Importance of Supplementation

[Venom]

I realize this is predominantly an anabolic board and this supplement forum section may not get too much attention which foreshadows my question.

"How important do you consider supplementation"?

Quick overview of myself, I'm 26, 5'6, 165lbs, and have been training serious going on just over two years now. I realize I am nowhere near ready for AAS usage and its going to take years till I hit my natural genetic potential. I also realize the only thing that's going to put mass on myself is increasing my calories and fallowing a tried and true training regiment and proper rest.

I'm curious to know from those of you who are natural or have used enough supplements in the past to give your standpoint on which ones are effective for muscle development and should be considered a staple.

My current staples
-Multi
-Fish Oil
-ALCAR
-Beta-Alanine
-Creatine
-BCAA
-Agmatine Sulfate
-Citrulline Malate

Things I cycle on and off
-Arachidonic acid
-PES Erase (OTC AI)
-Test Boosters
-PES Anabeta Elite-Allegedly builds LBM via Anacyclus (possibly via T elevation, although the mechanism is unclear), Forskolin (which increases LBM via cAMP), and 7-OH (which reduces cortisol, a hormone implicated in the breakdown of tissue).
-DAA
-Tongkat Ali

In the end it all boils down to how much money one is willing to spend on supplements and I'm frankly tired of spending money on unnecessary products, yet have no problem spending money on tried and true effective products. Any tips or suggestions would be much appreciated!

Thanks
-Dan-

[Dark_Ansem]

very important.
but you have to be careful and decide what is needed.
for example, Taurine is one thing that, if you need even more than 3g per day, it's better to look for supplements. I doubt that standard diet could allow such big quantities.

about other stuff, such as Anabeta Elite or Erase or Test boosters... it depends on whether you need them.
AFAIK DAA is always a safe bet, even if not overly effective.

[Venom]

very important.
but you have to be careful and decide what is needed.
for example, Taurine is one thing that, if you need even more than 3g per day, it's better to look for supplements. I doubt that standard diet could allow such big quantities.

about other stuff, such as Anabeta Elite or Erase or Test boosters... it depends on whether you need them.
AFAIK DAA is always a safe bet, even if not overly effective.

Thanks man!

[Dark_Ansem]

oh, and be sure to get something that works.

for example, APE by Athletic edge has been debunked as a multivitamin with baby doses.

[Venom]

oh, and be sure to get something that works.

for example, APE by Athletic edge has been debunked as a multivitamin with baby doses.

Lol thanks I just saw that in the other thread

I try to stay away from anything containing a proprietary blend and do my best to single out the ingredients in such products that "work" and dose them separately. For instance in Anabeta Elite, Forskolin seems to have a lot of positive literature surrounding it so now I'm going to research that further to see if it would be worthwhile using it as solo ingredient.

[baseline_9]

Supplementation is by far the most over thought out and over rated thing there is in bodybuilding...

How important do I think it is?

I think it is the least important factor there is to take into consideration when looking at an overall 'bodybuilding lifestyle'...

However the supplement industry would have you believe it is by far the most important thing.... Wonder why....

[austinite]

Supplementation is by far the most over thought out and over rated thing there is in bodybuilding...

How important do I think it is?

I think it is the least important factor there is to take into consideration when looking at an overall 'bodybuilding lifestyle'...

However the supplement industry would have you believe it is by far the most important thing.... Wonder why....

I agree that it's often over thought. But I know that I am healthier and my levels are far more optimum than I could ever get with food. That doesn't mean you cannot be healthy without supplements, but food alone will never, ever get you to optimum level. Ever.

Is it more important than food and training? Absolutely not. But most certainly should not be discredited for its benefits.

[JinNtonic]

The more stuff I've tried, the more I think its all crap and a waste of money.

[austinite]

The more stuff I've tried, the more I think its all crap and a waste of money.

lol. That's the problem with the world. All they do is read and abide.

[MajorPectorial]

I agree that it's often over thought. But I know that I am healthier and my levels are far more optimum than I could ever get with food. That doesn't mean you cannot be healthy without supplements, but food alone will never, ever get you to optimum level. Ever.

Is it more important than food and training? Absolutely not. But most certainly should not be discredited for its benefits.

I think half the problem is the amount or bioavailabilty of essential vitamins/minerals/etc etc these days as opposed to 1000 years ago.

U should chk austinites thread on supps. Best doses. What works for what. If u can afford to build your very own list like that then lucky u.
I gotta do it a bit at a time.

[Dark_Ansem]

supps also helps if you want to boost assumption of certain nutrients, such as C vitamins.
how much fruit would you have to eat in order to get 3g per day of that? a supp, even got at Tesco's, can save you your money AND time.

[belva]

The supplement indursty is all about marketing. The industry want to make you believe that you can't work out without them, you can't grow, there are not vitamins anymore in food etc... I think that if you train hard, eat alot including raw organic procucts you can go where you want, (yes this might include 20 eggs a day, half a kg meat etc..). Having said that, in the society we are today it's really difficolt to prepare meals in advance, eat at regular time etc...so supplements are an easy way to help you grow and health. but i think one should always remeber they are supplements, they don't do magic.
last thing: I think if you can eat eat

[Venom]

Thanks everyone for the awesome answers, I certainly agree with the concept of supplements are strictly there to supplement what you can't obtain through your diet.

I certainly believe supplements have their purpose and your essential vitamins and minerals can make a difference if you have a deficiency. I also believe there are certain supplements that without a doubt work, such as ALCAR, Citrulline Malate, and Agmatine Sulfate.

What I'm starting to realize is that the "muscle enhancement" supplements such as test boosters and various other compounds made up of herbal ingredients to be a waste of money. Sure some of them may work, for instance I have taken many test boosters which has spiked my libido but that doesn't mean it actually raised my test levels to anywhere significant enough to justify the price I paid.

I suppose I get caught up in "natural products" that claim to raise test levels or build lean muscle mass.

[kronik420]

training, diet, and rest are much more important than any supplement....

[MajorPectorial]

Thanks everyone for the awesome answers, I certainly agree with the concept of supplements are strictly there to supplement what you can't obtain through your diet.

I certainly believe supplements have their purpose and your essential vitamins and minerals can make a difference if you have a deficiency. I also believe there are certain supplements that without a doubt work, such as ALCAR, Citrulline Malate, and Agmatine Sulfate.

What I'm starting to realize is that the "muscle enhancement" supplements such as test boosters and various other compounds made up of herbal ingredients to be a waste of money. Sure some of them may work, for instance I have taken many test boosters which has spiked my libido but that doesn't mean it actually raised my test levels to anywhere significant enough to justify the price I paid.

I suppose I get caught up in "natural products" that claim to raise test levels or build lean muscle mass.

Pretty good summarization really.

[Venom]

Pretty good summarization really.

Thanks man, as someone who is natural for the time being its hard to break the ideology of needing supplements to progress.

It's not even the thought that I NEED supplements because I know I can achieve my goals through food it's the thought that those supplements can give me that extra "push" that I get caught up on. Whether it be an extra 5% or 25% push I get caught up on it.

[JAB1]

I realize this is predominantly an anabolic board and this supplement forum section may not get too much attention which foreshadows my question.

"How important do you consider supplementation"?

Quick overview of myself, I'm 26, 5'6, 165lbs, and have been training serious going on just over two years now. I realize I am nowhere near ready for AAS usage and its going to take years till I hit my natural genetic potential. I also realize the only thing that's going to put mass on myself is increasing my calories and fallowing a tried and true training regiment and proper rest.

I'm curious to know from those of you who are natural or have used enough supplements in the past to give your standpoint on which ones are effective for muscle development and should be considered a staple.

My current staples
-Multi
-Fish Oil
-ALCAR
-Beta-Alanine
-Creatine
-BCAA
-Agmatine Sulfate
-Citrulline Malate

Things I cycle on and off
-Arachidonic acid
-PES Erase (OTC AI)
-Test Boosters
-PES Anabeta Elite-Allegedly builds LBM via Anacyclus (possibly via T elevation, although the mechanism is unclear), Forskolin (which increases LBM via cAMP), and 7-OH (which reduces cortisol, a hormone implicated in the breakdown of tissue).
-DAA
-Tongkat Ali

In the end it all boils down to how much money one is willing to spend on supplements and I'm frankly tired of spending money on unnecessary products, yet have no problem spending money on tried and true effective products. Any tips or suggestions would be much appreciated!

Thanks
-Dan-

You seem to have educated yourself quite well, and have a good attitude!! Refreshing to see. Keep it up and best of luck in your training. As far as supps I take creatine/protein/multi/fish/flax oil and bcaa. Thats it for me for now.