Weight gaining meal plan please comment!

[blazerelf]

Hi everyone well as you guys can see by my tittle this is going to be my 1st cycle and well I want the opinion of experienced people on this so please comment I will accept any type of comment if they r wise and inteligent, no matter how rude it may sound (just don't be so mean please!).
This are my stats:

-hight:around 5.8-5.10(sorry for imprecise measure but take me as i was 5.10 which is a harder gainer)
-weight:130lb
-BF%(having proble to find a precse source but its around 12% or less as estimate)
-life style:active life style(do sports,love to walk and move.
-years workingout:2 and half years.
As you may see im a skinny person,my methabolism is very fast ive worked very hard to gather 10lb (120-130).
-goal:160lb(as much muscle as possibleof it;BF%:around 6-10%


My MEAL PLAN

**5am-2 scramble egg with 2 sausage,2 bread(toast or not) with butter jelly or whatever and drink it with a cup of corn creme.
TOTAL=678 CALORIES-FAT 19g-CARB 104g-PROT 27g(its actually slightly more if we count the butter or jelly and sausage)

**8am-2 scramble egg omellette,2 bread(toast or not) with butter jelly or whatever and drink it with a cup of corn creme
TOTAL=678 CALORIES-FAT 18g-CARB 104g-PROT 36g

**12am- eat a good food compose of either rice or spaghetti(recomended) with meat,chicken(recomended) or fish(recomended).
TOTAL:an estimate of 581 calories-fat:14g-carb:53g,-prot:57(Its actualy so much more than this thi was measure by the calories found in a steak of beef and 2 cups of rice but i'll also add beans or lentil,plantine,avocado and juice also instead of beef i eat fish(even better!) and chicken, but since these vary i cant give an exact calorie number(BUT TRUST ME WIL NEVER BE LESS THAN THIS) so i give the lowest"so i make my self eat even more than wat was planned")


**3pm- eat a good food compose of either rice or spaghetti(recomended) with meat,chicken(recomended) or fish(recomended).
TOTAL:an estimate of 581 calories-fat:14g-carb:53g,-prot:57


**5pm tuna sadwitch with tomatoe, onion and salad and a cup ofcorn creme.(dont wory tuna is digested quick so ull not be so filled from the before one u ate but anyways take ur time with this one.
TOTAL:315 CALORIES,fat:2g,protein 29g(Ill mostly acompany it with a shake"not 100%sure"also the tuna has onion tomato and cabbage but those calories weren0t counted)

**7pm- tuna sadwitch with tomatoe, onion and salad and a cup ofcorn creme.(dont wory tuna is digested quick so ull not be so filled from the before one u ate but anyways take ur time with this one.Shake made of fruit(apple or banana),milk,oat,some corn flake added and ice cream.
TOTAL:315 CALORIES,fat:2g,protein 29g
**9pm- If the time lets me I will have a cheating meal at this time(2 ful eggs or a shake,or both!)these calories wont be puten in count they r an extra bonus.

TOTAL:calories:3632-fat 86g-carb 472g-protein 234g "Its much more atleast 300 more calories than this but i didint put
(Im going to do a big effort to gather a prot shake to atleast reach 260 g protein(2g per lb of weight i got) but for now this is the macro!
Note *the meal that says"eat a good food compose of either rice or spaghetti(recomended) with meat,chicken(recomended) or fish(recomended)"are lunch meals and beside what is says it may have beans,lettice,corn etc but i didn't put it because it constantly vary also it may be chechen or meat soup.
*The shake after 2nd week I will add 2 raw egg white to it to increase the calorie intake.(not 100%sure)

My DICIPLINE
These are strict rule im going to follow in this cycle and after it:
*No drinkin alcohol
*no smoking
*every day sleep by the time its 10pm(by the time its 5 am for my 1st meal i will have added 7 hours sleep beside after eating ill go back to sleep).
*no junk food or fast food
*reduce cardio as much possible(wil quit playing soccer for a while.
*Not training in gym more than 1 hour a day

[Jfew44]

Ok brother first things first. I would not start a cycle (like I said in your other thread). Your diet is not good at all. Spend a little time in the diet forum and redo it. You should include macros (calories, protein, carbs, fat) and your BMR so we can properly access you.

[eatrainrest]

^^x2

[blazerelf]

Ok brother first things first. I would not start a cycle (like I said in your other thread). Your diet is not good at all. Spend a little time in the diet forum and redo it. You should include macros (calories, protein, carbs, fat) and your BMR so we can properly access you.

why isn't my meal good?it has aroud 3500 calories,247g of prot(almost 2g of prot per lb of weight),444g of carbs(little more),fat is 100g(not that good i think but its ok)
Ok my BMR is 1640.5.

[Reed]

Bumping this up.

Like Jfew told you list the macronutrients in each meal that you eat (protein/carbs/fats) along w/ the calories in each one so you know you are on the right track. Your food choices could be much better

Protein- lean red meat, fish, chicken, turkey, egg whites, whey
Carbs- brown rice, sweet potatoes, oats, ezekiel bread, rice cakes
fats- fish oil, whole eggs, avocado, flax oil,

don't forget your vegetables and fruits, a apple in the morning added in with your carb intake for breakfast and 2 bananas pwo is good.

sample bulk: http://forums.steroid.com/showthread.php?t=113010

[jamyjamjr]

Welcome to the diet forum....
please take the time to follow these directions, they will better prepair the both of us for the critique and tweaking of your diet..
you need to figure our your BMR (this is the basal metabolic rate of your body... which means if you were to do nothing all day, ur body would burn these many calories)
once u'v figured out your BMR, u need your TDEE (this is your total daily energy expenditure, it's based upon your activity level)

But first things first, please post up your current diet.. you have to be brutally honest about what you've been eating on average for the last few weeks so i know where your metabolism is at..
please include macros
MACROS = pro/fat/cal/carb of every meal and a daily total on the bottom
you can use fitday . com to help you our with this... be as detailed and specific as possible
please include the time of when u eat and the time of your workout
also tell me what your workout reg is...

BMR formula

BMR (men and women) = 370 + (21.6 X lean mass in kg)

in order to figure out your bmr, you need to know what your lean body mass is.. so, in turn, u need to know what your body fat percentage is...
if you dont know your bodyfat percentage, go to your gym and get tested (please dont use electronic scales to get your bf checked, they're horrible)
if you cannot find a gym to get tested at, please post up a picture for estimates, we're pretty good at it (you also have the option of pming it to me if you have more then 25 posts)
Total weight x bf in decimel form = total bf weight
Total weight - total bf weight = total lean body mass
if your total lean body mass is in lbs, u can divide it by 2.2 to get it in kilograms..
for example..
i am 6'4 275lbs at 14% bf... so i would multiply 275 by .14 (converted from percent to decimal)= 38.5lbs
275 - 38.5 = 236.5lbs lean body weight
236.5 / 2.2 = 107.5 lean mass in kg
370 + (21.6 x 107.5) = 2692 BMR (this is high for the average person, im a big guy)
TDEE
Once u have you bmr, u need to calculate your TDEE, this is simply done with some multiplication...
you can multiply it by an activity number to figure out your daily caloric expenditure, be honest here as this is the very cornerstone of your diet, if you are between two of the below activity levels then just multiply by a number in between them
To determine your total daily calorie needs, multiply your BMR by the appropriate activity factor, as follows:

If you are sedentary (little or no exercise) : Calorie-Calculation = BMR x 1.2
If you are lightly active (light exercise/sports 1-3 days/week) : Calorie-Calculation = BMR x 1.375
If you are moderatetely active (moderate exercise/sports 3-5 days/week) : Calorie-Calculation = BMR x 1.55
If you are very active (hard exercise/sports 6-7 days a week) : Calorie-Calculation = BMR x 1.725
If you are extra active (very hard exercise/sports & physical job or 2x training) : Calorie-Calculation = BMR x 1.9

Once you have your TDEE, i need you to watch these videos
Milos Sarcev "Secret of the Pro's" on Nutrition
http://forums.steroid.com/showthread.php?t=323516
this video will give you a great idea as to what your diet should be looking like and the foods you should be eating..
it's also very informative as to how dieting works and what you need to be doing..

once you've aquired this vast knowledge and done what i'v asked of you, please post up a new diet for critiquing and finalization...
please include macros and times just as before...

try to remember that dieting is not an overnight thing.. it takes time and patience....

[FireGuy]

Bumping this up.

Like Jfew told you list the macronutrients in each meal that you eat (protein/carbs/fats) along w/ the calories in each one so you know you are on the right track. Your food choices could be much better

Protein- lean red meat, fish, chicken, turkey, egg whites, whey
Carbs- brown rice, sweet potatoes, oats, ezekiel bread, rice cakes
fats- fish oil, whole eggs, avocado, flax oil,

don't forget your vegetables and fruits, a apple in the morning added in with your carb intake for breakfast and 2 bananas pwo is good.

sample bulk: http://forums.steroid.com/showthread.php?t=113010

Not with you on this one Reed. Fructose post workout would not be my carb of choice.

[jamyjamjr]

if they arn't brown bananas it's perfectly fine fire...

[FireGuy]

if they arn't brown bananas it's perfectly fine fire...

Fructose is a great for replenishing liver glycogen but a very poor choice to replace muscle glycogen. If that is his only carb post wrokout I would not recommend it regardless of the color. As always, open for debate and learning of you or anyone else has insight I am missing.

[collar]

at this stage i would have to agree with fire, fructose is fructose regardless of colour.

But if there is studies showing otherwise, hey theres something new.

[jamyjamjr]

Fructose is a great for replenishing liver glycogen but a very poor choice to replace muscle glycogen. If that is his only carb post wrokout I would not recommend it regardless of the color. As always, open for debate and learning of you or anyone else has insight I am missing.

phate has shown me more then one article stating that green to yellow bananas are starchy, making them a semi-simple, three chained carbohydrate.... this would make bananas okay for pwo...

im well aware of both philosophies though...

[Reed]

I have seen numerous top trainers recommend this as well as top bodybuilders utilize bananas post work out. Evan Centopani comes to mind, Hany Rambod hell Nark has it in with my pwo nutrition.

I remember DSM posted a 10 top myth about pwo nutrition myths and one of things it suggest that protein synthesis is our main goal pwo and using fast acting carbs helps us accomplish this.

Also the belief that fruit is just pure fructose is false it in fact contains a mixture of fructose, glucose, and sucrose which can be used for both muscle AND liver replenishment.

Bananas will cause a rise in blood sugar as we all know we would like a high spike of insulin pwo workout (the reason why insulin itself is utilized pwo), also the high level of potassium which is lost pwo, low cholesterol, and low fats pwo instead of utilizing something such as oats. Also the ability to digest so fast is very beneficial as we can then eat our meal sooner.

I have traveled to other boards and I understand there is a ton of debate on low GI and high GI pwo but for me I don't give two shits about how much science one can pull.

Done low and high GI pwo and I'll personally stick to the high GI carbs when bulking as I become much fuller pwo and hunger sooner then when I eat a low GI carb. I go how I look and feel, not what some science nerd on a board half my size thats telling me what science says cause we all know science and real world application can have different results; though I will utilize their advice to formulate what works for me.

But just so you know I'm not full out it here we are.

The studies reviewed here indicate that nutritional mixtures containing protein hydrolysates, added leucine, and high-glycaemic CHO greatly augment insulin secretion compared with high-glycaemic CHO only. When post-exercise hyperinsulinaemia is supported by protein hydrolysate and leucine ingestion-induced hyperaminoacidaemia, net protein deposition in muscle should occur. Thus, post-exercise recovery drinks containing these nutrients in conjunction with appropriate resistance training may lead to increased skeletal muscle hypertrophy and strength. If so, such post-exercise supplements would be of considerable benefit not only to athletes but also to anyone who has lost muscle function through disease?for example, Duchenne muscular dystrophy. Future studies should evaluate their long-term effects on body composition and exercise performance.

The full article: http://bjsm.bmj.com/cgi/content/full/40/11/900

[Reed]

Let me say I'm sorry I do care what the science people say. I'm letting the pressure to do well in my comps which are in 4 weeks get to me

And I have been dieting now for 11 weeks and just want a goddamn Wendy's spicy chicken sandwich and a coke

[collar]

Let me say I'm sorry I do care what the science people say. I'm letting the pressure to do well in my comps which are in 4 weeks get to me

And I have been dieting now for 11 weeks and just want a goddamn Wendy's spicy chicken sandwich and a coke

hahaha, classic...

[FireGuy]

I have seen numerous top trainers recommend this as well as top bodybuilders utilize bananas post work out. Evan Centopani comes to mind, Hany Rambod hell Nark has it in with my pwo nutrition.

I remember DSM posted a 10 top myth about pwo nutrition myths and one of things it suggest that protein synthesis is our main goal pwo and using fast acting carbs helps us accomplish this.

Also the belief that fruit is just pure fructose is false it in fact contains a mixture of fructose, glucose, and sucrose which can be used for both muscle AND liver replenishment.

Bananas will cause a rise in blood sugar as we all know we would like a high spike of insulin pwo workout (the reason why insulin itself is utilized pwo), also the high level of potassium which is lost pwo, low cholesterol, and low fats pwo instead of utilizing something such as oats. Also the ability to digest so fast is very beneficial as we can then eat our meal sooner.

I have traveled to other boards and I understand there is a ton of debate on low GI and high GI pwo but for me I don't give two shits about how much science one can pull.

Done low and high GI pwo and I'll personally stick to the high GI carbs when bulking as I become much fuller pwo and hunger sooner then when I eat a low GI carb. I go how I look and feel, not what some science nerd on a board half my size thats telling me what science says cause we all know science and real world application can have different results; though I will utilize their advice to formulate what works for me.

But just so you know I'm not full out it here we are.

The studies reviewed here indicate that nutritional mixtures containing protein hydrolysates, added leucine, and high-glycaemic CHO greatly augment insulin secretion compared with high-glycaemic CHO only. When post-exercise hyperinsulinaemia is supported by protein hydrolysate and leucine ingestion-induced hyperaminoacidaemia, net protein deposition in muscle should occur. Thus, post-exercise recovery drinks containing these nutrients in conjunction with appropriate resistance training may lead to increased skeletal muscle hypertrophy and strength. If so, such post-exercise supplements would be of considerable benefit not only to athletes but also to anyone who has lost muscle function through disease?for example, Duchenne muscular dystrophy. Future studies should evaluate their long-term effects on body composition and exercise performance.

The full article: http://bjsm.bmj.com/cgi/content/full/40/11/900

I read the study and feel even more confident in my opinion as I feel it backs it even further. If you want a high GI PWO carb (W/Protein) I still feel maldodextrin is by far your best choice. In that case a bagel, rice cakes or even a premixed recovery type drink will be far superior to a banana.

If you choose to go low GI starchy carb (which I do) just keep 200g chicken and 200g sweet potatoe in your gym bag and eat in when you get to your car. I am not saying you should not eat bananas at all. I am saying whether you are a high or low GI post workout believer there are far better choices.

[FireGuy]

Let me say I'm sorry I do care what the science people say. I'm letting the pressure to do well in my comps which are in 4 weeks get to me

And I have been dieting now for 11 weeks and just want a goddamn Wendy's spicy chicken sandwich and a coke

The anticipation is much better than the actual moment.

[Reed]

I read the study and feel even more confident in my opinion as I feel it backs it even further. If you want a high GI PWO carb (W/Protein) I still feel maldodextrin is by far your best choice. In that case a bagel, rice cakes or even a premixed recovery type drink will be far superior to a banana.

If you choose to go low GI starchy carb (which I do) just keep 200g chicken and 200g sweet potatoe in your gym bag and eat in when you get to your car. I am not saying you should not eat bananas at all. I am saying whether you are a high or low GI post workout believer there are far better choices.

How about a mix. Get that potassium and a high GI carb Hell during the bulking season I liked a G2 gatorade with some waxy maize. I've done sweet potatoes, oats, rice cakes, bananas, waxy, maldo, white bread and it just seems the high GI carbs fill me out faster and keep me fuller longer but that doesn't mean my gains are any better, its just a cosmetic thing I guess and I'm also am hungrier sooner which with time constraints for things like work and school I gotta get that PPWO meal as soon as possible


Just like cardio probably be one of those things that'll be debated to no end.

[FireGuy]

How about a mix. Get that potassium and a high GI carb Hell during the bulking season I liked a G2 gatorade with some waxy maize. I've done sweet potatoes, oats, rice cakes, bananas, waxy, maldo, white bread and it just seems the high GI carbs fill me out faster and keep me fuller longer but that doesn't mean my gains are any better, its just a cosmetic thing I guess and I'm also am hungrier sooner which with time constraints for things like work and school I gotta get that PPWO meal as soon as possible


Just like cardio probably be one of those things that'll be debated to no end.

Oh, I was going to address the other subject you had mentioned about pro's and top guys using bananas. Getting an insulin reaction from their PWO carb is not nearly as important to them as I am sure most are injecting it.

Yes, I do agree there are several shades or grey on this issue just as with cardio. The ole "if it works for you" quote probably applies.

[Reed]

Yeah when I was injecting insulin (not currently of course) I don't think bananas would have been enough. Did waxy. I have hypoglycemia so I need plenty of carbs and food as well....


Right now in contest prep mode, its sweet potatoes PWO, pretty much sweet potatoes all day long....

[Phate]

Fructose is a great for replenishing liver glycogen but a very poor choice to replace muscle glycogen. If that is his only carb post wrokout I would not recommend it regardless of the color. As always, open for debate and learning of you or anyone else has insight I am missing.

i agree with the statement about fructose, though bananas at pre and climatic stages are predominantly sucrose, not fructose

http://www.actahort.org/books/57/57_20.htm

up to 37% of a banana can be starch depending on level of ripeness, down to 3% starch in very ripe bananas

http://www.ajcn.org/cgi/content/abstract/44/1/42

i agree that there are better sources PWO but i don't think that bananas are a bad source at all

Oh, I was going to address the other subject you had mentioned about pro's and top guys using bananas. Getting an insulin reaction from their PWO carb is not nearly as important to them as I am sure most are injecting it.

Yes, I do agree there are several shades or grey on this issue just as with cardio. The ole "if it works for you" quote probably applies.

i think that insulin reaction from PWO foods is overrated(if anyone has a study on this that mentions actual amount of insulin secreted and not percentages please post it) and should only be used if bulking without regard to bf% gain

[C_Bino]

Not with you on this one Reed. Fructose post workout would not be my carb of choice.

I am with you on this 110% Only time I eat fruit is sometimes an apple with my oatmeal in the am.

[blazerelf]

can i actually hit 3600 calories a day without using shake damn a shake is like 80bucks(gnc) and 50 at local gym and im still a young person who has classes from 6am to 4pm +studying and homework i can bareley get a job to aford that but wat iu can do is manage my schedual to eat 6-7 meals a day but pplease can someone recomend me one and also have in mind i dont want to be a bodybuilder just want a decent weight(im right now only 130) for my age(22) and size(5,10) just ant a good summer looking body :P(i think 160lbi s a nice hit to reach)!!

[jamyjamjr]

160 is a nice goal.. what's your budget look like??

learn to cook.. go stock up on chicken and turkey breast.. get beef that's on sale...

get brown rice, oats, yams, sweet potato...

get creative..

[collar]

The anticipation is much better than the actual moment.

i have to agree with that 100%

[blazerelf]

160 is a nice goal.. what's your budget look like??

learn to cook.. go stock up on chicken and turkey breast.. get beef that's on sale...

get brown rice, oats, yams, sweet potato...

get creative..

Thanks dude umm check in the top i ahve everything about my meal plan there(ill edit it soon and put the total macronutrient and calories found in that meal.
Who ever is reading this please remeber i have all my details about my meal at the top.thanks

[Narkissos]

I have seen numerous top trainers recommend this as well as top bodybuilders utilize bananas post work out. Evan Centopani comes to mind, Hany Rambod hell Nark has it in with my pwo nutrition.

I remember DSM posted a 10 top myth about pwo nutrition myths and one of things it suggest that protein synthesis is our main goal pwo and using fast acting carbs helps us accomplish this.

Also the belief that fruit is just pure fructose is false it in fact contains a mixture of fructose, glucose, and sucrose which can be used for both muscle AND liver replenishment.

Bananas will cause a rise in blood sugar as we all know we would like a high spike of insulin pwo workout (the reason why insulin itself is utilized pwo), also the high level of potassium which is lost pwo, low cholesterol, and low fats pwo instead of utilizing something such as oats. Also the ability to digest so fast is very beneficial as we can then eat our meal sooner.

I have traveled to other boards and I understand there is a ton of debate on low GI and high GI pwo but for me I don't give two shits about how much science one can pull.

Done low and high GI pwo and I'll personally stick to the high GI carbs when bulking as I become much fuller pwo and hunger sooner then when I eat a low GI carb. I go how I look and feel, not what some science nerd on a board half my size thats telling me what science says cause we all know science and real world application can have different results; though I will utilize their advice to formulate what works for me.

But just so you know I'm not full out it here we are.

The studies reviewed here indicate that nutritional mixtures containing protein hydrolysates, added leucine, and high-glycaemic CHO greatly augment insulin secretion compared with high-glycaemic CHO only. When post-exercise hyperinsulinaemia is supported by protein hydrolysate and leucine ingestion-induced hyperaminoacidaemia, net protein deposition in muscle should occur. Thus, post-exercise recovery drinks containing these nutrients in conjunction with appropriate resistance training may lead to increased skeletal muscle hypertrophy and strength. If so, such post-exercise supplements would be of considerable benefit not only to athletes but also to anyone who has lost muscle function through disease?for example, Duchenne muscular dystrophy. Future studies should evaluate their long-term effects on body composition and exercise performance.

The full article: http://bjsm.bmj.com/cgi/content/full/40/11/900

Very solid post Reed.

[Reed]

Very solid post Reed.

Thanks


I just don't understand why when bulking I would not want to fill back out PWO as quickly as possible. Done oats and doing sweet potatoes and it definitely doesn't do me as well as high GI carbs. Its not like I got fat but I like being big and full since that is part of what bodybuilding is about.

Some of the people that were telling me to do low GI carbs have been doing this much much longer than I have been, know probably so much more and got so many more cycles (2 bulking cycles for myself) under there belts and I already got them in the rear view so I wonder do they sometimes revolve their approach too much around what some university studies have to say.


Wanna know how to get big. SIMPLE. Lift heavy ass weights and eat every 2-3 hours.

Like I told Phate earlier in competitive bodybuilding knowledge is not power the application of knowledge is power

or maybe its just who I am as a person


What is your input on the particular topic at hand???

[Narkissos]

What is your input on the particular topic at hand???

With regard to bananas specifically... or the overall topic?

As you stated above, I instructed that you use bananas (and a couple other fruits which will not be mentioned ) in the PWO environment.

This was made feasible in part by your state of leanness (as this relates to insulin sensitivity), as well as the nutrient-partitioning agents being utilized.

re: bananas...

Bananas are *very* complex.

Ripe bananas are about 2% starch, and 15-25% sugar.

Of the 20% sugar: 66%+ is sucrose... 20% is glucose, 14% is fructose... w/ trace amounts of maltose.

As sucrose is a disaccharide (50:50 glucose fructose), this translates to bananas being predominantly glucose.

In my experience (and as documented by statements in the insulin IGF/forums), I've used sucrose pwo in the place of dextrose (i.e. glucose). The effect? Higher fullness... and less of a PWO crash. Maltodex is pretty nice as well to be honest... but most on the forums despise it. I found it pretty surprising to see it mentioned here to be honest.

Anyway... back to bananas.

Personally, I feel that the mix of carb sources pwo is superior to any one specific carb source... that is, unless a nutrient partitioning agent is being used.

In addition, I think that fruit pre-W/O (particularly when cutting) is of greater benefit than straight dex (re: pre-w/o and intraworkout dogma).

Studies have shown that pre-workout fructose can be sparing to muscle glycogen... and also result in increased fatty acid release... a plus when cutting IMO.

re: this discussion...

I doubt the debate will ever truly close.

So let's agree to disagree.

At the end of the day... every person is entitled to try every protocol out there to determine what 'works best' for 'em.




References: (and further reading )

CRYER,A., RILEY,S. E., WILLIAMS,E. R. & ROBINSON,D. S.
(1974) Effects of fructose, sucrose and glucose feeding on plasma
insulin concentrations and on adipose-tissue clearing-factor lipase
activity in the rat. Biochem. ]. 140: 561-563.

HARGREAVES, M., COSTILL,D. L., KATZ, A. & FINK, W. ].
(1985) Effect of fructose ingestion on muscle glycogen usage
during exercise. Med. Sci. Sports Exercise 17: 360-363.

LEVINEL, ., EVANSW, . I., CADARETTEB,. S., FISHERE, . C. & BULLE, B. A. (1983) Fructose and glucose ingestion and muscle glycogen
use during submaximal exercise. /. Appi. Physiol. 55:1767-
1771.

KOIVISTO, V. A, KARONEN,S. L. & NIKKILA,E. A. (1981)
Carbohydrate ingestion before exercise: comparison of glucose,
fructose, and sweet placebo. /. Appi. Physiol. 51: 783-787.

KOIVISTOV,. A., HARKONENM, ., KARONENS,. L., GROOP,P. H.,
ELOVAINIO,R., FERRANNINI, E., SACCA,L. & DEFRONZO,R. A.
(1985) Glycogen depletion during prolonged exercise: influence
of glucose, fructose, or placebo. /. Appi. Physiol. 58: 731-737.

VRANA, A., FABRY, P., KAZDOVA,L. & ZVOLANKOVA,K.
(1978) Effect of the type and proportion of dietary carbohydrate
on serum glucose levels and liver and muscle glycogen synthesis
in the rat. Nutr. Metab. 22: 313-320.

[Reed]

Nice!!!!!!!!! I realize I am no guru and have a lot to learn. Always willing to take all sides of the argument and like you said formulate what works for me. Its just the ones that are so set that this is the way and there are no other ways do get on my nerves especially if their physiques don't speak it.

[FireGuy]

Nice!!!!!!!!! I realize I am no guru and have a lot to learn. Always willing to take all sides of the argument and like you said formulate what works for me. Its just the ones that are so set that this is the way and there are no other ways do get on my nerves especially if their physiques don't speak it.

Dont sell yourself short man, you are one of the brighter minds on this board. I especially agree with your last sentence.

Threads like this is what makes this board to great. There are quite a few people who's opinions I value and they are on both sides of the debate.

[jamyjamjr]

^^^agreed..

[Reed]

Thanks FG. Really appreciate it. I gotta stay hungry for knowledge and progress

I really do enjoy debates and hearing both sides of the story, as long as we are respectful to one another it can only cause us to progress and in the end thats what we should be here for.

I love looking through the old threads on the past vets and their debates, it really is awesome

Now time for some legs!!!!!!!

[collar]

Personally when i used to bulk, i always did simple sugars pwo : dex,malt,fruits tried all three..

When cutting though i try cut out all simple sugars and fruits for pwo, the reason is not cause it may not work or i think it wont benefit me, i just look long term.

I do train in the morning so i still have to last through out the day, so i prefer having lower gi food to help me stay fuller for longer while cutting..

Also personally when i cut out the simple sugars, i dont look so bloaded or some what holding water.

Also this is just off topic, i know the subject was about the banana..
If we have to wait till the banana is a certain color, we can utilise better things.

That dont mean having a banana is wrong.

What ever works for the individual, as i stated i used to have fruits while bulking mind you 90% of it was bananas lol

[Phate]

Dont sell yourself short man, you are one of the brighter minds on this board. I especially agree with your last sentence.

Threads like this is what makes this board to great. There are quite a few people who's opinions I value and they are on both sides of the debate.

agreed

[Narkissos]

I love looking through the old threads on the past vets and their debates, it really is awesome

I miss those discussions.

Giants 11, Jay, IBD, and I used to really debate back in the day.

It was awesome.

Time to bring it back!

[Swifto]

Charles Poliquin states that the amount of carbs used PWO should be determined by the number of reps in resistance training session:

* 12-72 reps per workout : 0.6 g/Kg/LBM
* 73-200 reps per workout : 0.8 g/kg/LBM
* 200-360 reps per workout : 1.0 g/kg/LBM
* 360-450 reps per workout : 1.2 g/kg/LBM

Thoughts...

[FireGuy]

Charles Poliquin states that the amount of carbs used PWO should be determined by the number of reps in resistance training session:

* 12-72 reps per workout : 0.6 g/Kg/LBM
* 73-200 reps per workout : 0.8 g/kg/LBM
* 200-360 reps per workout : 1.0 g/kg/LBM
* 360-450 reps per workout : 1.2 g/kg/LBM

Thoughts...

I would say its non applicable. How can you equate a rep in the squat rack with a rep for a bicep movement?

[xnotoriousx]

I've been doing Oats and Whey for the last 7 months. I'm going to give Dextrose a run and see what happens.

Damn this topic goes back and forth, i'm just glad I've stuck with one of them so I can really see which one works best for myself.

Great thread!

[collar]

Charles Poliquin states that the amount of carbs used PWO should be determined by the number of reps in resistance training session:

* 12-72 reps per workout : 0.6 g/Kg/LBM
* 73-200 reps per workout : 0.8 g/kg/LBM
* 200-360 reps per workout : 1.0 g/kg/LBM
* 360-450 reps per workout : 1.2 g/kg/LBM

Thoughts...

sorry i would have disagree with charles hehe..
It just doesnt seem to make sense, you dont get excat same intensity from deadlifts,squats to lets say dumbbell curls.

[Reed]

I miss those discussions.

Giants 11, Jay, IBD, and I used to really debate back in the day.

It was awesome.

Time to bring it back!

To me it seems it may happen, looks like AR is rebuilding a pretty good crew once again.

Less lounge and political matter and more of what the site was created for!!!