Post Morning Cardio Question...

[novastepp]

Pretty Basic Question,

Pro/Carb
or
Pro/Fat After my morning cardio, and why, if you could...

[Giantz11]

Really depends on you bro. I bracket my carbs around my workouts so I usually do a pro/fat after cardio. But on my off days I'll eat carbs in my frist meal, so in that case I'll be having a pro/carb after cardio.

[novastepp]

Ok so on training days ill eat pro/fat, but off days i'll do pro/carb.
Thanks a lot man!

[Panzerfaust]

I have always reacted really good to a pro/fat 45m-1hr after AM cardio. For the first few months of this last cuttig run i had pro/carb and it worked pretty good and then when i hit a plateu i switched back to pro/fat.

It really depends on you.

[Scarface06]

Depends on the intensity, if its steady state then ill go pro/fat, if its intervals for example then id go pro carb.

Ive been thinking of experimenting with morning cardio followed by a protein only meal, then returning to normal schedule 2hrs later. Not sure on its effectiveness, but im thinking it will give the body longer to use fat for fuel.

[novastepp]

bump, giantz...if you read that^^^ what do you think about the pro only meal after a steady 60% HRT for 45 mins am on empty???

[Kurz]

what about pm cardio on off days? Just PM cardio

[Scarface06]

ay nova; here's a link from Bodyrecomp board:

http://www.bodyrecomposition.com/for...l+computations

lyle mcdonald is a proponent in using it for stubborn fat, pretty interesting.

[Giantz11]

bump, giantz...if you read that^^^ what do you think about the pro only meal after a steady 60% HRT for 45 mins am on empty???

I would say a protain only meal would be ok, but I'd rather have some fats in there so that all the protein was not used for energy. But it's very likely that a protein only meal would contain fat as well. Prolonging the fat buring from low intensity cardio will make a very minimal difference in the overall picture, since the intensity was low, you should not expect much in the way of fat burn after the actual activity.

[Giantz11]

what about pm cardio on off days? Just PM cardio

Why not try and make it AM?

[novastepp]

ay nova; here's a link from Bodyrecomp board:

http://www.bodyrecomposition.com/for...l+computations

lyle mcdonald is a proponent in using it for stubborn fat, pretty interesting.

Its saying you gotta be a member, i cant access it...

[Scarface06]

Getting rid of stubborn bodyfat - by Lyle McDonald

Without going into the brutally long and complicated mental computations that led me to this (and I'm still working on the overall scheme), here's my current thoughts on how to approach it.

First and foremost, this is one of the places where morning/pre-breakfast cardio is probably crucially important.

An hour or two before cardio, take 200 mg caffeine with 1-3 grams of L-tyrosine (NO ephedrine).

There are two segments to the cardio:

- The first segment is for mobilization, to get those stubborn fatty acids out of the fat cell.
- The second segment is the oxidation part, to burn them off in the muscle.

For the first segment of the cardio, use a machine that you don't normally use. So if you normally do the treadmill, do the first segment on the stairmaster or bike or something. Just make it different.

First segment:
warmup: 3-5 minutes
go hard: 5-10 minutes. I mean hard, as hard as you can stand for the entire time. This will NOT be fun on lowered blood glucose. I've considered putting intervals here but haven't found the data I need to make up my mind. If you do intervals, go something like 5X1' all out with a 1' break (10' total intervals)

Rest 5', just sit on your butt, drink water, try not to puke.

Go to your normal cardio machine. Do at least 30 minutes at moderate/high moderate intensity (below lactate threshold but decent intensity). I'd say 45' maximum here but I'm still making up my mind and looking at data.

Go home, and wait and hour before having a small protein meal (25-50 grams or so). No dietary fat. 2-3 hours later, go back to normal diet eating. Your daily calories shouldn't be any different than they were already, they are just distributed differently, you only have 100-200 immediately after cardio, and then the rest afterwards.

I'd do that maybe 3 days per week to start, and see what happens.

Why this works

To get stubborn fat mobilized, you have to overcome a fairly severe resistance in terms of both blood flow and lipolysis, this requires very high concentrations of catecholamines (adren****e/noradren****e). Sadly, jacking up levels of catecholamines (necessary for mobilization) limits burning in the muscle which is why you follow the high intensity with low intensity.

Basically, you jack up levels to get the fat mobilized, and then let them fall so that the fatty acid can be burned in the muscle.

I have a study showing that Ephedrine before intense activity lowers the catecholamine response, that's the reason for avoiding it. Studies also show a lower than normal catecholamine response as people adapt to a given type of cardio; doing a different machine will result in a higher catecholamine response than you'd other wise get.

The bigger problem with stubborn fat has to do with:

- Blood flow to the fat cells: which is typically very low, odds are your butt is cold to the touch compared to other areas of your body
- It's harder to mobilize: both because of impaired blood flow, and because of adrenoceptor issues.

Oral yohimbe (0.2 mg/kg) can be effective when used over the long term. Don't take it within 3-4 hours of taking ephedrine, and start with a half-dose to assess tolerance (some people get really freaky responses from it). IF you can find pharmaceutical yohimbine, it's far far better than the herbal version (and most of the herbal versions are crap, the only one I trust is Twinlab Yohimbe Fuel).

Taking the yohimbe with caffeine prior to morning cardio does seem to help with very stubborn fat.

there ya go!

[novastepp]

what does anyone think about this cardio approach?

[Giantz11]

I actually don't think it's that bad of a plan. But I'd say that you can do the entire cardio session at low intensity and prevent muscle loss. His does seem to offer a better route for overall fat loss and I agree with much of what he says, but persoanlly. I'd rather keep the intensity low and not risk any muscle loss at all by doing High intensity running on an empty stomach.

[novastepp]

yeah im gonna keep it low, it works for me anyway...

[Kurz]

yeah im gonna keep it low, it works for me anyway...

BUT THERE IS A TOO LOW BRO...........