movements with a priority of over loading the muscle each and ever time you train, increasing your strength and ability to lift in proper form will help with building the foundation for future development


DIET
A lot of younger bodybuilders don't know how to eat. Researching and understanding how your own body responds will help you get to your natural limit, the right food at the right time and a full understanding of proteins,carbs, and fats will only help you succeed in achieving your natural goals. Keeping a diet diary will also help you understand the importance of macro, nutrients, calories and should help you see in which areas you could be going wrong in adding lean muscle tissue.

No matter how much anabolic support you have it will be worthless without proper nutrition, food will help build and maintain your valued muscle weather its natural, cycling or in PCT. Adjusting your food intake and consuming muscle building foods coupled with a solid training program will help you achieve your natural limit and foundation before you start AAS use.

This area is a huge problem with the younger guys and I can't express enough how important diet/food is when first starting out, post and pre training nutrition are very important and understanding how to load and feed the body will help push growth and create a very natural anabolic environment

Man i really do appreciate your responces.Are the negative effects you mentioned common for the average steroid user,i understand there are risks in using steroids too young .My understaning is these effects are dose,type and cycle lenght dependant,I have no experience using these compounds,and i do not know anyone that uses them, i am still learning and these forums are the only place i can ask questions about steroids.

Is the probaiblity of screwing up ones Endocrine system that high for a one 10 week cycle of test.? I know everybody responds diffrently and i might be the one that these things can happen to but is it that common?

I will be 23 in january next year and i have been training 7 going on to 8 years,for the last 5 years i have really started training and eating seriously after doing a lot of research on nutrition and training. I started extremely skinny and over the years i have progressed nicely, the last year or so has been some what dissapointing in that i look in the mirror and see hardly any changes .

I eat my 2g of protein per lb of bodweight ,eat every 2.5 hours and i truly give it everything in the gym and out, i make sure i get 8 hours of sleep, i dont drink or smoke or do any rec. drug. It is frustrating when you put so much into something for so long and get results in increments.

I dont think because someone using steroids you don't have to work out as hard if anything it should make it more motivated to workout harder.

You guys are the ones with the first hand experience an i appreciate you sharing your knowledge,after all i am hear to learn.

Pics of me when i started out in 2002 ,2007, an current.

[Aiwa]

Current

[Aiwa]

I am not a fan of traditional pct in the way that a person must have his own blood work done before and at the end of the bulking cycle to observe his personal situation and act accordingly regarding the pct, IMO.
Said that, from what I have read and studied so far, a pct made by only nolva after a cycle of a long ester like test en, is a week pct. It could be enough but probably it will not.
After a 10/12 weeks cycle on test en, you may want a standard pct on schedule, like clomid 100/100/50/50 and nolva 40/40/20/20.
By comparing your blood works, you may change your lined pct at a later time. But it is a must to have both drugs, taking into account also toremifene.

I started at 36 but my idea was to start at 30. I awaited though, because I knew I did not yet reach my genetic limit naturally.

So, since you wrote your cycle is not set in stone, read what, not only myself, but also other members more experienced than me in this environment, have advised you... and do the right thing.

What about hCG for a first cycle?

[BJJ]

I would not run it throughout but keep it on hand just in case.
Some people do not experience testicles shrinkage or they notice a little shrinkage and since it is your first cycle you may want to observe your body's reactions.

You can run it anyway, if using a long ester testosterone, in the two weeks just before your pct.

However, have a look at this thread and make up your mind:
http://forums.steroid.com/showthread.php?t=349581

[Aiwa]

I would not run it throughout but keep it on hand just in case.
Some people do not experience testicles shrinkage or they notice a little shrinkage and since it is your first cycle you may want to observe your body's reactions.

You can run it anyway, if using a long ester testosterone, in the two weeks just before your pct.

However, have a look at this thread and make up your mind:
http://forums.steroid.com/showthread.php?t=349581

Thanks everyone specially BJJ.

I have decided i will wait till i am 25 years to start a cycle, only 2 more years to go.

After marcus300 response about the endocrine system i started to do some more research and shit got a lot more confusing.

Question:

When i am 25 how will i know when my endocrine system is fully matured?

Is then when natural test starts to taper down? , if so what are the common levels for a 25 year old and if these levels correspond to levels when i am 24 or even 26 does this mean i am ready for a cycle?

I guess my question is how do you know when your Endocrine system has matured enough to start cycling?

[BJJ]

Thanks everyone specially BJJ.

I have decided i will wait till i am 25 years to start a cycle, only 2 more years to go.

After marcus300 response about the endocrine system i started to do some more research and shit got a lot more confusing.

Question:

When i am 25 how will i know when my endocrine system is fully matured?

Is then when natural test starts to taper down? , if so what are the common levels for a 25 year old and if these levels correspond to levels when i am 24 or even 26 does this mean i am ready for a cycle?

I guess my question is how do you know when your Endocrine system has matured enough to start cycling?

The only way, presently, is to run a biological age exam which will show you your correct age you are in. Then, you can only guess if your system have fully developed.
For example, I just ran those exams before my Oxandrolone cycle and gladly I was much younger than I am by considering my date of birth.
Unfortunately, those exams are very expensive.
If interested:

The concept of biological age and its relationship with the theories of the ageing:
In recent years, with the recovery of interest to the medical aspects and scientific the basis of the ageing and to the possibility of it through pharmacological interventions targeted, the concept of biological age has become a topic of conversation of great news. Here is that, in relation to the growing sophistication of the application of health, by the man in the road, from the questions: I have some disease hidden? are at risk for some disease? How can I do to remain in good health? It is passed to: what is my biological age? Can I rejuvenating?
The so-called biological age is a concept used frequently but so often vague and improper and with little objectivity to describe a difference between the eligibility of the average life of a cohort of individuals born in the same year and the eligibility of life perceived an individual in the same age. How can establish the biological age of a person? In general the impression immediate derived by the look of the face makes us able to judge if a certain person "is young" or "more old" with respect to its age. According to some authors the perception of the age of a subject or of its features in so apparently automatic, but it is in fact a consequence of the phenomena of learning related to sensory circuits, mental, cinestesici, in addition beliefs, thoughts and emotions. Moreover is common concept that understand the age of a person subject in the face cannot always be easy. Almost inevitably, you must use the use of observations more to less sophisticated indices physiological for which have extensive statistical bases in the general population.
To remove immediately possible misunderstandings must state that at the time has not been defined no standardized method and generally accepted quantify the biological age. Only for certain compartments of the body we currently have a sophisticated diagnostic methods instrumental non-invasive that allow, through the use of specific mathematical models of reference, to determine the biological age.
A typical case is that of biological age skin for which were developed sophisticated techniques based by torquemeter, spectrophotometry and analysis of image of microrelief skin. When instead we refer to biological age in a more global, then there are enormous problems of type methodology. If this quantification proves possible, its use would be unquestionable value, for example to assist the taking of informed decisions on appropriateness of invasive procedures or surgery, with less use criteria of mere subjectivity, or to give the individual a standard that allows him to project in a reliable its quality of life, or even its entitlement to life.
The inability to predict the eligibility of life in the single individual has interfered with the creation of the concept of biological age, even if the term was sometimes used in a subjective, with the complication that a patient seems more old or younger than in his age. The ageing can be regarded as a process multifactorial, which derives from interaction of factors genetic, environmental and living habits. In the course of the time many studies have been sent to the identification of biological events that could be attributable to progressive deterioration that occurs in conjunction with the ageing. Currently, one of more theories credited assumes that there is a common mechanism at the base of many diseases associated with ageing which affect several bodies. This theory is focused on primary role played by free radicals and provides a model plausible and general to explain the process of ageing.
The abstract start from the theory that aging and diseases associated with it are the result of damage caused by phenomenon of oxidative stress. This process is associated with one imbalance between the excessive production of oxidizing factors (such as free radicals) and a decrease in antioxidants defenses, that finally takes the form of damage to the body. According to the most modern theories aging is characterized by a state of chronic inflammation mild linked to genetic predisposition that innate alterations to the genetic heritage acquired by everyone in the course of his life for stochastic reasons and/or environmental.
This type of the inflammatory process can lead, in the long term, to impairment of organs and equipment thus to the reduction of the longevity, increasing the sensitivity to some risk factors. The diseases related to the age, such as Alzheimer’s, Parkinson’s disease, atherosclerosis, the type 2 diabetes, osteoporosis, begin to manifest themselves or be amplified by inflammation. For this reason the study of inflammation, and in particular the alteration in the production of cytokines that govern this process, is a frontier still little explored but very promising.

Estimation techniques of biological age by algorithms mathematical-statistics:
The difficulties involved in the determination of biological age through the examination direct and aims of the subject have urged the search of quantitative techniques to enable it to reach with lowest effort to a similar result, at least from the point of theory. The latter statement is of obligation because, in keeping with thermo-fee, no mathematical model, as sophisticated, substitute for direct observation of reality. Since there is a single method for estimating the biological age, may be useful in the first instance to operate a classification of the main methods available. In principle we can therefore distinguish two possible types of approach:
1) techniques that are trying to estimate, on the basis of some biological characteristics of the individual, the biological age that would be achieved by recourse to a methodology based on direct observation of the subject. These techniques are trying to build an algorithm in a position to imitate the best possible the process of awarding of biological age that would be a human being following a procedure empirical as those consolidated by legal medicine. This kind of techniques, are not generally be accompanied by instruments to test the validity of the standard that try to replicate. Have the problem that, even if it were possible to replicate perfectly the decision-making human allocation of biological age by a mathematical process, if it human fact, the process to be wrong would not be possible realizing it.
2) techniques which imply a definition of the concept of biological age, shall inform mathematics or statistics, in terms of a formal report with other biological characteristics of direct and possibly easy measurement in the individual. Since this report is used as note only in some of its aspects, in accordance with this approach will be first to use the data collected on a large number of individuals to specify the nature of this report, then use the mathematical formula so defined for the allocation of biological age of an individual on the basis of biological characteristics that were considered to be relevant for the purpose of its definition.

The validation of estimation techniques of biological age:
The techniques that are trying to estimate the biological age following the first approach are characterised by minor issues to validation. In fact, just take a group of individuals independent from that that was used for the construction of method validation, estimate for such individuals the biological age and compare it with the "true". Although this method of validation can hide thin pitfalls of a statistical nature, above all that linked to representativeness of the sample of validation and therefore the generalization of the results, it is undoubtedly equipped with an intrinsic and self-evident validity. Also, if properly conducted, allows to acquire information useful to improve the estimation method.
This is not the process of validation for technical of the second type. In this case, in fact, the biological age is directly defined in mathematical terms are looking for optimize a particular criteria with a rational generally explained by its application in which you want to use the estimated age. In such cases, therefore, it is to test the extent to which the algorithm of estimate has been able to optimize the criterion adopted, as its rational taken as valid prior.
The method of validation is very different from previous case since these techniques do not pose the objective to estimate a given that pre-is there to them but are seeking to satisfy the better, on the basis of the reality empirical, a precise criterion for optimality theoretical dictated by specific application for which is built the model. The validation is reduced to see how these techniques are able to extract from the real data an information that may be interpreted in terms of biological age.
As regards the approach of first type, the problem reduces "simply" in the construction of an algorithm able to replicate the performance of a human decision maker on the basis of a sample of individuals that is representative of the population of subject to which it will then apply the algorithm. For each of these individuals, therefore, must be available the biological age attributed by human decision maker and a number of variables within which to choose the most suitable for the construction of a predictive model.
The generalization of the results should be guaranteed, in the statistics, from the application of specific sampling plans based on random mechanisms to prevent, at least in terms probabilistic, to build a model not extensible to persons other than those that entered in the sample. This is therefore not extraneous to the algorithm predictive in itself, for which it is assumed that the representativeness of the sample used for its construction has been suitably ensured by appropriate practice of selection of individuals.
The regression techniques of origin may indeed be accompanied statistical methodologies as neural networks that can see their genesis in many theoretical contexts, more than applications, or hybrid solutions that draw separate from methodological deans but can be properly integrated in the light of their complementarity. A very classic is that of the application to appropriate statistical techniques to support the construction neural models. The framework can be then supplemented by more sophisticated algorithms as the support vector regression, the regression trees, the techniques based on whole populations (ensambles) of models show in place of one, as the bagging or the effect.
The situation is very different and more heterogeneous for the approach of a second type, for which we will just to submit briefly only some experiences we consider particularly representative of this second mode and useful to introduce our algorithm of calculation. A solution well characterized along the lines of second approach is based on observation that the value of the laboratory of many biomarkers tending to decrease in an approximately linear way the advance in age; authors have built a system of determination of biological age based on simple models of linear regression constructed from from the figures in 16 biomarkers.
This technique not only allows to estimate the biological age, but even before it from an implicit definition that follows the particular statistical report identified between age, biological age and value of biomarkers selected, as is characteristic of the approaches of the second type. The study in question has its interest not so much in the use of regression, but in its use in a manner not technically banal and in the construction very glossy of rational on the basis of which is built the model proposed.
The research mentioned above are particularly significant from our point of view, because even in our algorithm of calculation are widely use of models of regression. Also, very important to our eyes is the condition that the biomarkers expressed therein are determined on healthy people for the purpose of construction of the model, as the state of health plays a crucial role in our algorithm. Closely linked to experience structured around the models of regression are different searches based on measures of correlation, since they relate to a similar context and in many cases prodrome to that of regression. Investigations very complex from the point of view of the statistical methodology were based on analysis techniques of the factors and other methodologies from it derived.
In this context, the most famous and sophisticated is Nakamura based in large part on the lisrel methodology, which may be considered a sort of widespread common analysis of factors. In this search is done a survey with a very extensive information on the basis of 9 biomarkers selected by a group of 25, time to clarify the plot of relationships between these measures and the concept of biological age that have not to be limited to its simple quantification, which in reality is not between the declared purposes of work but that may be obtained from the model.

This is the list:

1. D-ROMs (REACTIVE OXYGEN METABOLITES) Test {blood}
2. OXI-Adsorbent Test {blood}
3. EICOSANOIDS Test {blood}
4. ALCAT Test (ANTIGEN LEUKOCYTE CELLULAR ANTIBODY TEST) {blood}
5. DISBIOSI Test {urine}
6. 8-OH-2DG {urine}
7. HOMOCYSTEINE {blood}
8. MELATONIN SULPHATE {urine}
9. Vitamin A Measuring {blood}
10. Vitamin E Measuring {blood}

The testosterone range in males is from 437 to 707 ng/dl. In any case, it may differ from different labs.

[Aiwa]

The only way, presently, is to run a biological age exam which will show you your correct age you are in. Then, you can only guess if your system have fully developed.
For example, I just ran those exams before my Oxandrolone cycle and gladly I was much younger than I am by considering my date of birth.
Unfortunately, those exams are very expensive.
.

Man,this is complex.

So if i am 25yrs i can still only guess if my system is fully developed?

I know the endocrine system deals with the secretion of many hormones that transfer information from one set of cells to another,

What is it that makes for a fully developed/fully functional system, is it the amount of hormones that is secreted .The state/age? of the glands: pituitary gland, hypothalamus, pancreas, thyroid gland,testes etc. ??

Thanks.

[Aiwa]

^^

Any one care to share their opinions..