Cutting, working out at 5'o clock and PPWO!

**manwitplans** · 05-28-2009, 08:10 AM

Well I am in a cutting phase and want to speed things along a little bit.
I've been loosing nicely for about 4 weeks, but it's time to bump things up a little bit.

So I was thinking of dropping my carbohydrate meal after training and going with a straight pro/fat combo for my last meals (two last meals).

I am always taking in 50grams of carbs after training in a shake. Would it be detrimental to my recuperation to only take in this shake, and then have pro/fat meal for the last two?

I eat 4 meals before I workout at 5'o clock, then have a shake with whey and carbs. And then I would like to eat pro/fat for the two lasts, considering I don't need any energy and I am in bed at 10 - 11.

**eatrainrest** · 05-28-2009, 10:51 AM

i dont think it wil be detrimintal, id still supplement with 25g whey to get some quick protein and refeed when you get home another pro/carb meal if your looking to pack on a litle

**M302_Imola** · 05-28-2009, 11:45 AM

I wouldn't eliminate the carbs in your pwo meal, just make sure you use a relatively low GI carb (like oats). If you want to remove carbs the last place I would go for this would be pwo, with pre workout following closely behind this. Your body is a sponge after an intense weight lifting session and 25-50g of low GI carbs will not hurt you...your body needs it to shuttle nutrients and to start the repair process.

**manwitplans** · 05-28-2009, 11:49 AM

Originally Posted by eatrainrest

i dont think it wil be detrimintal, id still supplement with 25g whey to get some quick protein and refeed when you get home another pro/carb meal if your looking to pack on a litle

If you mean the shake I take in 40grams of whey right after workout with carbs.

Originally Posted by M302_Imola

I wouldn't eliminate the carbs in your pwo meal, just make sure you use a relatively low GI carb (like oats). If you want to remove carbs the last place I would go for this would be pwo, with pre workout following closely behind this. Your body is a sponge after an intense weight lifting session and 25-50g of low GI carbs will not hurt you...your body needs it to shuttle nutrients and to start the repair process.

Well your probably right, but the whey and carbs will shuttle nutrition aswell.

I will try it one week and see how it affects me, never know until you have tried it right.

**M302_Imola** · 06-01-2009, 11:37 AM

Give this a shot for your pwo shake: 2 scoops whey protein, 1/2-1 cup of grinded up oats, and water. This is what I have been consuming for the last year or so with good success.

As far as the oats: grind them up using either a blender or coffee bean grinder and store in a container in your gym bag. This way you can consume your shake immediately after your workout.

**manwitplans** · 06-01-2009, 11:42 AM

^^ My stomach can't handle oats, so that sucks

thanks tho

***FireGuy*** · 06-01-2009, 05:29 PM

How about holding your diet where it is and adding some more cardio.

**xnotoriousx** · 06-01-2009, 05:43 PM

Originally Posted by FireGuy1

How about holding your diet where it is and adding some more cardio.

When I was in the same boat I did this and good great results during my cut.

***FireGuy*** · 06-01-2009, 09:14 PM

You could even split it up, 100 less calories a day and 100 more calories of cardio a day.

**eatrainrest** · 06-01-2009, 09:18 PM

Originally Posted by FireGuy1

You could even split it up, 100 less calories a day and 100 more calories of cardio a day.

thats wat i would do

**C_Bino** · 06-01-2009, 09:33 PM

I would go with fireguy...If you have whey and carbs right after workout you are fine.

It all depends on muscle group worked and the rest of the diet, so hard to say with the info given. But in general if you wanna cut and you are doing it for say 16 weeks and you are only on week 4 then you can still be doing a fair amount of carbs. Only when you get down to the end would I be worrying about dropping carbs pwo. And thats if youa re getting lean as a mosquito.

I keep carbs in first and pwo meals almost all the way through cutting besides the last maybe 2-3 weeks when I start to drop to maybe 1 carb meal.

All depends on your body and how much cardio you doin etc.

Play around with it and see how you respond would be my best advice. But cut the whey and powdered carbs in place of a real meal when you are cutting and you will notice better results as digestion of the whole foods will result in probably 10% extra calories burned in that meal alone.

**xnotoriousx** · 06-01-2009, 10:05 PM

Originally Posted by C_Bino

But cut the whey and powdered carbs in place of a real meal when you are cutting and you will notice better results as digestion of the whole foods will result in probably 10% extra calories burned in that meal alone.

I've been told I should do that but just can't get over thinking the whey+oats pwo shake is better then eating a meal.

Anyone tried both and have good information?

**eatrainrest** · 06-01-2009, 10:09 PM

Originally Posted by xnotoriousx

I've been told I should do that but just can't get over thinking the whey+oats pwo shake is better then eating a meal.

Anyone tried both and have good information?

take c-bino's advice. it makes sense. after cardio you burn x amount of fat kcals so why not take advantage of this instead of feeding the body immediate carbs/protein and just simply wait until you get home to refeed a meal. whats more important losing unwanted fat or strength? sometiems you have to weight the scale the other way. he gave me great advice- 2:1 ratio immediate carbs to protein... and 45 min later refeed carb/pro. now take into consideration if you want to take advantage of this after burn, just eat a pwo meal when you get home.

**manwitplans** · 06-02-2009, 08:33 AM

Well I haven't cut back on any calories as of yet (since the start of the cutter). But I have twisted my diet a little bit.
I was eating:

1. Pro/carb
2. Pro/carb/fat
3. Pro/carb/fat
4. Pro/carb
5. Pro/carb
6. Pro/fat

Now I am eating:

1. Pro/carb
2. Pro/fat
3. Pro/fat
4. Pro/carb
5. Pro/carb (only weight training because of shake)
7. Pro/carb
7. Pro/fat

So that's two spikes less per day. But I guess the spikes are bigger due to the bigger amount of carbs in three meals, over five. But I have been on this for a week now, and it's time to bring out the measurements and scale, to see where it has gotten me.

There will be four spikes at training days, with the shake included. The reason I wanted to try this was because 1. You need carbs for your breakfast, there is no way a little carbs for breakfast will slow you down, 2. Complex carbs for working out, and 3,4 to replenish the glycogen in the muscles.

By the way I am training 4 times per week (weight training), cardio on off days (60 min).
So I have a lot of guns to take into my arsenal once the weight stops dropping.
I can add extra cardio on all the workout days, aswell as twice per non-workout day. I can also lower my carbs to 1 or 2 meals per day. So we'll see how it goes.

I am probably sitting at around 10-11% right now, hope to get to 7-8% by the end of this in about 9 weeks.

Non training days (Cardio):

Total
2667kcal
Carb: 190
Pro: 265
fat: 82

Weight training days:

Total
2747kcal
Carb: 238.8
Pro: 279.4
Fat: 82

Meal plan

1. Tuna/bread/whey
2. Whole eggs, tuna.
3. Whole eggs, tuna.
4. Lean ground beef, pasta.
5. Whey, maltodextrin
6. Tuna, bread.
7. Egg, casein shake.

That's about it, with a shake after training on training days.