Prop and Tren A

[The_Incredible_Bulk]

Age= 31
height=6'
weight=207
bf=11%

I'm looking to start my 3rd cycle. First was sustanon 500mg a week for 10 weeks, 2nd was dbol and test E 750mg a week for 12 weeks and I was using hgh for 6 months at the time.
I want to run Tren A and Prop. for 8 weeks just not sure how much to run. I will be using Hcg through the cycle 250iu twice a week I believe? I will be using Nolva Clomid pct and was thinking about aromasin throughout the cycle. Any help on how much I should be using with no Tren experience would be appreciated.

[MickeyKnox]

your proposed cycle is good.

i recommend your test dose to be 100-200mg/wk total. this is MY opinion. and your tren dose around 50mg/eod would be a good starting dose to see how you react to tren for the first time. i would also recommend having prami/caber on hand, again MY opinion. make sure you use an ai on cycle to combat e2. include hcg and a solid pct and youre gtg.

[Lunk1]

Thanks for laying all this info out! really helps. My first prop/ace cycle recs are to run 500mg test/350mg tren per week EOD pins. After sometime with tren then I like to run test lower and tren higher but for first time run this is a solid start!

[The_Incredible_Bulk]

Thx for the replies. I notice the dosage recommendations are quite different. I like the sounds of test 500mg/week and Tren 350/week. If I go that high should I work up to 350 of Tren, or start there from week 1?

[DanB]

i would start at 350mg and see how it treats you

you can increase then if you wsh but you will stll make solid gains on 350mg

you need to find what works best for you test/tren, 250/500, 500/500, 500/250 etc

it will take time and a couple cycles to find your ''sweat spot''

remember to control your estrogen from day 1, this is key

[MickeyKnox]

keep in mind that the more test you use, the more susceptible to experiencing sides will be. that a fact. BUT it's not a fact that you WILL see sides, it simply increases the odds that you will experience them. and i agree with Dan on the importance of e2 control from the outset.

having said that, if you decide to use 500mg/wk with your tren cycle keep us posted on your results, including any e2 related sides you may experience.

[Lunk1]

i would start at 350mg and see how it treats you

you can increase then if you wsh but you will stll make solid gains on 350mg

you need to find what works best for you test/tren, 250/500, 500/500, 500/250 etc

it will take time and a couple cycles to find your ''sweat spot''

remember to control your estrogen from day 1, this is key

As Dan kind of pointed out, there are essentially 3 ways to run tren. Tren and test even, test high/tren low and tren high/test low. I have tried all 3 and found the last is best for me but as Dan pounted out it takes a few tries to see what works best but the before mentioned dosage is a great starting dose and there is no need to work up or down as it is a nice moderate dose. keep us posted.

[Lunk1]

keep in mind that the more test you use, the more susceptible to experiencing sides will be. that a fact. BUT it's not a fact that you WILL see sides, it simply increases the odds that you will experience them. and i agree with Dan on the importance of e2 control from the outset.

having said that, if you decide to use 500mg/wk with your tren cycle keep us posted on your results, including any e2 related sides you may experience.

Mick I would agree if were talking relatively high dosages of test but at 500mg and a good AI it should be no worse than anything else IMO.

[MickeyKnox]

As Dan kind of pointed out, there are essentially 3 ways to run tren. Tren and test even, test high/tren low and tren high/test low. I have tried all 3 and found the last is best for me but as Dan pounted out it takes a few tries to see what works best but the before mentioned dosage is a great starting dose and there is no need to work up or down as it is a nice moderate dose. keep us posted.

agreed. and im an advocate of starting your tren dose smaller than your test dose..then work up from there. GROW INTO YOUR DOSE.

[MickeyKnox]

Mick I would agree if were talking relatively high dosages of test but at 500mg and a good AI it should be no worse than anything else IMO.

i appreciate and respect your opinion Lunk. but i won't debate this any further. there is waaaay too much information supporting the fact that using a trt dose (100) couple with moderate dose of tren (350) will produce LESS sides than using 500mg test. 100..or 500? no difference? get real..sorry.

[Lunk1]

i appreciate and respect your opinion Lunk. but i won't debate this any further. there is waaaay too much information supporting the fact that using a trt dose (100) couple with moderate dose of tren (350) will produce LESS sides than using 500mg test. 100..or 500? no difference? get real..sorry.

I agree that is my prefered method as well...now.

[DanB]

i appreciate and respect your opinion Lunk. but i won't debate this any further. there is waaaay too much information supporting the fact that using a trt dose (100) couple with moderate dose of tren (350) will produce LESS sides than using 500mg test. 100..or 500? no difference? get real..sorry.

i was told this by several staff here, some who run copious amounts of tren and 250mgish test, so I swapped from gram test 350mg tren to 300mg test and 525 then 700mg tren, pinning tren a ed and far LESS sides from the tren even though its double the orginal amount, .334mg adex eod and thats it

[Lunk1]

i was told this by several staff here, some who run copious amounts of tren and 250mgish test, so I swapped from gram test 350mg tren to 300mg test and 525 then 700mg tren, pinning tren a ed and far LESS sides from the tren even though its double the orginal amount, .334mg adex eod and thats it

Thats the thing with this whole DEBATE as Mick put it. I agree Dan..my method as well. But SO many ppl have SOOOO many methods on dosing ot tren/test. Even guys with experience have varied opinions. I believe Pete is still and advocate of test equal or higher (can't remember).

I think as we both agreed before. It is about finding what works best for you as reactions can vary.

[MickeyKnox]

i was told this by several staff here, some who run copious amounts of tren and 250mgish test, so I swapped from gram test 350mg tren to 300mg test and 525 then 700mg tren, pinning tren a ed and far LESS sides from the tren even though its double the orginal amount, .334mg adex eod and thats it

exactly what im saying. lots of info right here on this site about this. BUT, this doesn't apply to EVERYONE. like another staffer said in a previous thread, different stroke for different folks. however, this rule of thumb appears to apply to a very large audience.

[DanB]

Thats the thing with this whole DEBATE as Mick put it. I agree Dan..my method as well. But SO many ppl have SOOOO many methods on dosing ot tren/test. Even guys with experience have varied opinions. I believe Pete is still and advocate of test equal or higher (can't remember).

I think as we both agreed before. It is about finding what works best for you as reactions can vary.

thats it, there nothing set in stone that says x or y is the best for everybody, even though the theory behind the low test/high tren seems sound, dosnt mean it works for 100% of people

[MickeyKnox]

Thats the thing with this whole DEBATE as Mick put it. I agree Dan..my method as well. But SO many ppl have SOOOO many methods on dosing ot tren/test. Even guys with experience have varied opinions. I believe Pete is still and advocate of test equal or higher (can't remember).

I think as we both agreed before. It is about finding what works best for you as reactions can vary.

cant argue with that bro. well said.

[The_Incredible_Bulk]

Should I use Aromasin or Adex from the start?

[Lunk1]

Should I use Aromasin or Adex from the start?

Either one is a good AI. Some will argue one over the other. I like Adex at .25mg ed (some will say eod). You have to find a sweet spot for this as well.

[DanB]

Should I use Aromasin or Adex from the start?

in theory aromasin is better, more effective and sucide inhibitor so it destroys the enzyme and in turn no risk of rebound

but in saying that i generally use adex, its cheaper and has never let me down, so just go with whatever you get the best value for money

[MickeyKnox]

well, actually aromasin is better because..................lol

[MickeyKnox]

in theory aromasin is better, more effective and sucide inhibitor so it destroys the enzyme and in turn no risk of rebound

but in saying that i generally use adex, its cheaper and has never let me down, so just go with whatever you get the best value for money

that's funny, i was going to write something similar but decided against it and thought i would just bug Lunk a bit..he's got a good sense of humor. lol

but now that you've opened the can of worms Dan, imho, aromasin is also easier on the lipids and increases test. and for those reasons, and the ones you listed, is why i chose aromasin over dex.

[Lunk1]

that's funny, i was going to write something similar but decided against it and thought i would just bug Lunk a bit..he's got a good sense of humor. lol

but now that you've opened the can of worms Dan, imho, aromasin is also easier on the lipids and increases test. and for those reasons, and the ones you listed, is why i chose aromasin over dex.

Mickey........

[MickeyKnox]

haha

[Lunk1]

Celebration...loks like Mick may break 2000 tonight!!!!

[The_Incredible_Bulk]

Ok, Thx a lot guys, was really helpful

[DanB]

that's funny, i was going to write something similar but decided against it and thought i would just bug Lunk a bit..he's got a good sense of humor. lol

but now that you've opened the can of worms Dan, imho, aromasin is also easier on the lipids and increases test. and for those reasons, and the ones you listed, is why i chose aromasin over dex.

i agree it is superior, but pharm aromasin is several times more expensive then adex, i can get generic natco but meh im set in my ways lol

i know what dose i need for various compounds, amounts and combos aswell so its handy but if i switch to aromasin then i will need to work it all out again

mabey someday.................

[MickeyKnox]

i agree it is superior, but pharm aromasin is several times more expensive then adex, i can get generic natco but meh im set in my ways lol

i know what dose i need for various compounds, amounts and combos aswell so its handy but if i switch to aromasin then i will need to work it all out again

mabey someday.................

if its not broke dont fix it.

[MickeyKnox]

Celebration...loks like Mick may break 2000 tonight!!!!

"ceeeeeeeeeelaaaabrate good times, c'mon!"

[Lunk1]

i agree it is superior, but pharm aromasin is several times more expensive then adex, i can get generic natco but meh im set in my ways lol

i know what dose i need for various compounds, amounts and combos aswell so its handy but if i switch to aromasin then i will need to work it all out again

mabey someday.................

Most likely wrong here (ya ya Mick) but isn't Aromasin capable of complete estro blocking?

[DanB]

not that im aware of, it destroys the e2 enzyme but not 100% of the enzyme in body, off top of my head it is somewhere in 85% range, but i think that figure that im using and everybody else throws around is for women with breast cancer so not really accurate for men, i dont know if there has been any studys on men

swifto or bona would be men that have the studys if they are available

but to answer your question, no, letro is the strongest

[measuretwicecutonce]

I'm running 40 prop/60tren a ED n loving it. thats 280t/wk, n 420tren/wk. no AI needed or caber yet. mild sides - sweats, insomnia once maybe twice a week,

[MickeyKnox]

I'm running 40 prop/60tren a ED n loving it. thats 280t/wk, n 420tren/wk. no AI needed or caber yet. mild sides - sweats, insomnia once maybe twice a week,

part of your absence of sides has to do with you pinning ed as opposed to eod. your bloods are very stable running this protocol. i like that idea, but hate the pinning every day.

[Lunk1]

I'm running 40 prop/60tren a ED n loving it. thats 280t/wk, n 420tren/wk. no AI needed or caber yet. mild sides - sweats, insomnia once maybe twice a week,

Why would you say no AI needed???

[measuretwicecutonce]

part of your absence of sides has to do with you pinning ed as opposed to eod. your bloods are very stable running this protocol. i like that idea, but hate the pinning every day.

precisely why i chose ED for more stable = less sides. good man. n yes ED sucks. first short ester cycle to boot. will most likely go back to long lol

[measuretwicecutonce]

Why would you say no AI needed???

sum people body's convert less to e, or show less sides, such as mine, and at 280test i don't feel the need to run the AI or the caber with my barely minimum sides.

[measuretwicecutonce]

i do have stane n caber on hand of course.

[MickeyKnox]

precisely why i chose ED for more stable = less sides. good man. n yes ED sucks. first short ester cycle to boot. will most likely go back to long lol

im actually considering running the next long ester like a short one ie..eod. a member here did this and reported positive reviews on gains and sides. i thought this was interesting enough to consider. i really like the idea of frequent injections to maintain stable bloods.

[Lunk1]

sum people body's convert less to e, or show less sides, such as mine, and at 280test i don't feel the need to run the AI or the caber with my barely minimum sides.

The only way you would have to even know this is BW on cycle...are you doung BW while on????

Not all sides from E can be physicaly seen....