Successful Competing

[kelkel]

I know what you mean. It's the epitome of love/hate. The only way I'd ever even consider it again is if I'm rich and if it won't hinder anything else in my life. For now, I enjoy what I do.

Kinda the same boat here. Still train like a nut but that leap to competing is hard to justify anymore....

Metalject;6689421]My favorite thing to do on this earth is to come here and argue with austinite, lol!

Really? I've never noticed....

You could step on stage right now and blow everybody away.

Thanks chad, but there's always more you have to do.

[emayarsh]

what is the biggest anabolic cycle you personally have ever run or someone you know has run?

do you know, would been on trt to maintain muscle from a previous cycle hinder your gains when you came to do another cycle as you havent had any off time?

thanks man..

[Cuz]

Metal, I need to talk to you via PM. Id like to know more about entering a show. thanks.

[Metalject]

what is the biggest anabolic cycle you personally have ever run or someone you know has run?

do you know, would been on trt to maintain muscle from a previous cycle hinder your gains when you came to do another cycle as you havent had any off time?

thanks man..

The biggest cycle I've ever known of? That's a hard one to answer. I know a lot of guys who've used 3g of testosterone week and 20iu of HGH a day along with a lot of Tren, Deca and things like that. Pretty much if you can think of it someones done it.

Biggest cycle I've ever run, I guess depending on how you look at it one of the two:

Test-e 250mg/ed (1750wk)
Tren-a 100mg/ed
Winstrol 50mg/ed
Deca 100mg/wk
Dbol 50 or 100mg/ed depending on which cycle we're talking about
Masteron 100mg/eod
T3 100-150mcg/ed
Clen up and down from 40-140mcg/ed
HGH 5iu/ed
Adex 0.5-1mg/eod

Or

Test-e 200mg/wk
Tren-a 200mg/eod
Materon 200mg/eod
Parabolin 152mg/eod
Anavar 100mg/ed
Turinabol 100mg/ed
T3 100-150mcg/ed
Clen up and down from 40-140mcg/ed
HGH 5iu/ed
Adex 0.25mg 2x/wk

Common Prep cycle:

WK 1-8 Test-e 200-250mg/eod
WK 1-8 EQ or NPP 200mg/eod
WK 9-14 Tren-a 100-200mg/eod
WK 9-14 Masteron 100-200mg/eod
WK 9-14 Winstrol 50mg/ed
WK 9-14 Test-p 200mg/eod
WK 15-16 Tren-a 100-200mg/ed
WK 15-16 Masteron 100-200mg/ed
WK 15-16 Winstrol 100mg/ed
WK 15-16 Test-p (maybe still 200mg/eod maybe a lot less, just depends)
T3 100-150mcg/ed
WK 1-14 or 15 Clen up and down from 40-140mcg/ed
WK 1-14HGH 5iu/ed
WK 1-16Adex 0.5mg/eod and 1mg/ed the last 2wks

Common Off-Season

Test-e 1g/wk as the years went by I split this up into EOD shots always
Deca or NPP 600-800mg/wk
Sometimes Dbol at 50-100mg/ed if I wanted to
Tren-a for 6-8wks overlapping with Deca 1-2wks and then back to Nandrolone (sometimes did this, sometimes didn't.)
HGH - Usually saved it for dieting but if used in the off-season standard 5iu/ed

[Metalject]

Metal, I need to talk to you via PM. Id like to know more about entering a show. thanks.

Sure, anytime. Shoot me a msg.

[emayarsh]

as you were once a competitive bodybuilder, are there any mistakes that you made, (that you haven't already shared with us) that you could tell us of so others dont follow the same fate? ive just started competing & as you know every week/day/meal/supplement/gear/training time counts up until the time comes to step on stage again.. i feel if i slack for even one week there will be someone who wont & so there progession will be quicker than mine..

[Metalject]

as you were once a competitive bodybuilder, are there any mistakes that you made, (that you haven't already shared with us) that you could tell us of so others dont follow the same fate? ive just started competing & as you know every week/day/meal/supplement/gear/training time counts up until the time comes to step on stage again.. i feel if i slack for even one week there will be someone who wont & so there progession will be quicker than mine..

That's a hard one to answer, because there were plenty of big mistakes to choose from. I can't remember what mistakes I made that I haven't mentioned in this thread so I might repeat some.

My mistakes in no particular order.

1. Worrying about my weight in the off-season: OK, this one may actually be the biggest mistake I ever made and is probably one of if not THE most common mistake guys will make. Worry about how big you get and you'll put on more fat and your diet will be much harder. Diets/Prep is already hard and when you make it even harder you risk wearing yourself out before your show comes, wearing your body down so much you don't look as good as you could or even losing muscle tissue that you didn't have to lose.

2. Taking Lasix without knowing what I was doing. End result, I could not flex my legs at all without them cramping up, so that meant I couldn't flex them. I could hardly walk without debilitating cramps in the arches of my feet.

3. Worrying about looking flat during the diet. Guys freak out when they look flat during their diet, but that does not mean you're losing muscle. Again, it DOES NOT mean you're losing muscle. Flat simply means you're flat and you're going to look flat at times when you diet if you're dieting right. If you worry about being full all the time, I can guarantee 99% of the guys who diet that way will not be in shape at the end.

4. Being too lazy with cardio at the beginning of the diet. When you start your prep, full blown cardio starts with it. The fear is you'll burn up a bunch of muscle, the truth is if you are using gear and a good amount you're not going to lose a ton of muscle. If you're carb intake is low and you're doing a lot of fast pace cardio where you're heart rate is flying, even with gear you may lose some muscle...running is a no go. Granted, the exception might be if you're using pro levels worth of gear, but that's only a theory as I don't know anyone who runs during a prep phase. Anyway, act lazy with your cardio early on and odds are strong you'll have to kill yourself at the end...at least kill yourself more than you have to, you'll still be killing yourself to a degree.

5. Eating a ton of junk food the night before. There are guys that can get away with it, I can't and most can't.

Anyway, pretty basic stuff. That's all that comes to mind right now.

[emayarsh]

i keep returning to this page hoping someone has asked some more questions so i can fill my little head with knowledge but noone has :-( lol i cant think of anymore questions but hoping someone else can think of something..

[Cuz]

^^surely you can think of something man lol.

[MIKE_XXL]

Great post...and i love the comment on Lasix, very, and i mean very difficult diuretic to control...
XXL

[Metalject]

Great post...and i love the comment on Lasix, very, and i mean very difficult diuretic to control...
XXL

Yeah, they can work very well but they tend to mess up more guys than not. There are plenty other good options for most. Primarily, the best option of all, actually being in shape. I'm sure you've seen plenty of guys a week or two out talk about how they're just holding water and it'll all work out when they cut water and pop a diuretic. And what happens? They walk off stage with a frown on their face because they were too fat. Often in great shape but bodybuilding fat. That makes me think of something I heard just this week.....

.....one of my competitors (currently off-season) said to me that they were worried about dieting as hard this go around because they were worried about losing gains. Now the important thing is after their last contest we both agreed they probably needed to be a little tighter and it could be done but it would be a little harder. My point, the word "Gains" I absolutely HATE that word because it is the achilles heel of so many competitors. The primary focus of any competitor should always be being as lean and hard as possible. Muscle mass is important, but it is a secondary concern. If you know how to come in shape and I mean really come in shape and you keep at the whole bodybuilding thing, more size will come. The best amateur bodybuilding I've ever known in my life, and by best I mean hands down could earn a pro card and I really think do well but will more than likely never turn pro, it is because he suffers from the "Gains Curse." Structurally, the guy is perfect. He can add muscle unlike anyone I've ever seen and stay in pretty good shape doing it but he cannot come in his best shape due to this fear. He diets hard, very hard and he eats very clean, but he becomes petrified when he feels his calories are getting too low. After several years of working together, he moved on to working with someone else. We still stay in contact and there's no bad blood at all. We're actually good friends. But his most recent contest coach told him he had some tricks that he thought would help him. The outcome? Same as always, big, structurally perfect looking guy that wasn't in shape because of "precious gains." It's a sad, sad never ending story for a lot of guys.

[APM]

Amazing thread!! Not sure if this was mentioned but, after the show you take a week off, during this time do you stop all gear??

After that week do you just go right into your off season, and start a bulking cycle? Or do you slowly transition into it? Specifically wondering about the transition between gear..

Personally, do you ever do a PCT? If so, what does it consist of for you personally?.

Thanks again for a great, informative, EXPERIENCED thread!! Very well written..

[Metalject]

Amazing thread!! Not sure if this was mentioned but, after the show you take a week off, during this time do you stop all gear??

After that week do you just go right into your off season, and start a bulking cycle? Or do you slowly transition into it? Specifically wondering about the transition between gear..

Personally, do you ever do a PCT? If so, what does it consist of for you personally?.

Thanks again for a great, informative, EXPERIENCED thread!! Very well written..

After a show, taking off from training and/or gear depends on what's next. If you're done competing for the year, I'd recommend taking at least a couple weeks off from training if not a little more. That doesn't mean you have to sit around like a sloth, you can still be active in other ways and simply enjoy life a little bit. You can still compete, and compete seriously and still have a life. The more normal parts of your life are just a little more scheduled than the average guy, parts of the year are normal and then insanity, lol!

Coming off gear post-contest: If you have another show soon to follow, you're not going to come off. If you do, you'll look worse than you did at your prior show. If you don't like the idea of being on gear that long without a break, then don't do multiple shows close together. Pretty simple.

If you're not going to do another show for a good while, I don't recommend coming off everything right away. It seems to be too big of a shock to the body. Normally, it's best to simply run a low dose of testosterone for about a month, TRT level and then consider a PCT.

Myself: The last several years of my bodybuilding days, I was on far more than off. Off-season gear use would go straight into contest use with no break. There might be a bit of a bridge, a maintenance phase with low dose testosterone, that was my preference but it didn't always work out that way due to timing. Once contest prep was done for the year, I'd typically go into TRT doses of testosterone and remain there until the next off-season cycle. Usually 2-3 months of coasting on TRT doses, much less intense training and more or less normal eating. I don't recall a period of being off everything the last 4-5yrs.

PCT: I used to do standard Nolva/Clomid PCT's sometimes with 10 day HCG front loads. But in the end, it seemed pointless to run a PCT only to shut everything down again soon after.

Final point, I don't claim any of this to be the smartest or safest way to use gear. It's simply what's done in bodybuilding.

[emayarsh]

i know you've just explained what you do.. but im also curious..

after contest prep, its claimed that you can make serious gains in the weeks after the show.. can you ellaborate on this?

you dont train for 2 weeks after (okay, the imppressive gains must come after this period?)

do you run gear while you dont train?

your supposed to have done gaining after 8 weeks? so how do you make gains the weeks after the show?... or will you?

if you stop the gear obviously you wont make any gains..

if a standard prep means you use test prop/tren ace/mast prop, how long will you have to use these for to peak for the show, then make the massive gains the X number of weeks after the prep.. or do you change to something else?

could you devise a prep cycle that will allow one to peak for the show & make the gains after? when your body is supposed to be super anabolic due to the huge increases in food intake..

much love..

[Metalject]

i know you've just explained what you do.. but im also curious..

after contest prep, its claimed that you can make serious gains in the weeks after the show.. can you ellaborate on this?

Your metabolism should be burning strong, so yes, you can grow more efficiently in terms of how much fat gain you might otherwise accumulate. But sometimes it's simply more beneficial to rest. Contest prep is hard and wears your body down. Beating your body into the ground right after a show with heavy off-season training right off the bat isn't always the best way to go.


you dont train for 2 weeks after (okay, the imppressive gains must come after this period?)

You can grow any time of the year. I think my above and soon to follow below comments will clear this up.


do you run gear while you dont train?

Testosterone, TRT dose or nothing.


your supposed to have done gaining after 8 weeks? so how do you make gains the weeks after the show?... or will you?

Why are you supposed to be done gaining after 8wks? What happens in 8wks? What determines gaining? The scale, bloat, water weight? You can make progress you're entire off-season regardless of it starting right after your show, two weeks later or even a month or even two months later. I know plenty of guys who do not train at all in Nov. or Dec and do very well.


if you stop the gear obviously you wont make any gains..

Pretty much you worry about growing when you're on gear. When you're off gear you worry about resting.


if a standard prep means you use test prop/tren ace/mast prop, how long will you have to use these for to peak for the show, then make the massive gains the X number of weeks after the prep.. or do you change to something else?

I normally used Test-e exclusively. Switched to propionate a few times but Test-e was always my primary. There's nothing special about Test-p when it comes to leaning out. The idea that you hold less water when using Testosterone Propionate is a myth, one of the finest broscience myths ever created. My theory, a lot of guys use Test-p when dieting, therefore they're leaner and eating cleaner and therefore they hold less water, so they say "must have been the propionate." When you inject testosterone, it's not active until the ester breaks off. Once the ester detaches, you have the same testosterone hormone in your body regardless of the ester that was originally attached.


A contest cycle can last anywhere from 8-16wks. How long is Tren used? Anywhere from 8-16wks. Same for Masteron. Just depends on the year, what you're trying that time around, etc. I've stayed on Tren up to 8 months solid in the past. 300-800mg/wk depending on the month. There's nothing that's set in stone.

I don't understand the last part of this question.


could you devise a prep cycle that will allow one to peak for the show & make the gains after? when your body is supposed to be super anabolic due to the huge increases in food intake..

If you're really worried about blowing up large right after a show, you can use pretty much anything you want. But in my opinion, big fast gains like this are rarely all that sustainable.

much love..

See above in red

[emayarsh]

this pretty much cleared everything up.. thank you.. tren for 8 months? wow thats crazy lol

[krugerr]

this pretty much cleared everything up.. thank you.. tren for 8 months? wow thats crazy lol

Yea, that's nearer the extreme end of the scale. However as Metal said, competitive bodybuilding isn't healthy or safe, and it's goal dependant.

Great thread MJ, loving the honesty and the straight talking manor if this. There's no glorifying of beating around the topic. Which I think is great insight for anyone wishing to compete.

[Metalject]

Yea, that's nearer the extreme end of the scale. However as Metal said, competitive bodybuilding isn't healthy or safe, and it's goal dependant.

Great thread MJ, loving the honesty and the straight talking manor if this. There's no glorifying of beating around the topic. Which I think is great insight for anyone wishing to compete.

Thanks. And yes, you're right, there's no need to beat around the topic, although that's what most do. The way bodybuilding is normally talked about is what's really insane. Telling young hopefuls that if you work hard and eat all your vegetables you have a chance causes more guys to waste their time and efforts and is just plain lying. Bodybuilding, at least being successful at any level of the competitive end does come with some risk. I do think a lot of the risk is over exaggerated even by many who enjoy bodybuilding but so much of the information out there is simply a lie and tells people that don't know any better that there is no risk. I mean what's risky about working hard and eating right? Nothing, of course not, but that'll get you as far in bodybuilding as learning how to drive 100mph on the interstate will get you in NASCAR.

[smile]

Great Post !!

[Cuz]

Thanks. And yes, you're right, there's no need to beat around the topic, although that's what most do. The way bodybuilding is normally talked about is what's really insane. Telling young hopefuls that if you work hard and eat all your vegetables you have a chance causes more guys to waste their time and efforts and is just plain lying. Bodybuilding, at least being successful at any level of the competitive end does come with some risk. I do think a lot of the risk is over exaggerated even by many who enjoy bodybuilding but so much of the information out there is simply a lie and tells people that don't know any better that there is no risk. I mean what's risky about working hard and eating right? Nothing, of course not, but that'll get you as far in bodybuilding as learning how to drive 100mph on the interstate will get you in NASCAR.

Very well said sir!

[David PvP]

Nice stuff Metal

[rotty2]

This thread is extremely helpful and interesting. Coincidentally I am on a similar diet you outlined and I want to throw some T3 in there to, have you noticed any negative repercussions from using it. I don't plan to take anywhere near as much as you did but maybe a six week cycle, take a break then do another. Any advice is welcome. I am also only plan on using 350 mg of test and hcg so take that into consideration.

[rotty2]

I don't see how people afford all the hgh either

[Metalject]

This thread is extremely helpful and interesting. Coincidentally I am on a similar diet you outlined and I want to throw some T3 in there to, have you noticed any negative repercussions from using it. I don't plan to take anywhere near as much as you did but maybe a six week cycle, take a break then do another. Any advice is welcome. I am also only plan on using 350 mg of test and hcg so take that into consideration.

I never had an problems with T3. Always a little hungrier, but that's part of dieting anyway and always a little warmer/hotter but it's not a big deal. As far as your test and hcg, it's never a good idea to use T3 for fat loss without some steroid related help or you'll risk losing muscle tissue, so using test and hcg would be a good thing.

[Metalject]

I don't see how people afford all the hgh either

They buy in bulk, that helps some. And they don't spend a lot of money on things other people spend their money on. Bodybuilding can be a lonely and boring life, but if you're really into it, that's really all you're doing anyway and so is everyone else around you and that helps.

[David PvP]

Ok metal new question,i wanna go test year round and trt dose betwen cycles,i wanna know how are youre ballz afther 5 years of test?i mean do you still have something there?

[emayarsh]

what are your thoughts on bostin lloyd?...

is he an idiot? or does he speak the truth?
or
does he speak the truth but needs to keep his mouth shut?

also.. what are your thoughts on pepitides igf-1 lr3, ghrp-6, cjc-1295 & others like these? have you had any good/bad experiences with them? could they be considered a cheaper source of hgh? or just a waste of money?

[Metalject]

Ok metal new question,i wanna go test year round and trt dose betwen cycles,i wanna know how are youre ballz afther 5 years of test?i mean do you still have something there?

Most bodybuilders have small balls. I know that sounds funny but that often comes with it. Of course, if you run HCG along with your testosterone, your balls should stay full. This isn't something most bodybuilders mess with but it doesn't mean you can't.

My sack, it was a shrunken shade of its former self for many years. I've been on TRT for a few years now, test and HCG and my balls are back to normal and stay that way.

And by shrunken balls, they don't disappear or anything like that. They just lose some of their fullness.

[Metalject]

what are your thoughts on bostin lloyd?...

is he an idiot? or does he speak the truth?
or
does he speak the truth but needs to keep his mouth shut?

also.. what are your thoughts on pepitides igf-1 lr3, ghrp-6, cjc-1295 & others like these? have you had any good/bad experiences with them? could they be considered a cheaper source of hgh? or just a waste of money?

I don't follow him although I've heard his name and people talking about him online. What did he say specifically that you're wondering about?

The peptides you mentioned, they're not a substitute for HGH. IGF-1 can be a good addition. I've personally never messed with the other items you listed. The combo of Semorelin and GHRP-2 seems like a good thing if you don't have access to HGH but I don't know too many guys who mess with the other stuff. Most just use HGH or they don't but that doesn't include if they use IGF-1 or not. Again, IGF-1 is a separate issue.

[mockery]

heyMetalject thanks for being so open and honest about bodybuilding truths. its refreshing seeing someone here being honest about what happening. I always say there is online cycling and offline cycling in regards to body building.

people are brain washed with orals cant be run for longer then 4 weeks, tren for 8 etc etc.

Need more openness about what happends when body builders come off the drugs. night and day difference with the pros. shocking how much of an illusion it can be at times with some athletes.

[David PvP]

Thanks for the info Metal i wanna go perma test,and i dont understand why people get freaked up about HRT/TRT,test is as cheap as it gets,and i love to see liquid go inside me

[mockery]

Thanks for the info Metal i wanna go perma test,and i dont understand why people get freaked up about HRT/TRT,test is as cheap as it gets,and i love to see liquid go inside me

because when u have to pin for years and years on end, it gets old and becomes a chore , blood work isn't cheap, and until you die is a long ass time. And phizer 100mg/ml cip isn't cheap either over the long run and homebrew is so up and down.

Id assume this is why people wanna avoid trt, TRT is just an excuse more or less for a lot of people to cruise and have a moral justification. I for one if i could have normal levels, not high levels of natural test i would take that in a heart beat.

One good thing about TRT is learning about DIM, saving adex for cycles only and controlling E2 with DIM, again for me DIM is pricey but at least i can give my body a bread from the AI.

[Metalject]

heyMetalject thanks for being so open and honest about bodybuilding truths. its refreshing seeing someone here being honest about what happening. I always say there is online cycling and offline cycling in regards to body building.

people are brain washed with orals cant be run for longer then 4 weeks, tren for 8 etc etc.

Need more openness about what happends when body builders come off the drugs. night and day difference with the pros. shocking how much of an illusion it can be at times with some athletes.

Glad you like the thread.
There are three types of people who talk out of their ass regarding bodybuilding:

1. Those that don't know any better.
2. Those that parrot message board rhetoric.
3. Those that do know better but talking out of their ass makes them feel better about themselves for some reason.

[Metalject]

Thanks for the info Metal i wanna go perma test,and i dont understand why people get freaked up about HRT/TRT,test is as cheap as it gets,and i love to see liquid go inside me

I wouldn't purposely cruise just to cruise but if you're going to be a bodybuilder you're going to end up on TRT. Is that a bad thing? That depends on how you look at it. Most men at some point in their life will benefit and need TRT but when's impossible to say. A bodybuilder, an actual competitor, once he's done will more than likely be on TRT much sooner. Of course if he's still competing into his late 30's and 40's he might have ended up on TRT anyway, who knows.

And like mockery said, TRT isn't the cheapest thing in the world and if you really need it I would only do it legally. When you're making something a permanent part of your life why risk it, primarily the legal issues when you'll be holding that risk non-stop? Yes, I know gear use recreationally carries the same legal risk but that can end, TRT doesn't.

I use the site sponsor. I like it, it's a fair deal and a better deal than most IMO. No you don't build some doctor patient relationship that finds you grilling out with your doctor like it seems a lot of guys here want (at least that seems to often be the perception) but you get everything you need. If you need butt massaging along with your TRT there are plenty of programs out there that cost a 2nd mortgage that can provide just that.

[mockery]

Glad you like the thread.
There are three types of people who talk out of their ass regarding bodybuilding:

1. Those that don't know any better.
2. Those that parrot message board rhetoric.
3. Those that do know better but talking out of their ass makes them feel better about themselves for some reason.

^ hey thats me!

[Metalject]

[/B]
^ hey thats me!

That's a lot of us at one time or another. It may be talking out of your ass about bodybuilding, steroids or something completely unrelated, but eventually your ass starts to hurt so it's better to just tell the truth.

[Cuz]

happy new year Metal!

[kelkel]

Glad you like the thread.
There are three types of people who talk out of their ass regarding bodybuilding:

1. Those that don't know any better.
2. Those that parrot message board rhetoric.
3. Those that do know better but talking out of their ass makes them feel better about themselves for some reason.

Metal you forgot:

4. All of the above.

[Metalject]

happy new year Metal!

Same to you!

[Metalject]

Metal you forgot:

4. All of the above.

True. Those are the true super hero's of bodybuilding BS.