370 for this cycle stack? First stack ever please help

[pleasehalp]

Test deca and Dboll a 10 week cycle and he told me I will need about 340 dollars. He said this is the real stuff not used for animals and from an actual lab/doctor. I know people who get it from him and have used these things and got awesome results. I just wanted to make sure this would be a good first stack

I weigh 185 pounds 5 11 and about 10% BF and been lifting for four years.

Thanks for any advice bros, first post

[AdrenalineJunkie]

Edit your post. Price discussion is against the rules

[pleasehalp]

wasn't aware thanks and fixed

[pleasehalp]

bump


please halp

[Bigshotvictoria]

First, you cannot discuss prices.

Second, This is a very bad stack. Testosterone should be the base of any and all cycles. It is also the only compound you should use for your first cycle; this is because it needs to be in every cycle, and you need to know how you will react to each compound. If you stack your first cycle and get unwanted side effects you won't be able to tell which compound is the cause, and how to treat it. In addition, steroids stop your own natural production of testosterone. Other steroids act differently in the body than testosterone. Using other AAS without test can leave you with some VERY terrible sides, such as erectile dysfunction. Test is a must!!!

Third, you are 20 years old. This is too young to start cycling as your endocrine system has not finished developing.
http://forums.steroid.com/showthread...*#.UMJX4bSWRSU Check out this forum, click the links and start your education, welcome to steroid use and the young 101!!!
Being young is a good thing though, because...

Fourth, you clearly have very little knowledge in regards to AAS. This means you have time to learn how to use these powerful hormones so that when you are ready, you can do so safely and responsibility.

Remember, steroids aren't innately safe; but they can be used safely, given proper time and education.

Good luck bro!!!

[Dpyle]

Well said big shot.

[pleasehalp]

First, you cannot discuss prices.
education.

Good luck bro!!!

Thanks a lot for the info I have been reading the link you sent me and appreciate the knowledge. I have taken Anadrol at 17 for a 2 week cycle and made it a 4 week with very low dosage (1/2 the pill) and did proper PCT


I want to go pro by the time i'm 30 and figured this would give me a boost to getting there, what reason should I wait for 25 when I may have already dmgd my enocryne system? I understand the dangers what should I do for my first cycle, thanks and with all respect do not mean to be rude.


wouldn't let me quote your post for some reason

[Bigshotvictoria]

Thanks a lot for the info I have been reading the link you sent me and appreciate the knowledge. I have taken Anadrol at 17 for a 2 week cycle and made it a 4 week with very low dosage (1/2 the pill) and did proper PCT


I want to go pro by the time i'm 30 and figured this would give me a boost to getting there, what reason should I wait for 25 when I may have already dmgd my enocryne system? I understand the dangers what should I do for my first cycle, thanks and with all respect do not mean to be rude.


wouldn't let me quote your post for some reason

you said it your self, you "may" have damaged your endocrine system. You "may" get addicted to hardcore street drugs the first time you try them, does that mean it would be safe to try them again? Doesn't makes sense when you think of it that way right? Even if you haven't damaged it, doing another cycle at such a young age is yet another assault against it, increasing the risks. Please note that these risks are far reaching, possibly effecting the entirety of your life. Don't mistake this as a scare tactic, thats not what it's meant to be. i did a dbol only cycle at 20 and my johnson didn't work for a year. I was also diagnosed with depression soon after, and still struggle with it. Are the two related, can't really say, but I find it interesting that I didn't have any issues with depression before hand. You may go haywire and not even get a single pimple, and your natural test may bounce right back; or, you may have incredible sides, and never bounce back.

With everything in life it's about weighing the cost vs. the benefit. At your age its common belief that the cost far exceeds the benefits, and what's a couple of years?

But please, if you are determined to do this, do the research on HOW to do it first. You have demonstrated a serious lack of knowledge so far, suggesting your stack as Deca and dbol. Learn all there is to know about a first cycle, using test only, proper AI use, proper SERMs for PCT, cycle protocol, PCT protocol, and the biggest one of all DIET. I don't mean any of this as an insult, only as an observed fact. You only get one body, and the info you need is at your fingertips.

[fit2bOld]

Thanks a lot for the info I have been reading the link you sent me and appreciate the knowledge. I have taken Anadrol at 17 for a 2 week cycle and made it a 4 week with very low dosage (1/2 the pill) and did proper PCT


I want to go pro by the time i'm 30 and figured this would give me a boost to getting there, what reason should I wait for 25 when I may have already dmgd my enocryne system? I understand the dangers what should I do for my first cycle, thanks and with all respect do not mean to be rude.


wouldn't let me quote your post for some reason

Statistically you have a better chance at winning powerball and being a millionaire.
Who's idea is it for a first stack?
Test only for a first cycle.
Research bro, get all the info first and put together a safe cycle that includes an AI and PCT and know why your taking these compounds and what they all do!!!

[pleasehalp]

y as an observed fact. You only get one body, and the info you need is at your fingertips.

I have my diet down to the T I have put on 45 pounds this year naturally and have same bf% might have slightly lowered it, i'm 5 11 185 and know what works as far as being natural. I have a friend who is on Deca Dboll test and he is getting great results, 3 weeks ago he was a lot weaker then me, now he is already using 50 more pounds on ATG squats and on the same level of all my other lifts what it took me a year to get to he did in less than a month. He is also 20 years old and he used to do AAS from 18-19 and got huge from it, got injured and quit and I recently got him back into it. Now i'm at the point where I have seen him and about 5 other my friends all on AAS all have awesome results and no side effects from this cycle and other types at a young age, some have been doing it since 17 and now 21 and still in the gym every day.

What would be a good first cycle for me? You mentioned just test as a first cycle, how long?

I have read stickies done my research and I get so many different answers and ideas I have learned it is better to talk to people like you guys 1 on 1 and get it down and make my decisions from their. Thanks again.

[pleasehalp]

Statistically you have a better chance at winning powerball and being a millionaire.
Who's idea is it for a first stack?
Test only for a first cycle.
Research bro, get all the info first and put together a safe cycle that includes an AI and PCT and know why your taking these compounds and what they all do!!!

Just a year ago I was told I would never reach 170 pounds till I was 23+ being natural without getting fat, well here I am a year later 45 pound gain lower bf% and at 185. Yes I realize how ridiculous it is to expect to go pro but its something I can achieve if I put my mind and hard work to it. Besides, how are you supposed to win the lotto if you don't even buy a ticket?

You mentioned test as a first cycle, I have been told in stickies and other forums/places to take PH's with them or else it wouldn't correctly. This is why I ask first hand from experienced people like yourself why and what worked for you

[Bigshotvictoria]

Ok. Before I get into this I want to be VERY clear. 25 is not far off, and you can still make great gains. Also, I'm absolutely going to get flamed for this.
First, if your doing it because your friend is doing it, that's just being an idiot. He may have done irreparable damage, he just won't know it for a year or two. When his penis stops working tell him we have a great HRT forum. Again, THIS IS A BAD IDEA!!!

First cycle, and maybe third, fourth, fifth, etc... until you stop getting good gains is test, then add another compound. I've played with some orals, hate them. I've always done test, sometimes with EQ solely for the increased appetite, which I get big time from it.

Make sure you research proper IM injections and sterile technique, don't f*** this part up!!!

Test only
weeks 1-10 Test E split twice a week. Thats 250mg monday, 250mg thursday. Hcg 250iu twice a week. if your balls are still shrinking you can up it to 500 x2/week
Adex .5mg EOD

take 2 weeks off to allow the test E to clear from your body
PCT
Clomiphene: 4 weeks @ 100mg ed first 2 weeks, 50mg ed last 2 weeks.
Tamoxifen : 4-6 weeks @ 20mg ed (40mg ed for first 2 weeks if you wish)

Get blood work before, and after.

One last note. You say your diet is perfect, please give a complete breakdown, what every meal is, macros, etc... Lets see if we can get you gains there instead of with AAS

[pleasehalp]

^ thanks a lot that looks exactly what I was looking for and it seemed a little extreme for me to get on Dboll test and deca as a first what my friend suggested.


Anyways, my first meal was a protein shake with 25g protein with 1 cup of oats and a banana my next meal will be slightly less carbs and same protein and as the night goes on I start to slowely lower my carbs and start to get my fats in and up the protein.

All in all at the end of the night my calories are at 3500 calories exactly (+- 100-200) and my micros are about 300 carbs (plus or minis depending on daily activities) 200-220g protein and 80-100g fat

[Bigshotvictoria]

^ thanks a lot that looks exactly what I was looking for and it seemed a little extreme for me to get on Dboll test and deca as a first what my friend suggested.


Anyways, my first meal was a protein shake with 25g protein with 1 cup of oats and a banana my next meal will be slightly less carbs and same protein and as the night goes on I start to slowely lower my carbs and start to get my fats in and up the protein.

All in all at the end of the night my calories are at 3500 calories exactly (+- 100-200) and my micros are about 300 carbs (plus or minis depending on daily activities) 200-220g protein and 80-100g fat

This isn't looking so hot.
I need a FULL breakdown, every single meal, like this:

7:00 1cup whole oats, 8 egg whites, 2 whole eggs, 1 piece fruit
9:30 1/2 cup almonds, protein shake
12:00p x2 8 oz chicken breast, 1cup mixed veggies, 1 medium yam
1:00 preworkout
2:30 PWO 5mg creatine, 50mg whey iso
etc, etc....

Plus a full breakdown of macros

[Bigshotvictoria]

even better, do exactly this, in a new thread in the nutrition section.

[pleasehalp]

Okay let me try to put it as best as possible

9:20 1 scoop of protein 25g protein 1 cup whole oats a banana

12 PM 1/2 cup of Black beans and 3-4 Oz of chicken breast

2 PM (usually pre workout) 1 cup of milk 1 cup 1/4 of shreddred wheats (50g carbs),berries protein scoop (25g protein)

5 PM Post workout scoop of protein (25 g) creatine, 1 cup milk 2 tablespoons of chocolate syrup 1/4 cup white rice and a can of tuna

6:30-7 PM 1 cup of brown rice and two chicken breasts (usually divide meals into two meals)

9 pm avocado big hass with chicken breast

10 PM another chkn breast or cottage cheese (depending on total P end of night) with olive oil shots 1 tablespoon, fish oils and bed

[Bigshotvictoria]

Okay let me try to put it as best as possible

9:20 1 scoop of protein 25g protein 1 cup whole oats a banana

12 PM 1/2 cup of Black beans and 3-4 Oz of chicken breast

2 PM (usually pre workout) 1 cup of milk 1 cup 1/4 of shreddred wheats (50g carbs),berries protein scoop (25g protein)

5 PM Post workout scoop of protein (25 g) creatine, 1 cup milk 2 tablespoons of chocolate syrup 1/4 cup white rice and a can of tuna

6:30-7 PM 1 cup of brown rice and two chicken breasts (usually divide meals into two meals)

9 pm avocado big hass with chicken breast

10 PM another chkn breast or cottage cheese (depending on total P end of night) with olive oil shots 1 tablespoon, fish oils and bed

I hate to break it to you, but this is nowhere near as spot on as you think. like I said, go to the nutrition section, start a thread, and post this, they'll get you making gains. AAS is a waste on this diet right now bro.

[pleasehalp]

I hate to break it to you, but this is nowhere near as spot on as you think. like I said, go to the nutrition section, start a thread, and post this, they'll get you making gains. AAS is a waste on this diet right now bro.

I made a nutrition log and pictures in the nutrition sections, please fallow me their.

[Perseverance1]

I have my diet down to the T I have put on 45 pounds this year naturally and have same bf% might have slightly lowered it, i'm 5 11 185 and know what works as far as being natural. I have a friend who is on Deca Dboll test and he is getting great results, 3 weeks ago he was a lot weaker then me, now he is already using 50 more pounds on ATG squats and on the same level of all my other lifts what it took me a year to get to he did in less than a month. He is also 20 years old and he used to do AAS from 18-19 and got huge from it, got injured and quit and I recently got him back into it. Now i'm at the point where I have seen him and about 5 other my friends all on AAS all have awesome results and no side effects from this cycle and other types at a young age, some have been doing it since 17 and now 21 and still in the gym every day.

What would be a good first cycle for me? You mentioned just test as a first cycle, how long?

I have read stickies done my research and I get so many different answers and ideas I have learned it is better to talk to people like you guys 1 on 1 and get it down and make my decisions from their. Thanks again.

So you've been training for four years, are 5'10 185, and this last year you gained 45 pounds of lean body mass, possibly more since you say you lost fat too...what the hell were you doing those other 3 years? Endless curls in the squat rack???

Something doesn't add up. Just wait till you're 24-25.

[Perseverance1]

Okay let me try to put it as best as possible

9:20 1 scoop of protein 25g protein 1 cup whole oats a banana

12 PM 1/2 cup of Black beans and 3-4 Oz of chicken breast

2 PM (usually pre workout) 1 cup of milk 1 cup 1/4 of shreddred wheats (50g carbs),berries protein scoop (25g protein)

5 PM Post workout scoop of protein (25 g) creatine, 1 cup milk 2 tablespoons of chocolate syrup 1/4 cup white rice and a can of tuna

6:30-7 PM 1 cup of brown rice and two chicken breasts (usually divide meals into two meals)

9 pm avocado big hass with chicken breast

10 PM another chkn breast or cottage cheese (depending on total P end of night) with olive oil shots 1 tablespoon, fish oils and bed

That's like nothing....what are your total macros? I think I eat more than that in JUST my pre/post workout meals and I HATE eating. I'm also only 210 right now.

[pleasehalp]

So you've been training for four years, are 5'10 185, and this last year you gained 45 pounds of lean body mass, possibly more since you say you lost fat too...what the hell were you doing those other 3 years? Endless curls in the squat rack???

Something doesn't add up. Just wait till you're 24-25.

LOL come on man you know, not hitting legs, not dieting, smoking partying not sleeping right etc etc. I did go from 130 pounds to 145 in 3 years but I thought if I just ran did bench press etc i'd get huge that way.

Past year I learned to diet and be committed and never miss a day in the gym

[pleasehalp]

That's like nothing....what are your total macros? I think I eat more than that in JUST my pre/post workout meals and I HATE eating. I'm also only 210 right now.

3500 calories, this is an estimate of the day, I go more off of total calories

[pleasehalp]

Never exceed over 110 grams of fat, and more than 350 carbs or more than 250 protein but make sure my total calories are at 3500 at the end of the night.

[pleasehalp]

3500 calories, this is an estimate of the day, I go more off of total calories

a total of 3500 bro.

Edit

[Perseverance1]

Never exceed over 110 grams of fat, and more than 350 carbs or more than 250 protein but make sure my total calories are at 3500 at the end of the night.

These macros are poor. What is your body type? Mesomorph? Cut your fat in half and send those macros to your protein intake.

I am a Mesomorph and my macros are 575pro/275carbs/70fat. 90% of my carb intake is pre/post workout (I lift in the mornings)

[GymRat96744]

Just looking at your diet. You need to eat more. You can put on size by just eating more. A shake and 1 cup of oats and a banana is not a good breakfast.

[Perseverance1]

Just looking at your diet. You need to eat more. You can put on size by just eating more. A shake and 1 cup of oats and a banana is not a good breakfast.

Yup, eating is BY FAR the roughest part of this hobby...but also the MOST important. Nothing is more anabolic than food.

[pleasehalp]

These macros are poor. What is your body type? Mesomorph? Cut your fat in half and send those macros to your protein intake.

I am a Mesomorph and my macros are 575pro/275carbs/70fat. 90% of my carb intake is pre/post workout (I lift in the mornings)

there is no such thing as a body type, only an over eater and an under eater and 575 pro is waaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaay to much dude, i'm natural and I need the higher fat to regulate GH's and overall health,

I have put on 45 pounds of LBM in a year from IIFYM and keeping my proteins at roughly 1G per body weight, people on gear it has been proven best to be at 1.5grams.

[pleasehalp]

Just looking at your diet. You need to eat more. You can put on size by just eating more. A shake and 1 cup of oats and a banana is not a good breakfast.

I agree I should eat more in the morning so I don't have to eat as much later but overall its about your total at the end of the night. If I eat any higher then 3500 calories a day it will go straight to fat, my maintenance is at 3200 calories as it is and i;'m eating 300 over

[pleasehalp]

Yup, eating is BY FAR the roughest part of this hobby...but also the MOST important. Nothing is more anabolic than food.

I agree, I started a bulk at 2200 calories, then 2500, finally reached 165 and moved it to 2700 calories then went to 3200 calories and was putting on only fat and minimal muscle, dropped it down to 3000 calories, bumped it to 3300 calories, now I weigh 185 pounds and I eat 3500 calories a day.

that was me a year ago

[pleasehalp]

This is me now at 185 a year later went from 17 inch thighs to 23


I'll be back in an hour or so going ot the store, looking forward to hearing some more questions/criticizing thanks

[Perseverance1]

there is no such thing as a body type, only an over eater and an under eater and 575 pro is waaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaay to much dude, i'm natural and I need the higher fat to regulate GH's and overall health,

I have put on 45 pounds of LBM in a year from IIFYM and keeping my proteins at roughly 1G per body weight, people on gear it has been proven best to be at 1.5grams.

Really? It has been proven that people on gear gain LBM optimally at 1.5g of protein per pound of body weight? Can you give me a link to that study? What were the controls?

You know, it's sad that you don't even know that there are different body types (meso/endo/ecto)...

Oh, and while I will forever be a student of bodybuilding, my lifting partner hired Ken Hill "Skip" to be his bodybuilding coach/trainer. You probably don't know who he is because you don't seem to know much of anything but I can assure you, he knows what he's talking about...and all I do is regurgitate his information.

[Bio-Active]

http://forums.steroid.com/showthread...s#.UMKEyHf4J8E

[GymRat96744]

Okay OP since no one has said it yet. Please dont take this the wrong way as this is just my opinion. You are 20 years old and have made some great progress by your pictures. You want to go pro by 30. I'm not at all saying that it is impossible but you need to know that pros have unbelievable genetics. I'm mean unreal genetics. I am a firm believer in you can do anything you put your mind to and work hard for. But please take what the vets tell on here very seriously. They know their stuff and have been in this game a longtime. I truly and sincerely hope that you reach that pro stage one day. Good luck and train hard!

[canesfan804]

If you gained 45 lbs of lean mass in the last year, why do AAS? If I could put 45 on I wouldnt even look into it. Hell if I could put 15 on in a year Id be happy. Just keep dialing that diet in and wait till you have reached your genetic limits. Trust me 4- 5 years is a blink away. It really is not worth it.

[pleasehalp]

Okay OP since no one has said it yet. Please dont take this the wrong way as this is just my opinion. You are 20 years old and have made some great progress by your pictures. You want to go pro by 30. I'm not at all saying that it is impossible but you need to know that pros have unbelievable genetics. I'm mean unreal genetics. I am a firm believer in you can do anything you put your mind to and work hard for. But please take what the vets tell on here very seriously. They know their stuff and have been in this game a longtime. I truly and sincerely hope that you reach that pro stage one day. Good luck and train hard!

Thanks bro and I have awesome genetics and a very determined mind and I listen to each and every ones post and always respect it.

[pleasehalp]

If you gained 45 lbs of lean mass in the last year, why do AAS? If I could put 45 on I wouldnt even look into it. Hell if I could put 15 on in a year Id be happy. Just keep dialing that diet in and wait till you have reached your genetic limits. Trust me 4- 5 years is a blink away. It really is not worth it.

This is the only reason I haven't taken anything yet but I am ready to take it to the next step

[pleasehalp]

Really? It has been proven that people on gear gain LBM optimally at 1.5g of protein per pound of body weight? Can you give me a link to that study? What were the controls?

You know, it's sad that you don't even know that there are different body types (meso/endo/ecto)...

Oh, and while I will forever be a student of bodybuilding, my lifting partner hired Ken Hill "Skip" to be his bodybuilding coach/trainer. You probably don't know who he is because you don't seem to know much of anything but I can assure you, he knows what he's talking about...and all I do is regurgitate his information.

You eat 600grams of proteins a day and less than 100 grams of fat, i'm not going to teach you nutrition 101 after you insult me. Good luck on that 600 grams of protein diet.

[Bigshotvictoria]

You eat 600grams of proteins a day and less than 100 grams of fat, i'm not going to teach you nutrition 101 after you insult me. Good luck on that 600 grams of protein diet.

I've spoon fed you exactly what you wanted to hear. Your'e quite clearly not interested in anything else other than arguing, so lets call it a day, ok?

[pleasehalp]

I've spoon fed you exactly what you wanted to hear. Your'e quite clearly not interested in anything else other than arguing, so lets call it a day, ok?

Argue? No. To debate, yes. I'm sorry but not even Arnold/Phill heath/ Branch warren etc etc takes in 600 grams of protein a day. Anyways this thread is done you're right, if you want to talk about nutrition more and have any advice or questions fallow me here,

thanks

http://forums.steroid.com/showthread...40#post6289740