first cycle-sustanon250

[polynomials]

hey guys id appreciate some help

im going on my first cycle next week sustanon250 12 weeks jabbing twice a week at dosages of 3 mls a week

im 24 years old been training for 4 years good solid diet 176 centimetres 90kilos with about 20% bodyfat

could i please get some advice on the post cycle therapy whether i should add some dianabols

any help would be appreciated

[Gaspaco]

hey guys id appreciate some help

im going on my first cycle next week sustanon250 12 weeks jabbing twice a week at dosages of 3 mls a week

im 24 years old been training for 4 years good solid diet 176 centimetres 90kilos with about 20% bodyfat

could i please get some advice on the post cycle therapy whether i should add some dianabols

any help would be appreciated

1-12 Sust 500mg/week two jabs
1-12 adex 0.25 eod
1- 4days before PCT, HCG twice a week 250mg

Start PCT 21days after last sust
NOLVA 40/40/20/20
Clomid 75/50/50/50

[Lunk1]

Good solid diet and a 20% BF??? How did you equate those 2 things together??

[MickeyKnox]

1-12 Sust 500mg/week two jabs
1-12 adex 0.25 eod
HCG twice a week 250mg and stop 3- 4days before PCT,

Start PCT 21days after last sust
NOLVA 40/40/20/20
Clomid 75/50/50/50

Adjusted hCG info

[songdog]

You really need to get that bf down bro.

[stpete]

PCT will be 18 days after last injection.

[MuscleInk]

I would have suggested a single ester for your first cycle. Blends such as Sust are a mix of very short, medium, and long esters. The PIP is a little worse IME, but I suppose there are far worse anabolics you could have chosen for a first cycle.

The fellas are right. Lowering your bf to 15 would be more optimal for cycling. 20 isn't horrific but you will likely have more negative sides than if you waited until your bf dropped to around 15.

Hopefully that diet IS good. You'll be disappointed with results if its not.

Good luck!

[polynomials]

hey guys this was my first post second day on the forum so i appreciate all your replies. i dont know my exact bodyfat but my abz arent visible so im assuming its about 20. what i mean by my diet is good is that ive came a long way i used to way 69 kilos i was a twig and now im 90 kilos. also is hcg really important to get....i heard about this product caled lectrazol or something whats your views on that

[Bio-Active]

Yes HCG is important to run during cycle to keep testicular function. Makes recovery much easier. Whats your plan for PCT?

[polynomials]

thanks bro my plans were just adex and clomid do i use hcg at the end of my cycle or from the beginning..

[P.Money]

You should check out my log, I think it's a waste to do two injections a week. I do two pins of 1.5ml each every monday. You have to remember how Sustanon 250 works. Many people will be against me on this once again, but 1 big injection a week is the way to go so you get a higher amount of propionate right away which sustains you until the isoprop and the other esters kick in. Trust me bro, 2 pins on mondays @ 1.5cc each and you'll be good to go.

Here is my log:
http://forums.steroid.com/showthread...g#.UL_2OoNQV8E

[Bio-Active]

Hcg can be run during the cycle starting the second week and adex is for on cycle as well. Tamox and clomid for PCT bro.

thanks bro my plans were just adex and clomid do i use hcg at the end of my cycle or from the beginning..

[Lunk1]

You should check out my log, I think it's a waste to do two injections a week. I do two pins of 1.5ml each every monday. You have to remember how Sustanon 250 works. Many people will be against me on this once again, but 1 big injection a week is the way to go so you get a higher amount of propionate right away which sustains you until the isoprop and the other esters kick in. Trust me bro, 2 pins on mondays @ 1.5cc each and you'll be good to go.

Your right...I am totaly against you on that one! The reality is that the BEST protocal for ALL AAS regardless of the ester is ED pinning. The best practice is to maintain the most stable blood levels as possible. Now I have no intent on pinning long esters ED but it is the BEST way!

The method your suggesting will not work the best at all with the prop ester. Consider the half life and by the time you pin again the 25mg or whatever of prop will have totally cleared the system then be reintroduced...this creates peaks and valleys...some ppl actually have negetive side effects when they experience the drops..

[Bio-Active]

I have to agree with lunk here. Pinning sust once a week for most would be to many highs and lows. It would be much better to keep your levels as stable as possible which means less sides.

Your right...I am totaly against you on that one! The reality is that the BEST protocal for ALL AAS regardless of the ester is ED pinning. The best practice is to maintain the most stable blood levels as possible. Now I have no intent on pinning long esters ED but it is the BEST way!

The method your suggesting will not work the best at all with the prop ester. Consider the half life and by the time you pin again the 25mg or whatever of prop will have totally cleared the system then be reintroduced...this creates peaks and valleys...some ppl actually have negetive side effects when they experience the drops..

[P.Money]

Your right...I am totaly against you on that one! The reality is that the BEST protocal for ALL AAS regardless of the ester is ED pinning. The best practice is to maintain the most stable blood levels as possible. Now I have no intent on pinning long esters ED but it is the BEST way!

The method your suggesting will not work the best at all with the prop ester. Consider the half life and by the time you pin again the 25mg or whatever of prop will have totally cleared the system then be reintroduced...this creates peaks and valleys...some ppl actually have negetive side effects when they experience the drops..

25mg of prop? If you do 3cc on mondays you'll actually get 90mg of prop at once which is the normal dosage one would use when pinning ED/EOD.
Once the prop is gone you'll be coasting on 180mg of phenyl-propionate and 180mg of isocaproate and the 300mg of decanoate will sustain you until your next injection.

You guys all talk about stable blood levels, pinning anything EOD is what creates spikes and side effects. Of course no one will agree with me, and I can really careless because I've been on 750mg of S250 for almost 6 weeks with literally no sides besides a little water retention.

Go ahead, pin your Sust twice a week, you're wasting your time and money.

[Bio-Active]

I have to disagree though everyone metabolizes Test different i can tell you from experience that even test C once a week will give most the roller coaster effect.

25mg of prop? If you do 3cc on mondays you'll actually get 90mg of prop at once which is the normal dosage one would use when pinning ED/EOD.
Once the prop is gone you'll be coasting on 180mg of phenyl-propionate and 180mg of isocaproate and the 300mg of decanoate will sustain you until your next injection.

You guys all talk about stable blood levels, pinning anything EOD is what creates spikes and side effects. Of course no one will agree with me, and I can really careless because I've been on 750mg of S250 for almost 6 weeks with literally no sides besides a little water retention.

Go ahead, pin your Sust twice a week, you're wasting your time and money.

[P.Money]

I suppose what works for me may not work for others. The S250 blend was designed for sustained released to go for injections twice a month, I'll stick with weekly injections, that's what works for me.

[Lunk1]

It doesn't matter if you get 50mg or 200mg of prop...withing 3-4 days your already down to half and by 8 dys it's nearly gone. It doesnt matter how many mg you inject..it still has the same reate of absortian and half life.

Would you agree that the half like of prop is approx. 4 days? if so then would you agree that the 90 mg of prop your suggesting is already down to 45mg by day 4 and by day 8 it would be nearly 0? That means that 7 days apart leaves you with very low levels and then your skyrocketing them agin the following Monday.

Thats why the BEST overall method even for Test C is ED injections...very little drop off occurs and blood levels remain stable. Your methed...while you might feel fine...still is not contributing to your levels and by the not contributing to your gains to the same degree that more frequent injections would!

I would be interested in hearing good evidence of less frequent pinning being better...cause I would take advantage of it myself

[P.Money]

It doesn't matter if you get 50mg or 200mg of prop...withing 3-4 days your already down to half and by 8 dys it's nearly gone. It doesnt matter how many mg you inject..it still has the same reate of absortian and half life.

Would you agree that the half like of prop is approx. 4 days? if so then would you agree that the 90 mg of prop your suggesting is already down to 45mg by day 4 and by day 8 it would be nearly 0? That means that 7 days apart leaves you with very low levels and then your skyrocketing them agin the following Monday.

Thats why the BEST overall method even for Test C is ED injections...very little drop off occurs and blood levels remain stable. Your methed...while you might feel fine...still is not contributing to your levels and by the not contributing to your gains to the same degree that more frequent injections would!

I would be interested in hearing good evidence of less frequent pinning being better...cause I would take advantage of it myself

You seem to only be caring about the prop ester? There's 3 other esters that will keep releasing when the prop is gone, which are in even higher quantities than the prop.

In 3cc of Organon Sustanon 250:
90mg Propionate; Active half-life 2 days
180mg Phenylpropionate; Active half-life 2-4 days
180mg Isocaproate; Active half-life 4-5 days
300mg Decanoate; Active half-life 7-8 days

Seriously, you are just completely brushing over the fact that the other higher dosed esters are even present in S250. Looks perfect for weekly injections to me, do you need a drawing? Longer esters simply means slower release, all esters will be releasing at the same time, some faster than others, which ultimately if you were to look at a graph will give you a pretty good release curve over 7 days.

[P.Money]

And not contributing to my gains? Man I've doubled my bench press in 6 weeks, my boxing coaches are blown away by my performance. I can run faster and longer than I've ever ran, my endurance is unbelievable. I've never been this powerful in my life. You are absolutely wrong my friend. I can careless what the body building propaganda has been saying for years about how to inject short/long esters. You guys are so set in your own ways it's not even funny. You guys should try some new things once in a while, being old school does you guys no favours.

[Lunk1]

You seem to only be caring about the prop ester? There's 3 other esters that will keep releasing when the prop is gone, which are in even higher quantities than the prop.

In 3cc of Organon Sustanon 250:
90mg Propionate; Active half-life 2 days
180mg Phenylpropionate; Active half-life 2-4 days By this math alone you lose 270mg by the time your next injection comes around
180mg Isocaproate; Active half-life 4-5 days Here you lose 70% or better by your next pin
300mg Decanoate; Active half-life 7-8 days

Seriously, you are just completely brushing over the fact that the other higher dosed esters are even present in S250. Looks perfect for weekly injections to me, do you need a drawing? Longer esters simply means slower release, all esters will be releasing at the same time, some faster than others, which ultimately if you were to look at a graph will give you a pretty good release curve over 7 days.

Are you making gains...sure! To bad the gains are being having to inject 750mg of Test 1X a week instead of 500mg or less injected 2 X week!
I'm just using simple math...add and subtract. Your using 750mg of test and by the time your next pin rolls around you are floating on an estimated 200mg or so!

Just imagine if you would the amount of test that would be in your system if you injected this blend 2Xweek, or even better...divided by EOD. Do as you please but your method is NOT the best way, plain and simple! ANYBODY should know that the more often you inject the more stable your bloofd levels will be and they also know that stable blood leveles are the key to growth.

Believe me...i undrstand esters and I understand that longer esters remaining in your system but the fact remains the short esters are not and then they are re-introduced every week when you pin. There is no way to argue that this doesn't cause peeks and valleys!

[Brick]

Pmoney.

I agree with the others on this issue but in no way am I attacking you. We used to think the world was flat and anyone saying otherwise was burned.

What is more important when dealing with this issue is evidence supporting your claim that 750mg of sus250 once a week is better then 500mg/twice a week. Did someone tell you this dosing protocol or did you come up with it on your own? Do you have any scientific studies supporting your claims or are you your own science experiment?

Remember I am not attacking you. I am more interested in the science behind your theory!

[P.Money]

Pmoney.

I agree with the others on this issue but in no way am I attacking you. We used to think the world was flat and anyone saying otherwise was burned.

What is more important when dealing with this issue is evidence supporting your claim that 750mg of sus250 once a week is better then 500mg/twice a week. Did someone tell you this dosing protocol or did you come up with it on your own? Do you have any scientific studies supporting your claims or are you your own science experiment?

Remember I am not attacking you. I am more interested in the science behind your theory!

Before choosing Sustanon 250, I did a lot of research and read a lot of logs about people's pinning cycles with the blend.

Applying Lunk1's theory won't get you to take advantage of any of the esters, how is pinning twice a week with 1.5cc going to help your Testosterone levels stay higher? If we do the exact same quick math he did, by your next pin your levels are going to be the exact same because the amounts of Testosterone injected is half. I'd rather spike my Testosterone once a week than twice a week. I'm fully taking advantage of the Propionate / Phenyl-Propionate with the way I inject. If I was to do 1.5cc pins twice a week I would get half of the amounts I'm getting. S250 was made for sustained release, there's already science behind it. I'm not trying to re-invent the wheel, I'm simply trying to use it for how it was designed in the first place.

Here is one of the many logs I have read before starting my cycle and making a decision on my pinning cycle:
http://www.steroid-encyclopaedia.com/blog/?p=25

[Lunk1]

Before choosing Sustanon 250, I did a lot of research and read a lot of logs about people's pinning cycles with the blend.

Applying Lunk1's theory won't get you to take advantage of any of the esters, how is pinning twice a week with 1.5cc going to help your Testosterone levels stay higher? If we do the exact same quick math he did, by your next pin your levels are going to be the exact same because the amounts of Testosterone injected is half. I'd rather spike my Testosterone once a week than twice a week. I'm fully taking advantage of the Propionate / Phenyl-Propionate with the way I inject. If I was to do 1.5cc pins twice a week I would get half of the amounts I'm getting. S250 was made for sustained release, there's already science behind it. I'm not trying to re-invent the wheel, I'm simply trying to use it for how it was designed in the first place.

Here is one of the many logs I have read before starting my cycle and making a decision on my pinning cycle:
http://www.steroid-encyclopaedia.com/blog/?p=25

This is the biggest reason I hate blends and have always siad that to take true advantage of a blend it should be injected ED or at least EOD! No you will not have lost as much of the test in 3 days that you would have lost in 7....simply impossible! From the time you pin your level goes up then starts sliding down...the longer you wait to pin the less test in your system...I don't see how you can argue that????

[Brick]

I'm going to have to agree with Lunk on this one. While I don't know the ins and outs of the math from what I have read he is correct.

Perhaps we can get Swoader to chime in? I believe he knows the math better (judging from his front loading posts)