Cardio PWO

**piepiezzz** · 06-21-2006, 12:49 PM

I wanted to raise a question to everyone to get some thoughts flowing........

I do AM cardio about 4-5 days a week. On the other 2-3 days I do PWO, sometimes double sessions (morning, PWO)

I have noticed good result with both......hence my question.

Everyone says lypolisis starts 20 minutes into your cardio session, regardless of intensity. That is why 45-60 minutes of low intensity is recommeded in the morning. Leaving catabolism out of this argument, wouldn't you burn more fat PWO than AM cardio........ If am cardio takes 20 minutes to tap into fat, thus only producing 25-40 minutes af energy from fat.

However, I lift heavy......not fast but heavy...... for a good 50-75 minutes.

Now, I can guarantee that my average HR in that time is in the 125 BPM range. (which is optimal for FAT loss) Not to mention glycogen depletion.

If I then did PWO cardio, wouldn't lypolisis already have started. So, say I do 35 PWO cardio.....this would give me 35 minutes of lypolisis versus 25-40 in the morning. If I pound glutamine pre-PWO cardio and a PWO shake immediately following cardio, wouldn't this limit catabolism a great deal.(not to mention tren /prop).

Just wanted some thoughts and discussion on a very contraversial subject.

**slimsc** · 06-21-2006, 01:02 PM

Great post... I have been contemplating some of the same questions, and really look forward to reading the responses!

**chest6** · 06-21-2006, 01:15 PM

You have some good thoughts..I've been thinking of that lately too. Lately, during AM cardio it is freaking impossible to get my HR above 130 without doing like a full sprint on the elliptical or going to 3.7mph and 7.5 incline without holding on. For PWO cardio..I immediately start out at 125ish..which quickly moves to 130-135 for the duration.

**Giants11** · 06-21-2006, 02:04 PM

20-25 min PWO should not be a problem at all.

**CoreyTampa09** · 06-21-2006, 03:54 PM

Thats what Ive been doing for the past 6 lifting sessions and its been working great. The only day I dont do 20-25 minutes elliptical is when I do legs, its near impossible. Then a quick 10 minute drive home from the gym and blend up my favorite meal of the day and im good to go.

Question though, I cant seem to lose anymore actual weight off the scale but I think I look overall better. Could this mean my macros are messed up(which I think there not) or am I just taking in the right amt of macros where Im losing fat and gaining LBM at a consistent rate?

**CoreyTampa09** · 06-21-2006, 03:57 PM

My bad for the double post, not sure how to delete this.

**taylormade** · 06-21-2006, 05:38 PM

Great post.

***SPIKE*** · 06-21-2006, 05:45 PM

I really like the following thread: Cardio on an empty stomach???

It answers all of the above questions and even goes further into it. Whom ever really wants to take the time to read it all will definitely come out with some knowledge.

Whatever isn't answered feel free to ask.

Hope this helps buddy :-)

**piepiezzz** · 06-22-2006, 10:43 AM

I read four of the five pages............so it really didn't answer my main question....all it did was conclude the "scientific" trials show am cardio to burn more energy form fat compared to 60-90 after a meal. What about PWO??

The other point I got was "Everyone is different" and "use what works for you" . So basically it's "Here's the scientific data but I'll cop out by saying do what works best for you , because I can't substantiate the data."

I also TOTALLY disagree with what someone wrote about non-workout day cardio. There are SEVERAL techniques you can use which MAXIMIZE fat loss on cardio only days.

Also not discussed was exactly when lypolisis kicks in AM cardio versus PWO. Is it from minute 1 because you are glycogen depleted?? I Think not.

I have honestly seen better results the last time I cut From 205 20% BF to 180 5-6%BF. Never once did I do AM cardio and ALL my lifts went UP...Bench from 245 to 375.....and the kicker....NO AAS, NO CLEN , just Ripped Fuel with Ephedra. Lost 30 lbs of fat and gained 6-7 lbs of muscle, all in a six month period.

This is the reason I bring up this topic.......because this time around, I read the "cutter" sticky, build a similar diet.....Do am cardio 5-6 days week, PWO 2 times week.....On Tren /Prop.....And I am seeing nowhere near the results that I did in my prior cut. I am losing weight and fat but my lifts are down, dragging...I know this isn't what tren is known for?!?!?

I read the science, thoeries, etc....But as a wise NYU professor once said to me "statistics can prove or disprove anything you want them to. It just depends on how you translate the results"......I have always believed this.

doctorherb said AM cardio, period.......but then later on admitted he barely ever does cardio.......

The mods and vets flame newbies, how about giving some back to yourselves for giving advice you can't really substantiate.

Don't get me wrong......This site is awesome and has helped me through some issues..........but I brought up this issue because I understand the science...BCAA's, glutamine this, that...........but what I see in practice, not only with myself, is that scientific tests do not always translate into results.

So I ask again.....Does anyone think 20-30 min PWO after a heavy workout burn more fat than AM cardio.

I think AM cardio will get you to where you want to be, it just takes longer and both situations will cause some loss of LBM.

**piepiezzz** · 06-22-2006, 12:31 PM

Didn't mean to sound hornary......I think that was the tren talking.....

Do you want to hear something absurd, compared to popular opinion. The leanest and hardest I have ever been was when I was doing cardio at 10:00 PM after my last meal and right before bed.....This is when I got down to 180 lbs....and actually I competed in a WPO regional bench comp in the 181 lb class at 177. And I benched 405 at 177. SO I don't think I lost much,(NO AAS) if any LBM while sucking weight.

So I guess that expands the convo......AM cardio, PWO cardio, or late night cardio???? ANy one else done late night cardio before bed??