Whats the most time youve spent on?

[Psaletta]

I know there are a few guys on here that blast and cruse for months even a yr. what about others? What's the longest time you have spent on gear and what where the pros/cons to such a lengthy cycle. Did gains decrees over time? Did you have to up dosage and cals as you continued?

[The Bear 79]

I blast & cruise, I know you're looking to hear from standard "on / off" users, but I just wanted to a bit of MY experience.

I have not noticed a decrease in gains, nor was there a NEED to up the doses, but you definitely have to adjust your intake the bigger you get or your growth will slow to a crawl if not stop completely.

[AdrenalineJunkie]

It's not worth it IMO. We all know people who have cruised for months at a time, and there are guys at my gym that cycle an entire year but why would you want to? The risks go up the longer you are on. And just because you know someone who is cycling for an extended period and appears fine doesn't mean they will be forever, who's to say how those guy are effected down the road. They'll all probably end up on TRT for life. Run recommended cycle lengths with a proper PCT.

[The Bear 79]

Let's have a closer look at the "threat" of TRT for life.

If you are unable to recover your natural Testosterone production due to extensive cycling or large dose cycling, you will need TRT to for the rest of your life in order to function normally............I don't deny that................but why is it made out to be such a threat or the worst thing that could happen to you??

I don't see having the Testosterone levels of a 15 - 20 year old kid for the rest of my life, as a threat, does this sound like a threat to any of you? Actually that seems rather tantalizing to me...............sign me the fvck up! And don't give me that bull sh!t about how much it sucks to have to pin once a week, I currently pin 10 times a week, once a week would be a fvcking treat. If the Doc won't prescribe it, I'll do it myself.

As for increased "risks" the longer you're on.............well, aside from the risk of permanent HPTA shut down (which is easily fixed with one shot a week) what risks are we talking about................. cholesterol............easily controlled, blood pressure............easily controlled, prostate enlargement................easily controlled & so on & so on. I get blood work every 90 days, & I can say with 100% certainty, there IS a safe way to cycle for extended periods.

Though I am of the opinion that unless you have a legit shot at the IFBB or WSM titles, there's really no point in blast & cruise, vanity is not a good excuse to willingly & knowingly shut yourself down for life.

"I'm just sayin........."

[Atomini]

Everything bear said.

I am not a fan of it. And I always advise very short cycles as they are the safest and easiest, and quickest to recover from. But if long cycles and cruising can be done safely, though the margin for error is large... you must know what you are doing at all times. And for the average individual who has no reason professionally or otherwise to do it, people should avoid this at all coats.

[The Bear 79]

lol..........you gotta get rid of that title Atomini.......

[Psaletta]

Let's have a closer look at the "threat" of TRT for life.

If you are unable to recover your natural Testosterone production due to extensive cycling or large dose cycling, you will need TRT to for the rest of your life in order to function normally............I don't deny that................but why is it made out to be such a threat or the worst thing that could happen to you??

I don't see having the Testosterone levels of a 15 - 20 year old kid for the rest of my life, as a threat, does this sound like a threat to any of you? Actually that seems rather tantalizing to me...............sign me the fvck up! And don't give me that bull sh!t about how much it sucks to have to pin once a week, I currently pin 10 times a week, once a week would be a fvcking treat. If the Doc won't prescribe it, I'll do it myself.

As for increased "risks" the longer you're on.............well, aside from the risk of permanent HPTA shut down (which is easily fixed with one shot a week) what risks are we talking about................. cholesterol............easily controlled, blood pressure............easily controlled, prostate enlargement................easily controlled & so on & so on. I get blood work every 90 days, & I can say with 100% certainty, there IS a safe way to cycle for extended periods.

Though I am of the opinion that unless you have a legit shot at the IFBB or WSM titles, there's really no point in blast & cruise, vanity is not a good excuse to willingly & knowingly shut yourself down for life.

"I'm just sayin........."

^^^ great reply bear! I agree that trt is far from the worst thing that could happen to someone.. I also agree that if your not the next jay cutler purposely shutting down your self for the sake of ascetics is plain idiotic!! Great replies guys thanks!

[Euroholic]

I disagree im a very vain person who is not fussed with growing old.

[Crooktele79]

Taking the blasting part of the equation out for a moment...does TRT in and of itself present any side effects in regards to the heart, liver, and prostate that cycling does? I'm just trying to wrap my head around why, if you don't desire kids, TRT is so bad? Other than the fact that it is a literal "pain in the ass." lol

[The Bear 79]

Taking the blasting part of the equation out for a moment...does TRT in and of itself present any side effects in regards to the heart, liver, and prostate that cycling does? I'm just trying to wrap my head around why, if you don't desire kids, TRT is so bad? Other than the fact that it is a literal "pain in the ass." lol

TRT does present some cholesterol, blood pressure & prostate issues that will need constant control.

[Metalject]

Let's have a closer look at the "threat" of TRT for life.

If you are unable to recover your natural Testosterone production due to extensive cycling or large dose cycling, you will need TRT to for the rest of your life in order to function normally............I don't deny that................but why is it made out to be such a threat or the worst thing that could happen to you??

I don't see having the Testosterone levels of a 15 - 20 year old kid for the rest of my life, as a threat, does this sound like a threat to any of you? Actually that seems rather tantalizing to me...............sign me the fvck up! And don't give me that bull sh!t about how much it sucks to have to pin once a week, I currently pin 10 times a week, once a week would be a fvcking treat. If the Doc won't prescribe it, I'll do it myself.

As for increased "risks" the longer you're on.............well, aside from the risk of permanent HPTA shut down (which is easily fixed with one shot a week) what risks are we talking about................. cholesterol............easily controlled, blood pressure............easily controlled, prostate enlargement................easily controlled & so on & so on. I get blood work every 90 days, & I can say with 100% certainty, there IS a safe way to cycle for extended periods.

Though I am of the opinion that unless you have a legit shot at the IFBB or WSM titles, there's really no point in blast & cruise, vanity is not a good excuse to willingly & knowingly shut yourself down for life.

"I'm just sayin........."

Best common sense response I've seen on here....ever.

[s.e.bowen]

TRT does present some cholesterol, blood pressure & prostate issues that will need constant control.

Can you elaborate on controlling prostate issues? Pls & ty.

s.e.bowen

[The Bear 79]

Can you elaborate on controlling prostate issues? Pls & ty.

s.e.bowen

It has been said that higher Test. levels can lead to enlarged prostate & in some cases, prostate cancer.

I use Saw Palmetto along side 2 other compounds (I can't remember their names at the moment, I'll look this evening when I get home) to promote premium prostate health.

[Tron3219]

What's ur blast and cruise protocol bear? Weeks blasting and weeks cruising. U can omit the POUNDS of gear u use! Lol

-TroN-

[Crooktele79]

I believe I came across some info on here which labeled high estrogen levels as a cause of enlarged prostate and the development of cancer as well. They mentioned that testosterone caused the cancer cells to multiply.

[Metalject]

It has been said that higher Test. levels can lead to enlarged prostate & in some cases, prostate cancer.

I use Saw Palmetto along side 2 other compounds (I can't remember their names at the moment, I'll look this evening when I get home) to promote premium prostate health.

The idea of testosterone promoting prostate cancer started 60yrs ago or so and was based on one study performed on one man who was castrated.

If we look at current data we find less than 1% of all men on TRT ever have prostate cancer...obviously this doesn't take into account steroid users, running cycles. However, this figure is still worthwhile when we compare it to the rest of the population where we find 1 in 7 have some type of prostate cancer related issue in their lifetime.

All that said, I'm not knocking trying to take care of your prostate. I should probably give mine more attention. After all, it grows as we age no matter what we do...at least that's my understanding.

[The Bear 79]

What's ur blast and cruise protocol bear? Weeks blasting and weeks cruising. U can omit the POUNDS of gear u use! Lol

-TroN-

Blast = 8 to 10 weeks at 3,000 mg/wk of Test. + 2,000 mg/wk of Tren.

Cruise = 2 to 3 weeks at 170 mg/wk of Test.

[Crooktele79]

Mother Of God what a blast!!!

[knuckles69]

Have to agree with bear. As long as regular blood work is done and you understand exactly what your doing then hey go nuts and get big

[Metalject]

Blast = 8 to 10 weeks at 3,000 mg/wk of Test. + 2,000 mg/wk of Tren.

Cruise = 2 to 3 weeks at 170 mg/wk of Test.

Why 170mg of test during your cruise? What I mean is how did you come up with this number? Just curious.

[TheClinch]

Why 170mg of test during your cruise? What I mean is how did you come up with this number? Just curious.

That is a common trt dose.

[The Bear 79]

Why 170mg of test during your cruise? What I mean is how did you come up with this number? Just curious.

The idea of the cruise is to give the body a rest, to do so you need to bring your levels back to "normal". 500 or 750 or 1,000 mg/wk is not a cruise just because it's less than what you were blasting with, it's just a lesser dosed cycle / blast. If you don't bring your levels back to normal, then you are not resting the body.

[Metalject]

I understand the point in cruising. I asked about the 170mg dose because most who cruise simple inject 1ml/wk of some large ester testosterone, such as cyp or test-e, which would give the guy 200-250mg/wk.

Nothing wrong with 170mg and I understand that dose will probably keep you in a decent range, was just curious why you didn't go with something simple that's all. Thought maybe you had a specific reason for going with 170....I mean if you're going to pinpoint it that close why not 165 or 180? See what I'm asking?

[Juced_porkchop]

^^^ great reply bear! I agree that trt is far from the worst thing that could happen to someone.. I also agree that if your not the next jay cutler purposely shutting down your self for the sake of ascetics is plain idiotic!! Great replies guys thanks!

not really... if you want a semi-finctional form of birth control haha im on HRT and i dont care about small nutz, i will use HCG one day when i want kids, for now w/e

just make sure you also take preng and |DHEA with your hrt long term if thats what you do.

[The Bear 79]

I understand the point in cruising. I asked about the 170mg dose because most who cruise simple inject 1ml/wk of some large ester testosterone, such as cyp or test-e, which would give the guy 200-250mg/wk.

Nothing wrong with 170mg and I understand that dose will probably keep you in a decent range, was just curious why you didn't go with something simple that's all. Thought maybe you had a specific reason for going with 170....I mean if you're going to pinpoint it that close why not 165 or 180? See what I'm asking?

Because my blood work has shown me that 170 mg/wk keeps me in the upper normal range.

[Atomini]

lol..........you gotta get rid of that title Atomini.......

Think so? It damages my reputation doesn't it? Was a good little inside joke for a while but you're right, i'll get admin to change it. Think up of something better to go there!

[Atomini]

The idea of testosterone promoting prostate cancer started 60yrs ago or so and was based on one study performed on one man who was castrated.

If we look at current data we find less than 1% of all men on TRT ever have prostate cancer...obviously this doesn't take into account steroid users, running cycles. However, this figure is still worthwhile when we compare it to the rest of the population where we find 1 in 7 have some type of prostate cancer related issue in their lifetime.

All that said, I'm not knocking trying to take care of your prostate. I should probably give mine more attention. After all, it grows as we age no matter what we do...at least that's my understanding.

Estrogen in fact plays a massive role in the promotion of prostate cancer as evidenced by an overwhelming amount of clinical data (as you no doubt should know). More people need to be aware of this. Androgens do not play as large of a role in prostate cancer as once believed (a VERY long time ago too, might I add).

[Psaletta]

Blast = 8 to 10 weeks at 3,000 mg/wk of Test. + 2,000 mg/wk of Tren.

Cruise = 2 to 3 weeks at 170 mg/wk of Test.

So you do a 8 week blast and 2 week Cruz then back to blast? How long do you continue to do this for?

[s.e.bowen]

It has been said that higher Test. levels can lead to enlarged prostate & in some cases, prostate cancer.

I use Saw Palmetto along side 2 other compounds (I can't remember their names at the moment, I'll look this evening when I get home) to promote premium prostate health.

Thank you Bear, I appreciate it!

s.e.bowen

[Soar]

I'd like to add that the normal person trying to bulk doesn't need anywhere near Bears dosages. I'd hate for some noobie to come by and read that 5g of gear a week will make him big. Bear has been doing this for ages and knows what he's doing. Do not try this.

[Turkish Juicer]

Estrogen in fact plays a massive role in the promotion of prostate cancer as evidenced by an overwhelming amount of clinical data (as you no doubt should know). More people need to be aware of this. Androgens do not play as large of a role in prostate cancer as once believed (a VERY long time ago too, might I add).

... and this goes to all the smarties who will advocate the theory of avoiding AI use during an AAS cycle.

[The Bear 79]

So you do a 8 week blast and 2 week Cruz then back to blast? How long do you continue to do this for?

11 months so far.

[The Bear 79]

I'd like to add that the normal person trying to bulk doesn't need anywhere near Bears dosages. I'd hate for some noobie to come by and read that 5g of gear a week will make him big. Bear has been doing this for ages and knows what he's doing. Do not try this.

And I will add, I am training to compete in the worlds strongest man comps.

[The Bear 79]

... and this goes to all the smarties who will advocate the theory of avoiding AI use during an AAS cycle.

I was gonna say the same thing Turk.

AI's should not be looked at as optional Gents.

[Atomini]

... and this goes to all the smarties who will advocate the theory of avoiding AI use during an AAS cycle.

Definitely. People place take things to the extreme of either end with a lot of things. For example...

"OMG ESTROGEN IS BAD! MUST ELIMINATE IT ALL WITH AN AI!"

or

"REDUCING ESTROGEN IS NOT GOOD, DONT RUN AN AI"

Well, my philosophy is: try to control Estrogen as best as possible without an AI. If the need for an AI arises, use it for Estrogen control rather than Estrogen elimination. Estrogen control is defined as keeping Estrogen levels as close as possible to normal physiological ranges.

There, that's not so difficult is it? There's no reason for people to take things to utter extremes, but I see it all the time here. It's crazy.

[TheClinch]

Definitely. People place take things to the extreme of either end with a lot of things. For example...

"OMG ESTROGEN IS BAD! MUST ELIMINATE IT ALL WITH AN AI!"

or

"REDUCING ESTROGEN IS NOT GOOD, DONT RUN AN AI"

Well, my philosophy is: try to control Estrogen as best as possible without an AI. If the need for an AI arises, use it for Estrogen control rather than Estrogen elimination. Estrogen control is defined as keeping Estrogen levels as close as possible to normal physiological ranges.

There, that's not so difficult is it? There's no reason for people to take things to utter extremes, but I see it all the time here. It's crazy.

Why not dose to lower estrogen without completely eliminating it? Maintaining more stable levels is certainly a smarter method hormonally speaking.

Especially seeing that too high or too low of levels can hinder gains and reduce your general feeling of wellness. Let alone the health issues regarding prostate cancer and other estroge related side effects of cycling.

[Metalject]

Definitely. People place take things to the extreme of either end with a lot of things. For example...

"OMG ESTROGEN IS BAD! MUST ELIMINATE IT ALL WITH AN AI!"

or

"REDUCING ESTROGEN IS NOT GOOD, DONT RUN AN AI"

Well, my philosophy is: try to control Estrogen as best as possible without an AI. If the need for an AI arises, use it for Estrogen control rather than Estrogen elimination. Estrogen control is defined as keeping Estrogen levels as close as possible to normal physiological ranges.

There, that's not so difficult is it? There's no reason for people to take things to utter extremes, but I see it all the time here. It's crazy.

I read this line and a tear almost came to my eye:
"Well, my philosophy is: try to control Estrogen as best as possible without an AI. If the need for an AI arises, use it for Estrogen control rather than Estrogen elimination. Estrogen control is defined as keeping Estrogen levels as close as possible to normal physiological ranges."

I had no clue there were others with this level of common sense.

[FONZY007]

And I will add, I am training to compete in the worlds strongest man comps.

Hope to see yea on tv soon

[Soar]

Hope to see yea on tv soon

You and me both

[Bio-Active]

I was gonna say the same thing Turk.

AI's should not be looked at as optional Gents.

I agree with both of you but I do not believe an ai should be used blind. You should run labs and run your ai accordingly! So many people fail to run labs!