keto

[bigcwithane]

I wanna try a keto diet to see how my body reacts.
Stats.
180lb
17%
18 yrs. Old

[Ishallnocheatmyself]

lol ok. kinda broad statement..why make a thread about it lol. I want a 2011 nissan gt-r i dont make threads on here i go to work lol

if you have questions then post upp or if you already made a diet and want to see if its a proper keto diet then post away, if your lost then read top*'s posts about it veryyyy informative make sure you read ALL of it

ToM

[bigcwithane]

I'm thinking 1600kcal
65% fat
30%protein
1%carb

[Ishallnocheatmyself]

sounds like 96% to my mathematical expertise,LOL jk but i got my grade twelve and i can add porperly and thaaaats wrong lol either 65 35 or 65 30 5 either way make a diet and post it to make sure your not eating any hidden carbs and if you post what you plan on eating alot of people here could probably identify it as a safe or not food for keto luvu

[bigcwithane]

im sorry bro just a little confused i was reading your thread and gbrice said 5% was to much for carbs so i didnt want to set it there. i started the thread because i was a little confused on the keto diet. i read tops thread and read a couple keto plans on google one seemed to help me out with the workout program and stuff. still just confused on the carb reload and my calories, so i posted it for some feed back on keto and to see if someone would help me out.

[gbrice75]

I wouldn't even bother counting carbs as a percentage of my daily calories while running a keto diet. Since you ideally want to stay below 20g, at most that would be 80 calories - is that really worth counting?

Make the diet 65% fat, 35% protein and the few extra carbs will factor in automatically from eating nuts, protein powder, fiberous veggies, etc. If the 80 calories from carbs puts you over your total caloric goal, reduce that number by 80 calories when coming up with your 65/35 split and then you'll wind up perfect.

Also, to the OP - 1600 kcal sounds VERY low. I don't know your situation obviously, but most girls eat more then that. Remember that you're doing a keto diet, and while eating at a caloric deficit can help, you don't want to go TOO low under maintenance, or you will most definitely lose LBM quickly! I wouldn't eat more than 300 under maintenance while running keto.

What's your question/confusion regarding carb reloading?

[bigcwithane]

im not sure how many carbs to eat or what kind ive read peoples threads and the said no fruit, uhm some people do simple carbs, other stick to complex, also ive seen people only doing one day of reloading on sunday so it is confusing the hell out of me, and i got my intake from D05s thread for tdee and bmr

[bigcwithane]

gbrice if you could help me figure out my daily intake it would be greatly appriciated man haha. bye the way thank you for helping me with all the diet stuff ive posted, your always on top of it

[gbrice75]

im not sure how many carbs to eat or what kind ive read peoples threads and the said no fruit, uhm some people do simple carbs, other stick to complex, also ive seen people only doing one day of reloading on sunday so it is confusing the hell out of me, and i got my intake from D05s thread for tdee and bmr

You should be able to find all the answers you need in Top's thread. What I've seen most often on the carb reload day is starting off with more simple carbs (not sugary carbs, but white potato, pasta, rice, etc) and tapering to complex carbs by mid-day, the dropping carbs completely by the evening. Ideally you'd want your reload to happen the day before a workout, so Sunday for instance, assuming you workout on Monday's. As for quantity, I would suggest upwards of 300g - 400g throughout the day. The key here is to keep fats VERY low, as much as possible. Keep protein the same. In the end, you should wind up eating close to maintenance, and don't worry if you go a bit over - it's good for your metabolism.

gbrice if you could help me figure out my daily intake it would be greatly appriciated man haha. bye the way thank you for helping me with all the diet stuff ive posted, your always on top of it

Have you worked out your TDEE yet? That's what you need to do - the formula's are in Damienm05's write up that you've probably seen me or him posting throughout the diet section. Based on that number, we can come up with your daily intake.

[bigcwithane]

okay i fixed it i think. my tdee is 2827. so i am going to eat 2100kcal, 65%fat, 35% protein. 150g fat. 184g protein. 0g carbs. Does this sound better?

[bigcwithane]

okay so like i am going to lift mon. tues. thurs. fri. then it said to uplaod right after fri workout until sunday morning, then sunday is back to the all pro/fat meals

[gbrice75]

okay i fixed it i think. my tdee is 2827. so i am going to eat 2100kcal, 65%fat, 35% protein. 150g fat. 184g protein. 0g carbs. Does this sound better?

Dude, that's a 727 calorie deficit - too low!!! You will most definitely lose LBM and feel weak as hell. I would eat at no lower then 2500. If you don't see you're losing bodyfat after a couple of weeks, knock off another 100 calories, or up your cardio.

okay so like i am going to lift mon. tues. thurs. fri. then it said to uplaod right after fri workout until sunday morning, then sunday is back to the all pro/fat meals

Ok yea, if you're following that exact diet then do it that way. Simple carbs PWO on Friday, tapering to complex carbs throughout the night (some people get up in the middle of the night to eat more carbs, but that's extreme as hell IMO), more complex carbs Sunday morning and then start back up with protein/fat meals by mid-day.

[bigcwithane]

well right now im eating 2600 cal so i figured 2100 would be good? maybe not okay ill do 2500 then haha i dont wanna lose lbm just the little bit of extra i got haha i only plan running this for a short time until winter and im gonna bulk again

[bigcwithane]

so do i eat 300g of carbs threw fri and sat. or so i eat that much each day and what would my protein be set at i know low low low fat

[bigcwithane]

alright now i got 2500kcal. 180g fat, 65%. 220g protein, 35%. 0g carb.

[gbrice75]

so do i eat 300g of carbs threw fri and sat. or so i eat that much each day and what would my protein be set at i know low low low fat

300-400g carbs over the 24 hour period from your Friday workout until Sunday mid-morning.
Protein would stay the same, whatever your 35% is.

[bigcwithane]

On tops thread it says start with liquid carbs? Then to simple than to complex

[bigcwithane]

what are liquid carbs i can use. most peoples threads ive read they aernt doing liquid and what about sugar content like none or is fruit and dairy sugar exceptable?

[gbrice75]

On tops thread it says start with liquid carbs? Then to simple than to complex

If you want to follow that particular CKD diet to the letter, then yes. The liquid carbs are simple - so it would be simple liquid to simple food to complex.

what are liquid carbs i can use. most peoples threads ive read they aernt doing liquid and what about sugar content like none or is fruit and dairy sugar exceptable?

I don't have specific brand names handy, but do a google search (or even within this forum) for glucose disposal agents.

Dairy is ok in small quantities. Fructose is not preferred because it mostly restores liver glycogen and not glycogen stores in your muscles.

[bigcwithane]

Okay so I don't need to do liquid, because I think pasta and potatoes would be a lot easier Haha but i will look into it. Also how do I determine how many carbs I need like my daily total for Fri night threw Sunday

[Damienm05]

Can I suggest Dave Palumbo's keto diet? I find CKD to be a far inferior alternative.

[Damienm05]

The premise of the diet is high protein (about 1- 1 1/2 gram per pound), moderate fat (about 1/2 g per lb) and low low carbs (no direct sources of carbs). During this diet, the brain goes into ketosis (it uses ketone bodies for energy-- fats) and thus the energy requirements by the body can almost all be supplied by fats (which you'll be taking in plenty of). The only activity that uses carbs will be the weight workout which may use 40grams per workout. You will get these 40g indirectly through the foods you'll be eating. As a backup, the cheat meal you'll be having once per week will provide a storehouse of glycogen (glucose) in case of emergency. So, you see, very little gluconeogenesis in the liver will be occurring. If we keep cortisol low (by
restricting STIMULANTS) we'll ensure that muscle is spared!

HAVE YOUR CHEAT MEAL ON THE SAME DAY EVERY WEEK, last meal of the
day so you dont cheat again.

Fiber helps burn fat! Everyone should take fiber 2x per day. Fiber actually helps increase the absorption of calcium.
When following my diet plan (which includes getting your brain into ketosis), there can be NO starchy carbs eaten!



For a 200lb man:

MEAL #1
5 whole eggs (make sure to buy OMEGA-3 EGGS from the supermarket. They contain virtually NO saturated fat and tons of good OMEGA-3 fats); add another 4 egg whites to this (they don?t need to be the Omega-3 ones; you can use liquid egg whites)

MEAL #2
SHAKE: 50g Whey Protein with 1 ? tablespoon of All Natural Peanut butter (no sugar)

MEAL #3
"Lean Protein Meal": 8oz chicken with 1/2-cup cashew nuts (almonds, or walnuts)

MEAL #4
SHAKE: 50g Whey Protein with 1 ? tablespoons of All Natural Peanut butter (no sugar added)

MEAL #5
"Fatty Protein Meal": 8oz Salmon, Swordfish, or RED MEAT with a green salad (no tomatoes, carrots, or red peppers) with 1 tablespoon of Olive Oil or Macadamia nut oil and vinegar

MEAL #6
SHAKE: 50g Whey with 1 ? tablespoon all natural peanut butter or 4 whole (Omega-3) eggs and 4 extra whites

For a 250lb+ man:
Meal 1 6 whole Omega-3 eggs
Meal 2 8oz chicken with 1/2 cup raw almonds
Meal 3 50g whey with 2 tablespoons all natural peanutbutter
Meal 4 8oz salmon with 1 cup asparagus with 1 tablespoon macadamia nut oil
Meal 5 50 g whey with 2 tablespoon PB
Meal 6 6 whole eggs

Remember, it takes 3-4 days to get into a strong ketosis where your brain is using ketone bodies (fats), instead of carbs, for energy. Be patient.

Many times I'll switch to an alternatiing diet where one day it will be protein/fat......then another protein/vegetables (very little fat). The great thing about the body and fat is that ESSENTIAL FATTY ACIDS can be stored in the muscle for several days, up to 2 weeks......therefore, once an adequate storehouse of Essential Fats are built up, the body can be "tortured" a little and it still won't give up muscle (that's assuming you're still taking in adequate protein. Protein can't be stored).

1oz almonds equals 6g carbs (2 of those grams are fiber) and 2oz equals 12g of carbs.

With the beef meal (any fatty protein meal), you should have the green salad with 1 tablespoon of Olive or Mac oil INSTEAD of the nuts. Only eat the nuts with the LEAN PROTEIN MEAL (chicken, turkey, lean fish)

The best fat sources come from the essential fatty acids-- Omega-6 and Omega-3's. Most of us get plenty of Omega-6s from cooking oils, ect..........however the Omega-3's are harder to get. I recommend WHOLE OMEGA-3 EGGS, FaTTY FISHS like SALMON and SWORDFISH and TUNA and MACKEREL, ALMONDS and WALNUTS have some OMEGA-3's (as well as OMEGA-6s). ANother great fat source is MONOUNSATURATES such as EXTRA VIRGIN OLIVE OIL and MACADAMIA NUT OIL.....they aren't essential but they are great for the metabolism (great source of energy) and they are extremely good for your heart.

You're not getting any indirect sources of carbs (just from the 1 spoonful of PB.... you may want to have at least one 1/3cup nuts meal. Remember, Olive or Macadamia nut oil is predominantly a MONOUNSATURATED FAT (good for the heart, but not essential)........ the nuts, and fish oil have the essential fats in them. Also, with regard to FLAX SEED OIL, the OMEGA-3 Fatty Acids found in them (alpha-linolenic acid) has a very poor conversion to DHA and EPA (Essential Omega-3 intermediates) in the HUMAN........therefore, you're much better off taking in FISH OILS (that already contain DHA/EPA) than FLAX SEED OIL.

Once fat loss slows, I always increase cardio first, then I increase the amount of fat burners (clen, cytomel, lipolyze).........After those other methods are exhausted, only then, do I play with the diet.

Always eat BEFORE lifting........never BETWEEN lifting and cardio.
Artificial Sweetners:
The artificial sweetener itself (eg. aspartame, sucralose) wont cause a problem. It's what some companies complex it with. For example, EQUAL and SPLENDA combine their aspartame and sucrolose with 1g of maltodextrin........whereas, in diet drinks, they don't do that. So, diet drinks are okay, SPLENDA and EQUAL must be used in moderation (STEVIA BALANCE is fine though since they use inulin fiber instead of maltodextrin

Forget using:
-MCT's are a waste when you're dieting. If you're gonna use FATS for an energy source, they might as well serve a function in the body. MCTs are useless. They can only serve as a source of energy!
-Arginine is not going to do anything. It will DO something; just not dramatic.

Cardio:
CARDIO should be performed at a low intensity (under 120bpm heartrate). This will ensure that you use FAT as a fuelsource since as your heartrate increase, carbohydrates begin to become the preferred fuel of choice for the body. When on a low carb diet, you're body will break down muscle and turn that into carbs. Remember, Fat CANNOT be changed into carbs. Therefore, for bodybuilding, the rule of cardio should be LONG DURATION, LOW INTENSITY

never do less than 20 min per session

The BOTTOM LINE is that low intensity cardio (while you might need more of it) ensures that fat is utilized and muscle is spared (especially while on my high protein/moderate fat/low carb diety).

Admin edit. I found these variations for different weights, female, etc. I don't think Dave created them, but someone else using the diet's theory.

Variations of the Palumbo diet for certain individuals :

200lb male
Meal #1: 5 whole eggs (Omega-3), 4 egg-whites (can be liquid egg-whites).
Meal #2: Shake: 50g Whey Protein with 1 ½ tablespoon of All Natural Peanut Butter (no sugar).
Meal #3: Lean protein meal: 8oz Chicken with ½ cup cashew nuts (or almonds, walnuts).
Meal #4: Shake: same as meal #2.
Meal #5: Fatty protein meal: 8oz Salmon, Swordfish, or Red Meat with a green salad (no tomatoes, carrots, or red peppers) with 1 tablespoon of Olive Oil or Macadamia Nut Oil and Vinegar.
Meal #6: Same as meal #2 and #4, or 4 whole (Omega-3) eggs and 4 extra egg-whites.

250lb+ male
Meal #1: 6 whole (Omega-3) eggs.
Meal #2: 8oz chicken with ½ cup raw almonds.
Meal #3: 50g whey protein with 2 tablespoons all natural peanut butter.
Meal #4: 8oz salmon with 1 cup asparagus with 1 tablespoon macadamia nut oil.
Meal #5: same as meal #3.
Meal #6: 6 whole (Omega-3) eggs.

120lb female
Meal #1: 2 whole (omega-3) eggs and 6 egg-whites.
Meal #2: 4oz chicken with 1/4 cup raw almonds.
Meal #3: 35g whey protein with 1 tablespoon all natural peanut butter.
Meal #4: 4oz salmon with 1 cup asparagus with 1 tablespoon macadamia nut oil.
Meal #5: same as meal #1 or meal #3.

100lb (lean body mass) female figure competitor
Meal #1: 2 whole omega-3 eggs and 4 egg whites.
Meal #2: 30g whey protein and 1 tablespoon natural peanut butter.
Meal #3: 6oz chicken and 1oz (1/8 cup) raw almonds.
Meal #4: same as meal #2.
Meal #5: 4oz salmon, 2 cups of spinach leaves, 1 teaspoon virgin olive oil and vinegar.

170lb male (153lbs LBM)
Meal #1: 3 whole omega-3 eggs, 3 egg-whites, 3 slices fat-free turkey.
Meal #2: 40g whey protein and 1 tablespoon olive oil.
Meal #3: 150g skinless chicken breast and 1 tablespoon soy and 1 tablespoon mustard and 30g almonds.
Meal #4: same as meal #2.
Meal #5: 200g top sirloin steak and 85g raw spinach and 1 tablespoon olive oil.
Meal #6: 2 whole omega-3 eggs, 1 can tuna.

160 lb male
Meal #1: 4 whole eggs, ¾ cup egg-whites, fish oil, primrose oil.
Meal #2: 7oz chicken, ¼ cup almonds.
Meal #3: 7oz salmon, 1 cup spinach.
Meal #4: same as meal #2.
Meal #5: 7oz lean ground beef, 1 cup spinach, 1 tablespoon olive oil.
Meal #6: 3 whole eggs, 1 cup egg-whites, fish oil, primrose oil.

185lb natty bb at 12%bf
Meal #1: 5 whole omega-3 eggs.
Meal #2: 7oz chicken with 1/3 cup raw almonds.
Meal #3: 40g whey protein with 1.5 tablespoons all natural peanut butter (post-workout meal).
Meal #4: 6oz salmon with 1 cup asparagus with 1 tablespoon macadamia nut oil.
Meal #5: 40g whey protein with 2 tablespoons all natural peanut butter.
Meal #6: 4 whole omega-3 eggs with 4 extra egg-whites.

176lb natty bb at 11-12%bf
Meal #1: 4 whole omega-3 eggs with 4 extra egg-whites.
Meal #2: 200g chicken with 1/3 cup raw almonds.
Meal #3: 40g whey protein with 1 tablespoon all natural peanut butter.
Meal #4: 200g red meat or salmon with 1 cup asparagus.
Meal #5: 40g whey protein with 1.5 tablespoons all natural peanut butter.
Meal #6: same as meal #1.

155lb male at 15%bf
Meal #1: 3 whole omega-3 eggs.
Meal #2: 5oz chicken with ¼ cup raw almonds.
Meal #3: 30g whey isolate with 1 tablespoon all natural peanut butter.
Meal #4: 7oz (93%) lean ground beef with 1 cup romaine lettuce (dressing: 3 teaspoons ev olive oil and 3 teaspoons balsamic vinegar) and 1 tablespoon flaxseed oil.
Meal #5: same as meal #3.
Meal #6: same as meal #1.

195lb male
Meal #1: 5 whole eggs.
Meal #2: 8oz chicken breast and 1/3 cup almonds.
Meal #3: 50g whey protein isolate with 1.5 tablespoon natural peanut butter.
Meal #4: 8oz fish with 1/3 cup almonds.
Meal #5: 55g whey protein isolate with 1.5 tablespoon natural peanut butter (post workout).
Meal #6: same as meal #1.

172lbs at 11%bf with protein and veggies days incorporated
3X P-F, 2X P-V

Pro-Fat
Meal #1: 4 whole eggs with 4 egg-whites.
Meal #2: 6oz chicken (cooked) and 1/3 cup raw almonds.
Meal #3: 40g whey protein and 1.5 tablespoon all natural peanut butter.
Meal #4: 6oz red meat (cooked) with 1 cup asparagus.
Meal #5: same as meal #3.
Meal #6: same as meal #1.

Pro-veggie
Meal #1: 12 egg-whites.
Meal #2: 6oz chicken (cooked) and 1 cup asparagus.
Meal #3: 40g whey protein with water.
Meal #4: 6oz tuna and 1 cup asparagus.
Meal #5: same as meal #3.
Meal #6: same as meal #1.

[bigcwithane]

Thanks d05 I'm glad you a g are helping me out

[bigcwithane]

I'm a little confused about the polumbo diet is it like one day pro/fat then next pro/veggies. And what can I eat for my cheat meals

[Damienm05]

I'm a little confused about the polumbo diet is it like one day pro/fat then next pro/veggies. And what can I eat for my cheat meals

Ignore the pro/veggie part altogether. That's more for the female version. I like to do one the day following my cheat meal which would be a mini-carb up. This is completely optional but I figure, once you're out of ketosis anyway...

The cheat meal would follow carb-up rules. Minimal fructose, fat, salt, simple sugar. Usually like a huge meal of sweet potatoes or a couple cups of basmati rice and fish and tons veggies. I didn't skimp on things like salsa and hummus as condiments. Sometimes a glass of wine, sometimes a little fruit. I'd have it as my last meal on Sunday night, following a late workout. I'd load creatine with it and drink tons of water. The workout the following day is great, obviously, so do something good! Now remember, the nice part is this is just one meal and not a huge weekend of planning/loading. In the same token, as just one meal, even if it's a binge-style meal - basically whatever you can stuff in your face for a 2-hour period - it's not gonna be that bad or really negate fat loss. The goal is to tame cravings, maintain an emergency glycogen reserve, and prevent plateaus.

If you wanted the pro/veg day. For me it would be like:

meal 1: 10 egg whites, 2 eggs, lots of spinach, mushrooms
meal 2: Chicken breast, Asparagus, teaspoon EVOO
meal 3: Flank steak, Asparagus
PWO: 1 tbsp natty PB, 2 scoops isolate
meal 5: Tilapia, green beans, teaspoon EVOO
meal 6: 1 tbsp natty PB, 1 scoop casein

As for the keto days, they looked the exact same, except that all meals would have 15-20g of fat. In the meals that contained avocado, nuts, and other whole food fats, I didn't eat veggies. In meals that used oil, I'd have a small veggie serving to pour it on. I also had more PB in the shakes. Carbs would sit around 25-35g negating fiber. I also took a fiber supp. Also, on keto days, I had 5 whole eggs for breakfast (which when in doubt is a perfect meal).

[gbrice75]

Good read Damien, if I ever decide to give keto a go again, I will definitely try the Palumbo diet. Seems MUCH easier to follow then CKD; way too much planning and extremely rigid!

[bigcwithane]

Do you guys think the polumbo would be easier than the ckd I only plan on cutting for four to six weeks until winter. Which one do you guys think is more effective in that period of a time and I don't want to lose really any of my lbm and the ckd diet says you won't lose any

[gbrice75]

I can't answer as i've only run a CKD diet in the past. I think Damien has run Palumbo, so he may be able to give you a fair comparison. He did say above that he feels CKD is far inferior, so that means something. Damien, why do you feel Palumbo's diet is superior?

[Damienm05]

Because the emphasis is taken off eating a lot of fat, regardless of source. It is put on moderate, high quality fat sources and high protein. Ultimately muscle is spared without the grueling transitions between glucose/ketones over days at a time. It just feels better and I've never run a CKD but I've done this twice over a 30-day period with clen and lost stupid body fat both times.

[bigcwithane]

What was your cardio d05 while on clen and the palumbo diet also dude you just do the same workout split like the ckd

[Damienm05]

There's no need to structure a split around this diet. It is simple. Just lived your life as you would if you were on a balanced diet. All your meals are simply clean pro/fat only. The cheat meal is optional honestly but if you do one; make good use of it the next day.

[bigcwithane]

thank you d05. i think im gonna try the ckd because ive been spending like 2 days reading up on it mine as well use all the info i just sucked up. haha so i was reading the thread and it said aim for 10-12g carb on reload per lean body weight. so my lbm is 68kg and i multiplied by 10 and got 680 how many meals should i divid that threw (i dont want to eat threw the night i need to sleep haha). also it says eat fruit before my fri. fullbody workout, but then other plaves i read no fruit because it fills the liver

[Damienm05]

The fruit is to snap you out of ketosis pre-workout.

[bigcwithane]

okay makes sense. i am getting confused because one thread says one thing and then i swear the other one says something else

[Damienm05]

Yeah, my experience with that diet is that people get too caught up in the little things and they forget doing the big things right. Like maintaining a caloric deficit throughout the week, efficiently training their body as they would with a balanced diet, and eating the right foods.

[bigcwithane]

well im trying to plan out the ckd right now but the carbs seem like they are getting to high im using lean meats and evo almonds eggs and like all the stuff you should eat but my carbs are at 16 with only three meals in

[gbrice75]

Because the emphasis is taken off eating a lot of fat, regardless of source. It is put on moderate, high quality fat sources and high protein. Ultimately muscle is spared without the grueling transitions between glucose/ketones over days at a time. It just feels better and I've never run a CKD but I've done this twice over a 30-day period with clen and lost stupid body fat both times.

There's no need to structure a split around this diet. It is simple. Just lived your life as you would if you were on a balanced diet. All your meals are simply clean pro/fat only. The cheat meal is optional honestly but if you do one; make good use of it the next day.

Wow, this throws a wrench into my life! It really makes me want to consider keto again. My biggest problem with CKD was the over thinking involved, especially during the carb reload. Also, I hated the total body workout schedule as it wasn't condusive to my own schedule.

On Palumbo's keto diet, i'm basically eating high protein/moderate fat all the time, with an optional cheat meal? And workouts can stay the same? That's what I like to hear...

[bigcwithane]

Yeah I'm kinda upsetting myself because I'm not sure which one I wanna tryhaha

[bigcwithane]

Can some one help me with a list of foods for ckd my carbs are getting to high I think from almonds natty pb and avocados

[digismash]

what would be a good fiber supplement for this? also is waxy maize the ideal pre workout carb??