GLUCORELLR- Is this stuff just another bogus supplement ?

[Joe Rilla]

Normally I wouldnt take any supplement serious but The guys in another AAS Forum (BB4L) were taking it . Its supposed to increase your muscles ability to absorb glucose up to 5 times as much. It doesnt sound believable to me.
I was just wondering what some of you guys think.
Here is a link to its page http://www.glucorellr.com/

[einstein1905]

Normally I wouldnt take any supplement serious but The guys in another AAS Forum (BB4L) were taking it . Its supposed to increase your muscles ability to absorb glucose up to 5 times as much. It doesnt sound believable to me.
I was just wondering what some of you guys think.
Here is a link to its page http://www.glucorellr.com/

I JUST saw a study that came out that showed the benefits of r-ALA are not seen in normal individuals. The data that was used to support r-ALA's effects were on obese, insulin-resistant subjects. I'll dig the study up when I remember where I saw it. I actually have used Glucorell R and seemed have had better, longer lasting pumps....maybe psychological.

[inheritmylife]

I used it for about 4 months and didnt notice any benefit whatsoever.

[MachZ]

I've been using it since Oct.03 and I believe it does indeed work.
Slam 3 of the caps down along with your PWO Pro. Drink and feed those muscles.

My GF has been taking them along with me for all meals and she has lost weight without any type of cardio so i'm sold.

[Joe Rilla]

I JUST saw a study that came out that showed the benefits of r-ALA are not seen in normal individuals. The data that was used to support r-ALA's effects were on obese, insulin-resistant subjects. I'll dig the study up when I remember where I saw it. I actually have used Glucorell R and seemed have had better, longer lasting pumps....maybe psychological.

Thanks alot man. I knew if anyone knew about glucagen and glucose storage it would be you !
I had a feeling all that RALA stuff was BOGUS . It was just that alot of the guys from BB4L forum were using that stuff and saying it was great. Thanks for saving me some money, money that would be better spent on test enethate and Gh Thanks again .

[einstein1905]

Thanks alot man. I knew if anyone knew about glucagen and glucose storage it would be you !
I had a feeling all that RALA stuff was BOGUS . It was just that alot of the guys from BB4L forum were using that stuff and saying it was great. Thanks for saving me some money, money that would be better spent on test enethate and Gh Thanks again .

Sorry to be ambiguous. I did say a study showed it to have no effect on increasing insulin sensitivity or as a partitioning agent in normal individuals, but that's just one study. Like I said, I believe I had better pumps while using it as have others. It's also an antioxidant, which is beneficial to people using orals.

[rambo]

I've used it (and am using it) in the past, and felt that it does indeed lower my blood sugar when I need it to. I've taken them, and forgotten to eat carbs in my feel, and I felt lightheadedness that is somewhat analogous to the earlier stages of hypo when using slin. Nothing that severe, of course, but nonetheless..

R-ALA does not work miracles, but with the proper diet and macronutritional layout, it can work very well. I don't think all of Macro and Ulter's supplements are worth buying, but this one (IMHO) is.

Einstein, could you post a URL for the most recent study you read?

And yes, in the very least, the sulfur-sulfur bond R-ALA has in the distal end makes it an excellent antioxidant.

[einstein1905]

Here is the study showing normal subjects don't see the benefits from r-ALA that insulin-resistant subjects do. In all fairness though, this study doesn't address how r-ALA may function in normal subjects post ET, who are given a high GI bolus dose post ET too. This study addressed conditions where there was no post ET glucose loading.


J Appl Physiol. 2002 Jan;92(1):50-8. Related Articles, Links


Effects of exercise training and antioxidant R-ALA on glucose transport in insulin-sensitive rat skeletal muscle.

Saengsirisuwan V, Perez FR, Kinnick TR, Henriksen EJ.

Muscle Metabolism Laboratory, Department of Physiology, University of Arizona, College of Medicine, Tucson, Arizona 85721-0093, USA.

We have recently demonstrated (Saengsirisuwan V, Kinnick TR, Schmit MB, and Henriksen EJ, J Appl Physiol 91: 145-153, 2001) that exercise training (ET) and the antioxidant R-(+)-alpha-lipoic acid (R-ALA) interact in an additive fashion to improve insulin action in insulin-resistant obese Zucker (fa/fa) rats. The purpose of the present study was to assess the interactions of ET and R-ALA on insulin action and oxidative stress in a model of normal insulin sensitivity, the lean Zucker (fa/-) rat. For 6 wk, animals either remained sedentary, received R-ALA (30 mg. kg body wt(-1). day(-1)), performed ET (treadmill running), or underwent both R-ALA treatment and ET. ET alone or in combination with R-ALA significantly increased (P < 0.05) peak oxygen consumption (28-31%) and maximum run time (52-63%). During an oral glucose tolerance test, ET alone or in combination with R-ALA resulted in a significant lowering of the glucose response (17-36%) at 15 min relative to R-ALA alone and of the insulin response (19-36%) at 15 min compared with sedentary controls. Insulin-mediated glucose transport activity was increased by ET alone in isolated epitrochlearis (30%) and soleus (50%) muscles, and this was associated with increased GLUT-4 protein levels. Insulin action was not improved by R-ALA alone, and ET-associated improvements in these variables were not further enhanced with combined ET and R-ALA. Although ET and R-ALA caused reductions in soleus protein carbonyls (an index of oxidative stress), these alterations were not significantly correlated with insulin-mediated soleus glucose transport. These results indicate that the beneficial interactive effects of ET and R-ALA on skeletal muscle insulin action observed previously in insulin-resistant obese Zucker rats are not apparent in insulin-sensitive lean Zucker rats.


Here are a couple other random r-ALA studies



Differential effects of lipoic acid stereoisomers on glucose metabolism in insulin-resistant skeletal muscle
RYAN S. STREEPER, ERIK J. HENRIKSEN, STEPHAN JACOB, JASON Y. HOKAMA, DONOVAN L. FOGT, AND HANS J. TRITSCHLER

Streeper, Ryan S., Erik J. Henriksen, Stephan Jacob, Jason Y. Hokama, Donovan L. Fogt, and Hans J.
Tritschler. Differential effects of lipoic acid stereoisomers on glucose metabolism in insulin-resistant skeletal muscle. Am.
J. Physiol. 273 (Endocrinol. Metab. 36): El&j--E191, 1997. The racemic mixture of the antioxidant a-lipoic acid (ALA)
enhances insulin-stimulated glucose metabolism in insulin resistant humans and animals. We determined the individual
effects of the pure R-(+) and S-(-) enantiomers of ALA on glucose metabolism in skeletal muscle of an animal model of
insulin resistance, hyperinsulinemia, and dyslipidemia: the obese Zucker (falfa) rat. Obese rats were treated intraperito-
neally acutely (100 mg/kg body wt for 1 h) or chronically [IO days with 30 mg/kg of R-( +)-ALA or 50 mg/kg of S-(-)-ALA].
Glucose transport [2-deoxyglucose (2-DG) uptake], glycogen synthesis, and glucose oxidation were determined in the
epitrochlearis muscles in the absence or presence of insulin (13.3 nM).Acutely, R-(+)-ALA increased insulin-mediated
2-DG uptake by 64% (P < 0.05), whereas S-(-)-ALA had no significant effect. Although chronic R-(+)-ALA treatment
significantly reduced plasma insulin (17%) and free fatty acids (FFA; 35%) relative to vehicle-treated obese animals,
S-(-)-ALA treatment further increased insulin (15%) and had no effect on FFA. Insulin-stimulated 2-DG uptake was in-
creased by 65% by chronic R-(+)-ALA treatment whereas S-(-)-ALA administration resulted in only a 29% improve-
ment. Chronic R-(+)-ALA treatment elicited a 26% increase in insulin-stimulated glycogen synthesis and a 33% enhance-
ment of insulin-stimulated glucose oxidation.


The antioxidant alpha-lipoic acid enhances insulin-stimulated glucose metabolism in insulin-resistant rat skeletal muscle
S Jacob, RS Streeper, DL Fogt, JY Hokama, HJ Tritschler, GJ Dietze and EJ Henriksen
Department of Physiology, University of Arizona College of Medicine, Tucson, USA.

Insulin resistance of muscle glucose metabolism is a hallmark of NIDDM. The obese Zucker (fa/fa) rat--an animal model of muscle insulin resistance--was used to test whether acute (100 mg/kg body wt for 1 h) and chronic (5-100 mg/kg for 10 days) parenteral treatments with a racemic mixture of the antioxidant alpha-lipoic acid (ALA) could improve glucose metabolism in insulin-resistant skeletal muscle. Glucose transport activity (assessed by net 2-deoxyglucose [2-DG] uptake), net glycogen synthesis, and glucose oxidation were determined in the isolated epitrochlearis muscles in the absence or presence of insulin (13.3 nmol/l). Severe insulin resistance of 2-DG uptake, glycogen synthesis, and glucose oxidation was observed in muscle from the vehicle-treated obese rats compared with muscle from vehicle-treated lean (Fa/-) rats. Acute and chronic treatments (30 mg.kg-1.day-1, a maximally effective dose) with ALA significantly (P < 0.05) improved insulin-mediated 2-DG uptake in epitrochlearis muscles from the obese rats by 62 and 64%, respectively. Chronic ALA treatment increased both insulin-stimulated glucose oxidation (33%) and glycogen synthesis (38%) and was associated with a significantly greater (21%) in vivo muscle glycogen concentration. These adaptive responses after chronic ALA administration were also associated with significantly lower (15-17%) plasma levels of insulin and free fatty acids. No significant effects on glucose transporter (GLUT4) protein level or on the activities of hexokinase and citrate synthase were observed. Collectively, these findings indicate that parenteral administration of the antioxidant ALA significantly enhances the capacity of the insulin-stimulatable glucose transport system and of both oxidative and nonoxidative pathways of glucose metabolism in insulin-resistant rat skeletal muscle.

[rambo]

The definition of obesity is ambigious in these studies, and doesn't lead us to believe what bodyfat % in human subjects is considered "obese". Is it over 12?

Don't forget that the clearance of adipocytes is already much lower than that of myocytes, and while R-ALA affects both, that could be a reason why the GLUT-4 transporter seems less effective when there is less bodyfat to begin with.

Just a thought.

[einstein1905]

The definition of obesity is ambigious in these studies, and doesn't lead us to believe what bodyfat % in human subjects is considered "obese". Is it over 12?

Don't forget that the clearance of adipocytes is already much lower than that of myocytes, and while R-ALA affects both, that could be a reason why the GLUT-4 transporter seems less effective when there is less bodyfat to begin with.

Just a thought.

The obese zucker rats are just the genotype, but the phenotype of all of them is that they are extremely obese. I don't have pics handy to attach, but they are obese. Since glut4 is also expressed in/on adipocytes, and extremely obese individuals very likely have more "potential" to have glut4 expression upregulated, the effects NOT seen in the nonobese animals could be because the dose of r-ALA would need to be adjusted accordingly. This is just one study....I have not seen anything else to support this.

[rambo]

Since glut4 is also expressed in/on adipocytes, and extremely obese individuals very likely have more "potential" to have glut4 expression upregulated, the effects NOT seen in the nonobese animals could be because the dose of r-ALA would need to be adjusted accordingly.

Right, that's what I was getting at. It leaves food for thought (no pun intended).