want to compete. dr. derek and mikexxl

[max_lft79]

Hey let me start by saying that you look incredible mikexxl. you obviously have this cutting formula down to a science. and that is exactly why I'm coming to you guys for help.
i have been serious for four years
ht= 6'3"
wt=235
bf(guessing) 13-15%

I have always strived for mass over te last four years, but now I want to compete. I have been doing alot reseach on the topic of cutting up(read every thing I could find on the board to), but still don't feel confident enough to try to come up w/ a plan on my own for the first time.
I tried to cut once about 1/12 years ago tuned out looking terrible and losing alot of muscle. I eat clean, seven meals a day(including post w/o meal)
My maintenence calories is between 3,800 and 4,000. Currenty eating 40%-40%-20% ratios for my macronutrients.
I should also mention that i wont be using gear.

If you guys could point me in the right direction or help me out in any way to successfuly lose fat and maintain hard earbned muscle I would be very grateful.( you guys obviously have experience in this department)
and good luck with your second show xxl,
-max

[MIKE_XXL]

I think Zone type of diet is a good start, i would do 40% Protein, 30% carbs & 30% fat, over your 7 meal and whatever you do i would slowely start to drop the calories, about 250cal every 5 days untill you are loosing about 1 - 1.5 lbs per week, anything above that and you will be loosing muscle. So first 5 days eat 4000, then 3750 for 5 days, then 3500 cal. for 5 days and at this point you should see weight loss of about 1lb per week, going slow is your answear as you will be clean, do not over do the cardio 20-30min in the morning and i wouldn't start right away either, wait till you are having hard time loosing weight and ad cardio then as oppouse to reducing your calories further. Reduce the volume of your training and deffinitely get out of the gym in less then 1 hour. You can still have some simple sugars after your workout (my personal opinion and advice) i wold say anywhere between 50-75gm of dextrose should be fine. Train intensly but smart...i hope that helps out a bit...XXL

[saboudian]

a question about cardio:

how much cardio should u do, i know ronnie coleman does 1 hour of walking right before he goes to bed and another hour of walking as soon as he gets up, is this too much? also do u recommend cardio on an empty stomach?

[MIKE_XXL]

Originally posted by saboudian
a question about cardio:

how much cardio should u do, i know ronnie coleman does 1 hour of walking right before he goes to bed and another hour of walking as soon as he gets up, is this too much? also do u recommend cardio on an empty stomach?

Let me ask you something, are you taking the amount of "supplements" Ronnie is taking???

Well probably not, or you are way better off then i am......so yes that is to much unless you are using some heavy gear...

Yes i recomend cardio on empty stomch, just take some glutamine before heading out and drink about 1 liter of water to hydrate yourself properly, and i do my cardio first thing in the monring...XXL

[Dr. Derek]

Max-

I agree with Mike on the diet, except I really dont think that it would be productive for a natural athelete to lose more than .75 lbs per week. If you try to lose more than that in my opinion your gonna lose muscle, your body just does not have the ability to lose fat and retain muscle like a person who is using gear. Now not saying that it not possible and it would really depend on your genetic's and metabolism. I have seen natural guys diet in 12 weeks and look good and I have seen them take upto 20 weeks, its all depnds. My suggestion is that you start with soemthing along the lines of what XXL has said and then watch your body closely, with calipers and the scale and see if your losing any muscle if you think you are then just add in alittle more calories and or cut back on the cardio.

If you dont know how to figure out your LBM then just give me a shout but I suspect you know how.

Sab- I suspect that Coleman does not do that much cardio, I dont know where you came up with that but I would not believe it until you hear it from the big guy himself, then I would question it. Besides why would he have to do cardio at all hes so fucking big walking from the car to the gym should suffice.

[max_lft79]

thanks for the insight xxl and dr.D

I have to work very hard to pack on muscle muscle and I seem to have an even harder time maintaing it. I have done four cycles before ( and I do everything right) I grow great and then I get off and My delts deflate and I start to look flat.
It is so hard to try to train natural after you have used juice.( I feel like it is impossible to make progress) The reason I am trying to discutinue using gear is because I an am extreme hypochondriac whenever I on a cycle, or off cycle for that matter.

Dr. D If you don't mind I would like to hear your advice on determining my lean body mass.

I Know your opinions differ slightly on carb intake durring cutting phases(mikexxl and DR. D) In my situation do you think it would be wise to not mess around with dropping carbs below 30% of my total caloric intake? ( being that I am TRYING to do this Natural and have a hard time maintaining gains)

fellas, once again thank you very much for your help. it deffinately did help. Please continue to share Your advise with me as I can obviously learn alot from you both

[silverfox]

Coleman seems to do that much cardio, but also eat french fries and bbq sause on his food. In his video shows him doing that much cardio in his prep. but may have been benefit of video only.

[Dr. Derek]

determining your lean body mass is simple, find out your accurate bf%. Now take that pecentage away from your total body weight, that will determine your LBM. Now this number is not what you should shoot for because that number is you at 0% bf and of course you would be dead at that bf% I say shoot for 6% or so, thats a good bf to compete at if your competing in a lower level show.
EXAMPLE Bodyfat 10% Bodyweight 200lbs, then the persons LBM is 180LBS, now he or she would be competition ready at 190-192 LBS.

As for the carbs and from the sounds of it I WOULD NOT drop them lower than 30%, I find it easier to work the fat intake end with people with fast metabolisms. So what I mean if you were to come to me and ask me to do your diet, and on my initial evaluation I determined that you had a fast Metabolism, then I would adjust your calories through you fat percentages not carbs or protien. Do you get my drift?

[max_lft79]

thanks Derek, I get what what your saying about the carbs. however, when you say manipulate the fat intake are you saying that instead lower my protein or carb intake lower the fat only?

so if I a m eating 380g protein, 380g carbs and about 84g fat per day( 3800 cals/40%-40%-20%)
I should only lower the the calories in the form of fat.

Is this better than just lowering the calories from all the macronutrients in your opinion?

again, thank you for your help

[Dr. Derek]

well I will bet that when you lower your fat atleast your protien will drop slightly. I say manipulate your fat cal yes, but this cannot be done by only dropping some fat cals, your gonna have to most likely give up a few protien cals