Ketogenic diet

[jpl315]

So i've used a ketogenic diet multiple times in order to cut fat. i have to say it is definitely the best way in order to shed bodyfat and maintain muscle. also, i don't understand the point of cyclical keto or tageting carbs around workouts as i never feel a drop in energy levels at any point. The only difficult part of keto diets are obviously the very limited food options. a typical day would be something like this

breakfast: 6 eggs with 2 cups spinach
lunch: 6 eggs with spinach or 1/2 pound steak
dinner: 12 eggs with spinach or 1-1.5 pound steak with broccoli

*post-workout 1-2 scoops protein powder (i also grind egg shells and eat them with this)
*i cook eggs and steak in coconut oil
*cod liver oil is my only supplement

i may eat a little more meat/eggs if i've done a lot or am hungrier....with this few number of carbs tho and intense workouts and sprints i never feel low energy levels and lose fat quite quickly...has any1 else done a longterm ketogenic diet? how'd it go?

[jamyjamjr]

wow.. we've got some work to do... first off, your only eating 3 meals a day..

aright, lets try to work through my sticky..

Welcome to the diet forum....

please take the time to follow these directions, they will better prepair the both of us for the critique and tweaking of your diet..

you need to figure our your BMR (this is the basal metabolic rate of your body... which means if you were to do nothing all day, ur body would burn these many calories)

once u'v figured out your BMR, u need your TDEE (this is your total daily energy expenditure, it's based upon your activity level)


But first things first, please post up your current diet.. you have to be brutally honest about what you've been eating on average for the last few weeks so i know where your metabolism is at..
please include macros

MACROS = pro/fat/cal/carb of every meal and a daily total on the bottom
you can use fitday . com to help you our with this... be as detailed and specific as possible

please include the time of when u eat and the time of your workout

also tell me what your workout reg is...



BMR formula


BMR (men and women) = 370 + (21.6 X lean mass in kg)



in order to figure out your bmr, you need to know what your lean body mass is.. so, in turn, u need to know what your body fat percentage is...

if you dont know your bodyfat percentage, go to your gym and get tested (please dont use electronic scales to get your bf checked, they're horrible)

if you cannot find a gym to get tested at, please post up a picture for estimates, we're pretty good at it (you also have the option of pming it to me if you have more then 25 posts)

Total weight x bf in decimel form = total bf weight

Total weight - total bf weight = total lean body mass

if your total lean body mass is in lbs, u can divide it by 2.2 to get it in kilograms..

for example..

i am 6'4 275lbs at 14% bf... so i would multiply 275 by .14 (converted from percent to decimal)= 38.5lbs

275 - 38.5 = 236.5lbs lean body weight

236.5 / 2.2 = 107.5 lean mass in kg

370 + (21.6 x 107.5) = 2692 BMR (this is high for the average person, im a big guy)

TDEE

Once u have you bmr, u need to calculate your TDEE, this is simply done with some multiplication...

you can multiply it by an activity number to figure out your daily caloric expenditure, be honest here as this is the very cornerstone of your diet, if you are between two of the below activity levels then just multiply by a number in between them

To determine your total daily calorie needs, multiply your BMR by the appropriate activity factor, as follows:


If you are sedentary (little or no exercise) : Calorie-Calculation = BMR x 1.2
If you are lightly active (light exercise/sports 1-3 days/week) : Calorie-Calculation = BMR x 1.375
If you are moderatetely active (moderate exercise/sports 3-5 days/week) : Calorie-Calculation = BMR x 1.55
If you are very active (hard exercise/sports 6-7 days a week) : Calorie-Calculation = BMR x 1.725
If you are extra active (very hard exercise/sports & physical job or 2x training) : Calorie-Calculation = BMR x 1.9



Once you have your TDEE, i need you to watch these videos

Milos Sarcev "Secret of the Pro's" on Nutrition

http://forums.steroid.com/showthread.php?t=323516

this video will give you a great idea as to what your diet should be looking like and the foods you should be eating..

it's also very informative as to how dieting works and what you need to be doing..


once you've aquired this vast knowledge and done what i'v asked of you, please post up a new diet for critiquing and finalization...
please include macros and times just as before...


try to remember that dieting is not an overnight thing.. it takes time and patience....

[jpl315]

i've seen it already, but i'm basically exploring other possible diet options...currently a longterm keto...i was just trying to collect info on others that have used this strategy...for the record i'm not a bodybuilder, i'm a sprinter/model i guess, so i'm more interested in getting as cut as possible...if i ever need to gain muscle i just consciously eat more food (meat) and the muscle comes along...i simply don't see the any advantage of eating carbs if my performance and mass stay constant

[eatrainrest]

i've seen it already, but i'm basically exploring other possible diet options...currently a longterm keto...i was just trying to collect info on others that have used this strategy...for the record i'm not a bodybuilder, i'm a sprinter/model i guess, so i'm more interested in getting as cut as possible...if i ever need to gain muscle i just consciously eat more food (meat) and the muscle comes along...i simply don't see the any advantage of eating carbs if my performance and mass stay constant

carbs for brain function? carbs for energy? so you dont get knocked into ketoacidosis? be smart now...

[jamyjamjr]

i've seen it already, but i'm basically exploring other possible diet options...currently a longterm keto...i was just trying to collect info on others that have used this strategy...for the record i'm not a bodybuilder, i'm a sprinter/model i guess, so i'm more interested in getting as cut as possible...if i ever need to gain muscle i just consciously eat more food (meat) and the muscle comes along...i simply don't see the any advantage of eating carbs if my performance and mass stay constant

a sprinter who doesn't eat carbs??? that's unheard of.. how do u do it??


anyways... keto diets consist of higher fat levels and protien levels while keeping your carbs to a minimum.. usualy under 20g a day if possible...

what exactly do you wanna know??

[t-gunz]

take the advice while you got the chance mate. these guys know there stuff.

[makod]

egg shells and protein powder PWO - no one find this a little off?

[jpl315]

my brain feels fine...the egg shells have a lot of minerals...only 1 maybe 2...well i'll say i've been on <75 carbs throughout college now and then going <20...i just don't feel a drop in energy levels or intensity...you guys are acting like im insane there are definitely others with a lot of success on low carb diets.....and im not gonna go into ketoacidosis....i wanted to know if any1 else has tried a longterm keto and their results...

*maurice greene says he eats a very low carb diet

[eatrainrest]

low carb diets can be less than 200g. first off this (<75) indicates greater than 70. 2nd, your body is fighting to get into ketosis and Fing with your brain. long term keto is never advised its a temporary strict last effort to shed that unwanted body fat and if your not the strict bodybuilding competitor why would you sacrifice so much. your missing the point. low carb and keto are two different diets. im on low carb my off days are 150g carbs while my workout days are about 190g.

[(1*)]

carbs for brain function? carbs for energy? so you dont get knocked into ketoacidosis? be smart now...

you will not get "knocked" into ketoacidosis. this is a diabetic thing. particularly a type 1 issue.

carbs are not needed. there are some who live on skd (straight keto diet) for a life time with no carbs. carbs are recommended in a fitness diet to assist in glycogen and leptin.



as for the diet the op is on.... you are going to turn into an egg my friend.

there are all sorts of options.

any meat. steak, beef, chicken, turkey, fish. etc etc.
you may have to add fats from oils and nuts and such.
good greens which are negative calories with fiber.
you can eat cheese as long as the carbs are low to none, which most is.
pepperoni, salami, pastromi, etc etc.
and let's not leave out the cheese cake or sugar free jello with rediwhip!

heck, if i am craving something sweet i will can the rediwhip to the mouth. lol

[(1*)]

low carb diets can be less than 200g. first off this (<75) indicates greater than 70. 2nd, your body is fighting to get into ketosis and Fing with your brain. long term keto is never advised its a temporary strict last effort to shed that unwanted body fat and if your not the strict bodybuilding competitor why would you sacrifice so much. your missing the point. low carb and keto are two different diets. im on low carb my off days are 150g carbs while my workout days are about 190g.

again, this is not so. there are some who even bodybuild on ckd or tkd keto. it's not a last ditch effort. some start on it and don't like going back to a carb diet. though i do think it would take longer to build mass and would not recommend it. at the end of this summer i am going to try a keto bulk. we'll see.

[eatrainrest]

again, this is not so. there are some who even bodybuild on ckd or tkd keto. it's not a last ditch effort. some start on it and don't like going back to a carb diet. though i do think it would take longer to build mass and would not recommend it. at the end of this summer i am going to try a keto bulk. we'll see.

well, you even said this yourself. but as a general keto is for weight loss... some do crack and dont sober up... i just stating its not a healthy lifestyle and is usually a last ditch effort of body fat

[Polska]

again, this is not so. there are some who even bodybuild on ckd or tkd keto. it's not a last ditch effort. some start on it and don't like going back to a carb diet. though i do think it would take longer to build mass and would not recommend it. at the end of this summer i am going to try a keto bulk. we'll see.

I don't understand why you would try a keto bulk diet? It's my understanding that you need carbs to build mass; would you not be short changing yourself of potential mass gains by doing it this way?

[jpl315]

i have gained muscle with less than 50 carbs per day...if you eat enough youll gain muscle.... and thank you 1*.....there are plenty of people that live on a keto diet perfectly fine.....there is no real scientific reason its unhealthy, only nutritionists' theories who only know about the food pyramid and arn't scientists...

[(1*)]

well, you even said this yourself. but as a general keto is for weight loss... some do crack and dont sober up... i just stating its not a healthy lifestyle and is usually a last ditch effort of body fat

but there is nothing unhealthy about it.. just because i think you would be better bulking on carbs doesn't mean i think keto is unhealthy..

[(1*)]

I don't understand why you would try a keto bulk diet? It's my understanding that you need carbs to build mass; would you not be short changing yourself of potential mass gains by doing it this way?

from those that i have followed logs and blogs on another forum they say that bulking on keto gives more muscle vs fat growth. i don't compete so i have no need to try and pack on as much as possible. i HATE cutting fat and dieting to do such. therefor i will try a keto bulk and see if it's as good as some say.
i will probably do the "anabolic diet" when bulking which give for two days of power eating and 5 days of keto style eating.

[(1*)]

to better clarify on my above post

the muscle to fat growth ratio is said to be better on a keto diet vs a carb diet with the same amount of calories.