How does this look

[Jonbana]

Alright got everything on hand and than some...
just planning this the best I can with the new information I found and got from you lovely people on this board .


Dbol 1-4 50mg a day ( 1hour Pre workout with shake) First week I will run 25mg than second week to 4th week will run 50mg (one bottle 5x 25mg tabs)

Deca 1-13/14 600mg ( 300mg twice a week)

Test E 1-16 800mg (400mg Twice a week)

Winny 12-16 50mg a day


Adex 1-10 0.5mg 3x a week
Aromasin 10-16 15.5mg EOD

IM starting with Adex cause I have this on hand and never used this before , but I want to finish with Aromasin because of the rebound effect you can get from Adex vs Aromasin do you guys agree with this or run Adex right to the end?


As for PCT I'll be heading back onto my TRT at 200mg Test E a week .

As for Diet I'm currently cutting / re-comping ,
I plan to head into this at a cutting calories intake still and than slowly upping my calories to maintenance than a small surplus I will not be stuffing my face but eating clean as always and listening to my body , I will be follow a intermittent fasting protocol 16/8 with carb back loading (all carbs PWO and very little 150-200G)

I want this cycle to be pure lean muscle gains with little fat as possible and hopefully burn some extra fat as well and stay below 10% BF I would normally use Tren but wasn't happy with tren results for my body so I will run deca again and compare them

Im not a fan of bulking as my last bulk with tren was not fun with weight gain so I figured go in with a cut slowly up calories and let me muscle use all the nutrients and burn some fat while fasting




any idea's or recommendations please let me know

Start date will be January 1st

[numbere]

That's not enough aromasin.

Imo the amount of aromatizing compounds you're using is too much for aromasin to be effective.

Your proposed diet seems silly to me but to each his own.

[tice1212]

It looks pretty solid. The 4 things I would say is

1:1-4week 40mg dbol 4-6week 60mg

2: 600mg of deca is a heavy dosage. 400 or 500 is prefect imo

3: I would just run the adex at 1mg eod with those dosages. Also throw 20mg of novla ed in the mix to proven gyno.

4:deca is best for putting on size not cutting. Yes it will hold muscle but so will 500mg of test. I would add 500+ calories and add size at those dosages. Ur diet method is no good imo

[Marcus G]

I agree with the above 600mg is a lot of deca and that high amount of test with dbol alone will cause a lot of estrogen side effects so adex at 1mg eod would be a starting point but you
could even need more depending on how sensitive your are to Estrogen.

[numbere]

I agree with the above 600mg is a lot of deca and that high amount of test with dbol alone will cause a lot of estrogen side effects so adex at 1mg eod would be a starting point but you
could even need more depending on how sensitive your are to Estrogen.

1mg/EOD of dex is not a good starting point.

Begin with 0.5mg/EOD then pull mid cycle labs that include a sensitive estradiol assay and adjust the dose if needed.

OP when you ran tren and didn't like the results did you also follow a similar diet?

[tice1212]

1mg/EOD of dex is not a good starting point.

Begin with 0.5mg/EOD then pull mid cycle labs that include a sensitive estradiol assay and adjust the dose if needed.

OP when you ran tren and didn't like the results did you also follow a similar diet?

What would be the down fall for him to start his adex at 1mg? If he was running lower gear I could agree with ur statement. But he is running VERY high converting compounds

[Batmanreturns]

Looks like what I wish I was on now.

How are you going to transition your calories on that much gear at your desired body fat?

How are you going to transition your calories from that to trt?

[numbere]

What would be the down fall for him to start his adex at 1mg? If he was running lower gear I could agree with ur statement. But he is running VERY high converting compounds

The down side to beginning with 1mg would be lowering his e2 too much.

0.5mg EOD = 1.75mg/week

1mg EOD = 3.5mg/week

That's a 100% increase!

OP plans on using 600mg/week test and 800mg/week.

In theory if nandrolone aromatizes at 20% the rate of test then his cycle would be similar in 920mg/week of test.

When using under a gram of test per week 0.5mg EOD of dex is a reasonable starting point.

I'm not guaranteeing that 0.5mg will be enough, he might end up using more but only blood work will tell.

You'd be much better off have slightly elevated e2 on your mid cycle labs than having low e2.

This is the third time this OP posted this cycle and 0.5mg EOD of dex was suggested every time even when he wanted to add dbol.

Heck even Marcus G adviced him to use 0.5mg EOD the last time.

[kelkel]

Jon why do you feel you need so large a cycle?

[Jonbana]

It looks pretty solid. The 4 things I would say is

1:1-4week 40mg dbol 4-6week 60mg

2: 600mg of deca is a heavy dosage. 400 or 500 is prefect imo

3: I would just run the adex at 1mg eod with those dosages. Also throw 20mg of novla ed in the mix to proven gyno.

4:deca is best for putting on size not cutting. Yes it will hold muscle but so will 500mg of test. I would add 500+ calories and add size at those dosages. Ur diet method is no good imo

THank you , Adex never used so wasn't sure on dosage , but 1mg EOD is not a problem

As for Dbol my pills are 25mg tabs.. that's why I figured 25mg than bumping up to 50mg , never used dbol before

as for 400mg deca that's what I ran 2 years ago it did work well , so your thinking 400-50mg deca and 500-600 test ?

as for nova I was told never to run nova with a nor 19..

[Jonbana]

I agree with the above 600mg is a lot of deca and that high amount of test with dbol alone will cause a lot of estrogen side effects so adex at 1mg eod would be a starting point but you
could even need more depending on how sensitive your are to Estrogen.

ok guess I will lower deca to 400-500 test 500-600 but keep adex at 1mg EOD whats your thought on finish with aromasin to provent a e2 rebound or run adex the whole time

[Jonbana]

1mg/EOD of dex is not a good starting point.

Begin with 0.5mg/EOD then pull mid cycle labs that include a sensitive estradiol assay and adjust the dose if needed.

OP when you ran tren and didn't like the results did you also follow a similar diet?

When I ran tren I was running a bulk cycle no , was in a surplus from the start

[Jonbana]

Jon why do you feel you need so large a cycle?

I don't really call this large.. I call this pretty standard im just gathering more information from you guys to be sure im not over killing .


seems most would lower the deca so I probably will lower the deca

[Marcus G]

What would be the down fall for him to start his adex at 1mg? If he was running lower gear I could agree with ur statement. But he is running VERY high converting compounds

This was my resoning for the suggested dose.

[Marcus G]

ok guess I will lower deca to 400-500 test 500-600 but keep adex at 1mg EOD whats your thought on finish with aromasin to provent a e2 rebound or run adex the whole time

I've never had an Estrogen rebound from adex. When you come off its still active for long time depending on the dose used, because of the half life it builds up in the system. But start off at 0.5 eod now you've lowered the compound doses and if your still getting Estrogen sides then adjust adex dose.

[tice1212]

THank you , Adex never used so wasn't sure on dosage , but 1mg EOD is not a problem

As for Dbol my pills are 25mg tabs.. that's why I figured 25mg than bumping up to 50mg , never used dbol before

as for 400mg deca that's what I ran 2 years ago it did work well , so your thinking 400-50mg deca and 500-600 test ?

as for nova I was told never to run nova with a nor 19..

If ur going to lower ur dosages then I would run the adex at .5mg eod. Up it if u start to get emotional or bloated. With those 3 compound.

If they are 25mg tabs bro just start off at 50mg. Imo 25mg isn't enough.

400mg of deca is perfect because it's not to crazy were the side effect are hard to handle and u can run it for much longer. It's been 2yrs since u have ran it that high so u will respond good to that dosage.

I like my test higher so 600mg of test is start honestly.

So this is what I would say is a good cycle for u

1-18 test e or c 600mg ew
1-16 deca 400mg ew
1-6 50mg dbol(cut if off if u cant handle it)

1-19 adex .5mg eod
3-17 .5 cabar
3-18 nolva 20mg ed (to battle any gyno)

[numbere]

1-18 test e or c 600mg ew
1-16 deca 400mg ew
1-6 50mg dbol(cut if off if u cant handle it)

1-19 adex .5mg eod
3-17 .5 cabar
3-18 nolva 20mg ed (to battle any gyno)

Dex should be 0.5 from week 1-20 but if OP goes back to cruising he should be fine dropping the dex back to his cruise dose after week 19.

OPs only using 400mg of nandrolone.

There's no need to use caber and nolva for the whole blast without having sexual issues, nipple issues or bw showing elevated PRL.

PRL shouldn't be a problem if he controls his e2 with an AI and bw.

[tice1212]

Dex should be 0.5 from week 1-20 but if OP goes back to cruising he should be fine dropping the dex back to his cruise dose after week 19.

OPs only using 400mg of nandrolone.

There's no need to use caber and nolva for the whole blast without having sexual issues, nipple issues or bw showing elevated PRL.

PRL shouldn't be a problem if he controls his e2 with an AI and bw.

See I though the same thing about keeping my e2 in check and I still had sexual issues and gyno.

I guess I'm just overly cautious when it comes to that stuff.

That's why I ran everything with my nor-19 cycles. (Adex, cabar and now nolva) ugh fvcking gyno even after being cautious with Adex and cabar. The nolva did the treat though

[numbere]

See I though the same thing about keeping my e2 in check and I still had sexual issues and gyno.

I guess I'm just overly cautious when it comes to that stuff.

That's why I ran everything with my nor-19 cycles. (Adex, cabar and now nolva) ugh fvcking gyno even after being cautious with Adex and cabar. The nolva did the treat though

I know exactly what you mean about 19 nors causing lump issues after repeated use.

Fortunately nolva does take care of it quickly if you use it soon after symptoms.

I've noticed that when people use mild to large amounts of 19 nors on repeated blasts gyno/sexual problems become more of an issue, even when e2 and PRL are in range.

It's just my hypothesis, but I believe it has something to do with progestins.

If one hasn't come to the conclusion that they need nolva while on 19nors then they likely haven't crossed the threshold.

If OP planned on using nandrolone and tren then I'd 100% agree 10mg of nolva from the start would be a good idea.

[tice1212]

I know exactly what you mean about 19 nors causing lump issues after repeated use.

Fortunately nolva does take care of it quickly if you use it soon after symptoms.

I've noticed that when people use mild to large amounts of 19 nors on repeated blasts gyno/sexual problems become more of an issue, even when e2 and PRL are in range.

It's just my hypothesis, but I believe it has something to do with progestins.

If one hasn't come to the conclusion that they need nolva while on 19nors then they likely haven't crossed the threshold.

If OP planned on using nandrolone and tren then I'd 100% agree 10mg of nolva from the start would be a good idea.

Yeah bro it must be progestin because this was my 3 nandrolone and I have ran 3 tren cycles too. And still got the gyno flare up. Started 40mg of nolva now down to 20mg and it seemed to go away. Not puffy anymore and they don't hurt.

That's why my protocol has so many supports in it. The last thing any guy should want is gyno. It doesn't matter how shredded and big u look, if u have 2 tits hanging there it's a wrap. Lol

[numbere]

Yeah bro it must be progestin because this was my 3 nandrolone and I have ran 3 tren cycles too. And still got the gyno flare up. Started 40mg of nolva now down to 20mg and it seemed to go away. Not puffy anymore and they don't hurt.

That's why my protocol has so many supports in it. The last thing any guy should want is gyno. It doesn't matter how shredded and big u look, if u have 2 tits hanging there it's a wrap. Lol

Huh I had roughly the same amount of 19 nor use when I had nipple problems with good hormone levels.

I've noticed that 10mg of nolva will suffice if you get on it soon.

[DHew]

Will you post your diet? I'm curious to see what your eating habits will be with this cycle.