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  1. #1
    sonysucks is offline Associate Member
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    This is by far the toughest part

    I started this thread ,but It got moved ...that was okay its just hard to find time to type my questions between eating and working.
    It went like this.
    "First and foremost ...DIET!!!
    Wow is there lots to learn and holy sh1t is it ever the most difficult part. the planning ,the macros ,the reading ,learning and thats just the beginning...then there is the sourcing the foods the prep and cooking ....then its gets harder...the actual eating at times and in quantities so different from my established patterns. And lastly and most difficult...the discipline to keep it clean (especially will those little halloween bars in the pantry.)
    Oh yeah did I mention I was on a cycle.....
    Even the 1.5 hours of workout is no where as difficult as the implementing of what I have learned about diet.
    I want to add that my first cycle was great and I had nice improvements ,but it could have been much better. Take my advice and stop reading the roid Q&A threads and read lots on diet and watch those online free videos.
    I will add more later ...as I have to go bbq 10 chicken breasts...
    On a good note...I had forgotten how much I like oatmeal...although I cheat by putting in some raisins....gotta keep it enjoyable."
    Okay too funny ,here it is about a week later and I have time to get to type a few questions....and then ...yep I gotta go bbq some more chicken breasts.

  2. #2
    sonysucks is offline Associate Member
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    Let me start with my stats. and although I have read and read.(let me add here...I have spent 10times more time reading then working out and 5 times more on prep and eating...so I get it this time...diet ,diet)
    I am 5'9" and I was 175 lbs at 13% bf.
    I am only moderately active with cardio 5x a week and one hockey game and a couple hikes a week.and then retail work .
    I have been learning loads and have been attempting to rotate the kinds of proteins but the plan goes as follows.

    8am 30 minutes cardio on empty stomach. -can I add a coffee here?

    meal 1) 9am breakfast
    2 whole and 4 eggs whites cal 240 pro 26g carb .6g fat 13g
    1/2 cup oatmeal cal 70 pro 3g carb 12g fat 1g
    1 brown toast cal 80 pro 3g carb 15g fat 1.5g
    1tbsp PB and 1/4 banana cal 90 pro 2g carb 20g fat 2 g
    total CAL 480 PRO 34g CARB 47.6g FAT 17.5g
    cycle products taken here also.


    Meal 2 ) 11 am pre workout.
    1/2 shake
    Shake contains isolate proteins and a product called anabolic od which is a mix of crea tines ,simple carbs amino acids and 25 grams of hemp powder for efa 3-6-9
    meal 3) 12:00 post workout 1/2 shake
    TOTAL CAL 480 PRO 82g CARB 30G FAT 3G

    meal 3 ) 2:00 lunch. at work now -low energy-
    chicken breast cal 490 pro 64g carb 17 g fat 17 g
    1 cup brown rice cal 218 pro 5g carb 46g fat 2 g
    1/2 cup raw peas cal 20 pro 2g carb 4 g fat0g
    TOTAL CAL 728 PRO 71g CARB 67G FAT 19g

    meal 4) 4:00 snack at work
    1 protien bar cal 290 pro 30g carb 25 fat 7g
    oatmeal cookie cal 200 pro 3g carb 30g fat 8g
    TOTAL CAL 490 PRO 33g CARB 55g FAT 15g

    meal 5 ) 6-7 pm Dinner at home rotates chicken /salmon /beef with salad
    1 bud light cal 29 pro 0 carb 1 fat 0
    chicken ceasar salad cal 300 pro 33g carb 17g fat 12
    TOTAL CAL 330 PRO 33g CARB 18g FAT 12 g


    meal 6) 9-10 pm evenings before bed.
    Dinners prepared large enough to leave enough for this snack. Whatever the protein portion was this is eaten now. IE:
    1/2 piece of salmon filet.approx 150g. cal 300 pro 30g carb 0 fat 18 g

    Okay so thats the day and on top of this I am taking 1 gallon of water and a couple coffees, one at breaky one at lunch.,and I chew gum after lunch at work.
    Chicken is easy and affordable and is an obvious staple but the freezer is full of salmon and some beef and to keep it interesting it gets worked in for dinner and lunch.
    Last edited by sonysucks; 11-03-2008 at 03:06 PM.

  3. #3
    sonysucks is offline Associate Member
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    The totals for the day are
    CAL 2808 PRO 283 g CARB 217 G FAT 84 g

    So hows does that look. The goals I have learned to aim for were to be around 1.5 g of pro per lb meaning about 270 g and although it seems I am eating way above my normal pattern it appears I am just hitting it. I am unclear of what carb- protein ratio should be my target... I have read 60-40 or 50-50 so I could use some help here.
    I have been sloughing at the trough now for 4 weeks and gave gone from 175 to 190 lbs
    Which is wild...But I am concerned as I am also looking noticeably softer. The tantia BFM machine at the gym states over 4lbs is gained water...But I had hoped this diet would allow for me to gain leanily (is that a word?). So now I have decided I must find and take the time to chart this out and type it into this thread to get it tuned before I continue to perhaps be in error.
    So please recognize that effort it takes to prepare this thread and truly know I appreciate the wisdom of those who have walked this road already.

  4. #4
    sonysucks is offline Associate Member
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    Oh yeah...gotta go que some chicken....

  5. #5
    sonysucks is offline Associate Member
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    Okay got the chicken done. So how are my pro/carb ratios looking for lean gaining goals? And how is the overall intake amounts?
    When I calculated my daily caloric needs it came to about 2700 calories which seemed high.
    This in mind means that the diet I layed out is only a bit above my normal intake needs and that makes me shake my head as its far more then I regularily eat so I better get some help as something seems amiss.

  6. #6
    fit4ever180's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by sonysucks View Post
    The totals for the day are
    CAL 2808 PRO 283 g CARB 217 G FAT 84 g

    So hows does that look. The goals I have learned to aim for were to be around 1.5 g of pro per lb meaning about 270 g and although it seems I am eating way above my normal pattern it appears I am just hitting it. I am unclear of what carb- protein ratio should be my target... I have read 60-40 or 50-50 so I could use some help here.
    I have been sloughing at the trough now for 4 weeks and gave gone from 175 to 190 lbs
    Which is wild...But I am concerned as I am also looking noticeably softer. The tantia BFM machine at the gym states over 4lbs is gained water...But I had hoped this diet would allow for me to gain leanily (is that a word?). So now I have decided I must find and take the time to chart this out and type it into this thread to get it tuned before I continue to perhaps be in error.
    So please recognize that effort it takes to prepare this thread and truly know I appreciate the wisdom of those who have walked this road already.
    Quote Originally Posted by sonysucks View Post
    Okay got the chicken done. So how are my pro/carb ratios looking for lean gaining goals? And how is the overall intake amounts?
    When I calculated my daily caloric needs it came to about 2700 calories which seemed high.
    This in mind means that the diet I layed out is only a bit above my normal intake needs and that makes me shake my head as its far more then I regularily eat so I better get some help as something seems amiss.
    Quote Originally Posted by sonysucks View Post
    Let me start with my stats. and although I have read and read.(let me add here...I have spent 10times more time reading then working out and 5 times more on prep and eating...so I get it this time...diet ,diet)
    I am 5'9" and I was 175 lbs at 13% bf.
    I am only moderately active with cardio 5x a week and one hockey game and a couple hikes a week.and then retail work .
    I have been learning loads and have been attempting to rotate the kinds of proteins but the plan goes as follows.

    8am 30 minutes cardio on empty stomach. -can I add a coffee here?

    meal 1) 9am breakfast
    2 whole and 4 eggs whites cal 240 pro 26g carb .6g fat 13g
    1/2 cup oatmeal cal 70 pro 3g carb 12g fat 1g
    1 brown toast cal 80 pro 3g carb 15g fat 1.5g
    1tbsp PB and 1/4 banana cal 90 pro 2g carb 20g fat 2 g
    total CAL 480 PRO 34g CARB 47.6g FAT 17.5g
    cycle products taken here also.Your macro counts are off here..


    Meal 2 ) 11 am pre workout.
    1/2 shake
    Shake contains isolate proteins and a product called anabolic od which is a mix of crea tines ,simple carbs amino acids and 25 grams of hemp powder for efa 3-6-9
    meal 3) 12:00 post workout 1/2 shake
    TOTAL CAL 480 PRO 82g CARB 30G FAT 3G [B 20-30g less protein, 30-50g more fast digesting carbs[/B]

    meal 3 ) 2:00 lunch. at work now -low energy-
    chicken breast cal 490 pro 64g carb 17 g fat 17 g
    1 cup brown rice cal 218 pro 5g carb 46g fat 2 g
    1/2 cup raw peas cal 20 pro 2g carb 4 g fat0g
    TOTAL CAL 728 PRO 71g CARB 67G FAT 19g[B50-60g protein and drop about 5-9g fat...How in the hell is there that many carbs in your chicken?[/B]

    meal 4) 4:00 snack at work
    1 protien bar cal 290 pro 30g carb 25 fat 7g
    oatmeal cookie cal 200 pro 3g carb 30g fat 8g
    TOTAL CAL 490 PRO 33g CARB 55g FAT 15g Eat a real meal here...Protein bars SUCK! and a cookie is no better

    meal 5 ) 6-7 pm Dinner at home rotates chicken /salmon /beef with salad
    1 bud light cal 29 pro 0 carb 1 fat 0
    chicken ceasar salad cal 300 pro 33g carb 17g fat 12
    TOTAL CAL 330 PRO 33g CARB 18g FAT 12 g
    Add in another 10g protein, 30-40g slow-digesting carbs

    meal 6) 9-10 pm evenings before bed.
    Dinners prepared large enough to leave enough for this snack. Whatever the protein portion was this is eaten now. IE:
    1/2 piece of salmon filet.approx 150g. cal 300 pro 30g carb 0 fat 18 g
    Try a cup ff cottage cheese or 20-40g casein powder with a tbs. olive oil or an oz. of nuts
    Okay so thats the day and on top of this I am taking 1 gallon of water and a couple coffees, one at breaky one at lunch.,and I chew gum after lunch at work.

    I would try to keep all meals about the same macro/caloric breakdown... A total ratio that works for me would be 38/42/20 (protein/carbs/fat) while bulking and 43/37/20 for cutting... Are you still currently on cycle or off?

  7. #7
    sonysucks is offline Associate Member
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    Quote Originally Posted by fit4ever180 View Post
    I would try to keep all meals about the same macro/caloric breakdown... A total ratio that works for me would be 38/42/20 (protein/carbs/fat) while bulking and 43/37/20 for cutting... Are you still currently on cycle or off?
    Thanks bud, good target %'s for me to work with.
    I am currently on cycle and after getting to week 5 in my 12 I was getting nervous about my diet. Good gains ,just feeling a bit chubby (this is the end of the dbol ,so that along with the tightened diet should change things)
    I was off on the fat for breaky and will lose the cookie. (hey it WAS oatmeal!)and that will bring the fat down.
    -I thought chicken was slow digesting protein,if it isnt please suggest another or do you suggest the low fat cottage cheese...I can do that,but a tub of caisein powder might be better .
    Thanks again.

  8. #8
    big_k's Avatar
    big_k is offline Associate Member
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    What is your PWO Meal or Shake?

    I agree with fit4ever about dumping the protein bar and cookie.


    I might suggest Less fat for your PreWorkout Meal, you don't want your insulin spike to be going after the fat in your blood. But that is just my view.

    In general it looks fine, with 2800 calories are you trying to bulk or cut?


    And did you know BBQ'n chicken increases the carcinogens found in it and the "free radicals," Just kiddin I'm bustin your balls, but really it does...

  9. #9
    sonysucks is offline Associate Member
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    An increase in electron loose free radicals is a good thing right?
    DID you know that BBq'n chicken makes it taste better...I am not pullin your leg...
    My post workout meal is just the shake with isolate ,a pwo carb sugar powder called anabolic od and the hemp protein powder for more protein and the efa's.
    its about 380 cal and 60gpro and 30g carg and 2 g fat.
    Timing wise I eat breaky about a ahlf hour after cardio and an hour before workout.

  10. #10
    OH REALLY is offline Banned
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    I just add two scoops of protien powder to my oats in the morning some cinnammomonon and splenda taste like gold

  11. #11
    sonysucks is offline Associate Member
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    Sorry forgot to add I am cutting this time . Goal is to be 175 lbs with as close to 10% bf as I can get.
    And ti fix the protein bar at work I will simply bring a thicker lunch and split it....the lunch I bring is nearly enough for two meals.
    Thanks again.
    Lastly ,just ran out of quaker 3 min oats and bought some new oats in a big bulk bag...they are terribly mushy ...I thought oats were oats....

  12. #12
    fit4ever180's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by sonysucks View Post
    Sorry forgot to add I am cutting this time . Goal is to be 175 lbs with as close to 10% bf as I can get.
    And ti fix the protein bar at work I will simply bring a thicker lunch and split it....the lunch I bring is nearly enough for two meals.
    Thanks again.
    Lastly ,just ran out of quaker 3 min oats and bought some new oats in a big bulk bag...they are terribly mushy ...I thought oats were oats....
    Quote Originally Posted by sonysucks View Post
    Thanks bud, good target %'s for me to work with.
    I am currently on cycle and after getting to week 5 in my 12 I was getting nervous about my diet. Good gains ,just feeling a bit chubby (this is the end of the dbol ,so that along with the tightened diet should change things)
    I was off on the fat for breaky and will lose the cookie. (hey it WAS oatmeal!)and that will bring the fat down.
    -I thought chicken was slow digesting protein,if it isnt please suggest another or do you suggest the low fat cottage cheese...I can do that,but a tub of caisein powder might be better .
    Thanks again.
    Yeah bro, that chubby feeling should die off after you drop the dbol... What's your cardio regimen looking like?

    All whole foods are generally slow as far the breakdown of amino acids becoming available for use by the body, but beef is slower than chicken and casein is the slowest overall... I totally suggest the cottage cheese! I eat 3-4 servings of it for my bedtime meal with 1 oz. almonds and 1/2 scoop of 24hr protein powder all mixed together...

    Instant oats (i.e. 3 minute oats SUCK!) they have been processed and refined into a simple carb, which increases insulin much more than a slow-digesting low GI carb... This isn't as big a deal when you are first waking up in the morning, but through the rest of the day other than post-workout, it will cause you to retain more fat... Get old fashioned whole oats or if possible, steel cut oats!

  13. #13
    Pinkharley is offline Female Member
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    Got it...checked my bag(the one with the oats in it) and its the 3 minute stuff, so its outa here.
    Off to the store for some decent oats and some low fat cottage cheese....uuuggggh.


    Ooops this was sonysucks but my wife was logged in....so it was me checkin my bag....saw the steel cut oats ...went for reg oats instead ,the 15 minute kind cause they only take 3-4 minutes in the microwave.
    Last edited by Pinkharley; 11-06-2008 at 07:03 PM.

  14. #14
    sonysucks is offline Associate Member
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    holy $h!t this fat free cottage cheese is awful...can I put something in it...like maybe some toe jam.....

  15. #15
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    try some splenda and cinnamin. makes it much better and if you mix it the day before and let it sit it tastes even bette.r

  16. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by jimmyinkedup View Post
    try some splenda and cinnamin. makes it much better and if you mix it the day before and let it sit it tastes even bette.r

    That works or I add .5 scoop of protein powder and 1 oz. almonds in mine every night

  17. #17
    fit4ever180's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pinkharley View Post
    Got it...checked my bag(the one with the oats in it) and its the 3 minute stuff, so its outa here.
    Off to the store for some decent oats and some low fat cottage cheese....uuuggggh.


    Ooops this was sonysucks but my wife was logged in....so it was me checkin my bag....saw the steel cut oats ...went for reg oats instead ,the 15 minute kind cause they only take 3-4 minutes in the microwave.
    You can always just eat them raw too a little water is good too... more filling

  18. #18
    sonysucks is offline Associate Member
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    okay so now for prebed I take 1.5 scoops of a casein protein...and all the other advice has been adhered to.
    I am now at week 7 of my 13 weeks cycle. I need to now loose all the bf I can. I have gained nicely from 175 to 192 (17lbs) after 5 weeks ,Now I am off the dbol and will finish with winny at 50mg/day (of course along with the test 2x a week(see my manning up thread)). I am wondering how to achieve these fat loss. I have increased my cardio from 30 min/day 5 days a week to 60 mins 3 days a week and 40 minutes 3 days a week, but what about diet adjustments?
    Questions about my diet.
    First challenge is determining my daily needs ...well it seems all they need is hieght /weight /age. 5'9" and 190 lbs now ( 175 is the goal ) and my age of 42. Then next the tougher part ....how active am I?
    Well using the harris B calc and the lightly active its states 2500 calories. So lets say I am a bit busier then that and go with 2700 calories. (wo 5x a week and hockey and hiking once each.)
    I am getting to my point...
    DO I go at maintainance calories to figure out my macros or do I go below them. (using the idea that a 10lb fat loss requires a 35,000 cal deficiency which over my time period of 60 days means about 600 cal defieciency a day.) or do I stay at mantainance and just juggle the pro/carb/fat %'s to get to my goal. (which as I mentioned before was to keep the muscle mass I have and shed prmiarily just BF).
    I am attempting now to rewrite my daily diet based on 2500 cal (just a little below maintanace)and with a split like 50/35/15 pro/carb/fat. ( so thats approx 320g pro-200 g of carb and 40g of fat)Thinking that I need to keep up the cals to near daily needs and just juggle the %'s to get it right to where I can maintain the muscle and burn the fat.
    How is my thinking?
    Cheers.
    Sony

  19. #19
    sonysucks is offline Associate Member
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    Quote Originally Posted by big_k View Post
    What is your PWO Meal or Shake?

    I agree with fit4ever about dumping the protein bar and cookie.


    I might suggest Less fat for your PreWorkout Meal, you don't want your insulin spike to be going after the fat in your blood. But that is just my view.

    In general it looks fine, with 2800 calories are you trying to bulk or cut?


    And did you know BBQ'n chicken increases the carcinogens found in it and the "free radicals," Just kiddin I'm bustin your balls, but really it does...
    Dumped the bar and cookie,replaced it by bringing to work a lunch so large I get two meals from it..The goal of the cycle was to cut ,but suprisingly due to this much better diet discipline i gained an amazing 17lbs...but didnt loose much bf ,so now please help me with what I need to adjust to get after the bf reduction goals .
    Thanks

  20. #20
    sonysucks is offline Associate Member
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    Quote Originally Posted by fit4ever180 View Post
    You can always just eat them raw too a little water is good too... more filling
    Thanks for this tip...now I can add some carbs to my shake pwo like was suggested,and I can sprinkle them on a salad...they taste great in a shake...so again thanks for this fix.
    Last edited by sonysucks; 11-24-2008 at 12:07 PM.

  21. #21
    sonysucks is offline Associate Member
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    Please guys chime in and time is ticking ,if adjustments need to be done I need to get on it.

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