should anybody be cycling if they cant see their abs?

[Shredded1]

I've heard you shouldnt cycle if you cant see your abs (meaning higher BF) because you'll have more side effects than gains. Is this true?

[BiggerByTheDay]

Several threads address this. In fact, two threads below this one there is one titled "Higher bf% cycling experience?" However, I will address your question anyway. When cycling at a higher bf%, you run a higher risk for getting gyno, higher blood pressure, retaining far more water, and looking like (as stated in the aforementioned thread) the Michelin Man. Therefore, the answer to your question is yes.

[Bertuzzi]

Is this hypothetical..... or is this for you??

[Shredded1]

Is this hypothetical..... or is this for you??

purely hypothetical, im cutting right now because my bf is too high from my last cycle.

[nwjt]

You can use test to lose fat:



PLEASE READ OUR RULES *admin*

[Bertuzzi]

You can use test to lose fat:

oh great.....

[nwjt]

oh great.....

You do realize test promotes fat loss, and one of the symptoms of low T is in fact, fat gain?

Let me guess, you have another icon.

[Bertuzzi]

You do realize test promotes fat loss, and one of the symptoms of low T is in fact, fat gain?

Let me guess, you have another icon.

Yes, I do realize that but thank you for the insight. That is no excuse to use test at higher bf %. You are giving advice way out of context my friend.... and thats all I am saying. Icon..... just for you

[Bertuzzi]

Sorry... I apologize, not only was it out of context it was also very vague and may be taken the wrong way for user who are not as knowledgeable as your fine self. So please if you are going to give advice like that..... please be more detailed so it is not misconstrued.

Thanks

[anabolix112]

I've heard you shouldnt cycle if you cant see your abs (meaning higher BF) because you'll have more side effects than gains. Is this true?

Heh. Depends ofcourse the nature of your cycle.

Not that much of the side effects but for example GH cycle would go pretty much into vain for example since you want to get maximum outcome of such expensive thing and theres cheaper ways to get the hindered effects which can be expected when GH cycle is being ran with obesity.

Then again what has been allready said if you keep to basics and propably monitor your health during that suggested cycle you might even get pretty good outcome what comes to sides/gains ratio and avoid problems that come with the excess fat you might had carried before the little miracle which might also encourage to keep that up but not relaying to chemicals only.

Its true that many substances make the best gains what comes to muscle mass when you start being ripped and are willing to feed yourself but then again some people carrying bit extra might actually have pretty good genes and appetite and combined with some base on training and self knowledge, training without those supplements for long enough they might actually be able to achieve awesome results. Not to mention that being fat and bit bloated and training does also stretch or have also stretched the fascia that makes somewhat easier for muscles to grow. Well still i think people who haven't learned how to do diet without propably should not do AAS before little selfeducation. But then again we are adults with our own goals. You just have to make your choices and take responsibility of causes.

[PC650]

i can only see my top two abs and ive been cycling for about 5 years now...

[NotSmall]

I'm confused - it seems to have done this chap the world of good...

[Morgoth]

It depends on what compound you are cycling. For instance, Aanvar burns fat and is used as a cutting steroid. If you are cycling Anavar, I would say you can do it on a higher body fat if your goal is to cut.

[VanillaGorilla1]

I definitely wouldn't say 'dont use steroids if you can't see your abs', that's a little foolish. The potential side effects are a higher risk if you're carrying extra fat, yes. However, not everyone is training to have a six pack. I know lots of guys who strictly train for strength and that's why they're on AAS, and they've got no abs that's for sure. It depends what you're taking and what you're training for.

[fattywarbucks]

Ad definition and shape are largely genetic. Low bodyfat doesn't always mean six pack.
That said, starting a cycle with a low bf is good advice. So is wiping your ass front to back. Doesn't mean you have to.

[Shredded1]

It depends on what compound you are cycling. For instance, Aanvar burns fat and is used as a cutting steroid. If you are cycling Anavar, I would say you can do it on a higher body fat if your goal is to cut.

true, I agree with you there, but for people at 15-20% BF who insist that they need to bulk with test or other aromatizing steroids is amazing to me. Most of the weight gained will be more BF, hence you should get leaner before you bulk.

[Shredded1]

ad definition and shape are largely genetic. Low bodyfat doesn't always mean six pack.
That said, starting a cycle with a low bf is good advice. So is wiping your ass front to back. Doesn't mean you have to.

And the funniest thing i've heard today goes to: fattywarbucks! come on down. aha

[uerbdon]

Plenty of power lifters use AAS. I don't see a ton of power lifters with a 6 pack...

[Shredded1]

Plenty of power lifters use AAS. I don't see a ton of power lifters with a 6 pack...

true, but how many people who come to this board who have a 15% bf and ask what cycle they should be taking are powerlifters? Be realistic, the majority of people who come and ask for a good first cycle are the ones who want a better looking body and arent willing to put the time or work into a good diet and/or cardio. Also, a powerlifter doesnt care about how his body looks, the majority on this forum are BODYBUILDERS or amateurs that want to become one, so the way they look DOES matter.

And btw, the good ones you can see SOME of their abs. They're in better shape than the slobs who call themselves powerlifters.

[steakline]

Thanks for this will for sure get my BF down before I start now.

[anabolix112]

Ok lets end this discussion here, great athlete, great abs but dunno about cycling.
Should you be watching your own abs that much anyway when you can get in that shape without:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Am03RKhyA8c

[Shredded1]

Ok lets end this discussion here, great athlete, great abs but dunno about cycling.
Should you be watching your own abs that much anyway when you can get in that shape without:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Am03RKhyA8c

That's a dumb statement but I do like the video No shit he isn't watching his abs because he can't....but he's probably feeling them, or someone else is telling him about his progress. Just because he can't see them doesn't mean he neglects them.

BTW, no one said you couldn't get in shape and get abs without steroids, that's EXACTLY what we are saying you should do before you touch AAS so estro side effects and fat gains are lessened to a large degree. So im confused why you said that...

[anabolix112]

That's a dumb statement but I do like the video No shit he isn't watching his abs because he can't....but he's probably feeling them, or someone else is telling him about his progress. Just because he can't see them doesn't mean he neglects them.

BTW, no one said you couldn't get in shape and get abs without steroids, that's EXACTLY what we are saying you should do before you touch AAS so estro side effects and fat gains are lessened to a large degree. So im confused why you said that...

I tricked you all just to get to post video of that awesome bb, and yea statement was just an execuse and mostly crap but just tired and tired of abs this and abs that conversation. Estro sides are too much in spotlight here and ppl are eating too strong cancer drugs to kill even that part of it which is necessary for many functions in body. Anyway what i propably would really say, its true that if you start from lean state with AAS that gives you many advantages and is more healthy. It has also some disadvantages.
Anyway, thats about what your goals are, and what are you taking and how well you know your body and its responses to different factors. Being lean and greedy and knowing how to put up some serious mass and strength going from 190lbs to 260lbs in few months did happen and yes, that wouldn't be possible if starting position weren't lean especially when at 260lbs you could see the abs but hardly tie shoes. Well muscles got bit short, had to actually pull down the bar when i tried regular bench for first time in years with someones 350lbs in it and joints and support muscles didn't just keep up but the injury itself happened first time just for own stupidity using too wide dumbbells of 145-150lbs which clanked together with nasty outcome and tadaa, next years workouts were about getting injury healed. Ok did it, just to tear another shoulder on some move. This isn't leading anything else than to tired offtopic blaablaa. Anyway i was about to tell about one powerlifter who propably never sees his abs during his life even with vision but he was the fat kid in school, now if i would do some googling i bet i would find his name on many national rankings. So yay, we have different goals and theres methods and genetics that respond bit differently than you would expect. Another strange case was guy with pretty much of excess fat and he just kept taking even mixture of test/estrogen for animals and eventually that guy got ripped (ok not because that estrogen crap which did give pretty good gains and gyno that he got operated), well in same year he entered to competition and for that amount of training, that starting level i must say good job

Me on the other hand. I know i would get best results starting lean but then again im not training atm but will eventually continue, it cannot be stopped

[Shredded1]

I tricked you all just to get to post video of that awesome bb, and yea statement was just an execuse and mostly crap but just tired and tired of abs this and abs that conversation. Estro sides are too much in spotlight here and ppl are eating too strong cancer drugs to kill even that part of it which is necessary for many functions in body. Anyway what i propably would really say, its true that if you start from lean state with AAS that gives you many advantages and is more healthy. It has also some disadvantages.
Anyway, thats about what your goals are, and what are you taking and how well you know your body and its responses to different factors. Being lean and greedy and knowing how to put up some serious mass and strength going from 190lbs to 260lbs in few months did happen and yes, that wouldn't be possible if starting position weren't lean especially when at 260lbs you could see the abs but hardly tie shoes. Well muscles got bit short, had to actually pull down the bar when i tried regular bench for first time in years with someones 350lbs in it and joints and support muscles didn't just keep up but the injury itself happened first time just for own stupidity using too wide dumbbells of 145-150lbs which clanked together with nasty outcome and tadaa, next years workouts were about getting injury healed. Ok did it, just to tear another shoulder on some move. This isn't leading anything else than to tired offtopic blaablaa. Anyway i was about to tell about one powerlifter who propably never sees his abs during his life even with vision but he was the fat kid in school, now if i would do some googling i bet i would find his name on many national rankings. So yay, we have different goals and theres methods and genetics that respond bit differently than you would expect. Another strange case was guy with pretty much of excess fat and he just kept taking even mixture of test/estrogen for animals and eventually that guy got ripped (ok not because that estrogen crap which did give pretty good gains and gyno that he got operated), well in same year he entered to competition and for that amount of training, that starting level i must say good job

Me on the other hand. I know i would get best results starting lean but then again im not training atm but will eventually continue, it cannot be stopped

You tricked us all to post a video? How mature...

Anyways, I didn't bother reading this besides the first part, but even that was bad. Your grammar sucks so bad it makes my head spin reading it.

[corsa5000]

nothing wrong with cycling without abs, you think guys all over the world using gear the entire year will be maintaining <8% bodyfat? dont make me laugh,

[anabolix112]

You tricked us all to post a video? How mature...

Anyways, I didn't bother reading this besides the first part, but even that was bad. Your grammar sucks so bad it makes my head spin reading it.

Thanks for the info. I think i write these words of wisdom down. Too bad i only read the first word of your response which seems to be written incorrectly.

Try new neck workout mate, you allready know how to spin your head just go round one full turn with it keeping your body straight and you wont have to worry about grammar.

Anyway haven't you noticed the hints given and see that you're kept as a clown here who doesn't just know that himself and complains about grammar when saying this for example "You tricked us all to post a video?". So i tricked everyone here to post a video aswell?
Your topics and writings are really lingual flowers. Have seen anyone with bike in this topic? Perhaps someone who can't see his abs but is pretty much 10 times better condition than people showing their abs brakes (like person whose nick happens to be car model posted) and seeing them and making everyone else to see them aswell. Its also funny how you swore against estrogen here and didn't read my message but then you lecture how estrogen is needed in another topic where person wants to get rid of excess bloat which shouldn't exceed your knowledge or give you false selfesteem to tell truths with CAPS when your don't have anything better to say. So... Shredded1, yeah sure, looong way to go soft boy.

[Shredded1]

Thanks for the info. I think i write these words of wisdom down. Too bad i only read the first word of your response which seems to be written incorrectly.

Try new neck workout mate, you allready know how to spin your head just go round one full turn with it keeping your body straight and you wont have to worry about grammar.

Anyway haven't you noticed the hints given and see that you're kept as a clown here who doesn't just know that himself and complains about grammar when saying this for example "You tricked us all to post a video?". So i tricked everyone here to post a video aswell?
Your topics and writings are really lingual flowers. Have seen anyone with bike in this topic? Perhaps someone who can't see his abs but is pretty much 10 times better condition than people showing their abs brakes (like person whose nick happens to be car model posted) and seeing them and making everyone else to see them aswell. Its also funny how you swore against estrogen here and didn't read my message but then you lecture how estrogen is needed in another topic where person wants to get rid of excess bloat which shouldn't exceed your knowledge or give you false selfesteem to tell truths with CAPS when your don't have anything better to say. So... Shredded1, yeah sure, looong way to go soft boy.

Are you drunk, bro? You have horrible grammar skills. Just stop posting, it's a waste of forum space. I never once "swore against estrogen." How about stop running your unproductive mouth and get some evidence. In the post you are talking about I said estrogen is necessary for maximum muscle growth when bulking. I am cutting so estrogen is not the best thing for water weight, hence why when cutting I hate estrogen. If you knew enough about cutting and bulking, you would know that. If you would have been paying attention in this thread, you would know that starting steroids at a unnecessarily high bodyfat can cause too much estrogen to linger in the body which is not productive for muscle growth and promotes fat gain. Get your shit straight, go take a language arts class, and stop posting things that you do not have any proof for.

As for my grammar, I think we all agree mine is much better than yours. Starting a sentence with a question is perfectly okay, but I wouldn't expect you to know that via your terrible grammar skills. As for arguing with you, I am done. Maturity is more important to me than trying to read your posts. Peace.

[Shredded1]

nothing wrong with cycling without abs, you think guys all over the world using gear the entire year maybe seasoned bodybuilders, not the average guy who wants to start juice at a 15% BF. And i never said they will be maintaining an 8% bodyfat so go laugh all you want. I guarantee no bodybuilder starts a bulk at the same BF that they are at when they end a previously bulking cycle. They cut to a low bodyfat first. will be maintaining <8% bodyfat? dont make me laugh,

I never said they stay at an 8% bodyfat did I? I said they start at a reasonably low bodyfat when they bulk so the majority is muscle and not fat. When you start a bulk at too high of a bodyfat, it is more prone to become fat than muscle. This has been discussed and proven hundreds of times on this forum, i'm not sure why suddenly you're surprised.

For the record I guarantee no pro bodybuilder has started using steroids at a 15% + bodyfat. Sure they always get above 8% when bulking, but they sure as hell cut again before they start bulking again or else they would gain too much fat.

This is what we are discussing, bro, how people want to start bulking at a 15% BF which is dumb and not as productive muscle wise than if they would just cut naturally to a reasonable bodyfat and then start. Sorry if we misunderstood each other their for a second, hope that helps to show you what I meant.

[anabolix112]

Are you drunk, bro? You have horrible grammar skills. Just stop posting, it's a waste of forum space. I never once "swore against estrogen." How about stop running your unproductive mouth and get some evidence. In the post you are talking about I said estrogen is necessary for maximum muscle growth. If you would have been paying attention in this thread, you would know that starting steroids at a unnecessarily high bodyfat can cause too much estrogen to linger in the body which is not productive for muscle growth and promotes fat gain. Get your shit straight, go take a language arts class, and stop posting things that you do not have any proof for.

Actually my grammar skills are excellent.

I would say the one who is wasting forum space lies behind this quotation.

Third. I have one evicence wearing 80's clothes and looking at HER tummy when SHE isn't writing something with caps lock down. Sorry capital letters aren't references. Nor is your ridiculous picture. Even there is abs i feel sad for you if you actually cycled to get that puny appearance.

And well. I can't name all of my references and even if i could why bother, i believe that people see eventually who has personal referenses and who is talking just egocentric crap.

And lets mention few little things here. As we know sleep is important for recovery.

I have been hmm.. Up for 36 hours, damn exceeded he brain damage limit and grammar alarm wen on 24 hours ago. Too bad it is you who is making typos that turn the whole meaning of sentence.

I can challenge your physics anytime after 1 years off from gym atm. After 2 months you look like pinochio and double that and i must be carefull if i wont step on you. Ofcourse your shredded will get also a new meaning. So shall we get prices enough to promote intrest ?

And sorry this is my third language anyway but i have accidentally gotten best possible grades from it and poor customers, this was my working language for 6 years. Too bad this situation isn't comparable since company makes you alike and your grammar is just short redneck sentences and CAPSLOCKS.

So bb contest ? How much u weight mouse ?

[anabolix112]

I never said they stay at an 8% bodyfat did I? I said they start at a reasonably low bodyfat when they bulk so the majority is muscle and not fat. When you start a bulk at too high of a bodyfat, it is more prone to become fat than muscle. This has been discussed and proven hundreds of times on this forum, i'm not sure why suddenly you're surprised.

For the record I guarantee no pro bodybuilder has started using steroids at a 15% + bodyfat. Sure they always get above 8% when bulking, but they sure as hell cut again before they start bulking again or else they would gain too much fat.

This is what we are discussing, bro, how people want to start bulking at a 15% BF which is dumb and not as productive muscle wise than if they would just cut naturally to a reasonable bodyfat and then start. How hard is that to understand?

Im surprised because it seems this theory must have something wrong in this or then the person who is so much promoting this idea and telling so confidently what should and shouldn't.... And that person looks like some skinny pete from deserted island who has almost managed to crack one coconut and that seems to be all the work out he has ever done. Dont say you have cycled for THAT ?

[gymnerd]

I never like these kind of discussions of who should and who shouldn't its all BS just a guideline or suggestion noone can tell anybody not to do anything.

Also it assumes that everyone uses steroids for personal cosmetic use ONLY!! I personally think that if you do not compete as a bodybuilder or powerlifter or athlete than you should not be juicing but thats just my .002 I think that is a ridiculous guideline.

Remember here are powerlifters, football players and strength athletes of all kinds that could not care if anyone can see there abs.

[anabolix112]

I never like these kind of discussions of who should and who shouldn't its all BS just a guideline or suggestion noone can tell anybody not to do anything.

Also it assumes that everyone uses steroids for personal cosmetic use ONLY!! I personally think that if you do not compete as a bodybuilder or powerlifter or athlete than you should not be juicing but thats just my .002 I think that is a ridiculous guideline.

Remember here are powerlifters, football players and strength athletes of all kinds that could not care if anyone can see there abs.

You're absolutely right. But then again this discussion is not what it seems.
Ok i would paint a tattoo on my forehead, make that as avatar and then seeking for attention claiming that only ppl with tattoo on their forehead should do this others, no way, persons with this mark has opinions that are the ones that matter. Others are low class. When getting critic i would get angry, when getting picture with dude and bike (cycle) i dont remeber if he even noticed to get angry. Aftetr my video he was happy but propably woke up finally seein that he is actually just promoting himself here and given improper answers with know it all attitude and we know that hes just a skinny beginner who has read few articles and talks about bulkings and cuttings which was propably read from some old source. All opinions tend to be only black and white and where i started to feel little pity for him was guy starting to look for errors in my posts and sure im tired i dont put even ,.,.,.,., but i still havent made any error which would change the meaning of sentence completely which that hero mentioned instantly after that flaming.

I think he is gettin on me so im off to sleep but hey wannabe"shredded1" just say so and we'll have competition, atleast 4 figures ofc. Tho its sad to compete against some beginner, if you win ill buy you some food for 1000$. Avoid windy places and dont sell more than 1 helium balloon at time.

[gymnerd]

You're absolutely right. But then again this discussion is not what it seems.
Ok i would paint a tattoo on my forehead, make that as avatar and then seeking for attention claiming that only ppl with tattoo on their forehead should do this others, no way, persons with this mark has opinions that are the ones that matter. Others are low class. When getting critic i would get angry, when getting picture with dude and bike (cycle) i dont remeber if he even noticed to get angry. Aftetr my video he was happy but propably woke up finally seein that he is actually just promoting himself here and given improper answers with know it all attitude and we know that hes just a skinny beginner who has read few articles and talks about bulkings and cuttings which was propably read from some old source. All opinions tend to be only black and white and where i started to feel little pity for him was guy starting to look for errors in my posts and sure im tired i dont put even ,.,.,.,., but i still havent made any error which would change the meaning of sentence completely which that hero mentioned instantly after that flaming.

I think he is gettin on me so im off to sleep but hey wannabe"shredded1" just say so and we'll have competition, atleast 4 figures ofc. Tho its sad to compete against some beginner, if you win ill buy you some food for 1000$. Avoid windy places and dont sell more than 1 helium balloon at time.

Well, IDK about all that but I dont agree with his original statement anyways.

[ubiq]

I'm confused - it seems to have done this chap the world of good...

Well, in that case, what exactly did this man use to achieve his results? And did he at least try to lose weight before starting his cycle?

[nunyabizness]

Well, in that case, what exactly did this man use to achieve his results? And did he at least try to lose weight before starting his cycle?

Can't tell if ur srs...

[glover]

I can't see my abs. My chest sticks out to much.

[anadroljack]

many many people i know do the stuff and can barely see there abs and can bench press 500 plus pounds but being overwieght is a different story but you dont have to be ripped to dable just my opinion.

[Stigmata101]

maybe the real question should be is it ok to cycle if you cant see your schlong...